KK 4way

[Razvan729]

my 1st mistake not 3bet pre, but lets forget about that.

stats:

MP3 40/16/14 25 hands

BUTT 25/13/36 69 hands

BB 19/15/10 46 hands

no special reads on anyoane.


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

saw flop

UTG+1 ($1.05)
MP1 ($4.30)
MP2 ($5.39)
MP3 ($5.02)
CO ($1.93)
Button ($12.50)
Hero (SB) ($24.27)
BB ($4.19)
UTG ($0.98)

Preflop: Hero is SB with ,
4 folds, MP3 calls $0.05, 1 fold, Button bets $0.25, Hero calls $0.23, BB calls $0.20, MP3 calls $0.20

Flop: ($1) , , (4 players)
Hero bets $0.47, BB calls $0.47, MP3 calls $0.47, Button raises to $2.50


i would fold here. i only beat, hmmm ... nothing.... BUTT could reraise AA or sets, KK for a tie, but i still have 2 more to act behind me that could have hit set cause i am a jackass and havent 3bet pre ( my fault i know). but folding here 4 way with that 5x reraise and 2 more to act its ok, right?

[daviddem]

3b pre. Why would you want to play KK multiway OOP??

[Razvan729]

i dont, just hit call button, my mind was somewhere else, doesnt matter now, but as played, a fold its the best way to play the hand?

[daviddem]

As played pre, if you are going to lead the flop, pot it. With half pot, you look like a draw begging for a cheap card, so he could very well be doing that with AQ.

So now button could have AQ, AA, KK, QQ, AhKh, KhQh, QhJh, QhTh. He could even be doing it with some more KQ and more AhXh. I am not all that sure whether he raises 44 and 55 pre because he has set mining stats and a rather small PFR (what are his steal stats, and what is the third stat in your OP? ATS or AFq?).

So roughly I'd call it 50/50 equity, and there is a ton of dead money in the pot... On the other hand there are two other players still in the pot, and nobody knows why they are going to do.

In doubt, I probably fold and beat myself for the misclick.

[Razvan729]

the 3rd is AFq. the same way i analyzed the hand then. i bet 1/2 flop cause i was afraid of sets... i played there wrong.... i just wanted to know if fold with 2 more to act is ok... HU i would call.

[daviddem]

i would fold here. i only beat, hmmm ... nothing....

So now button could have AQ, AA, KK, QQ, AhKh, KhQh, QhJh, QhTh. He could even be doing it with some more KQ and more AhXh. I am not all that sure whether he raises 44 and 55 pre because he has set mining stats and a rather small PFR (what are his steal stats, and what is the third stat in your OP? ATS or AFq?).

So roughly I'd call it 50/50 equity, and there is a ton of dead money in the pot... On the other hand there are two other players still in the pot, and nobody knows why they are going to do.

In doubt, I probably fold and beat myself for the misclick.

the same way i analyzed the hand then.

Not quite.

[Razvan729]

5x RR on KQ or AQ against 3 opps? dont think so, he must e a real donk and he is not.

[daviddem]

So what would you do with AQ if you were the button?

The point of my last post was mainly that you did not put your opponent on a range.

http://www.flopturnriver.com/pokerfo...ml#post1987120

[couriermike]

Flop is drawy, so bet near pot. As played, this is probably totally wrong, but I might just jam it, even deep, thinking villain has mostly big Qx hands, alot of draws that we're flipping with or beating, and rarely sets or AA.

[!Luck]

This hand is not as simple as it seems. We are 250bb vs main villain. Truthfully, we really can't go broke here without great reads.

[Razvan729]

This hand is not as simple as it seems. We are 250bb vs main villain. Truthfully, we really can't go broke here without great reads.

this a great thing, one of my problem here in this hand, beeing so deep was my main reason for not shoving over. if i was 100bb i would shove, cause if opp would c/c to SD 100 bb would would have cost me the hand, by betting 3 streets.

anyway, should i leave table when i get over 200bb and get in again 100bb so that my shoving would be easier in cases like this?

[NightGizmo]

5x RR on KQ or AQ against 3 opps? dont think so, he must e a real donk and he is not.

It's not as big of a raise as you think. You can't look at a raise size in terms of the original bet. Here, he's raising your bet of .47 to 2.50 -- but the pot is 2.41 before he does that. Check out daviddem's recent post for the details on the math, but this is only about a 2/3-pot size raise.

A stronger flop bet would have made this much easier -- a raise would be much more likely to mean real strength. But your weak bet probably made the button think you are just trying to steal the pot (or see the next card cheaply) and now his range can include a lot of random semibluffs. After all, he's risking 2.50 to win 2.41 -- so if all three of you fold a little more than 50% of the time, it's a profitable raise with any two cards. Any equity his hand has just makes the semibluff that much more profitable.

As played, I would probably fold. You are out of position, both absolute and relative. You've only invested 15bb so far, ditch the hand and next time play KK better preflop.

[daviddem]

http://www.flopturnriver.com/pokerfo...ll-185247.html

This is a 70% pot sized raise and you get 29% pot odds on your call (2.43:1)

[Razvan729]

i playd terrible the hand, pre and post... this is the truth. i normally 3bet pre and pot flop with over overpairs, but here i messed up all... really dont know what i was thinking that time.

{removed results - kmind}

[Carroters]

Some avatars tilt the shit out of me.

[Razvan729]

mine suits me sometimes i use it to remind myself during play that not always opp is a donk , but i am cause i cant read, analyze , play the hand well

[daviddem]

Some avatars tilt the shit out of me.

You mean the ones flashing in your face like a stroboscope?







@Razvan:
er... must also say that a poker community that calls itself a "team" could kinda raise some suspicions...

From the website:

At TDD, we love donkies and we spank 'em so you don't have to. Come join the fun! It's easy, just enter your email and check out our Forums or our Blog to get acquainted with your teammates. Our demeanor might be humorous but we're all business when it comes to poker strategies so if you want to improve your game, you're at the right place.

Maybe it's all legit, but some rewording might be in order...

[Razvan729]

i aint in no team just found the pic and like it

[Carroters]

OMFG PEPPER OMFG CARROT OMFG PICKLE

[OngBonga]

OMFG PEPPER OMFG CARROT OMFG PICKLE

I'd really like to say I hate your av, but I don't.



Yeah you got yourself inyo a mess here Raz by not 3betting pre, you know that though. However, it's not all doom and gloom here, the very fact you folded shows that you're recognising what is and isn't a good spot. How many times have we seen people get cute and limp in with AA/KK and then not be able to fold them when they're obviously beat by the junk that was allowed to see a cheap flop?

Horrible pre flop, but don't be results orientated, the fold on the flop is excellent.

[kmind]

You're 2908349834bb deep so def 3bet pre even though you don't want to hear that anymore I have to say that.

On the flop, you have to lead harder if you are going to lead. Their ranges are inelastic! I'd rather c/r tbh. As played bleh you put yourself in a very tough spot I guess flat and go from there.

[kmind]

i playd terrible the hand, pre and post... this is the truth. i normally 3bet pre and pot flop with over overpairs, but here i messed up all... really dont know what i was thinking that time.

I hope you have reasons when potting flop with overpairs and you don't just auto do that every time.

Also, I'm editing out the results. Please don't post results to any HH again.