*** Witch Hunt: Village of Souls gameplay thread ***

[jackvance]

maybe we should decide as a village to get someone to finger someone else. we choose both parties and set it up in a way where if its a megafail then we have enough info to have a shot at winning. if it works out, we clear a villager and snag a witch. we carefully and logically choose the fingerer and the fingeree, and maybe we catch a witch or 2 disagreeing with good logic, or trying to derail good rationale, and we lynch them without having to do the fingering


i havent thought of this too deeply but its fun considering

Sadly it doesn't help but we still don't get any info about the one doing the fingering.

[jyms]

Ya we do. A witch can't finger but a villager can. If the finger'ee dies it was a villager, if it's a witch they can't do it.

[gabe]

what happens if we get down to 3 villagers and 3 witches? can the witches autowin by fingering before the villagers do everyday? im trying to work out scenarios where we intentionally finger someone now and lose but have good info

[jackvance]

Ya we do. A witch can't finger but a villager can. If the finger'ee dies it was a villager, if it's a witch they can't do it.

Witches can, look at the rule change?

[jackvance]

what happens if we get down to 3 villagers and 3 witches? can the witches autowin by fingering before the villagers do everyday? im trying to work out scenarios where we intentionally finger someone now and lose but have good info

Same amount of wolves-villagers is usually game over.

[gabe]

err i think i mispoke in a previous post

"If a witch fingers somebody else, there will be no Night phase (unless it's another witch, but that will never happen)"

so if a witch fingers a villager, there is no nightphase and that witch dies.

if a witch fingers a witch, there will be a nightphase, and the fingerer lives

[rong]

Ah yeah, if the wolves finger someone there is no night phase so we do know it's a villager. Doh! Missed that bit.

[jyms]

OMG!! I was thinking that they couldn't so anytime they threatened to finger it was an idle threat. I saw the rule change, but I thought that originally they couldn't

[rong]

So we're actually better off picking two people today, and making one finger the other in a fastest finger first competition.

[gabe]

just typing this all out to make our strategies more clear

Ah yeah, if the wolves finger someone there is no night phase so we do know it's a villager. Doh! Missed that bit.

if the witches finger a witch, there is a night phase. they get to kill a villager.

if witch fingers a villager, they both die and there is no night phase

[rong]

Fuck! I can't multitable and read this thread and take in new information.

[rong]

Wait. But a witch can finger a witch and the night phase plays out as normal. So we.still don't know if a fingerer is a villager I'd they finger a witch.

[daven]

i'm not sure how bikes thought that fingering ong wouldn't be bad for the village. Epic throw...

I like luco playing, you should play more often. I agree with most of what you said. Daven does seem a little aggressive and gong after a noob in that manner seems a little excessive. That said its very early in the game by normal standards so attacking a noob is normally standard to see if they slip up but this game we've reached end game prematurely so its not as acceptable.

Luco's post above seems rather well constructed for a noob, so if he is a wolf I would expect a pro to be on his team, perhaps jv, JKDS or gabe, but I don't find him overly wolfy aside from that.

luco's posts seemed a bit suspicious to me.
i was hoping he would post a response quickly, it's gotta be difficult to write long defence posts like that in general, even harder first game
shame that it took so long for it to be able to be posted - luco, nice post, whatever your role

Gabe posted something earlier that i wanted him to comment on.

[daven]

I bet villagers don't care if its bikes or luco

witches should try to act like they won't emergency finger someone when they are getting walked to the gallows. witches have no need to emergency finger someone obv but they might use that sentiment to convince villagers not to vote for them

gabe - was this advice to the village? advice to witches? general commentary?

[daven]

We have little to go on but my strategy has always mostly been to spot villagers and then process of elimation try to find the wolves.

Villagers: jv, Gabe, rong, Pascal

jkds: tends a bit towards villager for me but could be a wolf

That leaves: hoopy, jyms, luco, daven

reasons would be good

[daven]

ok, let's see where this goes.

My only worry was putting in a good performance, so let the wagons roll and I'll finger my best guess when it gets close.

can you explain why this is best for the village if you're a villager?

[daven]

Daven's been awfully quiet. I know he said he'd take more of a back seat this time but we could use the input daven, and you proved to be more than competent last game so get your ass involved.

