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Ahead Of The Rake

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  1. #1

    Default Ahead Of The Rake

    "Defeat is not the worst of failures. Not to have tried is the true failure." -- G.E. Woodberry


    --

    CURRENT BLOG
    : When Push Comes To Shove

    --


    Poker Goal

    • Play sustainably profitable poker (NLHE).


    Career Highlights

    • Currently grinding cash games up to 100nl
    • Highest earnings in any given month: $620
    • Best tourney payout: $600 (5th place)
    • Biggest game I've sat in: live $500nl

    Poker Influences


    • Andrew Seidman
    • Cole South
    • Jared Tendler
    • Haseeb Qureshi
    • Tommy Angelo
    • My fellow poker mates (u know who u r)
    • FTR community as a whole


    updated April 2010
    Last edited by al yell; 06-05-2010 at 03:39 AM.
  2. #2
    I recently had the urge to create a journal. Not only to chronicle my progress but also as an aid to dump the mental clutter I tend to carry forward. If you happen to peruse and draw anything from my navel gazing then all the better. Please reply freely.

    I was going to kick things off with a summary of my poker misadventures over the last couple years but I'll focus instead on where I am and where I want to be.

    I'm currently grinding 10nl and bonus whoring. Obv to build a roll but more so to practice improving my game. I could actually be playing a bit higher but I'm a huge BR nit and I really don't feel that confident in my game (for reasons I won't get into. Think: spewtard). Though I've been an active player for a couple years I've been lazy and passive in my approach to learning; something I plan to attack with vigor moving forward.

    Here's September.


    I was mostly 12 tabling slow, boring, ABC poker. Played roughly 2k hands/day, so 2 to 3 hours of play daily which I'd like to work up to 5 or 6. Other goals include following through with the learning techniques introduced by Jared Tendler which basically consists of keeping a written record of sessions for review in order to systematically weed out weaknesses and introduce new skills. (i.e. a method for building and strengthening your 'A' game).

    I haven't played in two days because my sleep is all out of whack. I was going to bed at 4am but since I started working out to P90X it would appear my body is somehow trying to tune itself to a different cycle. Undoubtedly one more copacetic with nature's rhythm and not that of a degenerate poker player's. Not that I mind. Living on Vampire Time was beginning to take its toll.

    -- -- --

    been up all night, can't sleep but too out of it to play. So I'm reviewing hands...

    #1 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed)

    SB ($9.29)
    BB ($19.23)
    UTG ($10.15)
    MP ($5.51)
    Hero (Button) ($14.76)

    Preflop: Hero is Button with 6, 6
    UTG calls $0.10, 1 fold, Hero bets $0.50, 2 folds, UTG calls $0.40

    Flop: ($1.15) 5, J, Q (2 players)
    UTG checks, Hero bets $0.80, UTG calls $0.80

    Turn: ($2.75) A (2 players)
    UTG checks, Hero bets $2, UTG calls $2

    River: ($6.75) 10 (2 players)
    UTG checks, Hero bets $11.46 (All-In)

    I don't think Villain can profitably call against my shoving range which includes quite a few K's.


    #2 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (4 handed)

    Hero (SB) ($10.85)
    BB ($16.11)
    UTG ($6.30)

    Preflop: Hero is SB with A, K
    UTG bets $0.20, Button raises $0.75, Hero raises $1.25, 1 fold, UTG calls $1.10, Button calls $0.55

    Flop: ($4) 10, 9, K (3 players)
    Hero bets $3.33, UTG calls $3.33, Button raises $13.78 (All-In), Hero calls $6.22 (All-In), UTG calls $1.67 (All-In)

    Turn: ($28.10) 5 (3 players, 3 all-in)

    River: ($28.10) 3 (3 players, 3 all-in)

    Total pot: $28.10

    Results:
    Button had J, 5 (one pair, fives).
    Hero had A, K (one pair, Kings).
    UTG had 6, K (one pair, Kings).
    Outcome: Hero won $26.70

    [x] Never folding TPTK ftw

    Oh yeah, played a home SnG last night and got it in ahead uber deep on a Th8c9sKc Turn w/T8 vs AcJc after donking Flop for pot and getting called by PFR. River came 2c. gg. I was basically flipping against his range I think. Guy was a station.

