Varchertine's Werewolf Game Thread

[JKDS]

INTRO

Not even one day into the couples retreat, Krieger tells you some awful news.

Kreiger: Guys, I was looking into Cheryl's mind-brain...

Cheryl: Hey!

Kreiger: Oh, I should have asked you I guess. Anyway, I was looking into Cheryl's mind-brain and discovered she had a bomb in there!

All: Gasp!

Kreiger: I know, right? So anyway, it seems they are rigged to explode if the person we brought with us dies...

Archer: You mean like this? (He pulls out his gun, and instantly shoots Randy Gillette in the face)

Randy: Oh, what the...fuck...archer....

Cheryl: Huh...hes dead! Do me, do me do me do me do me do me DO ME!

Janelle: Uh...guys...

(BOOM)

Janelle, Randy's +1 died.

Archer: Huh. (Points gun at Lana)

Lana: What, NO

Archer: Relax, I was just kidding. Mostly. I'd have to be brain dead to shoot you.

Malory: You will be the one who's brain is dead if we dont find who put these bombs in our heads!

Archer: You mean...

Lana: Oh, no.

Archer: INVESTIGATIVE RAMPAGEEEEE WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Living
a500lbgorilla
LilRascal
Keybored
Ongbonga
Gabe
BID
Wufwugy
Rong
Luco
Boog
Hoppy
Baudib
Monstrman
Bigred
MMM
Daven

The Exploded
Randy Gillette (NPC)
Janelle Gillette (NPC)

Living Roles
14 ISIS
4 KGB

Specific Game Rules

1. Every player is linked to another player. If you die, the person linked to you dies as well.
2. You dont know the alignment of the person youre linked to! They could be ISIS, or KGB!
3. You may talk with the person you are linked to anytime, in any way. I prefer quicktopics myself, so that they can be shared at endgame.
4. You may reveal your role name at anytime, but be warned. The KGB each have believable fake claims. This will probably get you nowhere.
5. Self-lynches will NOT be modkillable offenses this game. However, they will still count as a vote.

The village PM looked something like this

Villager PM

img

You are role name, with ISIS. (1 line describing the role). You brought playername with you as your +1. You can talk with him anywhere, at anytime after game start. But beware, Krieger says there is a bomb in everyone’s mind-brain. If one of you dies, so does the other. You also don’t know if playername is fighting for ISIS, or for the KGB. Good luck, go ISIS!!!

TLDR: If one of you dies, so does the other. You dont know his alignment.

Day 1 Starts now! Day 1 will end in 72 hours, or by Majority Lynch.

KGB win when they are in greater or equal number to the ISIS agents. ISIS wins by killing all the KGB agents.

Link to important PM use rule: http://www.flopturnriver.com/pokerfo...30#post2226030

[BankItDrew]

Weeeeeeeeeeew!

GLGLGLGLGL

[OngBonga]

Stop looking at me drew.

[wufwugy]

hey jerkids you promised us a spectacularrrrrrrrrrr game. this is not that

inb4 keith self-lynches

[MadMojoMonkey]

lynch wuf 'cause it's wolfy not to.

[wufwugy]

lynch wuf 'cause it's wolfy not to.

[daven]

lynch wuf 'cause it's wolfy not to.

lynch wuf

Can't think of a reason not to.

can't argue with this logic, i'm always down with Lynch Wuf

[OngBonga]

[enter amusing gif here]

[MadMojoMonkey]

FYP

[Keybored]

Ha! JKDS misspelled Hoopy's name. Freudian Slip or Fat Finger? I think the former: Lynch Hoppy.

[BankItDrew]

lynch wuf

Can't think of a reason not to.

[JKDS]

MOD CORNER: Q&A

Q: Do the wolves have wolf chat?
A: Yes. This in addition to any lover's chat.

Q: How do wolves nom?
A: They dont.

Q: Majority vote D1?
A: Yes. Voting is the same as other games.

Q: Guidelines on posting PMs?
A: You may NEVER refer to, or post information from, private messages in the game thread. The only exception to this is your role, and alignment. This is a hard rule, and I take it very seriously. Do not do it.

