Chopper's rant...

[Chopper]

well, i'm going to give it another go. however, this wont be solely poker related. there is far too much other stuff on my mind.

i will rant about something, maybe poker, whenever the mood strikes. this is also to be a completely open forum. if you have something to add, or subtract/debate, lets have it. for thats what the fun is about.

i found myself ranting about sports in another blogger's space today...a dumbass Cardinal fan telling people that the baseball cardinals need to only add one bat and one pitcher and they will be fine. on top of that he suggested we go after Schilling. WHAAAAA? it fired me up to say the least, and i stopped and thought....hmmmmm.

why not rant here. where i feel i will get responses. where i can rant amongst the, most of the time, intelligent.

oh, and learn some poker, too.

po (peace out)

[grnydrowave2]

Baseball is a joke to me now. Seriously. Someone asked me if I wanted to go to a game last week and I laughed at her.

[Jack Sawyer]

the paders/ rockies game, uhm, rocked

[Chopper]

baseball will always be a "joke." as will other pro sports. these people have lost all touch with reality, if you ask me, but i digress.

baseball is still baseball. people ask other people all the time, "what do you think about steroids?" and everyone, who is afraid to say what they really think, says, "its bad for the game...blah blah blah." but, THEY STILL GO TO THE GAMES.

i will tell it to you str8. yeah, steroids is no good for the PLAYER...long-term, but i'd do it if i were a borderline player, and this was my shot to earn millions and set my family up for life!! and, yeah, they all are on something, and therefore, are cheating, but...i still love the game, and will continue to watch/go. as will most people.

people just like to bitch and moan about stuff they cant control. and they like to play the "moral police." i dont worry about what i cant control. if i dont have the desire to "boycott" something, i may as well support it......or at least not bitch about it.

just my opinion.

but, i thought that game was VERY entertaining. however, i didnt know what the hell went on inside that umpires head when he delayed, and delayed, then called holliday safe. either he was thinking, "the players are on the field and dumbass Barrett doesnt care enough to argue, or he never saw that holliday was blocked off the plate." either way, the ump is an idiot. he had no angle from which to make a call.

but, thats not why the padres lost. they had many, many chances, as did the rockies. neither team played close to perfect, imo.

i figured before the game, when i saw the matchup, that the padres had a huge edge.....except for one factor. they were playing at colorado. therefore, i figured the game about 50/50.

even in the 13th, when the padres hung 2 on them, i thought...well, now they're done. but, they mentally hung in there enough to let hoffman blow the save (WOW). so, hats off to them. they ultimately deserved that win.

and we all know how the wild cards perform in the postseason. colorado could be a team to do some damage. i hope they kick the crap out of those cubbies. but, i really dont care that much. i am one of the few from STL that doesnt mind the cubs too much.

[grnydrowave2]

and, yeah, they all are on something, and therefore, are cheating, but...i still love the game, and will continue to watch/go. as will most people.

You are the reason baseball sucks now. Congratulations.

[grnydrowave2]

Actually, I take that back. I'll reserve that statement for college football fans that support bowl games.

You're not a cause of the problem, you're actually a victim. Sort of like smokers in the 50's.

"Hey guys, it turns out those things give you cancer and all kinds of other problems."

"Well, I don't want to quit now."

People that grew up with baseball are naturally going to be apathetic. But future generations will see it for the farce that it is. I don't see it that way because of my morality or political correctness. There's beefed up freaks breaking records and men twice my age posting sub-3 ERAs. That's a joke. I ignore baseball for the same reasons I ignore professional wrestling, and future generations will see it the same way.

Once they get to be 12 years old or so they'll realize, "Oh, baseball is fake" and change the channel. And when that happens, perhaps the gatekeepers will get off their asses, repair this broken game, and restore it to respectability.

[Chopper]

youre so wrong about the "youth."

this country/world doesnt make up its own mind anymore. whatever the tube shows, they watch...and believe...and follow.

look at all the reality crap. look at all the gossip shows. no one has anything good to say/provide anymore...its all CrapTV. and until you or i can get our kids off of it, things will continue to slowly slide downhill.

baseball is the least of your worries. high dollar athletes using 'roids? the least of your worries.

NBA officials gambling on games they referee? now we are getting somewhere, but truly.....who cares? i dont bet on the games. i dont give a rat's *ss about the outcome. i watch for entertainment.

i'm not one of those guys who goes into work and says, "WHEEEE! WE won." and on days the team lost says, "Stinking humps...THEY lost."

i dont live and die with sports. i like them. i watch them. but they are for entertainment. not to provide my children with role models of ethics and decency. that is my job.

btw, baseball doesnt suck now because of me/people like me. baseball sucks because of the fans that get geeked up by the long ball. or, actually, because of what the ownership thinks will pack the seats and puts out on the field. baseball sucks because of the "casual" fan...not the person who watches regardless and still appreciates a pitcher's duel and fundamentals more than a slug fest. the era has changed due to ownership, lemming fans, and selig. i am just honest enough with myself (not saying you arent) that i will step up and admit that in spite of the crap going on inside the sport, i will continue to watch.

i am not going to be (again, not saying you are) one of those fans that says, "i'm done with the sport. its all about money. owners dont care about fans. ticket prices are through the roof. i cant afford to go.....but i'll watch on TV." and, then, after the one of the most exciting events in modern sporting history, the McGwire/Sosa HR chase, say, "well, i'm back...baseball rocks again." these are the idiots who are what is wrong...the casual, lemming fan.

i never left. i doubt i will.

fans like me leaving the game because of our "ethical standards" is not what is best for baseball. that will make it slide downhill even faster. to preserve the game, fans like me need to TEACH the casual fan the nuances of the game...the fundamentals. and through education, the casual fan will learn to appreciate the tradition/nuances instead of what attracted them to the game in the beginning...homeruns.

now, thats a pipe dream, and i know that, but the concept holds true.

