Ultimate Werewolf

[OngBonga]

lynch mojo

L-1

[baudib]

Baud...since you're lurking at day's end and nuthin else is goin' on...why did you vary your voting this game by sticking with just one bold all day? You hit Daven 15mins into it and never moved. Are you no longer hunting with bolds?

The Daven vote was originally a joke but he came in howling and has done absolutely nothing since to convince me he's a villager.

but MMM was a runaway wagon from the get-go, where exactly was I going to go? Daven has taken the Gator defense of ignoring the fact that he's a wagon. So if the 2nd wagon isn't even responding to pressure, what good is it to bold anyone else?

Though tbh, I would usually eye people off-wagon with a suspicious eye here, I kinda respect it.

[baudib]

alright, looks like a done deal.

glgl, we're gonna need it I think.

[OngBonga]

daven isn't defending himself because he's in New Zealand and it's first thing in the morning there.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Who are they?


My friends... why?

[baudib]

I thought he was in UK. but he didn't seem interested in villaging himself out of it and disappeared at exactly the time he started getting more votes.

[Keybored]

lynch mojo

L-1

Monkey begs for his life and you cap his ass without cause.
dude...that was harsh.
your vote meant nothing since MMM was already L-1 (tie breaker).
stone cold, bro.

[OngBonga]

Monkey begs for his life and you cap his ass without cause.
dude...that was harsh.
your vote meant nothing since MMM was already L-1 (tie breaker).
stone cold, bro.

I don't think I finished him, but if I did it doesn't matter. And I don't care if he's begging for his life. Remember me begging for my life last game? I've explained why I'm not lynching daven.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Post #554 summarizes my final reads.

See you on the flip side.

[baudib]

Ong's vote doesn't matter, unless he's protecting Daven from a snipe from another wolf.

gg MMM

[OngBonga]

I thought he was in UK. but he didn't seem interested in villaging himself out of it and disappeared at exactly the time he started getting more votes.

We do pretty well for an international community. There's only really daven and boog that I can recall who ever found it difficult to engage in real time.

[Luco]

10 minutes left.

gg mmm

[baudib]

or protecting MMM. IDK. figure it out later I guess.

[monstrman]

im so glad you brought this up because ive been saving this argument for when it was time to unload on monstrman: does everyone see the dissonance here? i think its clear. he tells me what i said about him was "very bad reasoning." then later in the same post, he explains the exact reasoning I was using, except its applied to himself. the 2nd bold part is exactly how i think about the situation, but earlier in his post he said this was "very bad reasoning" !!! its like in his head he was trying his hardest to defend the first attack on him because hes a wolf (or special?), but the other half of his brain was trying to look like a villager.

How is that the exact same reasoning you are using?

I was literally saying "I won't be impossible to read, but I will have a hard time reading many of the people here because of a lack of experience in the thread." Those two sentences are not dissonance, nor are they mutually exclusive because one explicitly means, in my opinion, "I'm not going to try to read you and jump out the gate trying to lynch you" ergo: my reaction

and the other explicitly means, in my opinion, "I will have a difficult time reading you" but at no point do I throw my hands up into the air and say "I'm going to refuse to try." And I think I've made quite a few reads from tricks of the trade I've learned through villaging at PoG like reading threadflow and tone of players and to be honest I just see you constantly tunneling me and it gives me a rough time being able to try to be objective about your alignment, which I know is flawed logic but you have to admit when someone comes at you it's hard to shrug off the initial reaction of "Why is this person reading me wrong, are they a wolf trying to lynch me?"

[baudib]

10 minutes left.

gg mmm

it's funny cuz on the other site we could probably start 2 whole wagons in 10 mins.

[OngBonga]

Ong's vote doesn't matter, unless he's protecting Daven from a snipe from another wolf.

gg MMM

I dunno what the votes where, I threw mine back on mojo to increase the chance it's him who dies. I think he's more likely to be a wolf based on wagon dynamics. If I were acting on gut, I'd say daven is wolfier, but wagon dynamics > gut on d1 imo.

[monstrman]

I'm not too sure about gabe and rong.