    A little later this guy's analysis blew my mind:
    They're still like 8 handed.. UTG limps, EP min-raises, CO min-reraises, call, call.
    Flop is KcJc5c. UTG checks, EP 3/4 pot, CO calls, UTG folds.
    Turn is 7c. EP 3/4 pot, CO calls.
    River blanks. EP again bets roughly 3/4 pot, CO calls pretty quickly. EP shows AT no club, CO flips over 33 with the 3 of clubs for a flush.

    When I asked him what compelled him to call (thinking maybe he had a sick tell or something because these guys play together often) he explained how the board was all black cards, he had two black cards, so surely his opponent was holding red cards and couldn't have a flush. !! And he wasn't even leveling me.

    Can I get a "+", can I get an "E", can I get a "V". What d'ya get!? Hooomme Donkaments! (rah rah).
  3. #3
    Advice: start playing less than 12 tables, focus on improving, put thought into every decision, and actively consider everyones ranges.

    This should help fix that red line a bit, you have a leak of too often putting money into the pot then folding.
  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Micro2Macro
    Advice: start playing less than 12 tables, focus on improving, put thought into every decision, and actively consider everyones ranges.

    This should help fix that red line a bit, you have a leak of too often putting money into the pot then folding.
    Thanks for the sound advice and insight. I suppose optimally I should find the right amount of tables that allows me to still actively pick up reads, have time to think, not get bored, flatten the variance, and still capitalize on RB. I'm guessing 4 to 6 for now. The potential increase in winrate/improvement will more than make up for the difference of hands I get to play/hr.

    My problem, due to eagerness/impatience, was thinking that I should nit it up mass tabling until I jumped up a couple stakes and then cut down tables and open up my game. But I have the perfect opportunity to practice right now and nothing says that it might not lead to me actually climbing up the stakes a bit faster. It will certainly better prepare me for the higher ones.

    Napped for an hour and a half and feel a bit better. Now hopefully I can get to bed at a decent time (i.e. no later than 1am) and condition myself to keep that schedule.
  5. #5
    I finally had a good night's sleep last night and it was fucking GLORIOUS! I can finally get back to the grind. I'll 6-table with the focus on applying ranges (though this will go without saying from this point on) and not focusing on results as I play. Once I totally pwn that bad habit I'll move on to another until I systematically eliminate them all. This will clear the way for applying new skills. It's just a question of recognition and repetition.
  6. #6
    today's sess: 4 hrs, 2.2k hands, up 4bi's. Started out rough losing AA to QQ but it was smooth sailing after that. I never once checked my results but left my email notification on and must have received half a dozen emails which I checked every time. I'll be turning it off while I play from now on as I evidently don't have the discipline to ignore the little "new email" msg that pops up.

    criticism welcomed:

    -Click Here for discussion -
    #3 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed)

    BB ($9.75)
    UTG ($10.43)
    Hero (MP) ($10)
    CO ($7.66)
    Button ($27.85)
    SB ($11.33)

    Preflop: Hero is MP with 3, 3
    UTG bets $0.40, Hero calls $0.40, 4 folds

    Flop: ($0.95) 10, 9, 8 (2 players)
    UTG bets $0.40, Hero raises $1.28, UTG calls $0.88

    Turn: ($3.51) 9 (2 players)
    UTG checks, Hero bets $1.76, UTG calls $1.76

    River: ($7.03) 8 (2 players)
    UTG checks, Hero bets $6.56 (All-In)
  7. #7
    Spew.