[grnydrowave2]

It's important. It's our culture, part of our identity. I don't want to lose it, or see it go down the shitter.

But you're probably right about the mindless masses oohing and ahhing all the dingers on Sports Center's top 10. And sadly, you're probably right that nothing much will change for that exact reason.

I'm not happy to have ignored baseball. It seems like a sport I would really have loved. Perhaps one day if reliable testing methods can assure me that the game is reasonably clean, I will give it a chance. I hope that doesn't make me a "lemming fan".

Anyway, I'll stop shitting on your thread now. That is, unless you decide to start posting some hands

[Chopper]

hands will come in good time. right now i'm having fun talking about something else.

and, youre not shitting on my thread. thats why i started it. i want fire and fury in here. nothing personal, just some pissed off people ranting about other shit...so, when they play poker, they can keep their heads screwed on correctly....because they know they can bitch about steroids, soccer, beer, whatever right here.

if you want to shit on a couple hands, though, i just posted some for gabe in the bad beats forum. they were pretty standard bad beats. you should laugh.

[Chopper]

yeah, theres not much to "rant" about right now...lol.

the cardinals are done.....for awhile, imo.
the rams suck.
and, i'm on a heater, to boot.

the only thing i can ask is: are there any hockey fans left?

i wish any, and all of you, could be a STL fan right now. we have a management/ownership team that simply GET'S IT!!

they have been marketing like crazy for 10 months. the newspapers, tv, radio, etc. they have been extremely accessible to media, both GM John Davidson and players alike.

they have promised a concerted effort in getting this team back into contention, and relatively soon vying for a Cup. they signed a huge name in Kariya. i know, i know, "so what?"

but heres the most impressive thing i have ever seen...

they "hand delivered" their season tickets. some of the players, and some of the management literally HAND DELIVERED the season tickets to their fans!!

now thats some serious fan appreciation.

look out, hockey fans, the Blues may be a solid team again. and, i, for one, am a fan again.

all in thanks to....management? go figure.

[grnydrowave2]

Soccer + Figure Skating = Canadian Sport?

Yeah, that sounds about right.

[Chopper]

whaaa? sorry, i'm a bit dense, i guess.

[grnydrowave2]

It's just a lame joke that's supposed to push your buttons.

[Chopper]

cool

[Chopper]

btw, WHATS UP WITH THE POLLS THIS WEEK? wow.

my favorite part? Those Kansas Jayhawks. they jump over all but OU in the Big 12, and i doubt they are the best team in the North. that has to be really pissing MIZZOU fans off right now. Mizzou has worked for the better part of 10 years to build a football program only to finally have a solid year and.....THEY STILL CANT GET PAST THE JAYHAWKS!!!

MFLMAO. it makes me giggle like a schoolgirl.

[Chopper]

and finally some poker.

i dont like talking poker when i am sucking balls. its too depressing. i would rather "muddle through" by my lonesome.

and, let me tell you it SUCKED lately. a whole lot of losing, followed by some break even, followed by a small, unsustained heater, to only give it all back...what the F ever. SUCKED.

been going on for 2 1/2 months now. but, i finally got back on track yesterday.

you know how i know? IT FELT RIGHT. i didnt feel i was on a heater. just solid play. my wife asked, "how much are you up?" and i said, "about $35ish. but, lets look, it may be better." i was up $65.

thats how you know.

i used to "feel" rather ho-hum about clipping off 5-8 ptbb/100 at the 25's. i moved to the 10's after the US regs and killed them for 12. tried to move back up in august, and went seriously south. it sucked.

i tried to fiddle with bet-sizing, opening my range, 3betting, short-stacking, playing for stacks, LAGging...basically everything i could think of.

i watched video after video after video, all of which are pretty good, btw, and still nothing changed. nothing that sent my GUT off with that naturally smooth feeling you get when you are absolutely PWNING a level.

but, i got it back. last night/yesterday felt very good...solid. no stupidity, no overplay, no real sick beats (always a plus), but no real monster cards, either.

sure, i had AA quite a few times, etc, but i didnt feel i was on some humongous rush of cards. you know the feeling...in ten minutes you see AA like 3 times, AK about 3, KK a couple, and pp's all set up on you...and you hit a gutshot and a couple flushes. that feeling. it never happened even for a little while.

and that felt GREAT!!

sorry for the long "yea, me" post, but its about F-ing time.

we may be back, baby.

