The way to show government should intervene into personal lives

[BananaStand]

I'm not closeted. What kind of fucking bigot are you?

Whatever the cause, there's clearly a self-deprecating rage boiling inside of you.

I'm sure from your privileged ivory tower than it's something you'll need to "play along" with.

I'm privileged because I'm straight and cis? What does that make you? Afflicted?

Oh okay, so the treatment of transexual PEOPLE, not "behavior" as you've so ridiculously asserted, is something that can be ignored by common sense. Got it.

But you don't see people. You see "behavior." It's no wonder you have no fucking clue.

Dude everything in that paragraph was meant to be a ridiculous hypothetical that would demonstrate the circumstances where gov't intervention might be necessary. Obviously you missed the follow up sentence that says "None of this seems to be happening", because, as I said, it's all a ridiculous hypothetical.

Yeah I'm sure that people just choose to be transexual. You probably think people choose to be gay.

I don't, but I also don't think the answer is that black and white. Sexual preference may not be a choice, but lifestyle certainly is. I actually have a little bit of a problem with the "loud and proud" types.

What you're displaying right here, right now is the reason why LGBT folks like myself are at a much higher risk of suicide.

If cyberbullying causes suicide, and most people prefer not to die, then that means that the cyber-bullying is compromising individual freedom, and should compel government action. Again, google "bullying laws", and bathe yourself in reassurance that the government is on your side.

I don't need the government coming in and trying to force my preferences to what they think is "better for me." What myself and millions of Americans need is for people like you to stop thinking that you know better of what other people need than they know for their fucking selves.

None of this seems to be in response to ANYTHING I said. I never suggested the government should try and force your preferences. I said the government should take action against outside forces that exploit your preferences in order to undermine your individual freedom. We kind of agree, so why so pissy?

If you believe that, then maybe you should STOP BULLYING PEOPLE. But instead, you think the government should step in and tell gay or transexual or bisexual people to start "acting normal" since that's what's best for them, and you think the government has the right to force people to do what you think they should do because you think you know what's best. That matches up perfectly with your bullying rhetoric and weak attempts at gay-bashing jokes about being in the closet and suicide.

I never suggested the government should do any of that.

Do you know why so many LGBT people stay closeted?

Honestly, I think it's at least partially due to modesty. I mean, when you introduce yourself as a gay person, what you're doing is making a first impression by stating what kind of sex you like.

I once checked out a group on meetup for a hike in the mountains. The name of the group was "Gay Adventures" or something like that. And while I'm sure all are welcome and the group is very inclusive...it's a little off putting to put that in the title. I mean, all I want to do is find some folks to hike with, and the very first thing they tell me about the group is "Hey, just so you know, we're all into butt-fucking".

Why is that even relevant? Why introduce yourself by revealing intimate personal details about your sex life? I don't think it's homophobic to be a little put-off by that kind of behavior.

Because of assholes who think that it's great to bully them with jokes like yours that make them feel like they have no worth as a human being. People like you with your bigoted jokes are EXACTLY why there is fear about gay concentration camps in this country in 2017 (soon to be 2018) based EXACTLY on the type of communist rhetoric you're spewing left, right and center about why the government should step in and force you to act the way they think you should act. That's EXACTLY what gay concentration camps look like, and that's EXACTLY the attitude that leads to them

Honestly dude, or whatever you are, none of this aligns with what I said. If you're offended, it's because you're an oversensitive drama queen. Go run and tell the government sissy

[Poopadoop]

I don't, but I also don't think the answer is that black and white. Sexual preference may not be a choice, but lifestyle certainly is. I actually have a little bit of a problem with the "loud and proud" types.

I would say it's a bit silly to be 'proud' of an orientation you didn't choose, but it's also silly to be ashamed of it. The loud and proud types I think are asserting their right to sexual freedom to others who feel they should be ashamed. It's a "fu" to those people imo.

Honestly, I think it's at least partially due to modesty. I mean, when you introduce yourself as a gay person, what you're doing is making a first impression by stating what kind of sex you like.

Do a lot of people do that in your world? I've never had someone come to me and say 'Hello, I'm gay'.

I once checked out a group on meetup for a hike in the mountains. The name of the group was "Gay Adventures" or something like that. And while I'm sure all are welcome and the group is very inclusive...it's a little off putting to put that in the title. I mean, all I want to do is find some folks to hike with, and the very first thing they tell me about the group is "Hey, just so you know, we're all into butt-fucking".

I'm sure those were their exact words....