    The turn pairing also makes it harder to rep a set due to combinatorics, and your sizing is suspicious.

    Assuming no reads: Fold flop>>>float flop>>>raise flop, imo. Don't run multi-street bluffs without appropriate reads.
  8. #8
    In regards to hand #3 above, at the risk of appearing like a total donk I will disclose my honest and precise thought process so it can be picked apart and critiqued. I caught myself being reluctant to do this out of embarrassment and fear of being wrong. This is no doubt a big part of what has stunted my progress. Fortunately, being something of a step removed with this blog, I feel I can go into it and I'm ready to receive and consider all opinions and constructive criticism.

    meta/gameflow: I'd just played a hand with him at another table. I flatted 99 from SB to his BTN raise then donked a AK9r flop. He raised, I shoved, he called and showed AQ.

    pf: I'm flatting 33 initially for set value against his UTG range which I estimated was something like top 8% of hands: 88+,ATs+,KTs+,QJs,AJo+
    My flatting range here is something close to JJ-22,AQs-AJs,KJs+,QTs+,JTs,T9s,98s,87s,AQo

    flop: He bets less than half pot on a board that is pretty scary for a significant portion of his range. So I raise repping strength or a big draw and immediately plan to b/f the following Turn cards: 6-T, any non-broadway diamond if he calls.

    turn: when the 9 comes and pairs the board and its checked to me I just thought, "That's way better for me than it is for him." When he checks I spontaneously decided to bet half pot because I decided this was the best way to repp the nuts by making it look like I'm hoping to get raised or don't want him folding to too large a bet. But it was also the perfect amount to leave him exactly a PSB left behind if he should call. If I bet bigger and he calls he might be more inclined to get stubborn with an over-pair if he feels pot committed (if only for psychological reason as oppose to actual mathematical ones). When he flats I remember thinking, "He has an over-pair and doesn't know what to do or is playing a draw passively."

    river: 8. Now, being a double paired board and seeing him check again, I think slowplayed straights, overpairs, missed draws are all folding, and I think he raises me on the flop with a set so I don't put him on a boat. I've shown strength the whole way, he hasn't, there's nothing left to do but put him to a decision for all his chips.

    There it is, fwiw. This kind of shit is what happens when I'm playing too few tables. I get way way too deep in my own thoughts; too imaginative and not logical enough I suppose.
  9. #9
    Excellent summary of your thoughts. It's good to write them all out to get a better idea of how you were thinking in the hand and also bring out some history etc. that can help analyze the situation more effectively.

    I think you should copy/paste this hand in the BC as well as your thoughts on it so some discussion can get started since some of the best contributors to the BC don't browse through the hands in the Operations forum as often.

    I'm not quite sure what to think exactly but I'll say this for now:

    Quote Originally Posted by al yell
    meta/gameflow: I'd just played a hand with him at another table. I flatted 99 from SB to his BTN raise then donked a AK9r flop. He raised, I shoved, he called and showed AQ.
    You have a read that he isn't folding top pair or an overpair - yet this is essentially what you are trying to do in this hand. Whether or not he believes you have it, he's going to call down anyway because he's a station. Even if this player KNOWS you are taking the line to represent a set/boat or whatever, he's not going to talk himself into folding. Especially after he lost a big pot - he's going to want to get that money back however he can, and if he has top pair as the preflop raiser, regardles of whether or not you stacked him before with a stronger hand, he's going to call down anyway most of the time.

    If you think you have the best hand, raising only folds worse and gets calls from better in this case, so given that, theoretically, floating seems like it would be the best play.

