poker stars or me

[jyms]

Has anyone noticed that the micro stakes NL and $1+0.10 S&G's at poker stars have seemed to get real tight. I can't seem to find consistant flops with more than 3 people at full ring. In the S&G's people are passive or tight as hell. Players are either folding to minimum raises or camping for AA, KK, AK it seems. Have I just hit a spot in my game where it seems that way or has anyone else seen it. I left $5 NL to play $25 NL for 2 hours and the game was much more loose and people were easier to read. But I decided after the last fiasco that I would deposit $50 and try to build a BR so I can't really play $25NL or variance will kill me. (I know, I know BR management), I just tried it to see if there is a difference in the games, I didn't get involved in losing my buyin. I have spent alot of time after losing my first deposit on stars learning from this site and reading SSH, and I'm about to start TOP this week, vowing to never lose another deposit and stay within my BR. Is it possible that I can't play that low of a stakes because of something i haven't learned or maybe unlearned that's causing my slow decline of BR again, or are the low of stakes at Stars just unplayable. Should I move.

[Xo_Sirk_oX]

I am find that at Stars, ( only place i have a BR ) micro limits no matter what you bet Post Flop someone will follow. They chase ANYTHING.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

BB ($5.53)
UTG ($2.50)
MP ($1.54)
CO ($1.64)
Hero ($1.90)
SB ($2.37)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A, J.
3 folds, Hero calls $0.02, 1 fold, BB checks.

Flop: ($0.05) 4, J, 2 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.06, BB calls $0.06.

Turn: ($0.17) 5 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.06, BB calls $0.06.

River: ($0.29) 3 (2 players)
BB bets $0.28, Hero calls $0.28.

Final Pot: $0.85

Now this is not a perfect play in any way shape or form, But I have others where I hit on the Flop TPTK with AK or similiar only to get rivered. Example. I hit FH on the Flop All in for 6 Bucks or something, Other Caller Rivered King to get the FH as Well... I have 89s Flop Comes 989 bet 6 bucks and hit the Rivered King, Bad Beat Yes but, i am not complaining.. Just the players at Micro hold on to anything

[bdawg56kg]

Yep, gotta agree with Sirk on this one. Low stakes NL on stars is a total fish-fest. Check out these hands.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

CO ($2.60)
Button ($7.28)
SB ($5.28)
BB ($4.64)
UTG ($5)
Hero ($4.74)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 7, 7.
1 fold, Hero raises to $0.04, 1 fold, Button calls $0.04, SB raises to $0.06, BB calls $0.04, Hero raises to $0.08, Button calls $0.04, SB raises to $0.1, BB raises to $0.14, Hero raises to $0.18, Button calls $0.06, SB raises to $0.2, BB raises to $0.28, Hero raises to $0.34, Button calls $0.06, SB raises to $0.36, BB raises to $0.48, Hero calls $0.04, Button calls $0.04, SB raises to $0.56, BB raises to $0.72, Hero calls $0.04, Button calls $0.04, SB calls $0.02.

Flop: ($2) 2, K, 5 (4 players)
SB bets $0.24, BB folds, Hero calls $0.24, Button folds.

Turn: ($2.48) 3 (2 players)
SB bets $0.32, Hero calls $0.32.

River: ($3.12) A (2 players)
SB bets $0.28, Hero raises to $1.28, SB calls $1.

Final Pot: $5.68

Results in white below:
SB has Kd Kh (three of a kind, kings).
Hero has 7c 7d (one pair, sevens).
Outcome: SB wins $5.68.


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

SB ($4.92)
BB ($5.86)
UTG ($9.57)
MP ($9.29)
CO ($5.55)
Hero ($3)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 6, K.
UTG calls $0.02, MP calls $0.02, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.02, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($0.10) 3, 5, K (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero bets $0.04, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls $0.04, MP calls $0.04.

Turn: ($0.22) 4 (3 players)
UTG checks, MP checks, Hero bets $0.1, UTG calls $0.10, MP calls $0.10.