Q: Does the narrative reveal any alignment indicative information?
A: No. The narrative is strictly for fun.

[Keybored]

lynch wuf 'cause it's wolfy not to.

lynch wuf

can't argue with this logic, i'm always down with Lynch Wuf

I'm your Huckleberry.
Lynch Wuf

[rong]

Lynch ongbonga he'd never find anyone to be his plus one so must be a wolf where his date had no choice.

[gabe]

lynch ong
he spewed so hard as a wolf last game that he will try to get away with spewing as a villager this game. not worth it

[OngBonga]

lynch ong
he spewed so hard as a wolf last game that he will try to get away with spewing as a villager this game. not worth it

Wait, you know I'm a villager. There's no waiting to see what I do, there's no thinking that if I'm a wolf then I'm a liability to them, you're just picking off an easy target based on shit logic. Except you already slipped by showing that you know I'm a villager.

Oops. Your turn to spew?

[a500lbgorilla]

Wait, you know I'm a villager. There's no waiting to see what I do, there's no thinking that if I'm a wolf then I'm a liability to them, you're just picking off an easy target based on shit logic. Except you already slipped by showing that you know I'm a villager.

Oops. Your turn to spew?

God dammit, Ong.

If Baudib is a villager, don't let Ong survive.

[baudib]

God dammit, Ong.

If Baudib is a villager, don't let Ong survive.

Ong is scheduled to be lynched Day 5, keep up.

[Hoopy]

@keybored

You've got a point, gabe's first post is odd.

lynch ong
he spewed so hard as a wolf last game that he will try to get away with spewing as a villager this game. not worth it

I guess he could mean that ong will spew regardless of role, though this post is sketchy the more I look at it.

[JKDS]

ModCorner

You may identify your +1 in this thread..


​

[a500lbgorilla]

This game is fundamentally flawed. The best strategy and the worst strategy are the same strategy.

[Hoopy]

This game is fundamentally flawed. The best strategy and the worst strategy are the same strategy.

rilla is too hip for this game!

[wufwugy]

This game is fundamentally flawed. The best strategy and the worst strategy are the same strategy.

this

i see zero value in keeping partners hidden. every lynch includes automatic death of the partner. let's be real, none of us are gonna vote to lynch our partners. this is really just a game of "which two players do we want to die". even in a 3v1 situation, it is always correct to not vote your partner since you know that 50% of the deaths in the lynch are village

it's me n teh hoopster

[MadMojoMonkey]

this

i see zero value in keeping partners hidden. every lynch includes automatic death of the partner. let's be real, none of us are gonna vote to lynch our partners. this is really just a game of "which two players do we want to die". even in a 3v1 situation, it is always correct to not vote your partner since you know that 50% of the deaths in the lynch are village

it's me n teh hoopster

Keep lynching wuf for posting ill-conceived crap like this.

[wufwugy]

Keep lynching wuf for posting ill-conceived crap like this.

in 3v1, if you vote for your partner, you are opting to kill one target for potential wolf instead of two. given how big margins of errors are in ww, it is virtually always wrong to vote for your partner

[MadMojoMonkey]

in 3v1, if you vote for your partner, you are opting to kill one target for potential wolf instead of two. given how big margins of errors are in ww, it is virtually always wrong to vote for your partner

In 3v1, you have an entire thread of information behind you to suss out the wolf.


How about you focus on people instead of mechanics for a while, and maybe - maybe - find an argument to move my policy lynch off of you.
Noting that it will also kill hoopy isn't sleuthing.

And we're nowhere near deadline, and you have 2 votes... it's not like you needed to pull out a ringer to save yourself.

[lilrascal]

this

i see zero value in keeping partners hidden. every lynch includes automatic death of the partner. let's be real, none of us are gonna vote to lynch our partners. this is really just a game of "which two players do we want to die". even in a 3v1 situation, it is always correct to not vote your partner since you know that 50% of the deaths in the lynch are village

it's me n teh hoopster

I strongly disagree with this. Revealing partners gives wolves information that they didn't have.

