*** Witch Hunt: Village of Souls gameplay thread ***

[rong]

I guess I'm the only one not worried about metagame, I'm aware that towning myself too hard will make my first wolf game damn near impossible but whatevs

Well we have until friday (I sincerely hope) to get this right so let's slow the fuck down. (the fingering/voting, not the posting. that's slow enough already).

Just read this again. It's as if JKDS wrote it.

[Luco]

Interesting how you've turned up the flames now we're looking at hoopy.

[rong]

My strategy to counter your suspicions is to simply keep posting. Every post is information and if it can hang a witch it can clear a villager.

I don't have a hand up my ass. This is me.

It doesn't help that I don't really see the value in our other options.

[Luco]

I think we have enough not to need a finger. If I get lynched, it's hoopy rong and pascal when I flip villager.

[Luco]

It doesn't help that I don't really see the value in our other options.

You mean I'm the best decoy you've got. Your timing of this move is very suspicious.

[eugmac]

Just burn luco already.

[Luco]

Going to bed.

lynch hoopy

[Luco]

Just burn luco already.

I told you not to post in here coach!

[rong]

Also going to bed. lynch luco

[daven]

i'm back online, i'll do a readthrough shortly

[daven]

hoopy and JKDS are my best bets for witches right now

[daven]

[Jyms/Luco] are unlikely to be witches together, same goes for [Jyms/JKDS], and for [JKDS/Gabe]. I can see it being unlikely that [JV/JKDS] are withces together because of the timing of JV's withdrawal from the JKDS wagon. I think Pascal put in the 4th vote for JKDs, maybe means [JKDS/Pascal unlikely witches together too?

I didn't think that the use of the term 'towning' is much of a tell, although JV's post 326 gives me cause to reconsider.
We shouldn't discount the theory that Luco is simply smart and investing a bunch of time in this game (mostly because bost of these facts are self-evident), I do wonder if that time investment is more likely as a wolf or as a villager though. I don't imagine i would have been so post-heavy if i had been villager in the last game, dunno. Luco is a ?tending village in my list for now.

Holy shit, we have till friday.

@daven: Those were the q's, and ill think about that post later.

your thoughts please?


the JKDS wagon stalling at 4 is trying hard to tell us something. I'm not hearing it clearly though.
Two options i'm looking at, 1 = most likely witch, and this isn't clear to me, 2 = which role-player clarification gives us most info. And it's looking like Luco or JKDS at the moment.

at 5:30 pm my time pascal bolded JKDS to put him at 4

at 5:40

and Jack rescinded 10 mins later

I am kind of wondering several things right now. Rong and hoopy are posting but don't seem to have their hunting hats on as they usually do. I'm also trying to wrap my head around why JKDS wasn't lynched. If he's a witch then the witches were either on the wagon or not and if they were on it's very telling for JV to pull out. If they weren't then we have 4 guys to choose from.

If he's not a witch (which is quite possible because the whole Luco argument points to him) then JV is clear for stepping off and some of the wolves are on the bandwagon or not present. I think we need to work from these scenarios with our other reads and try to put together a strat going forward, even if it means putting up a possible villager to clarify these positions. Who would give us our best ideas going forward?

although i guess it is funny how daven keeps detailing his off-forum exploits. like he knows he's misleading us (b/c hes not a villager) so gives us real facts that are actually irrelavant

fair point. off-forum stuff is pretty consuming at the moment, but, yeah, i'll stop dragging that up cos who cares. I'm busy, that's enough.

[Hoopy]

This isn't good, I probably should have voted for JKDS earlier but wanted to use the whole day if possible. Looks like that's screwed me now.

I really think the witches are JKDS, Pascal and daven. Though pascal did put the 4th vote on JKDS so could be problems with that pairing.

Villagers are likely gabe, rong and JV.

rescind pascal

burn JKDS

[Luco]

Sorry guys I can't sleep until I post this, I think I've got it. Will post in morning.

[Pascal]

you're wrong hoopy.

the only question i can see is luco or jkds first. thoughts?

[wufwugy]

why is eugmac posting?

[jyms]

I was wondering the same thing.