I've somehow managed to get pretty heavily involved in a little campaign that's going on down here in the south of NZ. Yesterday i spent about 9hrs putting together media packs, arranging content for an outa town meeting i've been asked to attend tonight, talking to journos, etc. My posting in this game is going to be different than last game, as i said in the signup thread. I really would have liked wagons to run bikes vs luco, like i said. Bikes snap fingering lost us a whole lot of info and no idea why a villager would finger another player he suspects as villager to be honest.

I'm trying to do what JV suggested and figure out likely villagers.

[daven]

What's daven's time zone? Is he normally on this time of day?

i'm in the future. Right now it's 8:45am, wednesday

[daven]

earlier you said this

You still need a read strong enough that you'd bet your life on it

and now you threaten to finger pretty much everyone

[jackvance]

reasons would be good

They're in my subsequent posts.

[Luco]

Thanks daven, I'll make some more long posts when I'm not on the back foot.

[rong]

Daven, what's yout thoughts on JKDS?

[Luco]

can you explain why this is best for the village if you're a villager?

Because 5-2 >>>> 4-3

You all seem to assume I'll get it wrong but there's two potential outcomes.

[wufwugy]

Sorry for the confusion. If a witch fingers a villager, there will be no night phase and both players will die. If a witch fingers another witch, only the fingered witch will die and there will be a night phase.

Forgot to state that with 9 players left, it's 5 votes to lynch

[rong]

Because 5-2 >>>> 4-3

You all seem to assume I'll get it wrong but there's two potential outcomes.

It is your first game ever and you're expecting us to be happy to have the whole game resting in your hands.

[wufwugy]

As it normally is, the witches win if they equal the number of villagers. The reason for this is that even if the game is 3 witches and 3 villagers and a villager correctly fingers a witch, a night phase will happen and it will then be 2 witches and 2 villagers. The baddies simply win when both teams are of equal size

[jackvance]

Wait. But a witch can finger a witch and the night phase plays out as normal. So we.still don't know if a fingerer is a villager I'd they finger a witch.

Still worth considering because it gives us 2 look-ups. We don't get a read on the fingerer if they kill a witch but that's ok, we do get a free kill of a witch if we skip a night phase and we'll move on to day 5 in a 4-2 situation.

It'll sure beat a TLR-bikes-esque move from whoever we try to drown..

[jackvance]

Ok just read the update, the witch dies if he fingers a villager, so we don't need to kill him.

[gabe]

its 5-2 if we nail a finger
its 3-3 if we botch a finger
its 5-2 if we hit a lynch
its 4-3 if we miss a lynch

if it becomes 3-3, there should be a stipulation where a village finger gets precedence over a witch finger, so the village has a chance. the rules arent as clear as they could be about who wins in tie situations. like if it gets down to 1 witch and 1 villager, whoever fingers the other person first wins ?? wut

[Pascal]

if we're about to lynch a villager, and he can use the finger and stay alive if he hits a witch (plus has a fairly good idea from reading the posts as to who might be a wolf from pushing his wagon) and we find out if he's a villager anyway, then there's gotta be some EV in having him finger if he's a good player as he's got a decent chance of hitting especially 5-3

[gabe]

oh i just saw the new posts. ignore that last one till i think about this

[Pascal]

oh shit didnt realise there was a 3rd page #noob

[Pascal]

i'm still thinking about luco posting "towning" - i mean, that to me seems like a phrase a pro witch would use and hes picked it up from the private thread.

ong and boog are dead which would just leave JKDS who people are already thinking looks suspicious. that would mean a JDKS/Luco team, plus one other. i'm not sure who the other is yet. i'd be fine with a wagon on either of those two

[gabe]

As it normally is, the witches win if they equal the number of villagers. The reason for this is that even if the game is 3 witches and 3 villagers and a villager correctly fingers a witch, a night phase will happen and it will then be 2 witches and 2 villagers. The baddies simply win when both teams are of equal size

why?? if its 3-3, then there is a correct finger with subsequent night phase, its 2-2, then repeat and its 1-1, then whoever fingers the other person first once the thread is unlocked wins the game. right? of course different things can happen which i wont disclose but given the posted rules, the baddies dont lock it up when its even. please explain (even if it includes having to admit the rules arent impeccable)

[jyms]

I'd offer to finger someone but that won't clear my name. I'd offer to be fingered too but in no way would that help either.