Lurkers:
BID, aubrey, JKDS, monstr

I would love for you to read the champions game I'm in and tell me that you expect amazing participation from me on both sites especially considering I am clearly far more invested in the other game. I was told when signing up I could be slightly lower volume and not have to deal with the stress which is partly the only reason I joined because the posts in the champions game just reached #4913.

[monstrman]

No offense to this site but I was in that game first and it is a lot more post-intensive environment and it makes it difficult for me to shift gears so massively between the two cultures of PoG and FTR especially with the lack of meta that I have on this site.

[monstrman]

Sorry I don't mean to sound rude or anything.

I'm trying as hard as I can to be present in both sites with as much participation as I am capable of giving.

[Luco]

it's funny cuz on the other site we could probably start 2 whole wagons in 10 mins.

sounds like fun

[baudib]

sounds like fun

yeah I don't think it's the greatest village strategy. I had a chat with the mod about it in dead chat and I was like, "hey we spend all day talking about the wagons, get up to like 2,000 posts in 12 hours, and then everyone gets buyer's remorse and says, "hey let's lynch someone else."

but i've seen it work, and more importantly, the vote switching leads to finding wolves quite often.

[Hoopy]

Day is over.

Vote Count 1.6

MMM - 7 (wuf, rong, dhuber, aubrey, BID, daven, Ong)
daven - 6 (baudib, keybored, Luco, MMM, bigred, monstrman)
keybored - 1 (keith)
monstrman - 1 (gabe)

No vote - (JKDS)

[baudib]

Monstr, don't talk too much about the Champs game, I might sub in if Yamato doesn't post soon.

I'm not qualified to be in it, but then neither are you!

#SHOTSFIRED

[Luco]

yeah I don't think it's the greatest village strategy. I had a chat with the mod about it in dead chat and I was like, "hey we spend all day talking about the wagons, get up to like 2,000 posts in 12 hours, and then everyone gets buyer's remorse and says, "hey let's lynch someone else."

but i've seen it work, and more importantly, the vote switching leads to finding wolves quite often.

i said fun, not smart

[monstrman]

Monstr, don't talk too much about the Champs game, I might sub in if Yamato doesn't post soon.

I'm not qualified to be in it, but then neither are you!

#SHOTSFIRED

I take a moderately irritated corycurren level of offense to that

:P

[baudib]

yeah CP told me I'll be first sub in.

[OngBonga]

Hurry up and cut his head off!

[Keybored]

hey momo...no matter what you flip, I thought you played a cool game given the bad rap from last one. Cheers!

[Keybored]

Hurry up and cut his head off!

chill, have a toke and a smile.
I don't like Gangsta Ong...or would that be Gongsta?

[OngBonga]

Funnily enough that's exactly what I'm doing.

[Hoopy]

With everyone stuck inside dhuber's house MMM has a bright idea to lighten the mood. A Physics lecture!

As he powers through Quantum Powers 101 a nasty integral appears. "No problem" he gloats, "my laptop can do this". "You promised cats" whines bigred.

MMM boots up his laptop while saying "I'm ganging to solve this beauty". "Wat" says rong.

"Mathematica to the rescue" says MMM. A box appears with "powered by Wolfram Language" in it.

A tense silence is broken by baudib. "So you speak the wolves language eh".

MMM turns pale. "Now wait a minute guys".

"GET HIM" screams BID.

The mob beats MMM to death with the "Quantum Physics for Dummies" textbox he'd handed out.

Pity he was a regular villager.


The Village
dhuber
BID
Luco
Ong
wuf
bigred
baudib
JKDS
keith
daven
aubrey
keybored
gabe
monstrman
rong


Seer
Priest
Tough Guy
7 Regular Villagers
Miller
Cursed Villager
3 Wolves


MMM, a regular villager, was lynched day 1.

[OngBonga]

Well I think this means daven is a villager too. Wolves dithering leaving daven vulnerable makes no sense if he's a wolf. wuf has a point that sometimes crazy stuff happens, but it's not the norm. Seems like they were happy with either lynch, but didn't interfere because daven villager is a better lynch than mojo villager.