River: ($0.52) 2 (3 players)
UTG checks, MP checks, Hero bets $0.26, UTG folds, MP raises to $9.13, Hero calls $2.58 (All-In).

Final Pot: $12.49

Results in white below:
MP has 7s Qd (high card, king).
Hero has 6h Kh (straight, six high).
Outcome: MP wins $6.29. Hero wins $6.20.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

SB ($3.74)
BB ($9.20)
UTG ($5.45)
MP ($1.95)
CO ($13.14)
Hero ($3.64)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 5, 6.
UTG calls $0.02, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.02, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($0.08) 8, A, 9 (4 players)
SB bets $0.08, BB calls $0.08, UTG calls $0.08, Hero calls $0.08.

Turn: ($0.40) 7 (4 players)
SB bets $0.34, BB calls $0.34, UTG raises to $0.68, Hero raises to $1.8, SB folds, BB calls $1.46, UTG calls $1.12.

River: ($6.14) 2 (3 players)
BB checks, UTG bets $2, Hero calls $1.74 (All-In), BB folds.

Final Pot: $9.88

Results in white below:
UTG has Tc Jd (straight, jack high).
Hero has 5c 6c (straight, nine high).
Outcome: UTG wins $9.88.


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

CO ($3.30)
Button ($7.32)
SB ($10.96)
BB ($1.95)
UTG ($13.14)
Hero ($2)

Preflop: Hero is MP with Q, Q.
UTG calls $0.02, Hero raises to $1.14, 2 folds, SB calls $1.13, 1 fold, UTG folds.

Flop: ($2.32) 7, 9, K (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $0.86 (All-In), SB calls $0.86.

Turn: ($4.04) 4 (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: ($4.04) 6 (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: $4.04

Results in white below:
SB has Ad 4c (one pair, fours).
Hero has Qd Qs (one pair, queens).
Outcome: Hero wins $4.04.


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Button ($2.35)
SB ($4.42)
BB ($13.63)
UTG ($4.89)
MP ($2.58)
Hero ($2.73)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 8, 3.
2 folds, Hero calls $0.02, Button calls $0.02, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($0.08) 8, 6, 7 (4 players)
SB checks, BB bets $0.02, Hero raises to $0.04, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls $0.02.

Turn: ($0.16) 9 (2 players)
BB bets $0.02, Hero raises to $0.04, BB raises to $0.06, Hero raises to $0.08, BB calls $0.02.

River: ($0.32) 5 (2 players)
BB bets $0.18, Hero raises to $2.59, BB calls $2.41.

Final Pot: $5.50

Results in white below:
BB has 9c Jd (flush, jack high).
Hero has 8d 3h (straight flush, nine high).
Outcome: Hero wins $5.50.

[jyms]

Yea, I noticed that you can't get them off a hand. Maybe that's the problem. They are hitting on the river on me a little more than they should. Maybe it's just me. I just went in there with a minimum BR not looking to be phil Ivey on the 200NL but to build from scratch but the suck outs are amazing. But what about the tightness. I can find the fish but there are a lot of campers at any table I go to. The S&G's take till first break to get 5 or 6 out of 45 out of the game. everyone seems to have read FTR or something. Some days it's like pulling teeth for the blinds. I'm not losing but there is no winning either. I make a buck, 50 cents,whatever and then just as i'm up a few $$, BAM, suckout. I'm in for $3 trying to get this guy of my set. He's hit a flush with one spaid in his hand.back to the beginning.

[andy-akb]

To the OP: The low stakes at stars are playable and are insanely beatable. Yes, people call with anything and yes it sucks when they draw out on you, but these are the people that make you money. Dont play $25nl or anything other than what you are bankrolled for, just keep grinding it out and stay disciplined.

Yep, gotta agree with Sirk on this one. Low stakes NL on stars is a total fish-fest. Check out these hands.
[/color]

No offense, but the only fish in most of these hands is you.