[gabe]

3-3 shouldnt be a death sentence when we have the power of the finger

[jyms]

Should one of us rescind JKDS or have we decided the witches either don't want him dead or they don't have the numbers to lynch without another villager?

[Hoopy]

what happens if we get down to 3 villagers and 3 witches? can the witches autowin by fingering before the villagers do everyday? im trying to work out scenarios where we intentionally finger someone now and lose but have good info

If we lose (villager fingers villager) then the game is over right? Wolves will just kill at night for 3-3.

[gabe]

Should one of us rescind JKDS or have we decided the witches either don't want him dead or they don't have the numbers to lynch without another villager?

i think we should just burn him. he hasnt threatened to finger anybody although hes pretty close to getting lynched...

(this should answer your question daven)

witches should try to act like they won't emergency finger someone when they are getting walked to the gallows. witches have no need to emergency finger someone obv but they might use that sentiment to convince villagers not to vote for them

gabe - was this advice to the village? advice to witches? general commentary?

[gabe]

If we lose (villager fingers villager) then the game is over right? Wolves will just kill at night for 3-3.

im not convinced 3-3 is autowin for the witchy wolves..

[jyms]

If he's a villager he won't finger someone, he's played the game enough to put the village ahead of himself.

[jyms]

i'm still thinking about luco posting "towning" - i mean, that to me seems like a phrase a pro witch would use and hes picked it up from the private thread.

Yea this is what I said earlier. That is why I have JKDS and him as 1,2

[gabe]

If he's a villager he won't finger someone, he's played the game enough to put the village ahead of himself.

but letting the village lynch a villager is not good for the village.

getting lynched leaves the village at 4-3. fingering gives a shot for the village to be 5-2 at the risk of being 3-3. i plan on going out with a fingerbang if it comes to it

[gabe]

wuf i would like you to explain the 3-3 scenario. how do the witches have that locked up?

also i think we should burn jkds now. why not

[Pascal]

yeah, i dismissed it initially but it seems really important. i'm happy to go with the order you think is best.

lynch JDKS

if we're wrong i say we lynch jyms

[jyms]

sure, sounds fair. You're wrong but fair. I was second on that wagon by the way.

[wufwugy]

why?? if its 3-3, then there is a correct finger with subsequent night phase, its 2-2, then repeat and its 1-1, then whoever fingers the other person first once the thread is unlocked wins the game. right? of course different things can happen which i wont disclose but given the posted rules, the baddies dont lock it up when its even. please explain (even if it includes having to admit the rules arent impeccable)

It just won't work in the game. The least convoluted method to let fingerings continue after 3-3 is me PMing a random villager, telling him to post his pick, then if he's right, the game continues, then he gets nom'd, rinse repeat two more times

It completely changes the game and it just becomes a question of whether the three remaining villagers can randomly pick the right target in perfect order. Nobody wants the game to be resolved that way

[jyms]

but letting the village lynch a villager is not good for the village.

getting lynched leaves the village at 4-3. fingering gives a shot for the village to be 5-2 at the risk of being 3-3. i plan on going out with a fingerbang if it comes to it

I actually do too. I think I have a good read enough to help us gain some ground

[gabe]

please explain how 3-3 (after a night phase) always ends in the witches winning. maybe i am being dense but i need it broken down for me

[rong]

i plan on going out with a fingerbang if it comes to it

lol

[wufwugy]

pascal - jkds
jv - jkds
jkds - jyms
jyms - jkds
gabe - jkds


jkds = 4
jyms = 1

no votes = hoopy, rong, daven, luco

I think that's accurate

[JKDS]

Id like Pascal, Jyms, and JV to clearly articulate why they want me dead. Gabe's reasoning is shit and he refuses to address it. So tell me why youre bandwagoning and why I shouldnt just finger one of you to death.

Yes, im smart enough to know that fingering now is bad for the village. However, im also one of the best wolf hunters in this game even if yall never listen to me. (Seriously, ong gets more respect than i do. What up with that!). Id rather gamble on my instincts than on yours, so gimme.

[rong]

Should we give him a chance to finger? He has a better chance than most.

[JKDS]

Hey, heres an idea. Lets bitch about game rules in a different thread. This one is for witch hunting, not fluffing up and detracting from your bad arguments so you can ride them into the sunset.