Also, with 4 wolves and 14 villas, it is absolutely pro-villa to lynch your partner if you're convinced they're a wolf. The villas can afford to trade 1 for 1 with the wolves, while this would be devastating to the wolves.

[BankItDrew]

Revealing partners gives wolves information that they didn't have.

This is 100% true. But here's the thing: Revealing partners provides information to both the wolves and the village. The difference is that the information gained by the village is worth waaaaaaay more.

[lilrascal]

This is 100% true. But here's the thing: Revealing partners provides information to both the wolves and the village. The difference is that the information gained by the village is worth waaaaaaay more.

I don't see where it helps the villas. At least not yet.

Assuming all wolves are partnered with a villa, then with 18 live players we have 4 w/v partners and 5 v/v partners.

I'm trying to work thru the odds here for whether or not it is pro villa to know the partners.

Let's assume all partnerships are known. If I'm a villa, then it's better for me to vote for my partner than a random villager since I'm likely to hit a wolf 4 out of 9 times. But that only works if everyone follows that, which others have already stated that they won't vote for their partner (wuf in particular).

Still need to think on this more to think of the other angles.

[wufwugy]

I strongly disagree with this. Revealing partners gives wolves information that they didn't have.

revealing partners gives the village information we dont have. much more value in that than what the wolves get out of knowing. let's say we think gabe is a villager and we lynch bigred because he never does anything, but they're linked. then we say "oh shit how dumb was that, we didnt want gabe to die"


this game is different than normal in that the partners make the statistically correct choice far more easy to see. granted i dont think we're going to stick to this 100%, but we've got to be kidding ourselves if we think we're gonna vote for our partners any time soon. nobody is going to opt to kill just one possible wolf instead of two possible wolves

like it or not, the correct way to lynch is to kill the two players we want dead, not just the one player then have the other die as a surprise

[BankItDrew]

like it or not, the correct way to lynch is to kill the two players we want dead, not just the one player then have the other die as a surprise

How is it that so few players are aware of this extremely important part of the game?

[BooG690]

i see zero value in keeping partners hidden. every lynch includes automatic death of the partner. let's be real, none of us are gonna vote to lynch our partners. this is really just a game of "which two players do we want to die". even in a 3v1 situation, it is always correct to not vote your partner since you know that 50% of the deaths in the lynch are village


it's me n teh hoopster

That's not the point. The point is that there is ZERO value in revealing our partners (there is YET to be one rational argument for doing so and, again, we're giving the wolves perfect information on a silver platter). So what you, BID and Rilla are doing is most likely -EV for the village. It's definitely not a positive and stop pretending it is. Why are we revealing without having a logical discussion given it? Those who've revealed so far haven't even thought it through.

i have seen zero reasons why it's a good idea to not reveal. if we waste time trying to figure out if there is any edge to keeping it secret (which would be super tiny if it exists), we'd just be turning that edge into a liability


i dont want people to think that it's wolfy when i don't bold hoopy, because i never will. i dont want to misread the intentions of other players when they never vote their partners too. life if gator and keith were partners but nobody knows it and i see gator acting weirdly about keith, im probably going to call it wolfy. but if i knew they were partners i wouldnt

So what would you have lost from revealing at a point where people suspected wolfiness where you didn't bold hoopy. You created a scenario that didn't exist and that would have been easily solvable: you could have just revealed AT THAT POINT. Hoopy would have corroborated. Nothing would have been lost.

revealing partners gives the village information we dont have. much more value in that than what the wolves get out of knowing. let's say we think gabe is a villager and we lynch bigred because he never does anything, but they're linked. then we say "oh shit how dumb was that, we didnt want gabe to die"

And here you are again creating a sense of urgency THAT DOESN'T EXIST. Let's just reveal as we lynch. There is NOTHING LOST FROM DOING SO.


Wuf, Rilla and BID need to start thinking through this reveal stuff and stop making it seem that anyone who thinks otherwise is suspect. There's a wolf in there somewhere, especially in those revealing without their partners approval.