[jyms]

Here's an example of what I'm talking about

PokerStars Game #4577723998: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2006/04/09 -
22:22:10 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas III' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: Nocontest ($4.70 in chips)
Seat 2: warcoug ($2.53 in chips)
Seat 3: sk8terfred ($1.57 in chips)
Seat 4: SpeckFisher ($5.24 in chips)
Seat 5: trainer_jyms ($2.99 in chips)
Seat 6: KC Cha Cha ($1.83 in chips)
Seat 7: sodapoppa ($0.98 in chips)
sodapoppa: posts small blind $0.01
Nocontest: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to trainer_jyms [Jc Ts]
warcoug: folds
sk8terfred: folds
SpeckFisher: calls $0.02
trainer_jyms: calls $0.02
KC Cha Cha: calls $0.02
sodapoppa: calls $0.01
Nocontest: checks
*** FLOP *** [7h Th Td]
LukeStryker joins the table at seat #9
sodapoppa: checks
Nocontest: checks
SpeckFisher: checks
trainer_jyms: bets $0.06
KC Cha Cha: folds
sodapoppa: folds
Nocontest: folds
SpeckFisher: folds
trainer_jyms collected $0.10 from pot
trainer_jyms: doesn't show hand

here's another stupid one

PokerStars Game #4578031217: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2006/04/09 -
22:44:12 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas III' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: depot20fan ($1.92 in chips)
Seat 2: warcoug ($3.22 in chips)
Seat 3: sk8terfred ($1.68 in chips)
Seat 4: Chrome64 ($4.59 in chips)
Seat 5: trainer_jyms ($3.13 in chips)
Seat 6: KC Cha Cha ($3 in chips)
Seat 7: sodapoppa ($0.87 in chips)
Seat 8: bltmsu ($7.80 in chips)
Chrome64: posts small blind $0.01
trainer_jyms is disconnected
trainer_jyms is connected
trainer_jyms: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to trainer_jyms [2c 7d]
KC Cha Cha: folds
sodapoppa: folds
bltmsu: folds
depot20fan: calls $0.02
warcoug: folds
sk8terfred: folds
Chrome64: folds
trainer_jyms: checks
*** FLOP *** [Kc As 6s]
trainer_jyms: checks
depot20fan: checks
*** TURN *** [Kc As 6s] [4s]
trainer_jyms: checks
depot20fan: checks
*** RIVER *** [Kc As 6s 4s] [Ac]
trainer_jyms: bets $0.06
depot20fan: folds
trainer_jyms collected $0.05 from pot
trainer_jyms: doesn't show hand


this shows no one goes in and they arre passive as hell

PokerStars Game #4578101179: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2006/04/09 -
22:49:20 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas III' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: depot20fan ($1.88 in chips)
Seat 2: warcoug ($3.22 in chips)
Seat 3: sk8terfred ($1.30 in chips)
Seat 5: trainer_jyms ($3.58 in chips)
Seat 6: KC Cha Cha ($3 in chips)
Seat 7: sodapoppa ($0.91 in chips)
Seat 8: bltmsu ($7.74 in chips)
bltmsu: posts small blind $0.01
depot20fan: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to trainer_jyms [Tc Qs]
warcoug: folds
sk8terfred: folds
trainer_jyms: calls $0.02
KC Cha Cha: folds
sodapoppa: folds
bltmsu: calls $0.01
depot20fan: checks
*** FLOP *** [Kd 9d 9c]
bltmsu: checks
depot20fan: checks
trainer_jyms: checks
*** TURN *** [Kd 9d 9c] [5h]
bltmsu: checks
depot20fan: checks
trainer_jyms: bets $0.06
bltmsu: folds
depot20fan: folds
trainer_jyms collected $0.06 from pot
trainer_jyms: doesn't show hand