[Chopper]

i guess i am generally too happy a person. i just dont find a lot of stuff to bitch about because i dont go looking for them.

sure, there is the asshole that cuts me off in traffic...oh well. the fat people at the beach making me sick by wearing two-piece bathing suits (god forbid the DUDE wearing the speedo)...oh well. sports and all the corruption that goes with that...oh well. etc etc etc

i just dont waste the energy bitching about that stuff, as i cant do much about it.

however, something came up this morning that makes me THANKFUL, and its this i will choose to bitch about since it fired me up.

my sister-in-law and her husband make GOOD money with their jobs. they deserve every penny. they put in the work, and deserve to get paid...just like the rest of us. but...........THEY SPOIL THEIR KIDS ROTTEN!!

there is NO discipline in that house. none. those kids get 5 or 6 "warnings" before they get sent to their rooms for about 5 minutes. BIG-FUCKING-DEAL! that kid didnt learn shit. the kids show NO respect for adults. they kick them, tell them "no," defy directions, and can barely get along with each other. and, I BLAME THE PARENTS.

yes, we all have our "issues," and shouldnt judge someone before walking in their shoes. you just never really know what other people are dealing with (special needs, stressful jobs, etc). but, c'mon. get a grip on your children, especially at this time of year when family is around constantly.

i cant expect much for the future from these kids, and its the PARENT'S FAULT. sure, the kids may have good jobs, as they may very well follow the example set, but there is a better than 50% chance that they will be "piece of shit" people, too. they will raise children just like they were raised...who will raise children like THEY were raised, etc, etc. the worst part of this is that it multiplies exponentially.

these people live like slobs. they havent washed their bedding in 2 months. there are so many toys (all bought by the parents) littering the hallway and bedrooms that the kids can hardly get in their beds without stepping on something. the parents claim "there's no time to clean because we are never home." well, who's friggin fault is that? if your kids werent playing hockey, soccer, ballet, tap, pom-pon, and basketball...ALL AT THE SAME TIME...maybe you would be home to have dinner, or bathe, or do some laundry.

and, not only do they have a PS2...and X-box, they are now adding a Wii for the oldest son (all the game systems along with GameBoy and another portable are his). i watch them go to a restaurant and interrupt the parents for "game money," and the dollars just literally fall out of the parent's pockets like leaves from a tree.

the worst part of all of this is: they take advantage of my Mother-in-law by inviting her over to the house to "watch the kids" while they disappear to the grocery store or do other routine shopping. meanwhile, my M-I-L gets so disgusted with the housing conditions, she spends HOURS cleaning the house. bathrooms, floors, laundry...all of it. she was over there for 9 hours last weekend alone. she is 68 years old, and cant say "no." (another rant for another day, as she is the enabler)

but, I BLAME THE PARENTS for most things wrong with children and young adults these days.

discipline your children consistently, guide them between right, wrong, and ethical. be there for them. take your eyes off the god-damned dollar long enough to realize these children need GUIDANCE and ROLE-MODELS or else they will seek them elsewhere. and, elsewhere is usually the wrong place.

and, remember, THESE KIDS WILL PASS ON WHAT THEY LEARN TO THEIR KIDS, TOO. they are watching you, and will repeat what they saw. and, if left to continue down the path it's on...

...THIS WILL BE THE DOWNFALL OF THE UNITED STATES (the piece of shit children WE raised) if you are a parent, or are going to be one someday, bear this in mind. and, put your focus back where it should be so you dont propagate the above mentioned scenario, as it is truly a shameful one. and it will be YOUR fault. YOU can stop this vicious cycle, if you recognize it, and DECIDE you've had enough, too.

i guess i'm just THANKFUL it hasnt ruined our country...yet.

[Setzy]

Man that's a good post. Strike that, that's a GREAT post! Good readin.

[Jack Sawyer]

Now I know why I am allergic to most kids

And I can't stand the rest


good post, chop chop choppastyle!

[mixchange]

if you are playing bad just play like a nit for awhile, abc conservative and you will remember how to play

like 17/12 or something, nothing too tricky just very discliplined, lots of folding, learn to fold a street earlier instead of calling turn raises when villain is screaming "OMGGG I HAVE 2P OR A SET"

I think you play 25nl and most raises are "I HAVE TEH GOODS!!!". Double barrell most of your PF raises, as a lot of people love to stick around to the turn even with whiffed Ax. Btu if you get re-raised, they're usually ahead.

[Chopper]

problem is...i am a nit already. i hit the fold button too early. i ran about 22/10, and have cut back to about 15/12....while abusing position. mostly a raise and cbet style.

but, the call stations i play make it hard to even cbet profitably. if they call a 2 barrel, you are certainly beat. and the river card doesnt help often enough.

i appreciate the advice, as it is DEAD ON. i just need to get better at believing raises and not believing bluffs. basically, post flop play. of course, everyone could get better at that..

[ackthecat]

...THIS WILL BE THE DOWNFALL OF THE UNITED STATES (the piece of shit children WE raised) if you are a parent, or are going to be one someday, bear this in mind. and, put your focus back where it should be so you dont propagate the above mentioned scenario, as it is truly a shameful one. and it will be YOUR fault. YOU can stop this vicious cycle, if you recognize it, and DECIDE you've had enough, too.

Thats the truth!! I am known as "The Mean" by my son (sometimes). I'm always in his business, know his internet passwords and know how to say no.
Any argument from there and there are consequences, and possibly more untill he finally quits arguing says yes mam and sulks back to his room. The ps2 is great because being confined to your room with no tv, ps2, etc is a punishment worse than death for a 15 year old and fortunately since he knows that consequences immediately follow actions this dosent happen often anymore.

My other rant..........The snowshovel was burried in the snow this morning!

[Chopper]

The snowshovel was burried in the snow this morning!

where in NM? Taos area?

[ackthecat]

where in NM? Taos area?

Tijeras, its about 30 miles east of albuquerque. I'm way up in the mountains at about 7200 feet so when it snows it usually snows lots. We got 4 inches in the last hour and the storm isnt moving.

[Chopper]

good stuff...unless you run out of milk. lol.