Anyway I'm taking it really easy by night. Call it wolfy all you like but it's fucking hard work as a wolf posting by night, so I'm not going to do it as villager either.

zzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Hoopy]

Night 1

It is now night! Night will last 24hrs, or less if all actions have been completed early.

Feel free to talk/gibber in terror/post lolcats.

[monstrman]

Well I think this means daven is a villager too. Wolves dithering leaving daven vulnerable makes no sense if he's a wolf. wuf has a point that sometimes crazy stuff happens, but it's not the norm. Seems like they were happy with either lynch, but didn't interfere because daven villager is a better lynch than mojo villager.

Anyway I'm taking it really easy by night. Call it wolfy all you like but it's fucking hard work as a wolf posting by night, so I'm not going to do it as villager either.

zzzzzzzzzzzzz

I said the first part first but in different words

[monstrman]

And not with the same conviction in daven being a villager

I just had a hunch we were all heading in the wrong direction but it seems like on this site the lynches are who they are

[baudib]

Ong could be right about this.

Id really like to hear from the people who voted MMM thinking he was a villager. Now that your distraction is gone, I assume you will be putting forth superstar effort.

[Hoopy]

Hurry up and cut his head off!

You bloodthirsty Englishman!

[Keybored]

Who was it that didn't vote last game d1??

[Hoopy]

Who was it that didn't vote last game d1??

You rang?

[Keybored]

Nevermind, it was Hoopy. But still...how the hell do you ever not vote??

JKDS ... wtf?

[Keybored]

Well I think this means daven is a villager too. Wolves dithering leaving daven vulnerable makes no sense if he's a wolf. wuf has a point that sometimes crazy stuff happens, but it's not the norm. Seems like they were happy with either lynch, but didn't interfere because daven villager is a better lynch than mojo villager.

I agree with this reasoning. But I gotta look at the voting more closely. Shall take a look at its potential tonight...

[Hoopy]

Change of plan

I think we'll say no night posting this game. I've been talking to rilla about it and it's too much in the village's favor, thread will lock shortly.

Get some sleep guys, sorry for the sudden change.

[baudib]

WAT!

[Hoopy]

All through the house nothing was stirring, except Ong.

Despite the fact he'd locked himself securely in the bathroom getting to sleep was proving difficult due to the nightmarish creatures out to kill them and the fact that bathtubs are only meant to be slept in by drunk people.

Fortunately Ong had managed to sneak in some magic pills when everybody piled into dhuber's house. He pops a couple of them.

Now I don't know much about magic pills.

But any pill that causes you to cartwheel down the street naked while telling various pieces of garden furniture that you'll take them to poundtown doesn't seem like a great idea.

Three shadowy figures follow him down the street.

Ong, a regular villager, was killed by the wolves on night 1.

[Keybored]

Hello?

[Hoopy]

Day 2

The day will last 72hrs, 8 votes to lynch!


The Village
dhuber
BID
Luco
wuf
bigred
baudib
JKDS
keith
daven
aubrey
keybored
gabe
monstrman
rong


Seer
Priest
Tough Guy
6 Regular Villagers
Miller
Cursed Villager
3 Wolves


MMM, a regular villager, was lynched day 1.
Ong, a regular villager, was killed by the wolves on night 1.

[dhubermex]

Well, not the flip I was hoping for on MMM lynch and I'm sad to see Ong go. I was suspicious of him given his first posts, but he indeed was coming off as Villagery recently and I would've probably worked with him.

I stand behind my vote for MMM, but now that that's done with I need to go over the thread in more detail and focus more on the posts of others.

Post #707 may have had something to do with Ong's night kill. If so, I wonder how the Wolves intended us to react.

[Keybored]

Wowzers! Gonna miss ya, Ong. RIP. Blasted wolves...

[Hoopy]

I know that I rather suddenly switched to having silent nights, that's my fault and sorry to those who were ready to talk about day 1.

I'll explain why I changed the rule after the game, and maybe create a thread as well to discuss night posting in general.