[gabe]

just reread and i dont like how much rong is pushing the luco train. the word 'towning' is not a big deal, its probably been said independently hundreds of times. also its a big reach to connect that a newb witch would be influenced enough by another witch to actually sound like him.

hoopy's post are convincing enough for me to stick with jkds. hoopy plays tight sometimes so his posting patterns arent unusual.

i still think burn jkds. hoopy isnt even the 2nd best candidate imo

[Luco]

Right I'm awake. I have enough evidence to hang at least two (rong and pascal) and will produce it when I'm not on my smartphone.

Naturally my whole line hinges on whether you can take me as you find me or not, but if I do prove I've solved it I humbly request you let me finger bang someone.

[rong]

Lol luco, so you've got an amazing theory that nails two of the wolves who just happen to be the two people on your wagon. Well that is certainly a noob tendency, seeing everybody who votes for you as a wolf.

[Luco]

Lol luco, so you've got an amazing theory that nails two of the wolves who just happen to be the two people on your wagon. Well that is certainly a noob tendency, seeing everybody who votes for you as a wolf.

It's just unfortunate for you that you picked the wrong noob to screw with

[gabe]

luco there will be no chance for a lone finger champion. after this vote we will probably have to vote on who does the fingering (if we miss), or won't do any fingering (at least not sitting at 5-2)

[Luco]

About me:

If I’m witch, why didn’t I go for bikes? Remember, the only charge against me is that I’ve picked this up fast. The concept of the game, the terminology, whatever. If you can get over that then you may be able to hear what I have to say. Unfortunately a large part of my argument rests on the interplay between myself and those two, so it’s kinda important.

Yes, it’s already been posted that revenge voting is usually bad but as I’m the only lock I know it has to be a starting point when there’s little else out there. It would appear that I have indeed fallen into the trap of basing a lot of my judgements on who says they believe me and who says they don’t, so I’m doubting myself right now but I’ll post my thoughts anyway and let you all decide.

With the JKDS lynch, gabe votes. Jyms votes. JV votes. Pascal votes. JV rescinds. Why didn’t they finish him off? I’m still not sold on this theory but if I’m right then he would have needed two consecutive witch votes to finish him off and they were considering the best way to do it. Pascal put his in, they couldn’t run another vote immediately without arousing suspicion and JV pulled the plug before they could finish the job. The alternative is that JKDS is the third witch instead of Hoopy.

Rong:
He set out from the start to be absolutely dead against fingering. Why? Others have at least considered how much of a game changer it would be to go 5-2 instead of 4-3. Yet he repeatedly and consistently refuses to consider it. Right from the start he made his position clear. Is it that fingering has never been an option for him?

There was a point where both jkds and I were on the block. I asked why I didn’t get more votes. Is it because of this?

luco u said u were going to finger someone if the wagon was about to burn you. who would you finger? the village needs to know what we're risking and if youre a villager youll be open about it

Not decided yet. But rong had better start believing me soon.

Then a little later, rong (who was previously happy to vote either of us) chimes in with:

Not Luco as if he comes back witch I'd still wanna lynch JKDS.

Did my aggressive use of the finger mechanic, combined with gabe’s question, save my life?

Look at the latest exchange between us as well. He’s pushing hard before the Hoopy train rolls. Why?

Pascal:
My main bone of contention is just the interplay between us. Look at how dismissive he is of every counter argument I throw at him. Look at the whole thread. He gets worse, the last exchange between us is particularly damning.

i'm definitely gone now, this isnt revenge just reading your posts one after the other. the attempt at redirecting this onto me (i'm not a witch BUT MAYBE YOU ARE) convinces me

rescind jkds
burn luco

I know why the pascal that trusted me is gone. He never really existed to begin with. His vote reasoning is that I basically said ‘I’m not a witch but maybe you are’. Hang on, isn’t that exactly what I’ve been doing all game? I’ve defended myself to the hilt, and every person that has questioned me has gone under the microscope. I did it to jyms, I did it to rong, then I did it to Pascal. Why is that all the evidence he needs? His responses to my defence are weak. At least I had fun with my 2k post though.