[Chopper]

so, i am running a quick sample to see how bad the rake is killing me at AP and Stars. i thought i'd play some at the 10's for kicks, calculate the rake, convert it to bb/100, and see how much it hurts.

i start of the day with a goal of 1k hands. no biggie. i 5table 6max regularly now. start off fine. hit a little spot of usual variance, and decide to tilt off the rest. i have no F-ing clue why i went on tilt. there were no bad beats... there were no overly aggressive players messing with me... no real reason. other than.....

BOREDOM!!!!

i got so friggin bored i started to call stupid shit off, and gambool on long shots. you know, the stuff that never works against donkeys.

let us count the ways: 1) sticking it in on the flop with combos (that will pay anyway when they complete). 2) bluffing at pots when the oop guy is leading into you strong on 2 streets. 3) betting flush draws for two streets (one is usually fine, but getting called on the second barrel means you had better hit your draw to win the pot). 4) calling down lightly...just to see what the table fish is doing the betting with.

you know, ALL the recipes for disaster. and, ALL in about the last 150 hands.

oh well, at least it was the 10NL's. heres the graph...for YOUR viewing pleasure. not mine.

[Chopper]

my beef is with those damned Cardinals. this may be short because my thoughts are rather uncollected...

- first, the organization is shopping Scott Rolen. fine, i guess. i love the guy. hes not what he used to be, never will be a 40 dinger guy. but, he is the best glove in our infield, and a solid bat when healthy. gap power and a bit of speed. he is a guy that hits doubles and keeps rallies going. but, you cant replace that glove w/ some pop, espcecially when you just downgraded your infield's offense over the past two years.

- izturis? most of STL is in a huff over this one because they loved Eckstein. i did, too, but he wasnt the defensive player he had been before last season. i dont mind letting him go, but i DO mind replacing him with something worse. i dont know where i stand on Izturis other than to say, "why did the Cubs and Pirates let him go?" because hes injury prone. thats why. a career .295 OBP isnt going to get it done when the rest of our offense is steadily declining. but, defensively, we'll see what he has left. i hope i am pleasantly surprised.

- injuries. always a hot button with me. these idiots in the cardinal organization have mishandled every injury over the past several years. i dont want another injury prone guy on this team, as i'm sure we will screw him up even more. these medical guys have more job security than the damned weatherman, and it makes me nuts.

- our OF is a mess, and we wont address it. edmonds is a platoon player that ownership cant let go of. duncan is a strikeout machine, as is ankiel, but larussa wont play them everyday because he doesnt like to play newer players regularly. my question: Tony, who the hell do you have to platoon them with now? i, for one, hope to see these guys everyday because thats how they learn...experience.

- this Cardinal organization is now a minor league franchise. the owners have delivered nothing but empty promises, and one very lucky world championship. their team has declined in victories each of the past four years from 105 to 100 to 83 to 78, and yet they sit and wait for home-town-discounts and wont pursue top flight free agents. the rest of this division is improving, although it is still the NL Central, while we sit like an old lady on a park bench watching all the people rollerskate, errrr, rollerblade, by while we feed the pigeons. ownership will continue to put only the minimum into the team. and, why?...

- they want to sell. cant anyone else see that? they had to finance 90+% of the new stadium themselves, which was the correct thing for the fanbase to decide btw. but, they are dumping all their money into paying down that debt, all the while raking in the dough from season tickets, corporate sponsorship, merchandising, etc. why would they put money into a competitive product if the sheep keep coming through the stiles in record numbers? i wouldnt either, honestly. but, as a fan/sheep, i would like to see some dedication to excellence without being so overtly cheap.

the ticket prices will continue to go up, the quality of baseball will continue to go down until demand drops off. lets hope the Blues can provide some competition for the STL sports dollar because the Rams cant keep their fans awake in that morgue of a dome.

they say baseball is a business, and i agree. i dont like it, and i dont have to. but, i will continue to watch on TV and bitch about it when it frustrates the shit out of me.....hence, the RANT!!!


BAAAAHHHHH (obligatory sheep sound)

[Chopper]

cynical post upcoming....

what we dont understand is just how LITTLE any of this matters. i have lost my will to even give a shit, personally.

they have their heads so far up special interest committee's asses, its not even funny. and, besides, there isnt much of a difference...politically...anyway with where any one individual will take/lead a country. you could vote in mickey mouse and the country would be no better/worse off in 4 years.

we are headed for stagflation/recession. the fed will lower rates to bail out bad lenders. economy will see a false bump. fed will raise rates to stave off inflation. repeat.

the congressmen/women will continue to spend money for the benefit of their constituents...not the country as a whole. they will continue to TRY and deliver on campaign promises to those who gave the most money, but cant fulfill said promises to most.

healthcare wont be fixed....ever. dependence on foreign oil wont be fixed...ever. alternative fuels will be a "token research project." besides, studies show alternative fuels cause more damage environmentally anyway.

global warming will be a hot topic, but any "independent" scientist tells you its all in the cycles of the sun, not much humans can do about it one way or the other. its really a way to "scare" idiot citizenship into spending money in the direction the gov't/media want you to go.

we will continue to sell our souls to China...outsourcing every piece of product we can for corporate profit. in the meantime, building THEIR economy into the largest on the planet. oh, and giving them the money to use in "oil warfare" against us. (how dumb is that?)

our society is so immediate gratification oriented...like ROME...that we will implode as a society. gov't corruption, and a citizenship too stupid to see it, will be our downfall. and it WILL happen in our children's lifetimes.

the problem is our lack of leadership, and the fact that IF we did have a real leader, he/she couldnt do anything anyway. the other party would be so busy "blocking" his/her every move that we would never see the fruits of his/her visions.

we continue to stagnate while other countries continue to catch us and pass us by.

only a matter of time.

and you can blame the very politicians you are struggling to vote for.