[daven]

yeah, i'm pretty happy with my vote on wuf
i reckon he's finally rolled wolf

i see zero value in keeping partners hidden.

zero? sounds like wolves have agreed in the den that they'd prefer to have perfect information.

even in a 3v1 situation, it is always correct to not vote your partner since you know that 50% of the deaths in the lynch are village

i call bullshit. Wuf normally claims some savant-like ability to make clutch reads in endgame spots, yet here he's claiming that this type of read is inappropriate in this game? something doesn't gel right here. he's setting up for lynching the other team. What he doesn't seem to consider is that the end-game is always going to be two couples, so by his logic it's simply the first couple to have both log in to cement the lynch.

I'm coming around to the idea of Wuf being a wolf.

come join the lynch party

it always changes and the only sort of reliable d1 reads are really superficial ones

^ this re the question on who he reads best. It's unlike wuf to be talking about day 1 reads being superficial rather than simply going nuts and day 1 soul-reading

revealing partners gives the village information we dont have. much more value in that than what the wolves get out of knowing. let's say we think gabe is a villager and we lynch bigred because he never does anything, but they're linked. then we say "oh shit how dumb was that, we didnt want gabe to die"

there are times where outing partners might make sense, e.g. in the scenario where a player is close to lynch then outing as +1 could result in an information gold-mine for the village based on reactions etc. We lose this opportunity if we all out our partners early. villa-villa pairings are the only piece of the jigsaw that the wolves are lacking... of course you're keen to get this information out there, cos you're wolf. Probably with 'rilla.

[wufwugy]

zero? sounds like wolves have agreed in the den that they'd prefer to have perfect information.

thank you for making my point for me. do you not see how if you believe this, you must also believe it is better for the village to know exactly who we're lynching?

you cant have your cake and eat it too. you cant on the one hand say it's info for the wolves but on the other say it's not info for the village. regardless i dont see how it's much info for the wolves but i do see how it's loads of info for the village. the wolves already know who they're linked to. they won't be caught by surprise. the village is what gains by knowing exactly who's dying when a lynch is reached, not the wolves

lol at the fucking idea y'all have where it's better to have half of our lynches be of unknowns. am i the only sane person here? well and bid. everybody else seems to have lost their brains on the floor

one of these games im going to say only utterly stupid things. then we will win as easy as can be since everybody always disagrees with my points no matter how correct they are. yeah i get a lot of stuff wrong. yeah i rallied hard to lynch the angel the last game. yeah i rallied hard to lynch a reg villager last game. yeah i defended ongwolf last game. but this is a whole different level. i am stating basic facts about how this game functions statistically. this should be the least controversial thing of all time.

i call bullshit. Wuf normally claims some savant-like ability to make clutch reads in endgame spots, yet here he's claiming that this type of read is inappropriate in this game? something doesn't gel right here. he's setting up for lynching the other team. What he doesn't seem to consider is that the end-game is always going to be two couples, so by his logic it's simply the first couple to have both log in to cement the lynch.

my early game reads are always simplistic. early game is when the most reliable reads are things that are overt. this is exactly what got ong lynched d1 last game. it's what got baud lynched d1 when he was a wolf. all d1 lynches have little information behind them and are for the simplistic purposes, like post count or some weird stylistic thing

[Luco]

#233, in response to daven

thank you for making my point for me. do you not see how if you believe this, you must also believe it is better for the village to know exactly who we're lynching?

you cant have your cake and eat it too. you cant on the one hand say it's info for the wolves but on the other say it's not info for the village. regardless i dont see how it's much info for the wolves but i do see how it's loads of info for the village. the wolves already know who they're linked to. they won't be caught by surprise. the village is what gains by knowing exactly who's dying when a lynch is reached, not the wolves

lol at the fucking idea y'all have where it's better to have half of our lynches be of unknowns. am i the only sane person here? well and bid. everybody else seems to have lost their brains on the floor

one of these games im going to say only utterly stupid things. then we will win as easy as can be since everybody always disagrees with my points no matter how correct they are. yeah i get a lot of stuff wrong. yeah i rallied hard to lynch the angel the last game. yeah i rallied hard to lynch a reg villager last game. yeah i defended ongwolf last game. but this is a whole different level. i am stating basic facts about how this game functions statistically. this should be the least controversial thing of all time.




my early game reads are always simplistic. early game is when the most reliable reads are things that are overt. this is exactly what got ong lynched d1 last game. it's what got baud lynched d1 when he was a wolf. all d1 lynches have little information behind them and are for the simplistic purposes, like post count or some weird stylistic thing

V point for daven. I'm always looking for a word or phrasing that makes interactions unlikely w-w and the 'do you not see how if you believe this' in the first paragraph is a decent example.