    Basically, just don't waste fancy plays on players who aren't thinking nor care what they stack off with.
  10. #10
    Discussion of hand #3: link
  11. #11
    fun game

    #4 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed)

    SB ($16.23)
    BB ($12.57)
    UTG ($2.75)
    MP ($8.70)
    Hero (CO) ($10)
    Button ($10.26)

    Preflop: Hero is CO with Q, A
    1 fold, MP calls $0.10, Hero bets $0.45, 3 folds, MP calls $0.35

    Flop: ($1.05) 4, 2, A (2 players)
    MP checks, Hero bets $0.70, MP calls $0.70

    Turn: ($2.45) 4 (2 players)
    MP checks, Hero bets $1.95, MP raises $7.55 (All-In), Hero calls $5.60

    River: ($17.55) 4 (2 players, 1 all-in)

    Total pot: $17.55

    Results:
    MP had 4, 5 (four of a kind, fours).
    Hero had Q, A (full house, fours over Aces).
    Outcome: MP won $16.68

    -- -- --

    #5 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed)

    CO ($16.73)
    Hero (Button) ($18.54)
    SB ($2.44)
    BB ($10.05)
    UTG ($1.68)
    MP ($5.84)

    Preflop: Hero is Button with K, Q
    3 folds, Hero bets $0.35, SB calls $0.30, 1 fold

    Flop: ($0.80) J, J, Q (2 players)
    SB checks, Hero checks

    Turn: ($0.80) J (2 players)
    SB checks, Hero bets $0.40, SB raises $2.09 (All-In), Hero calls $1.69

    River: ($4.98) 5 (2 players, 1 all-in)

    Total pot: $4.98

    Results:
    Hero had K, Q (full house, Jacks over Queens).
    SB had 3, J (four of a kind, Jacks).
    Outcome: SB won $4.74
  12. #12
    hand 3: i think anything other than folding the flop is spew
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos
    hand 3: i think anything other than folding the flop is spew
    It's certainly the consensus, and I do normally fold the flop. Maybe the real lesson to be taken from this is to recognize why I found myself getting out of line as to avoid its re occurrence.

    I know it's completely result oriented, but had I lost the hand my mistake may have been immediately evident to me. Thanks for the feedback.
  14. #14
    gah, it's noon and I'm just waking up. Why do the games have to be SO good at 3 in the fucking morning!?
  15. #15
    yeah its ridiculous.. im almost 100% sure, that if we were to play only between midnight and 5am, our winrate would at least triple
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    8,697
    Location
    soaking up ethanol, moving on up
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos
    yeah its ridiculous.. im almost 100% sure, that if we were to play only between midnight and 5am, our winrate would at least triple
    move to nz for a while?
  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by daven
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos
    yeah its ridiculous.. im almost 100% sure, that if we were to play only between midnight and 5am, our winrate would at least triple
    move to nz for a while?
    Tempting.. Maybe when my finances catch up with my goals, though in some ways that's prob the wrong approach.
  18. #18
    What a day! If I may I'd like to invite you all to play a little game I call, "Spot The Stacks" at these 25nl tables:



    I had a nearly 8 hour day that essentially went like this:



    I'm so wired and fried at the same time. I'll go play some Assassin's Creed until I pass out. Here are the highlights of the sess...

    This guy sat down with me HU and was literally shoving ATC pf. He hit and ran me after this beauty:


    #6 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (2 handed)

    Hero (SB) ($42.55)
    BB ($14.44)

    Preflop: Hero is SB with A, K
    Hero calls $0.15, BB bets $14.19 (All-In), Hero calls $14.19

    Flop: ($28.88) 3, 5, 8 (2 players, 1 all-in)

    Turn: ($28.88) 10 (2 players, 1 all-in)

    River: ($28.88) 2 (2 players, 1 all-in)

    Total pot: $28.88

    Results:
    Hero had A, K (high card, Ace).
    BB had 10, K (one pair, tens).
    Outcome: BB won $27.88

    -- -- --

    And prob the best hand was this one:

    #7 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    UTG ($21.90)
    Hero (MP) ($47.40)
    CO ($32.98)
    Button ($14.96)
    SB ($5.88)
    BB ($4.73)

    Preflop: Hero is MP with 10, A
    1 fold, Hero bets $0.85, CO calls $0.85, 3 folds