/rant

[biondino]

global warming will be a hot topic, but any "independent" scientist tells you its all in the cycles of the sun, not much humans can do about it one way or the other. its really a way to "scare" idiot citizenship into spending money in the direction the gov't/media want you to go.

Wait...what? Are you levelling us? Please to quote a scientist without an agenda who says global warming is unconnected to human activity (and then, for fairness, quote 100 scientists without agendas who believe the evidence points to the opposite), and then please to explain in whose interests the environmental lobby (aka scientists who know far more than you + people who don't want the planet to die) is acting?

Why do people continue to disbelieve climate change in the massive overwhelming face of evidence THAT, IF ACTED UPON, WILL (if it's not too late already) MAKE A HUGELY POSITIVE DIFFERENCE TO THEIR LIVES AND THE LIVES OF THEIR CHILDREN? Can't you see it's a win win situation? In the unlikely event that scientists are wrong, or some mechanism is discovered, natural or otherwise, to reverse climate change, then we'll still have made efforts in reducing our need for increasingly rare resources and therefore spending less money on them (not to mention cutting pollution, preserving the environment, researching cleaner, safer, cheaper forms of energy, etc etc etc).

[Chopper]

no, i am not levelling you. and, i cant provide names because i have only seen them on tv talking opposite the "warming activists." besides, do you see the oxymoron in "independent scientist?" there is no such thing. they are ALL working for someone on a grant anyway. it was sort of tongue-in-cheek, hence, my thread/my rant/my opinion.

but, as far as climate change is concerned, mother nature CAN and WILL shut it off whenever she likes. yes, pollutants caused by human inhabitation of this planet may be accelerating a process of warming, but it is a cycle of greater power causing the warming...not US. we are only adding a micropercentage to it.

environmentalists, which you sound like you are, politicians (for votes and money), and scientists (working for grants), the media (working for advertising dollars and the "green movement's" fad-like popularity) are all jumping on a "bandwagon" and blowing it out of proportion. they want you to believe you can control it...YOU CANT. they want you to pass their legislation (containing other agendas...see Port Security and Frist). players like Al Gore, who want to pile up money while really looking for INFLUENCE, are using this forum even though they dont really give a shit, imo. sure, he TELLS you he cares, but he really wants the popularity and influence that comes with it. btw, Gore's money came from mines in Tennessee (aluminum i think) that cause more pollution than he cares to fix. oh, and his wife's Heinz catsup fortune. so, forgive me if i feel he is insincere as the rest of them.


wait, before i get all caught up in this....

i am NOT against the environment. i am against believing WE (humans) caused the change. i am against the sensationalizing of the same theory. its simply not proven yet. and cant be for a long time. we dont have HUMAN WRITTEN records/samples that go back far enough into history/pre-history. we only have about 100-125 years, and most of that is non-scientific by today's standards.

we do, however, have some ice samples that suggest the earth has been MUCH warmer, and contained MUCH more carbon dioxide back as far as 400k years ago...when human ancestors were still walking on all fours. however, it is being suggested that the result is "polarization" of the earth's temperatures. the cold up north/south and the warm in the middle...with NO mixing. result: ICE AGE. not overwhelming warmth. this is caused by a number of factors. sun cycles, magnetic fields being altered, melting seawater shutting off ocean currents due to desalination of salt content, trade winds closing down, etc.

mother nature HAS done it before w/o humans. and she will do it again w/ or w/o humans. the question is: how important a part are we? i say we are more insignificant than people want you to believe. its human nature to be egotistical and arrogant...to think WE are the end-all and be-all to everything we touch. the fact is: we are NOT as important as we think we are...ever. we are just a blip on the time line.

all i am saying is lets not go crazy passing all sorts of regulations that increase pollutants by their manufacturing or decrease economy causing us to use MORE fuel. lets not buy into the bandwagon sensationalists that still have NO CLUE what they are preaching, but think they do. and certainly dont buy into what a corrupt POLITICIAN says when he absolutely has no clue about what he speaks.

biondino, i'm not going to change your mind, and youre not going to change mine. no amount of "quoting sources" will accomplish this. i am also not the most articulate poster around, either. so my points prolly wont come across correctly. but, they are just as valid as any other theory out there. but, i dont care to do the research to provide the sources because its a smattering of here and there. just things i've picked up and provided my own thought to as well.

[Muzzard]

I agree with chopper, it hasn't been proved and I doubt it can ever be proved, that the sole cause of this was human alone. he is correct in saying there are cycles where it gets cooler/warmer and this could be one.

Even if we are contibuting to the problem stopping things that possibily exacerbate the problem would only shave seconds off the 'end of the world'.

Also, the sun will eventually engulf the whole world - so all this effort is in aid of...? WE ARE ALL GOING TO DIE AND THE HUMAN POPULATION WILL CEASE EVENTUALLY. Deal with it

[biondino]

I don't disagree for a second that what nature can do, has done and will do again can outweigh any efforts humans make to bugger up the planet. Problem is, we still don't have anywhere else to go, so when it seems very likely that we ARE having a negative effect, then all we can do is try and reverse it.

Have you seen the hockey stick graph? Let me see if I can find it, one sec.



There are no known natural phenomena that can cause such a massive and immediate change. The graph doesn't prove that this kind of spike hasn't happened before records existed, you're right, but it does prove that it's NOT natural, because a change of this magnitude would almost certainly be catastrophic in some way and wouldn't have just slipped by without anyone noticing.