[Hoopy]

this

i see zero value in keeping partners hidden. every lynch includes automatic death of the partner. let's be real, none of us are gonna vote to lynch our partners. this is really just a game of "which two players do we want to die". even in a 3v1 situation, it is always correct to not vote your partner since you know that 50% of the deaths in the lynch are village

it's me n teh hoopster

Can confirm, wugums & hoopz 4 ever <3

[Hoopy]

Hoppy

God dammit JKDS you fucker.

[Luco]

Hoopy is a villager

#foolmetwice

[OngBonga]

lynch gabe

Shit reason to vote for a strong asset.

[bigred]

Sup guys

I googled archer kitty....meh

[BooG690]

Without a JKDS in here to lynch, I'll have to lynch the person one down on my frenemies list: Lynch BankItDrew.

[baudib]

Think the only post of substance so far has been Ong's, that may have been a legit slip from Gabe.

[BankItDrew]

I'm reading ong as villager and anyone who is lynching him based on last game as opportunistic wolves.

[OngBonga]

I'm reading ong as villager and anyone who is lynching him based on last game as opportunistic wolves.

This is just plain odd, but coming from drew I don't know how much importance I should place on this.

The language "anyone who is lynching him based on last game..." is odd because so far there's only gabe who is doing so. Why is drew sidestepping gabe here? Why not just outright say he's reading gabe as wolfy? Why the plural "wolves"?

gabe might have legit slipped by calling me a villager, but drew looks fishy here too. gabe is wolfier though because gabe is more logical, so his comments are more alarming.

[a500lbgorilla]

This is just plain odd, but coming from drew I don't know how much importance I should place on this.

The language "anyone who is lynching him based on last game..." is odd because so far there's only gabe who is doing so. Why is drew sidestepping gabe here? Why not just outright say he's reading gabe as wolfy? Why the plural "wolves"?

gabe might have legit slipped by calling me a villager, but drew looks fishy here too. gabe is wolfier though because gabe is more logical, so his comments are more alarming.

LOL this is why I ignore your posts, Ong.

[OngBonga]

If gabe is a villager, then drew is a wolf.

[BankItDrew]

If gabe is a villager, then drew is a wolf.

If you're a wolf - gabe is a villager.

So what you're essentially saying is that if I'm a wolf, so are you.

Never go full retard.

[OngBonga]

If you're a wolf - gabe is a villager.

So what you're essentially saying is that if I'm a wolf, so are you.

Never go full retard.

wut?

[a500lbgorilla]

If you're a wolf - gabe is a villager.

So what you're essentially saying is that if I'm a wolf, so are you.

Never go full retard.

So? A villager could easily say this.

You're right, I could have simply said "gabe looks wolfy here".

I'm saying it now and don't know what the big deal is.

I've fallen victim to D1 lynchings based on the preformance of the last game. It's stupid imo...

We all make mistakes, some more than others (stfu).

lynch BankItDrew

[baudib]

I think I have 4 villagers so far. I have 2 other wolf candidates, and as much fun as it would be to lynch Wuf Day 1, I can't help to think at least 1 wolf jumped all over him.

yeah it's early

[daven]

I think I have 4 villagers so far. I have 2 other wolf candidates, and as much fun as it would be to lynch Wuf Day 1, I can't help to think at least 1 wolf jumped all over him.

interesting.... noted.
who are the villagers and wolves baudib?

[MadMojoMonkey]

I think I have 4 villagers so far. I have 2 other wolf candidates, and as much fun as it would be to lynch Wuf Day 1, I can't help to think at least 1 wolf jumped all over him.

yeah it's early

interesting.... noted.
who are the villagers and wolves baudib?