Hoopy is my least lock, but JV seems happy and it just fits with my theory of these two, particularly the timing of rong’s latest attack on me. Firstly, it’s far enough away from Pascal’s not to draw suspicion. Second, it’s just as we start looking at Hoopy but before the train gets really rolling.
JKDS is pretty much the only other possible witch for me right now but looking at how rong and pascal have talked about him, if I’m right about their coven then it’s unlikely jkds is in it.
The alternative is me. I’m willing to put myself out there for voting today on the condition that you lynch rong, pascal and hoopy when I flip villager. Jkds and I seem to be intertwined so if I’m villager he prolly is too.


I'd like to lynch rong today. Thoughts?

[jackvance]

The case against Pascal is good, but about Rong, I know he is good at playing a bad guy, but not agreeing with that at all. Damn Luco, if you are a wolf that is one hell of a dedicated job you are doing, on that point alone I pretty much can't believe you are one.

[Luco]

Thank you JV, if you want pascal first that's clearly fine with me.

[jackvance]

I kinda just wanna lynch someone and get the game forward, We need some solid feedback on roles to get the pieces falling together now.

[jackvance]

Not meaning a random lynch ofcourse, someone we can compromise on.

[Luco]

Who would give us the most information, while also being a likely wolf?

[rong]

Who would give us the most information, while also being a likely wolf?

That's you imo.

[jackvance]

I'm not thinking about the information aspect, more important we get a witch today so we can continue to rely on lynches and talk, otherwise at 4-3 it's probably just gonna be fingerbang after fingerbang until one side wins.

[rong]

Luco, re your case against me above:

Me being against fingering: I've stated the case for that repeatedly. In the beginning the fingerer died too regardless of role of who they finger. In early game with little info this is terrible for the village. With the rule change this improved but now we're near the end it is awful to do it today as explained in the post at the top of this page. If you think I'm wrong there respond to that post because I can't see a better alternative.

Re the timing of the hoopy bw and my renewed interest in pushing through your lynch, you're right that hoopy's bw prompted me to act. But that's not because he and I are wolves together, but because I think you are a much better lynch than him and we can't really afford an unnecessary mistake and I think you show up wolf far more often than him. If it had been JKDS gaining momentum instead of hoopy I'd have been less inclined to push your lynch as I think he would be a reasonable choice today.

[jackvance]

I can vote for Hoopy, Daven, JKDS or Pascal.

You have a solid case for Luco rong but I'm still seeing too much of a villager in him so not gonna get on that train.

[Luco]

Well I think we've made our positions on each other clear rong, so what's your opinion on pascal?

[rong]

I need to review his posts. Can't do that on my phone, will look at him when I get home.

[jyms]

Pascal was 4th on the Jkds wagon, I am really struggling to put that wagon together. If he's a wolf then why 4th? If the witches wanted a lynch they should have had it easily. If he was just trying to get village cred on a witch burning, why so late to the wagon and make it almost happen?

[jyms]

Although, now that I think of it, they may have been pressuring JKDS to use a finger to end this as I mentioned earlier

[Pascal]

The case against Pascal is good, but about Rong, I know he is good at playing a bad guy, but not agreeing with that at all. Damn Luco, if you are a wolf that is one hell of a dedicated job you are doing, on that point alone I pretty much can't believe you are one.

I kinda just wanna lynch someone and get the game forward, We need some solid feedback on roles to get the pieces falling together now.

The case against me is good...what? We reading the same thread? Defending Luco who looks suspicious, trying to palm off rongs argument about why Luco is a wolf (placating by saying you agree with his argument but you he's too much of a villager so if we do burn him and he flips witch no one can be like JV said not to burn Luco)

You're also pushing for a lynch when we've still got time.

From Luco: "The alternative is me. I’m willing to put myself out there for voting today on the condition that you lynch rong, pascal and hoopy when I flip villager. Jkds and I seem to be intertwined so if I’m villager he prolly is too."

that's interesting that he links himself with JKDS. suggest to me that if Luco flips witch JKDS is more likely to be a villager as he's obviously trying to take him down with him.

not changing my vote atm

[Luco]

I made an honest assessment of jkds. A lot of people were happy to see either of us lynched and the voting didn't ever really roll my way. What does that mean for him if I'm villager?

I'm still trying to be objective and not just think in terms of who believes me or not.

[Luco]

I think if we can unlock the secret of the jkds nearly lynch we can take this down. Nobody seems to know what it means though.