    Flop: ($2.05) K, 6, 2 (2 players)
    Hero bets $1.40, CO calls $1.40

    Turn: ($4.85) Q (2 players)
    Hero bets $3, CO raises $6, Hero calls $3

    River: ($16.85) J (2 players)
    Hero bets $13, CO raises $24.73 (All-In), Hero calls $11.73

    Total pot: $66.31

    Results:
    Hero had 10, A (straight, Ace high).
    CO had Q, K (two pair, Kings and Queens).
    Outcome: Hero won $63.31
  19. #19
    Put in a short sess this morning, and by morning i mean 2pm. Kept defaulting back to autopilot and wasn't able to sustain any kind of 'A' game so I decided to stop at 1k hands... but not before taking a quick stroll through Value Town. I was in the neighborhood after all and didn't want to be rude by not stopping in to say hi to the folks.

    #8 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed)

    Hero (BB) ($32.25)
    UTG ($29.36)
    MP ($25.10)
    Button ($27)
    SB ($4.61)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with K, A
    1 fold, MP bets $2.25, 2 folds, Hero calls $2

    I'd normally 3bet but I wanted to keep a monkey to my left in the pot

    Flop: ($4.60) Q, 5, K (2 players)
    Hero checks, MP bets $2.30, Hero calls $2.30

    Turn: ($9.20) 4 (2 players)
    Hero checks, MP bets $4.30, Hero calls $4.30

    River: ($17.80) 9 (2 players)
    Hero bets $23.40 (All-In), MP calls $16.25 (All-In)

    Total pot: $50.30

    Results:
    Hero had K, A (one pair, Kings).
    MP had 9, A (one pair, nines).
    Outcome: Hero won $55.45

    -- -- --

    #9 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    Hero (BB) ($25)
    UTG ($30.93)
    MP ($25.31)
    CO ($36.60)
    Button ($24.35)
    SB ($12.83)

    I'd seen Villain get it in light and make real thin value bets

    Preflop: Hero is BB with K, A
    2 folds, CO calls $0.25, 2 folds, Hero bets $0.90, CO calls $0.90

    Flop: ($2.40) A, 8, 9 (2 players)
    Hero bets $1.80, CO calls $1.80

    Turn: ($6) 8 (2 players)
    Hero bets $4.90, CO calls $4.90

    River: ($15.80) 4 (2 players)
    Hero bets $17.15 (All-In), CO calls $17.15

    Total pot: $50.10

    Results:
    Hero had K, A (two pair, Aces and eights).
    CO had A, 6 (two pair, Aces and eights).
    Outcome: Hero won $47.60
  20. #20
    #8 Id like to hear your reasoning for shoving river. You should just c/c. He's gonna value bet all Kings anyway and the other part of his range is air or TJ.
    #9 Std
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos
    #8 Id like to hear your reasoning for shoving river.
    I was actually keeping a close eye on this guy 'cause it was just a matter of time before he donated his stack. He was a total maniac. From the time I sat down he'd open shoved 3 hands pf and over shoved nearly a half a dozen flops then showed a variety TPNK type hands. No one was playing back at him. When he wasn't doing that he was always checking the River in spots he was obviously beat/weak and made one call OOP with 3rd pair where a nit was value betting. I also figured shoving looked bluffy/suspicious even though he obv wasn't thinking.

    Justified or still spewy? Thanks for yr feedback.
  22. #22
    i guess it cant be that bad vs a donk.. but then again theres so much air in his range then that i'd still let him bluff river prob
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos
    i guess it cant be that bad vs a donk.. but then again theres so much air in his range then that i'd still let him bluff river prob
    k, ty. This is really educational - not only in regards to my play but also in bringing about awareness of my slightly flawed logic and deceptive self-certainty. Actually that's not accurate b/c I'm not certain about anything!