There is a massive amount of evidence where the only conclusion is that, in various ways, we are behaving in ways which actively contribute to climate change, whether it's CFCs in fridges (banned since 1990 or so), the clearing of peat bogs which releases the carbon dioxide stored therein, the massive increase in livestock which produce massive amounts of methane, a far more potent greenhouse gas than CO2, the thawing of the permafrost (see peat bogs), and the millions upon millions of tons of greenhouse gases produced by power stations, factories and vehicles. There is incontrovertible proof that atmospheric CO2 concentrations have increased by 30-40% in only a few decades. How is this not convincing to you? All of the above is fact, not theory, not propaganda, and that's just off the top of my relatively ignorant head.

Regarding your view of politicians, I agree with you 100% - their self-interest will almost always come first. Which doesn't necessarily mean they will misinform or deceive, but you certainly need to watch them carefully. I do, however, think you're very hard on scientists. There will always be agendas, and people will always abuse statistics to prove a point. But the massive majority of scientists live or die by the veracity of their work - the whole point of science is that its theories are falsifiable, and any good scientist will work 100 times harder to DISPROVE his own theories than any political or media critics. So when there is an enormous amount of evidence that strongly points to a consensus about many of man's activities actively causing climate change, you can't just say "oh, it's in their interests to say that" because there is far, far too much proof, or as near as dammit, that a great deal of what they posit is accurate. And denial in the face of this evidence, especially when the consequences could be so terrible, is bloody minded to a ridiculous degree.

[biondino]

I agree with chopper, it hasn't been proved and I doubt it can ever be proved, that the sole cause of this was human alone. he is correct in saying there are cycles where it gets cooler/warmer and this could be one.

Fine, ignore the cause. The fact is we're going to suffer horrifically in generations to come and the more we can do to avert this the better.

Denying all the evidence that we are largely responsible for climate change is a bit like blaming the rigging of poker sites for your losses. Yeah, it's *possible*, but actually if you look a bit harder you'll find a lot of evidence in your play that you may just be responsible yourself. Either way, your play is the only thing you can do anything about, so are you going to try and improve, or are you going to continue stacking off and crying about how the nasty p0ker sites stole your $$$?

(p.s. I'm using a general "you", not directed at anyone's poker skillz!)

[Muzzard]

Lol the graph is for the last 2000 years only. Lets take the whole cycle of the earth. We are in a cool cycle, so it getting warmer is normal.

look at the whole picture. Increase/decrease in temp change is normal and has happened even before humans existed.



Also, I would like to add that CO2 levels are historically at one of the lowest levels ever.

[Chopper]

i absolutely love good debate. too bad i suck at the evidence part of it. so, thank you both for bringing graphs to the table.

no one denies that we could be causing this warmup to occur at a faster rate than ever before. but, the fact is, we simply dont have proof.

how do you know that the measures Gore & Company want you to take arent going to have an equally opposite affect? we could try so hard to stop a warm up that we inspire a cool down. can you prove that wrong? of course not, because we dont have the historical evidence to know WTF we are doing....yet. its mankind's innate desire to "play God" that is running amuck here. and, i dont like seeing the media and politicians getting involved. the scientists i dont mind....at least they went to school for this stuff and chose to make it their livelihood. besides, they need a forum to foster change anyway. without someone noticing, a scientist has rarely brought anything to fruition. nothing against science...just stating a fact.

this is just like environmentalists saying, "wow. look at all that algae in the water. i wish it were cleaner like when i was a kid." and, scientists saying, "we need to introduce japanese carp to control that algae problem." a politician saying, "now theres a platform i can run on. lets clean up those rivers."

25 years pass, the carp population is exploding because they are not in their natural habitat with natural predators to control their breeding. sure, there is no algae in the water anymore, but now all the carp are ruining the environment of other native fishes that WE depend on to eat. that WE depend on to catch and sell. that WE depend on to keep fisherman employed so the local economy will stay solvent. that whole chain is in jeapordy now, and how do we repair it? NEVER FUCK WITH IT IN THE FIRST PLACE!

who is to blame? the environmentalist that didnt know what he was doing...who just needed a cause to justify his being? the scientist for knowing how to fix the problem? or the politician for using his platform for personal gain?

ALL OF THEM.

not one of these people should have screwed with mother nature in the first place. they THOUGHT they were helping. their intentions were good-hearted. BUT, they couldnt keep themselves from playing God. and, as a result, they created a new problem...a bigger problem.

all because they couldnt let NATURE TAKE ITS COURSE.

mother nature will correct this warming issue when SHE sees fit. and, if we screw it up real bad, it could wipe humans off the face of the planet.

biondino, i know we are mostly having some fun here, but seriously...get cracking on finding that other liveable planet. and give me the first ticket to board up. in fact, we can play HU for the last ticket....lol.

i agree that we have no where else to go, but i dont have a clue how to solve that problem.

i agree that the sun will probably swallow the earth whole, but i doubt humankind will be around to see it happen. maybe fish will be the dominant species by then. but, again, theres another "theory" that we cant possibly prove. it, too, is just speculation.

carry on boys. this is kind of fun.

[Jack Sawyer]

Chopper I missed your global warming rant.


The Earth has undoubtedly seen many cycles. However, we're accelerating the course of nature with our greenhouse gasses, which have already been dealt with in the past in order for us to get nice and blue skies. Waaaaaaaaaay back in the past.

I just don't want the world to become like Venus. I am doing my small part in helping with it.