[JKDS]

Btw, daven youre still not off the table either. Ignoring my questions has NOT gone unnoticed.

[gabe]

Hey, heres an idea. Lets bitch about game rules in a different thread. This one is for witch hunting, not fluffing up and detracting from your bad arguments so you can ride them into the sunset.

sorry mang im trying to figure out different end game scenarios and their relative values. theres a big difference in 3-3 being worth 0 and a nonzero amount. weird that youre stifling this regardless of your role

my argument for u is that your word choice has been affected by your witch subconcious moreso than anyone else, so you are the best pick to burn

[JKDS]

Ill ask again then. WHAT word choice.

[JKDS]

Fuck it, maybe ill just finger you. This is some bullshit.

[jackvance]

rescind

[Luco]

So is there anything at all apart from my use of ww lingo? I'll still try to take the coaching thing as a compliment despite all the attention. Someone used the word town in this game before me, I just borrowed it.

I made my threat with the best of intentions based my (noob). assessment on the dynamics of a 4-3 situation. It seemed really bad to guarantee a villager death (me) when there's a game changing card in my deck.

At the very least it's provided plenty of discussion, aka information.

[jackvance]

I'm going on a short vacation on thursday with dubious inernet access, so some fingerbang action is fine with me, I'm just afraid we'll lose on a horrible pick due to villager-infighting.

[jyms]

Id like Pascal, Jyms, and JV to clearly articulate why they want me dead. Gabe's reasoning is shit and he refuses to address it. So tell me why youre bandwagoning and why I shouldnt just finger one of you to death.

Yes, im smart enough to know that fingering now is bad for the village. However, im also one of the best wolf hunters in this game even if yall never listen to me. (Seriously, ong gets more respect than i do. What up with that!). Id rather gamble on my instincts than on yours, so gimme.

I told you, and it's been mentioned again. Luco using the word town has everything to do with you being lynched. Your not starting a luco wagon or bolding anyone but me so I'm all for lynching you first and then luco or the other way around.

[jyms]

rescind

Why??

[jyms]

Is that a witch jumping before a witch is lynched by the 5th?

[Luco]

Why??

Because closing the day now doesn't help.

[jyms]

Why are you answering for JV? 3 witches, JKDS, Luco and JV. That explains why the witches never bolded anyone else or started another wagon at 3 all day

[JKDS]

I told you, and it's been mentioned again. Luco using the word town has everything to do with you being lynched. Your not starting a luco wagon or bolding anyone but me so I'm all for lynching you first and then luco or the other way around.

How does that incriminate me more than any other player in this game. Tick tock.

[JKDS]

^^Clarified, him using the word 'town'. If it incriminates anyone, its him.

[Hoopy]

I actually do too. I think I have a good read enough to help us gain some ground

Best to share it with the village, any little thing will help right now.

[jyms]

Because in searching this forum, there are very few people that use that term in that way. FWIW, Rong has also used it, Ong and you.

[jyms]

I'd finger Luco for reasons stated

[gabe]

jkds this is the link to post where i pick out some random stuff you say http://www.flopturnriver.com/pokerfo...ml#post2143056

i read your responses to each one of my points. your justifications arent making me think you are less wolfy than the next best thing. also fingering me would be hilariously bad

rescind

weak. you are too scared of jkds fingering someone i think. its not like we are getting much new info this day.

to luco, closing the day now does help, especially if its a decent lynch attempt instead of a wild finger attempt. i dont think jkds is going to finger someone though. there isnt an obvious candidate to take such a risk if you are a villager, and a witch really shouldnt be fingering now

[rong]

I don't think I've ever used towning or town.

[JKDS]

Because in searching this forum, there are very few people that use that term in that way. FWIW, Rong has also used it, Ong and you.

Use ctrl f on the first page of this thread and tell me again how it matters that I use the word 'town'. (PS, im saying direct evidence of the terms use in thread invalidates your "it could only have come from a witch thread" bullshit)

[gabe]

Id rather gamble on my instincts than on yours, so gimme.

so what are your instincts saying? that only jyms is a witch? ive read and reread your big case on him and almost all the points just seem standard jymish. is that who you would finger? who else in the village thinks thats a good idea???