on this no one wanted it so I took it

PokerStars Game #4578130972: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2006/04/09 -
22:51:34 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas III' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: depot20fan ($1.84 in chips)
Seat 2: warcoug ($2.31 in chips)
Seat 3: sk8terfred ($1.28 in chips)
Seat 5: trainer_jyms ($3.62 in chips)
Seat 6: KC Cha Cha ($2.98 in chips)
Seat 7: sodapoppa ($1.85 in chips)
Seat 8: bltmsu ($7.70 in chips)
warcoug: posts small blind $0.01
sk8terfred: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to trainer_jyms [8d Jd]
trainer_jyms: calls $0.02
KC Cha Cha: folds
sodapoppa: folds
bltmsu: folds
depot20fan: calls $0.02
warcoug: calls $0.01
sk8terfred: checks
*** FLOP *** [As 3h 4s]
warcoug: checks
sk8terfred: checks
trainer_jyms: checks
depot20fan: checks
*** TURN *** [As 3h 4s] [8h]
warcoug: checks
sk8terfred: checks
trainer_jyms: checks
depot20fan: checks
*** RIVER *** [As 3h 4s 8h] [8s]
warcoug: bets $0.04
sk8terfred: folds
trainer_jyms: raises $0.06 to $0.10
depot20fan: folds
warcoug: folds
trainer_jyms collected $0.16 from pot
trainer_jyms: doesn't show hand


then when you think your beat

PokerStars Game #4578202424: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2006/04/09 -
22:56:50 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas III' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: depot20fan ($1.72 in chips)
Seat 2: warcoug ($2.22 in chips)
Seat 3: sk8terfred ($1.14 in chips)
Seat 5: trainer_jyms ($3.65 in chips)
Seat 6: KC Cha Cha ($3.36 in chips)
Seat 7: sodapoppa ($1.82 in chips)
Seat 8: bltmsu ($7.73 in chips)
Seat 9: farmerkel ($0.94 in chips)
bltmsu: posts small blind $0.01
farmerkel: posts big blind $0.02
Studmuffino: sits out
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to trainer_jyms [Ac 2h]
depot20fan: calls $0.02
warcoug: folds
sk8terfred: folds
trainer_jyms: calls $0.02
KC Cha Cha: calls $0.02
sodapoppa: folds
bltmsu: calls $0.01
farmerkel: checks
*** FLOP *** [Ah Tc Qc]
bltmsu: checks
farmerkel: checks
depot20fan: bets $0.02
trainer_jyms: raises $0.04 to $0.06
KC Cha Cha: calls $0.06
bltmsu: folds
farmerkel: folds
depot20fan: calls $0.04
*** TURN *** [Ah Tc Qc] [5c]
depot20fan: checks
trainer_jyms: bets $0.06
KC Cha Cha: folds
depot20fan: calls $0.06
*** RIVER *** [Ah Tc Qc 5c] [Qh]
depot20fan: checks
trainer_jyms: bets $0.10
KC Cha Cha is sitting out
depot20fan: calls $0.10
*** SHOW DOWN ***
trainer_jyms: shows [Ac 2h] (two pair, Aces and Queens)
depot20fan: mucks hand
trainer_jyms collected $0.60 from pot