For now day 2 is go!

[baudib]

LOL WOLVES/gg Ong

Who were Ong's wolf leans?

[Keybored]

The MMM Wagon:
KEITH (camped out all day, only to pull out last minute)
WUF (camped out nearly all day after a meaningless early snap vote on Dhub)
DHUBER (one/only bold all day)
RONG (one/only bold all day)
AUBREY (one/only bold all day)
BID (one/only bold all day)
DAVEN (bolded end of day)
ONG (cinch vote)

So, MMM had a bad rap coming into this game. Got it, but it’s bad for the village to lynch someone solely because of a grudge. Yah, the guy acted a fool early but that behavior lasted <9hrs. He self-recognized a bad move and was back to himself rest of the day. Whereupon, he made a good case that showed absolutely no wolf and he continued to hunt along with the village. I bolded him early but I moved on after he sobered up.

However, despite ppl on the wagon stating that he was probably a villager, they continued to camp out. Even when Baud, Monstr, Luco and I defended him and we asked ppl to start wolf hunting instead.

Many think day-1 isn’t a huge deal and that there’s never enough to work with conclusively; so, let’s just lynch whomever. But that’s a copout, especially given the familiarity within FTR. And 700 posts is plenty of info to go on. If you’re a villager interested in killing wolves, then STOP voting to lynch ppl you don’t think are wolves...

Keith: Vows pregame to snap-lynch MMM and does. “MMM is going to be a distraction on later days. (#402)”

Rong: “Instinctively wanna lynch mmm…he's playing well, not actually like a wolf, but like someone who gets lynched. So maybe he's not a wolf. (#69)” “To be clear he's sold me he's a villager but he has to go for pulling the trick in the first place. (#194)” “I wanna lynch mmm in spite of the majority of his behavior falling into the villagery side of things. (#500)” “He's posted a lot since then and I find him less wolfy now than I did then. (#501)”

BID: “I agree with rong regarding MMM (#70)” “I'm good with an MMM lynch (#220)” “Gonna make this real easy. lynch mmm (#242)” “re:MMM He'll be a distraction in future days where he'll be the reason for a wagon every day. (#400)”

Wuf: “Villagers who pretend to be anything other than villagers are only making the wolves' job easier. (#196)” “I'm posting like d1 is done. Because it is. Under which circumstances will we not lynch MMM? I'm just waiting for the death of the person I want lynched. (#353)” “TBH I just skimmed over the last two pages. I feel like we're doing way too much. We already have way more than enough to kill MMM. So let's kill MMM today (#590)”

Aubrey: “Jumped on MMM 'cause MMM made himself super easy target. (#227)” “for now I will jump on the mmm bandwagon because I am curious to see what comes of that (#241)” “I know I voted for mmm but I agree with this (Keybored), because he's (MMM’s) def scapegoat. (#420)” “i want to rescind MMM but i can't decide who i would like to put my vote on (#563)”

Ong: “…mojo is scapegoaty. I sense there's an element of punishment for his final day self-vote last game…I don't see anything better today…If it's a mislynch, well that's what normally happens d1 anyway, so it's not a disaster. (#314)” “I'm gonna go on record and say I think mojo is a villager. (#381)” “I don't think the mojo situation does need to be resolved. I did, but I don't now. I think when we can talk about optimal cursed stratgey a little more openly, people will realise that mojo is unlikely to be cursed. (#612)” “mojo reads villager…Looks like mojo is our man. I'm not thrilled with it but it seems better than… (#647)”

Dhubs: “I'm not really concerned about whether MMM flips V or W…regardless of how MMM flips the major distraction is out of the way. (#317)” “…take a Day #1 lynch next game but just put it behind you and move forward. I'm personally uncomfortable reaching even mid-game with him even if he is a Villager. MMM-Villager is going to be -EV for the Village this match due to recent memories (#380)”

[wufwugy]

The only thing I'm going to say ITT about the talkless nights is that we're in a substantially better position since they help villagers way more than wolves

Now that that's out of the way, I hope I can actually focus on playing correctly

[dhubermex]

Point taken but MMM had to go, and now he's gone. I would play that scenario over the same way given his Page #1 posts and how difficult it was going to be to go mid- or end-game with him. Your post is useful for future matches, but now it's time to see if we can't lynch an actual Wolf Day #2.