And yes, a scientist without an agenda cannot deny what is going on, *the severity* of what is going on. Those on Exxon's or Shell's payroll have to deny. Its simple.

[Jack Sawyer]

I want to get good at pokah so I can buy this house and outfit it with solar power thingies, and cultivate my own wine, and have my own harem


Look at how environmentally friendly I am this will be my next home if i ever make it big and you'll all be invited so we can play some omaha in the french fucking riviera

*house in cannes

[Chopper]

i would prefer to play you in some dominoes.

and, dont anybody get me wrong...again. i am not drinking gasoline. i am not throwing used diapers in the river.

i am just no going crazy overboard with all the recycling, either.

[biondino]

Lol the graph is for the last 2000 years only. Lets take the whole cycle of the earth. We are in a cool cycle, so it getting warmer is normal.

look at the whole picture. Increase/decrease in temp change is normal and has happened even before humans existed.



Also, I would like to add that CO2 levels are historically at one of the lowest levels ever.

Everything you say is accurate, but the problem is that you see the short time span as making my argument worthless when it fact it's the entire point. No-one would argue that over huge timescales, temperatures and CO2 levels have changed hugely, and no-one would argue that they're at their lowest ever, looked at in geologic time. The terrifying thing is that within the blink of an eye, geologically speaking, we have been responsible for a massive relative jump in CO2 levels and in a rise in temperature.

It is irrelevant what CO2 levels or temperature were like 100 million years ago because it didn't affect us. What matters is now, and the evidence strongly suggests (without quite, yet, being the "proof" that Chopper requires) that we are doing the planet ill on a catastrophic scale in a phenomenally short timespan.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, and scientists are performing tests which already seem to indicate the duckness of the object, are you not going to consider there's a strong possibility it might be a duck, and plan accordingly for a duck-filled future (I recommend confiting it)?

[Muzzard]

OK then.

The terrifying thing is that within the blink of an eye, geologically speaking, we have been responsible for a massive relative jump in CO2 levels and in a rise in temperature.

Let's not present opinion as fact. We can estimate levels of CO2 and teperature historically, we cannot estimate the exponential growth of this at certain periods of time with accuracy. Who is to say it is not normal growth?

Looking at things from a different angle... I dont really care if it us or not. There are far too many people on the earth at the moment. Some of of need to die, or in fact a lot of us. Let's hope that 'global warming' kills about 4billion, then we'll be on the right track.

[Chopper]

time to change it up. that was fun, though.

heres another opinion that should be ill-received...

i was talking with and FTR'r about Bush's legacy. i dont know how we got on the topic, but i'm sure i started it.

i said i thought Bush was going to be a great president because of business background and delegation to people who knew more about specific areas than he did. i thought it would be a classic example of an idiot getting tremendous credit because he staffed himself well. i was wrong, obv.

but, the subject of the War in Iraq came up, and i dont get a lot of support for my thinking we should stay the course. i have not changed my opinion from the very beginning. that...

WE SHOULD ONLY START THIS WAR IF WE ARE WILLING TO FINISH IT APPROPRIATELY, AND I DONT THINK WE ARE. THE NEXT PRESIDENT WILL TRY TO RUIN WHAT THE PREVIOUS ONE DID AND ASSESS BLAME TO THE PREVIOUS PRESIDENT; THEREFORE, ALL LIVES LOST IN THIS WAR WILL BE FOR NOTHING...AND I WOULDNT WANT TO HAVE TO TELL THOSE FAMILIES THAT THEIR SON/DAUGHTER DIED FOR NOTHING...LIKE VIETNAM.

heres more detail of my thoughts, if you care to read/debate...

yeah, but i'm not sold on it not being his fault. i think there was a lot of "personal agenda" in slanting things so we felt justified in going in. a lot of it to avenge his father's lack of closure in '92. i think a boy at any age still wants to make daddy proud and pick up where daddy left off. just a hunch.

here's my thing with Iraq, though. and, this hasnt been popular lately. i feel we need to stay there...as long as we are committed to finishing the job (whatever the job may be). and, that will take decades. we are dealing with some real goof balls over there. people we dont understand on the most basic of levels. and they HATE us, to boot.

but, you dont start a war and leave it unresolved because it is "taking too long." apparently, the general public didnt learn anything from Vietnam or Korea. should we have gone to Iraq? based on the information we had...maybe. but, that doesnt matter anymore. WE ARE THERE.

we are fighting a "religious war" that we never realized the severity of, imo. holy wars take hundreds of years to end. we should have known that ahead of time, too. we should have weighed that into our decision to even begin a war. and, we didnt.

if we pull out before this thing is finished...to our satisfaction...every soldier who died, died for NOTHING. and, i dont want to be the person delivering that news to mothers and fathers. each day the toll goes up a bit. and, it gets harder to explain to MORE families why their son died. but, at least they died for something if we stay the course.

the real problem, imo, is politics. i knew, as should have the rest of this country, that bush had 8 years to fix this war (impossible in a holy war with fanatics). if he couldnt, the next president will be elected primarily on an anti-war, bring home the troops campaign...and will most likely be from the opposing party. what does that mean?

it means that the next president, politically opposed to the former one, will try and UNDO everything the last one did. they always do. and, that means pulling troops out. ending the conflict, sort of (the arent done with us), and having to tell all the families their soldiers died in vain...for nothing. BUT, the new president will blame it all on the old one. and because the families are bitter about their loss, they will accept that blame instead of noticing WHO pulled the troops out. the person who pulls out the troops, is the one that ends the war. and, HE is to blame for all the soldiers dying in vain.

so, yes, in hindsight, this is a war that should not have ever started. why? not because we weren't justified to go in, but because this country will never finish what it starts. and that concept of commitment transcends all political lines. it is not a political party thing, its a LEADERSHIP thing. and this country has NONE!!

sad, but true.