and finally found one to prove my point about WTF
PokerStars Game #4578762826: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2006/04/09 -
23:39:50 (ET)
Table 'Kalchas III' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: BLACKJOHN ($3.56 in chips)
Seat 3: Philthos ($1.98 in chips)
Seat 4: Studmuffino ($2.62 in chips)
Seat 5: trainer_jyms ($2.83 in chips)
Seat 6: hongkongfewy ($4.79 in chips)
Seat 7: sodapoppa ($2.18 in chips)
Seat 8: bltmsu ($7.91 in chips)
Seat 9: farmerkel ($0.63 in chips)
BLACKJOHN: posts small blind $0.01
Philthos: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to trainer_jyms [Ac 8d]
Studmuffino: folds
trainer_jyms: calls $0.02
Lil Auggie leaves the table
hongkongfewy: raises $0.04 to $0.06
sodapoppa: folds
bltmsu: folds
farmerkel: calls $0.06
BLACKJOHN: calls $0.05
Philthos: calls $0.04
trainer_jyms: calls $0.04
*** FLOP *** [4d 3c 8c]
BLACKJOHN: checks
Philthos: checks
trainer_jyms: bets $0.10
smokingjoe68 joins the table at seat #2
hongkongfewy: calls $0.10
farmerkel: calls $0.10
BLACKJOHN: calls $0.10
Philthos: calls $0.10
*** TURN *** [4d 3c 8c] [8h]
BLACKJOHN: checks
Philthos: checks
trainer_jyms: bets $0.10
hongkongfewy: calls $0.10
farmerkel: calls $0.10
BLACKJOHN: calls $0.10
Philthos: calls $0.10
*** RIVER *** [4d 3c 8c 8h] [7c]
BLACKJOHN: checks
Philthos: checks
trainer_jyms: bets $0.30
hongkongfewy: folds
farmerkel: folds
BLACKJOHN: calls $0.30
Philthos: folds
*** SHOW DOWN ***
trainer_jyms: shows [Ac 8d] (three of a kind, Eights)
BLACKJOHN: shows [2c Qc] (a flush, Queen high)
BLACKJOHN collected $1.85 from pot

[andy-akb]

I wouldnt complain about it if you are winning chips with bad hands. Every single hand you posted I would have folded preflop except for the 72o in the BB, and that I would have checked down. At these micro-limits if a table is too tight, find another, there are so many you can pick from, find one that isnt this tight.

[piratepeaty]

Has anyone noticed that the micro stakes NL and $1+0.10 S&G's at poker stars have seemed to get real tight. I can't seem to find consistant flops with more than 3 people at full ring. In the S&G's people are passive or tight as hell. Players are either folding to minimum raises or camping for AA, KK, AK it seems. Have I just hit a spot in my game where it seems that way or has anyone else seen it. I left $5 NL to play $25 NL for 2 hours and the game was much more loose and people were easier to read. But I decided after the last fiasco that I would deposit $50 and try to build a BR so I can't really play $25NL or variance will kill me. (I know, I know BR management), I just tried it to see if there is a difference in the games, I didn't get involved in losing my buyin. I have spent alot of time after losing my first deposit on stars learning from this site and reading SSH, and I'm about to start TOP this week, vowing to never lose another deposit and stay within my BR. Is it possible that I can't play that low of a stakes because of something i haven't learned or maybe unlearned that's causing my slow decline of BR again, or are the low of stakes at Stars just unplayable. Should I move.

I sometimes play the micro limits on stars as stress relief. They are stupid soft. Value bet, value bet, value bet. Bet hard and keep pushing. Don't bluff. I'm always amazed when I'm donking it up and my J high holds.

[jyms]

Yea, i wasn't complaining as much as saying that these players throw me for a loop. How can you win when you get 4 or 5 hands at 0.06 cents then a guy chases a flush and catches when your betting 5bb at the flop, turn and river. I have to play alot of the crap because I can play it like I have something. I prefer to play alot tighter but I can't make anything on the big hands as you see. Any raise and they fold. They fold to any pressure. In order to get paid I just try to rack up the 6 cent profits until someone hits. and takes my hours work. Is it just the table selection or are they all relatively the same, within reason. I'm trying everything I can find, slowplaying, pausing and raising weak like I have nothing, check raising trying to get them pot commited but nothing.

[andy-akb]

Yea, i wasn't complaining as much as saying that these players throw me for a loop. How can you win when you get 4 or 5 hands at 0.06 cents then a guy chases a flush and catches when your betting 5bb at the flop, turn and river. I have to play alot of the crap because I can play it like I have something. I prefer to play alot tighter but I can't make anything on the big hands as you see. Any raise and they fold. They fold to any pressure. In order to get paid I just try to rack up the 6 cent profits until someone hits. and takes my hours work. Is it just the table selection or are they all relatively the same, within reason. I'm trying everything I can find, slowplaying, pausing and raising weak like I have nothing, check raising trying to get them pot commited but nothing.