I'm not sure who I'll be willing to work with today. My gut told me MMM was going to flip Wolf-alignment, and my gut was wrong.

[baudib]

The only thing I'm going to say ITT about the talkless nights is that we're in a substantially better position since they help villagers way more than wolves

Now that that's out of the way, I hope I can actually focus on playing correctly

It's somewhat angleshooty to talk about mod decisions IMO but I couldn't help but make the connection between Ong saying how much he hates open thread at night as a wolf and Hoopy making the decision shortly after.

The more I think about it, the Ong nom is really elite. From my POV, I can stop tinfoiling on Ong-Keybored being w/w again. Last game, I sorta cringed when they interacted and I was getting a feeling they were doing the same thing this game.

[JKDS]

Sorry guys, I got slammed with law. I should be able to catch up and post my thoughts later tonight.

[wufwugy]

lynch daven

i have other reads. i think i found two and possibly all three wolves. i also think ive found 3 solid villagers. but honestly i do not think it is right to talk about anybody other than the current day's lynch. mine is daven for obvious reasons. this post is dumb and im probably wrong, but im at the "whatever idgaf" point with some things right now

and no nothing changed with mmm. all we can do is just lol. im still voting him if i have a time machine

btw ong was the correct nom. he looked very specialy and i was worried that he would be a liability if the wolves didn't notice that and nom him, since that would suggest he was a wolf

[wufwugy]

^^i dont think im probably wrong about daven, but about the other wolf or two i may have found (the connections are interesting, but pointless to make at this juncture)

i am wholly unconvinced daven has an ounce of vilblood this game

[baudib]

lynch daven

i have other reads. i think i found two and possibly all three wolves. i also think ive found 3 solid villagers. but honestly i do not think it is right to talk about anybody other than the current day's lynch. mine is daven for obvious reasons. this post is dumb and im probably wrong, but im at the "whatever idgaf" point with some things right now

and no nothing changed with mmm. all we can do is just lol. im still voting him if i have a time machine

btw ong was the correct nom. he looked very specialy and i was worried that he would be a liability if the wolves didn't notice that and nom him, since that would suggest he was a wolf

That game Ong was the seer, I knew INSTANTLY that he was the seer -- it was the only D1 read I had right. I didn't get quite the same vibe off him here.

that said, in a game without Rilla/Gator it makes sense as a combo of Strong Player Kill (SPK)/seer hunting nom.

[baudib]

and no nothing changed with mmm. all we can do is just lol. im still voting him if i have a time machine

IDK Wuf, have you never seen a villager twisting in the wind? I remember Luco saying that he doesn't think lying comes naturally to MMM and after taking so much heat, I think he would have just went AFK or come unhinged. If you remove the carryover from last game and his "lone wolf" stuff (really, what wolf does that anyway? It's like Ong going "aroooooo I mean quack") he was doing a lot of work and sharing his reads on everyone. I thought he was playing damn well tbh

[bigred]

lynch aubrey

Cause she's clearly a wolf

[baudib]

BigRed, why so certain on Aubrey?

[wufwugy]

IDK Wuf, have you never seen a villager twisting in the wind? I remember Luco saying that he doesn't think lying comes naturally to MMM and after taking so much heat, I think he would have just went AFK or come unhinged. If you remove the carryover from last game and his "lone wolf" stuff (really, what wolf does that anyway? It's like Ong going "aroooooo I mean quack") he was doing a lot of work and sharing his reads on everyone. I thought he was playing damn well tbh

Of what concession I may have, the main part is that there is legitimate theory that says the wolves never (or just rarely) inhabit the Zone of the Wolfiest. If I had to lay bets on it, I would say it's accurate, but I have yet to embrace the concept because I hate it and I believe there is a way to better define wolfy behavior so that we could create a spectrum in which my $20 tell-all novella thesis is accurate

[Keybored]

Your post is useful for future matches, but now it's time to see if we can't lynch an actual Wolf Day #2.