[jyms]

There was plenty of heat about you and JKDS, Why would you think if you flip villager JKDS is a witch? Why wouldn't the witches try and flip us to you? There was lots of people willing to have you as their #2. The fact that you got no heat is more witchy than if you had 2 or 3 on your wagon too.

In thinking about this the witches may have been going for the finger, I am thinking that Pascal is a decent choice too. Not sure if there were others on the wagon or not yet, but I am feeling that more and more, the witches aren't taking sides. They are trying to get us to finger someone else. The fact that there is no wagon at the moment shows they aren't trying to steer us to a lynch.

[jyms]

Anyone have a true count? I'm on my phone around hte building today but No way I can scroll back to far at the moment.

[Luco]

There was plenty of heat about you and JKDS, Why would you think if you flip villager JKDS is a witch? Why wouldn't the witches try and flip us to you? There was lots of people willing to have you as their #2. The fact that you got no heat is more witchy than if you had 2 or 3 on your wagon too.

I didn't say jkds is witch when I flip villager, quite the opposite:

...Jkds and I seem to be intertwined so if I’m villager he prolly is too.

And I've been asking why the witches didn't turn on me for a while now.

[Luco]

Hoopy, what's your opinion on a luco lynch?

Hoopy, I asked you this while I was taking heat. You never answered.

[jyms]

Tying you guys together because of the "towning" incident is what made us think of you and him as witches. If one of you flips villager that doesn't excuse the other at all. It was a tie that binded, but if that proves not to be then you will still need to stand on your other merits and posts. I don't excuse either one of you guys as village yet. I just think we still have a lot to figure out. Tonights lynching will tell us something.

[Luco]

Rescind hoopy, lynch pascal

He went from complete trust in me to total shutout, no doubts left at all in his mind. He was #4 on the jkds train. Choo fucking choo.

I'm damn confident on this one guys and I'm clearly next if wrong.

[Luco]

Tying you guys together because of the "towning" incident is what made us think of you and him as witches. If one of you flips villager that doesn't excuse the other at all. It was a tie that binded, but if that proves not to be then you will still need to stand on your other merits and posts. I don't excuse either one of you guys as village yet. I just think we still have a lot to figure out. Tonights lynching will tell us something.

I agree. I've already stated where I stand on him, he's far from off my radar and I still have no lock villagers besides myself.

I know there are 5 people out there I need to convince too regardless of jkds' true colours. Pascal flipping witch will help.

[jyms]

hoopy - jkds
pascal - luco
jkds
jyms - hoopy
rong - luco
daven
jv - hoopy
gabe - jkds
luco - pascal


Ok now the witches are playing. My head is spinning right now. I would love to find a lock villager or two. I'm seeing monsters under the bed and everything that is posted sounds like a level

[Luco]

Vote pascal. It will make everything better, I promise.

[jyms]

Ya I'm not sure I want to be on the same train as you just yet.

I still think hoopy's our #1. He hasn't posted much, he hasn't seemed the same for me. He magically shows up when bolded and I still have JV as one of my near villagers along with Rong based on a few things that they have been first to point out

[gabe]

I'm damn confident on this one guys and I'm clearly next if wrong.

I disagree. why would you say 'clearly' ? I'm not sure if you're right or not but you being wrong just makes you look like an over zealous villager not a crazy witch

[Luco]

For I time I never would have thought jyms and jkds could both be village, but then it all kind of fizzled out and my brain died.

Things are definitely clearing up again though. No matter what, thank you all for giving me a kickass first game and sincere apologies if I got too emotional for a while there.

As stated, I won't finger so come at me witches and hang yourselves with your words. I've said it would be foolish for all three to lead the charge, so look at who isn't voting me too.

No finger doesn't mean no defence though, you vote me and you can just call me hadoken.

[Luco]

I disagree. why would you say 'clearly' ? I'm not sure if you're right or not but you being wrong just makes you look like an over zealous villager not a crazy witch

I figured with the two of us butting heads so hard I'd be in really bad shape if he wasn't a witch.

[jyms]

Well without any wagons there is no finger so we will end up lynching someone tonight I am sure. Then we will at least have some info for a last gasp fingerfest.

[jyms]

I figured with the two of us butting heads so hard I'd be in really bad shape if he wasn't a witch.

As stated before, more often than not, it's two villagers when people go hard at each other. The people with perfect info don't seem to be able to sustain it.