But really, what they're trying to do is help you understand what they're about so you don't come over a ridge and see two men kissing or holding hands or whatever and then feel like you've been duped into thinking it was just a group of happy guys who like to hike. They're in effect saying "If you're not comfortable with gay people, maybe this isn't the place for you."

[BananaStand]

I would say it's a bit silly to be 'proud' of an orientation you didn't choose, but it's also silly to be ashamed of it. The loud and proud types I think are asserting their right to sexual freedom to others who feel they should be ashamed. It's a "fu" to those people imo.

When I said "loud and proud" types, I meant the types who express themselves in ways that set gay people back. Like if you wanna have a parade to say we're here, we're queer, get used to it, then fine. But if I look at that parade and I see a half naked freak with a dildo strapped to his head, then I'm going to have much less of an open mind.

But really, what they're trying to do is help you understand what they're about so you don't come over a ridge and see two men kissing or holding hands or whatever and then feel like you've been duped into thinking it was just a group of happy guys who like to hike. They're in effect saying "If you're not comfortable with gay people, maybe this isn't the place for you."

That sounds like you're just enabling discrimination.

[Poopadoop]

But if ... I see a half naked freak with a dildo strapped to his head, then I'm going to have much less of an open mind.

I agree that kind of 'openness' lacks a certain dignity but if you don't like it, then don't look at it. It's not like the guy is doing it on your front lawn.

That sounds like you're just enabling discrimination.

I'm just saying if they didn't tell you they were gay you might be in for a shock. So telling you they're gay is a courtesy to you. I for one would prefer they say that because I'd rather not be the guy coming over a ridge and seeing two guys going at it, because I find that disgusting. If that makes me homophobic, fine, but at least they're being up front about it so I can't complain.

[BananaStand]

I'm just saying if they didn't tell you they were gay you might be in for a shock. So telling you they're gay is a courtesy to you. I for one would prefer they say that because I'd rather not be the guy coming over a ridge and seeing two guys going at it, because I find that disgusting. If that makes me homophobic, fine, but at least they're being up front about it so I can't complain.

So if you joined up with an outdoor group on Meetup.com, went out for a hike, came over a ridge, and saw two straight people going at it......that's ok?

This is kind of my point. The only gay thing about gay people is the gay stuff they do in private with other gays. Other than that, they're just regular people. This is why I have a problem with the phrase "identify as gay". Unless you're some kind of workaholic porn star, your life is probably a lot more than what kind of sex you have. So why is your sexual preference the defining feature of your "identity"

If they wanna hold hands, or sneak off into the woods for a smooch session, why should that bother anyone? Why does one need to be warned?

[Poopadoop]

So if you joined up with an outdoor group on Meetup.com, went out for a hike, came over a ridge, and saw two straight people going at it......that's ok?

Did you even read what I said?

So why is your sexual preference the defining feature of your "identity"

Who says it is the defining feature of their identity? But is still a part of your identity, and if someone wants to reveal that they're gay or they're straight or they're something else, why do you care? If you don't want to know, maybe ask them in advance not to tell you.

If they wanna hold hands, or sneak off into the woods for a smooch session, why should that bother anyone? Why does one need to be warned?

It shouldn't bother anyone but it does bother some people. So like i said three times now, maybe they're saying in effect 'if this bothers you, you've been warned'.

Really, what is your objection to that? You think the information is irrelevant, so it's wasting three seconds of your life to process it?

[BananaStand]

Did you even read what I said?

Yeah. Maybe I misunderstood "going at it". If we're talking gratuitous, overt, sexual displays....that really isn't appropriate for gay people or straight people. If we're talking casual hand-holding and familiar affection, like the stuff that happens in parks, restaurants, and other public spaces every single day then who the fuck cares. Why does anyone need to be warned about that?

If we're gonna do that, why not just put up a sign in every public space that says "WARNING: Gay people are allowed here" just so the homophobes don't have to be surprised when they see Ethan and Josh holding hands while shopping for throw pillows.

Who says it is the defining feature of their identity?

They do. If I have no plans to buttfuck with a guy.....why would I ever need to know that he's gay? I'm not saying he has to hide it. I work with a gay guy. The first year and a half we worked together, I had no idea he was gay. I only found out because one day we were talking and he mentioned something about his "husband". So then the light bulb went off and I though "oh, I guess he's gay". And it affected our interaction 0%.

That's HUGELY different than if he had just introduced himself as "the gay quality control guy"

See what i mean?

It shouldn't bother anyone but it does bother some people. So like i said three times now, maybe they're saying in effect 'if this bothers you, you've been warned'.

And like I've said to you, this enables discrimination. You're basically offering someone a mechanism to exercise prejudice.