My VPIP is 17% and I wouldnt say that is too low, but it definitely isnt high, and I make a profit playing micro-limits at PokerStars. I dont think your opponents can be as tight as you are making them up to be, because at .05/.10 they are very loose/passive, Id imagine they would be more loose at the lower stakes and after looking at the table stats where the majority of the tables have over 50% of players seeing the flop, getting your hands paid off should not be a problem. Yes, they will fold sometimes when you raise with aces, but at these limits you get paid off a lot.

[FriskyPirate]

Has anyone noticed that the micro stakes NL at poker stars have seemed to get real tight.

There is actually some statistical proof backing you up jyms. Check out the table rating charts for 5c 10c at Stars vs 10c 25c this week and the game is actually a little tighter at the lower level. I'm guessing this is temporary.

5 10
http://www.pokertableratings.com/tab...ers=10&search=

10 25
http://www.pokertableratings.com/tab...ers=10&search=

[Micro2Macro]

Has anyone noticed that the micro stakes NL at poker stars have seemed to get real tight.

There is actually some statistical proof backing you up jyms. Check out the table rating charts for 5c 10c at Stars vs 10c 25c this week and the game is actually a little tighter at the lower level. I'm guessing this is temporary.

5 10
http://www.pokertableratings.com/tab...ers=10&search=

10 25
http://www.pokertableratings.com/tab...ers=10&search=

There's alot of timid/rock/tight weak players at 10NL from what I've noticed. I've seen some players who literally have 0% steal percentage and 100% fold to steal with samples of roughyl 300-400 hands. This is the easiest money around because all you need is raise into them all day. These guys won't adjust, and this is where you can make your money. They probably don't realize they're losing yet, they're playing 'properly tight' from their point of view. With that said, just because a table is tight doesn't mean the players are good.

It is quite funny though how 10NL turned out tighter than 25NL for the given sample. But statistically, I THINK the 'tightness' of tables from select limits would be able to be justified by a Confidence Internval. I think it might be jusifiable that the hand ranage of the population could be illustrated by a normal distribution. Won't get into detail about how to calculate given a sample, but basically you can say 'I am 99 (or whatever number) % confident that 10NL will be looser than 25NL. This occurance where 10NL is tighter than 25NL just happens to be that 1% showing up.

This '1%' could in fact be higher, I just used these numbers to illustrate the concept. Speaking of this, does anyone use confidence intervals at all when analyzing other aspects of poker? It doesn't really accomplish much in this scenerio, although I think some of the higher stakes players could use this sort of concept to polarize their range?

[givememyleg]

lol

[gingerwizard]

LOL at this insane bump.

Also confidence intervals mean NOTHING. They are not probabilities so you can't actually use them for anything other than weak evidence.

[angrystoc]

I'm guessing this is temporary.

Define temporary.

[kb coolman]

I'm guessing this is temporary.

Define temporary.

Until the next time I check.

Actually, the $10NL and $25NL seem to be running pretty close lately.

[Rage2100]

I thought jyms was drunk when I started reading this.

[jyms]

That's what I get for linking an almost 3 year old post as an example of how things don't change, just the people asking the questions.

[mrhappy333]

I waz like, wtf? I thought jyms was a poker pro? and he's playing 5cent 10cent?
then I realized I had been Leveled!

[bigspenda73]

definitely you jyms

[Robb]

That's what I get for linking an almost 3 year old post as an example of how things don't change, just the people asking the questions.

LoL on the mod leveler. Also instructive. My first 50 FTR posts are probably "worse." Scared to look 'em up.

Bottom line: we get better when we look internally for solutions to poker problems.

[bigspenda73]

nom nom nom



<3 Jyms