[Luco]

I've been going full retard on anyone that even looks at me funny. Pascal was sly in how he 'arrived' at his vote for me.

My strategy to counter your suspicions is to simply keep posting. Every post is information and if it can hang a witch it can clear a villager.

I don't have a hand up my ass. This is me.

Quoting myself, but still this. Post till I'm clear.

[jyms]

It's not your job to convince us you're a villager, it's your job as a villager to find a witch. Instead of reading your posts, why don't you read others? I got work to do, until some others chime in.

[Luco]

It's not your job to convince us you're a villager, it's your job as a villager to find a witch. Instead of reading your posts, why don't you read others? I got work to do, until some others chime in.

I thought it was both. I'll look through the thread again though.

[gabe]

are there any 2 players where they can never both be villagers? we could get one of them to finger the other tomorrow. but we wouldn't want to lynch a member of a good fingerpair today.

maybe lynch pascal today then tomorrow make jkds finger rong?
or lynch jkds today then make pascal finger rong (or vice versa)?

ye?

[rong]

Gabe, that concept is genius. How have we not thought of that. In retrospect it seems an obvious strategy.

[Luco]

Ok my village map has shifted somewhat since my last post on everyone.

gabe, JV and prolly jyms are all looking villagery. If they're witch then they must have had coaching or something

Pascal, rong and Hoopy are still my top 3.

jkds I've explained, waiting for him to post more. Daven is a huge ? due to inactivity.

[Pascal]

you're saying gabe must have had coaching if he's a witch?? level?

[Pascal]

or purposefully trying to pretend youre a noob now and that you dont understand what terms are?

[Luco]

Trying to make a joke ldo, been too srs about this for a while now.

[Luco]

are there any 2 players where they can never both be villagers? we could get one of them to finger the other tomorrow. but we wouldn't want to lynch a member of a good fingerpair today.

maybe lynch pascal today then tomorrow make jkds finger rong?
or lynch jkds today then make pascal finger rong (or vice versa)?

ye?

This sounds fun

[Luco]

I still love you pascal. I really want to finger you to show how much I care. I don't have to be pitcher though

[jyms]

I'm also willing to finger tomorrow if need be but I don't know where I would fit in your "not both village"

I agree that we need to do exactly this gabe and I thought it was pretty much strat for this game now. I think we need to either go with Pascal or hoopy myself.

[Pascal]

I still love you pascal. I really want to finger you to show how much I care. I don't have to be pitcher though

as long as you've got some poppers

[jyms]

Also, I take it that you also have Rong as your strongest villager then? So forcing someone finger him would work best so long as we know we have a great choice at witch.

If pascal is a witch, then I think my scenario of them trying to get JKDS to finger is true and JKDS is not. I doubt he was simply trying to get villager cred.

[Pascal]

if we decide who is going to finger someone tomorrow before today's lynch then the wolves will know and that causes metagame problems depending on who they kill

[jyms]

Not really. There still needs to be the info of who gets lynched tonight and whether they turn witch.

[jyms]

Also, tomorrows fingerer can't be killed by the witches.

[jyms]

I'm thinking that both JV and Rong can be fingered, so long as we don't lych one tonight we have one for tomorrow.

[Luco]

That's the biggest rookie mistake in the book though. Who do you think is more likely to get it wrong, villagers who know nothing and are trying to figure things out, or wolves who already have all the information about everyone's roles? For this reason wolves (and specials, but we don't have that now) tend to not be too accusatory to not step on too many toes. So be careful with the revenge reasoning, that is what loses games.

I've been thinking about this and potential other double bluffs.

You all know that wolves don't tend to lead the charge

You all know that arguing the rules is a town tell

Even JVs rule change could be a mad double bluff.

hrrrrm, if anyone is double bluffing it's unlikely to be more than one

[gabe]

i think we should just ignore whoever the witches kill tonight. if it happens to be one of the people that were part of the fingering pair, tomorrow's vote should just be for who replaces the deceased.

no one should bold anyone tomorrow under any circumstances

[rong]

I'm thinking that both JV and Rong can be fingered, so long as we don't lych one tonight we have one for tomorrow.

I get the "can't both be villagers" theory, but how do jv & I fulfil that criteria?