    The deeper I delve the more I see things that need work, naturally. But the very recognition of that fact suggests improvement and with this I know I'm heading in the right direction, which is exciting.

    I am grateful, also, to all who continue to be overwhelmingly generous with their time, guidance and knowledge. I can't imagine success would find itself easily without consistent support and encouragement.

    sry for the sentimentality - i put my cat down today.
  24. #24
    No poker today. It it my intention to continue to find new and better ways to utilize this journal. I updated first post above to include some editable content focusing on development and giving a summary of "where I'm at". For those following along please feel free to suggest modifications to the 'Skills Development' list (or anything else for that matter) if you feel there's anything I should be aware of. Always greatly appreciated.
  25. #25
    You seem really focused and perfectionist/nit :P Nice list though.

    What's left is to grind a lot of hours and post a lot of hands/discussions. Preferably in SHNL/beginners since it gets more traffic than here.

    Gl.
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  26. #26
    Got in a really short session tonight. Games were dead. Up a bit.

    - Click Here for discussion -
    #9 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    SB ($34.66)
    BB ($53.83)
    UTG ($22.58)
    Hero (MP) ($37.24)
    CO ($13)
    Button ($24.49)

    Preflop: Hero is MP with Q, A
    1 fold, Hero bets $0.85, 1 fold, Button calls $0.85, 2 folds

    Flop: ($2.05) K, A, 3 (2 players)
    Hero bets $1.56, Button calls $1.56

    Turn: ($5.17) K (2 players)
    Hero bets $3.85, Button calls $3.85

    River: ($12.87) 5 (2 players)
    Hero bets $6.77, Button calls $6.77

    Total pot: $26.41

    Results:
    Button had A, 10 (two pair, Aces and Kings).
    Hero had Q, A (two pair, Aces and Kings).
    Outcome: Hero won $25.09
  27. #27
    I'll be watching this. You seem to know what you want from poker, and it looks like you have a good way of acheiving those goals. Stay focused, don't let a bad run of cards get you down, etc, etc. Hit me up any time you want to discuss poker and whatnot.

    Also, do you always type in your bets? I rarely do that.
  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by dranger7070
    ....don't let a bad run of cards get you down....
    A little background:
    I'm all too familiar with downswings. I've easily played at least 800k hands of poker in my "career" so far; but I suck(ed). Started out w/SnG's (standard), progressed to cash. I was playing mostly 50nl and taking several shots at 100nl. But it wasn't until I lost nearly 20 bi's at 200nl that I was awakened to the fact that I was making several fundamental mistakes. The hh's confirmed it. It wasn't just variance, though there was a fair share of beats/coolers/shitty spots, etc. This "from the ground up" approach I've embarked on is a solution to practicing while minimizing the risks and rebuilding my shaken confidence after having nosedived from the lower-mid stakes. Anyhow, what you say is very important to learn to do, and extremely difficult.

    Quote Originally Posted by dranger7070
    Also, do you always type in your bets? I rarely do that.
    Fairly often, but not always. For instance I'll almost never type them pf if there are preset buttons. Mostly for Turn and River bets where I want to bet slightly more or less than what might be a standard bet depending on the situation. I also like throwing in odd bet sizes just to fk w/opp. $5.37 instead of $5.30, etc. But when I do I try to merge between doing it for value/semi-bluffs/air. I can't say with any certainty that it has actually ever helped in any way, but it's fun and keeps me focused.

    Quote Originally Posted by dranger7070
    Hit me up any time you want to discuss poker and whatnot.
    Much obliged. Same to you.
  29. #29
    new resolution: no more dragging the computer with me to the washroom when I have to take a shit while playing.