[Chopper]

had to get rid of incriminating evidence...ldo.

[XTR1000]

I am a happy single

[wesrman]

....

[Rondavu]

Why the FUCK cant the women sit down for a second? why must they feel the urge to be busting their asses ALL friggin' weekend? then, they cry at the end because they are "physically exhausted." WTF? who's fucking fault is that?

First of all you're generalizing women. It's your particular human partner who can't sit down for a second. Some "people" are wound that way.

When she cries at the end because she's physically exhausted, she's asking you for something. She wants you to comfort her, and appreciate her. She wants you to say something like "Oh poor baby let me get you a pillow, you work so hard".

Now I have to be a little tough on you. When you say "WTF? who's fucking fault is that?", it basically tells me you can't be bothered with analyzing her emotions and needs to the end of meeting them. Don't listen to what's coming out of her mouth. Listen to what she's saying. They're two different things. Figure it out or be single.

Also, LOL at single people analyzing relationships.

[Chopper]

rondavu,

this was a rant, and supposed to come from the comedic "men are from mars, women are from venus" angle.

forgive me for saying you took this a bit too seriously.

i agree, in reality, with what you said. and, have been in said relationship for 10 years. we arent going anywhere.

truth be told, i get pissed when i repeatedly get asked to do things. but, truth also be told, i got her a frozen bag of peas for her foot (plantar fascaitis, or however its spelled).

dont take anything i post here too seriously. my priorities remain on solid ground, at all times.

God
Family
Business
...in that order.

[kmind]

Also, LOL at single people analyzing relationships.

Isn't this generalizing single people?

[Rondavu]

Also, LOL at single people analyzing relationships.

Isn't this generalizing single people?

Isn't this generalizing generalizing?


Awwwww ya, leveled like a bitch

[Chopper]

no need for this to go 4 levels....is there? lol. nice plays, guys.

[kmind]

He beat me...straight up. Pay him...pay that man his money

(carry on chopper)

[Chopper]

hand check...

Pokerstars Game (?) HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($0.05/$0.10) - 2008/02/28 - 18:06:01 (ET)
Table 'Carme II' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: Harrylux ($10.05 in chips)
Seat 2: zittr ($6.90 in chips)
Seat 4: NYBigB ($12.75 in chips)
Seat 5: verysolvent ($17.75 in chips)
Seat 6: biggman ($13.30 in chips)
Seat 7: Hero ($6 in chips)
Seat 8: filigrante ($7 in chips)
Seat 9: Danny Briere ($7.50 in chips)
filigrante: posts small blind $0.05
Danny Briere: posts big blind $0.10
pillagerseb: sits out

Holecards:
Dealt to Hero [ ]
FOLD Harrylux
CALL zittr, $0.10
FOLD NYBigB
FOLD verysolvent
CALL biggman, $0.10
CALL Hero , $0.10
RAISE filigrante, $0.40 to $0.50
CALL Danny Briere, $0.40
CALL zittr, $0.40
FOLD biggman
CALL Hero , $0.40

Flop: (Pot: $2.1)
[ ]
CHECK filigrante:
CHECK Danny Briere:
CHECK zittr:
CHECK Hero :

Turn: (Pot: $2.1)
[ ] [ ]
CHECK filigrante:
CHECK Danny Briere:
BET zittr, $1
RAISE Hero , $4.50 to $5.50 and is all-in
FOLD filigrante
FOLD Danny Briere
CALL zittr, $4.50

River: (Pot: $13.1)
[ ] [ ]

Showdown:

[kmind]

HH messed up

[wesrman]

I get it all in on the flop.

[Chopper]

lol... you fuckers are fast. i was only testing it. and, i tried to delete it before you got to it. lmao.

heres the fixed one...

$0.05/$0.1 No Limit Holdem
8 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($10.05)
UTG+1 ($6.90)
MP1 ($12.75)
MP2 ($17.75)
CO ($13.30)
Hero ($6.00)
SB ($7.00)
BB ($7.50)

Pre-flop: ($0.15, 8 players) Hero is BTN
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.1, 2 folds, CO calls $0.1, Hero calls $0.1, SB raises to $0.5, BB calls $0.4, UTG+1 calls $0.4, CO folds, Hero calls $0.4

Flop: ($2.1, 4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($2.1, 4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 bets $1, Hero goes all-in $5.5, SB folds, BB folds, UTG+1 calls $4.5

River: ($13.1, 2 players)

Final Pot: $13.10
UTG+1 shows:
Hero shows:

UTG+1 wins $12.45 ( won +$6.45 )
CO lost -$0.10
Hero lost -$6.00
SB lost -$0.50
BB lost -$0.50

[Chopper]

i'm going to take my push out, replace with ??, and post it to see what people say.

you guys know the results, dont rat me out. k?

[bjsaust]

This should be a great play, but at these levels people dont fold, so inevitably semi-bluffs like this cost me monies.

[Jack Sawyer]

Pre-flop: ($0.15, 8 players) Hero is BTN
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.1, 2 folds, CO calls $0.1, Hero calls $0.1, SB raises to $0.5, BB calls $0.4, UTG+1 calls $0.4, CO folds, Hero calls $0.4

don't do this, chopper