Another one of those "not W-W" cases*.

Based on the fact that baudib never directly answered this question, IIRC.

[BankItDrew]

You're right, I could have simply said "gabe looks wolfy here".

I'm saying it now and don't know what the big deal is.

I've fallen victim to D1 lynchings based on the preformance of the last game. It's stupid imo...

We all make mistakes, some more than others (stfu).

[baudib]

I'm not ruling out Gabe-Ong as W-W.

[OngBonga]

Nor should you. You can probably rule out ong-gabe as partners though.

[bigred]

You guys are amazing for making such clutch day 1 reads.

[OngBonga]

You guys are amazing for making such clutch day 1 reads.

I've made plenty of good d1 reads. People who say "d1 is useless" are trying to excuse their own uselessness. Lucily for you, that's not wolfy for you.

[baudib]

Think we're 50-50 on lynching wolves on D1 over the past several games. D1 is important just like any other day.

[BankItDrew]

Everyone should state their character name from the TV show theme. As well as who their lover is.

It's within the rules and will also provide information.

[a500lbgorilla]

Everyone should state their character name from the TV show theme. As well as who their lover is.

It's within the rules and will also provide information.

Lead by example, bitch.

[Luco]

Everyone should state their character name from the TV show theme. As well as who their lover is.

It's within the rules and will also provide information.

How about no

[a500lbgorilla]

No specials means only tone reads as wagons won't be particularly telling.

I'm betting the wolves aren't pair-bonded together even though that'd be the best of all scenarios.

OP lists 16 people, but has 14 villagers and 4 wolves (for 18), assuming a typo that's 8 pairs.

All wolves with another villager, 4 v-v pairs, 4 w-v pairs. Even though you know your own role, you don't know the value of your life with 100% confidence. Given nothing but tone reads to go off of, villagers are at worst .5 villagers, and at best .9 villagers as they can never really know for sure what their partner's role is.

Hopefully there's one complete w-w pair, so we can stumble into something as a village, otherwise it's a complete guess-fest brought to you by strained tone reads and wacky slip-analysis.

[baudib]

lynch bigred

[a500lbgorilla]

Why not?

[Luco]

Why not?

I like the mystery for now.

[Luco]

I found gabe's buddy



His accountabilibuddy

[OngBonga]

My gut reaction "fuck that", but I'm not sure why it's bad. I can't think why it's good though either, so it's pointless without a detailed explanation.

[a500lbgorilla]

Wrong and dumb.

[Luco]

Wrong and dumb.

I care not

[a500lbgorilla]

Your first responsibility is to get a read on your partner.

My partner is Baudib. He claims Tiffy (Tunt), I claim Cecil Tunt.

Second, the game is about the wolves total information against our none. With partner-lines known, they'll be less able to defend each other.

They already know all of the villager's they or their buddies are bonded with and can use that to navigate through the lynch mob and claim ignorance after the fact if anyone in the future should sniff them out.

[BankItDrew]

Your first responsibility is to get a read on your partner.

My partner is Baudib. He claims Tiffy (Tunt), I claim Cecil Tunt.

Second, the game is about the wolves total information against our none. With partner-lines known, they'll be less able to defend each other.

They already know all of the villager's they or their buddies are bonded with and can use that to navigate through the lynch mob and claim ignorance after the fact if anyone in the future should sniff them out.

Right on!

My partner is MMM. He claims Lana Kane. Of ISIS. I claim Cyril Figgis, with ISIS.

[BankItDrew]

I don't want to lead by example yet because:

1) I don't want to piss off my 'lover' without his input
2) I want feedback from other players first, too.

Personally, I see nothing but an exchange of information, which is a good thing.

[baudib]

I'm not 100% confident that this is not explicitly banned by the rules.

[a500lbgorilla]

lynch luco

[OngBonga]

I'm not 100% confident that this is not explicitly banned by the rules.

I don't see where JKDS specifically says not to claim buddies.

I think it's somewhat premature though.