The end of the world as we know it

[Savy]

Wow, rilla is at the point where global warming denial is on a par with creationism.

It is funny that your friends mum tells you something and you think the world is on the brink yet tonnes of evidence backing something up and it's hearsay.

[OngBonga]

It is funny that your friends mum tells you something and you think the world is on the brink yet tonnes of evidence backing something up and it's hearsay.

Yeah because I trust my friend's mum, but not media. My friend's mum is at the very least sincere in her beliefs, and is way better qualified to make that claim than I ever could be.

[Poopadoop]

So anyone who knows more than you about something must be right? Unless they're a scientist?

[OngBonga]

So anyone who knows more than you about something must be right? Unless they're a scientist?

Do you know what trust means?

[Poopadoop]

Do you know what trust means?

Yes, and it's understandable you trust your friend's mom more than a complete stranger. But I also think there has to be some faith that qualified people who study the matter intensely and have no obvious interest in lying have a better grasp on things like global warming than you or I.

[Poopadoop]

In Ong's defense, there is a difficulty in proving global warming based simply on mean global temperatures. The kind of time scales and fluctuations involved mean it would take probably centuries to 'prove' global warming is for real.

The crux of the matter to me though is the fact that the concentrations of greenhouse gases have been rising exponentially since industrialization began. If that isn't resulting in global warming then they will need to rewrite all the geology texts.

[OngBonga]

In Ong's defense, there is a difficulty in proving global warming based simply on mean global temperatures. The kind of time scales and fluctuations involved mean it would take probably centuries to 'prove' global warming is for real.

The crux of the matter to me though is the fact that the concentrations of greenhouse gases have been rising exponentially since industrialization began. If that isn't resulting in global warming then they will need to rewrite all the geology texts.

Why are you assuming that a build up of gasses implies an increase in temperature? It could, for all we mere mortals know, result in a cooling, as more solar radiation is reflected back into space. There's a logical argument supporting cooling and warming.

Furthermore, there's a balancing act that goes on in nature. The warmer something gets, the more it radiates energy, and thus, the quicker it cools. That's why hot water freezes quicker than cold water. So if the planet is warming up, then it's also losing more heat in the form of radiation. Nature can deal with warming.

There's no need for panic. The sea levels aren't rising like they said they would be. Thermal expansion of the oceans isn't happening, because it's nonsense. The VAST majority of water in the oceans is deep water, and isn't going to be even remotely influenced by a degree or two of surface warming. There's a Pacific nation that has a vested interest in playing the climate change card to get foreign aid... they refused to allow a video to be shown by a Swedish scientist who claims there's nothing for them to worry about.

I'm not buying it. This decade is cooler than last, based on my observations here in the UK. I strongly suspect that the warm period of 2000-2010 was natural fluctuation. There's much more pressing things to worry about... air quality is one of them so the global warming myth at least can do some good.

[OngBonga]

But I also think there has to be some faith that qualified people who study the matter intensely and have no obvious interest in lying have a better grasp on things like global warming than you or I.

Ok, this is fair enough. But what is it to "study"? If I want to learn about something, such as water filters, I go to wikipedia. I'm learning what someone else has written. If I then filter water as advised, and it's clean enough for me to consider it a success, then I'm going to assume that what I was told is truth. I might even teach other how to make water filters, spreading the knowledge. But how do I actually know that it worked as a result of what I was taught? I'm making a leap of faith. So, too, is every scientist who trusts their education.

The problem isn't necessarily that qualified people are lying directly to the people, the problem might be much more deep rooted than that. Maybe people are being taught lies as they become qualified.

Ultimately, the distrust is still aimed at the system, not the person.

[Poopadoop]

Ultimately, the distrust is still aimed at the system, not the person.

Well obviously I'm biased, but I think the system of science has been shown to work pretty well over the years, no? I'm not saying mistakes haven't been made but on the balance it seems to me that science has been one of mankind's more successful ventures.

[Savy]

Yeah because I trust my friend's mum, but not media. My friend's mum is at the very least sincere in her beliefs, and is way better qualified to make that claim than I ever could be.

It's very hard to believe that a media run by rich people are pushing an agenda that makes people want to implement policies which lose them money. You'd think the millions they spend trying to squash things like that would be somewhat at odds.

[OngBonga]

It's very hard to believe that a media run by rich people are pushing an agenda that makes people want to implement policies which lose them money. You'd think the millions they spend trying to squash things like that would be somewhat at odds.

Well let's assume just for one minute that is is all bollocks. I wouldn't assume that their lies are losing them money, I would assume the opposite. I'm not going to pretend how the complexities of that works, but I'm gonna suggest that maybe it's for the greater benefit of big business due to excessive regulations killing the smaller competition. Fuck knows. But if they're lying about it, then they're not losing money, they're making it.