Dhubs...Post is useful for current match. There's def a wolf or 2 in there! And yes, time to focus on real hunting. No more soft bolds.

[baudib]

I kinda thought Aubrey was villagery but I could see it.

The votes by BID and Aubrey on MMM are probably the wolfiest.

[daven]

i have other reads. i think i found two and possibly all three wolves. i also think ive found 3 solid villagers. but honestly i do not think it is right to talk about anybody other than the current day's lynch. mine is daven for obvious reasons.

this makes zero sense. Except that your reasons will be ridic and nobody trusts your early reads. So maybe not as ridic as it first appears.

btw ong was the correct nom. he looked very specialy and i was worried that he would be a liability if the wolves didn't notice that and nom him, since that would suggest he was a wolf

once mmm flipped village i had basically decided to go with ong as lock-villager. My guess is that wolves nom'ed him cos he's village after those late day posts and with mmm's flip about 100% of the time

[baudib]

@keybored

be careful about posting before the Mod announces Day. if you're a villager we don't need you getting modkilled again

I agree with a lot of the sentiments you've expressed. I'm pretty much in the camp of "don't ever lynch a villager, no matter how bad they are."

like lynching people who haven't posted who are likely to be vanillagers is terrible, I've always railed against that thinking on D1. lynching them if it means that AFKing makes them more likely to be a wolf, then sure. it's one of the reasons I was convinced Wuf was a wolf a few games ago because he just insisted on lynching the inactives.

still though, sometimes you have to accept that the village is going to take the path of least resistance.

[daven]

^^i dont think im probably wrong about daven, but about the other wolf or two i may have found (the connections are interesting, but pointless to make at this juncture)

i am wholly unconvinced daven has an ounce of vilblood this game

'i don't think i'm probably' lol love it.
you have never managed to read me correctly, my first game you said for days that if i was wolf then goat-wolf. Etc.

what do the confirmed villagers think about my role?
as per my day 1, i got things pretty wrong re mmm and ong obviously. I was convinced mmm wouldn't make such a fps-ridic post early if he was vanilla, and basically built a lot of my reads off that.

[daven]

Of what concession I may have, the main part is that there is legitimate theory that says the wolves never (or just rarely) inhabit the Zone of the Wolfiest. If I had to lay bets on it, I would say it's accurate, but I have yet to embrace the concept because I hate it and I believe there is a way to better define wolfy behavior so that we could create a spectrum in which my $20 tell-all novella thesis is accurate

ja lynch wuf

you've seen me as both wolf and villager, you know that as wolf i never get heat until end-game, if at all.
and this game you are certain i'm inhabiting the 'Zone of the Wolfiest' and a wolf.

[daven]

there was a post by monstr i read when the thread was locked that made me want to lynch him too. Basically saying he had no time to devote to this game cos some other game? while continuing to look like a wolf.

[daven]

gabe is still alive, just putting it out there...
and jkds
jkds was one of ong's wolf-reads, and he would have been among my options for night kill target if i was a wolf

[daven]

@ keybored, i don't think we gain a whole lot of info from mmm's wagon given that it was villager vs villager and he'd made a play that meant he had to go before mid-game

[daven]

@ keybored, can you post the vote and wagon orders? there are a couple of things i'm interested in around my wagon and if you're storing the info in a spreadsheet or whatever it was then it's an easy copy-paste ja?

[wufwugy]

At least you're back to old form. It's partly because after I called you out and you retreated that I knew you were a wolf. Vildaven never retreats from those obtuse posts I made. But it's too late. You already showed your hand

[wufwugy]

Obtuse is the wrong word. Just very blunt. Vildaven haaaaaaaates my bluntness because he reads it as obtuseness and wolfing. Always has and always will

[wufwugy]

lol fucking vildaven would have been so pissed at how much i was calling him lock d2 lynch. he would never have done the washy bolds he did. he would have plowed straight onto me

he just didnt know what to do. he was caught by surprise