    -- -- --

    - Click Here for discussion -
    #10 Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed)

    Hero (BB) ($25.57)
    UTG ($21.46)
    MP ($39.01)
    Button ($20.83)
    SB ($26.39)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with 8, 8
    Hero bets $0.85, UTG calls $0.85, 3 folds

    Flop: ($2.05) 10, 8, 6 (2 players)
    Hero bets $1.65, UTG calls $1.65

    Turn: ($5.35) 10 (2 players)
    Hero bets $1.35, UTG raises $2.70, Hero calls $1.35

    River: ($10.75) K (2 players)
    Hero checks, UTG bets $5.38, Hero raises $20.37 (All-In), 1 fold

    Total pot: $21.51

    Results:
    Hero had 8, 8 (full house, eights over tens).
    Outcome: Hero won $35.43
  30. #30
    Was like pulling teeth but I managed to get 5 hours in today. I chose to take a shot at 50nl during my evening session. Ran slightly below EV but finished up a bit. It's nice to have things like this happen when taking a shot:

    #11 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (4 handed)

    Hero (Button) ($102.95)
    SB ($10.95)
    BB ($50)
    UTG ($72.18)

    Preflop: Hero is Button with A, J
    UTG bets $1.75, Hero calls $1.75, 2 folds

    Flop: ($4.25) 2, J, A (2 players)
    UTG bets $3, Hero raises $12.35, UTG calls $9.35

    Turn: ($28.95) 5 (2 players)
    UTG checks, Hero bets $22.94, UTG raises $58.08 (All-In), Hero calls $35.14

    River: ($145.11) 9 (2 players, 1 all-in)

    Total pot: $145.11

    Results:
    Hero had A, J (two pair, Aces and Jacks).
    UTG had 10, A (one pair, Aces).
    Outcome: Hero won $143.11


    Energy level was looowww today. I might be fighting something. It's a good thing today's P90X workout was Yoga. I'm in my third week and so far I've really enjoyed it. It's a nice supplement to my occasional martial arts training. Family gathering/dinner tmr so don't know how much time I'll have to play.
  31. #31
    looking good my man, looking good.
    when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
  32. #32
    lol, it appears I've made an impression. One of the 25nl grinders wrote this the minute I sat at the table today (my screename is 'flip4souls'):

    v*******> get lost please
    v*******> flip
    v*******> haha

    That being said I am totally doomswitched today. Heading out in a minute for turkey dinner. We'll see if the late night weekend crowd is feeling particularly generous later.
  33. #33
    Hmm. Have had a couple break even sessions as I think I may have gotten off track in a few situations like these:

    #12 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    SB ($10.76)
    BB ($28.53)
    UTG ($26.83)
    MP ($17.77)
    Hero (CO) ($31.65)
    Button ($25)

    Preflop: Hero is CO with K, A
    2 folds, Hero bets $0.85, 1 fold, SB calls $0.75, 1 fold

    Flop: ($1.95) 7, A, 5 (2 players)
    SB bets $1.95, Hero calls $1.95

    Turn: ($5.85) 4 (2 players)
    SB bets $5.85, Hero raises $28.85 (All-In), SB calls $2.11 (All-In)

    River: ($21.77) A (2 players, 2 all-in)

    Total pot: $21.77

    Results:
    SB had A, 5 (full house, Aces over fives).
    Hero had K, A (three of a kind, Aces).
    Outcome: SB won $20.69

    Wow, as crazy as this is going to sound I just realized something while posting this. It has to do with comparative psychology or something but on the Turn I looked at my stack size compared to his and thought, "I'm beat but screw it" which, irrationally, I don't think I would have done if I had started with 100bb or less. I'll have to watch out for this in the future.
  34. #34
    Re-reading the previous post I was reminded of this video on life EV by Dan Gilbert.

    On another note I've come up with a way to check items off my "Skills" list above. I'll work on two things at once (sometimes more but never so many as to have things potentially bottleneck); one from the Weakness category and the other from Pseudo Skills. This way I'm eliminating counter-productive things which paves the way for new skills. This balance I believe will be the most efficient approach.

    Presently I am focused on looking at stack sizes before acting. For the time being I don't actually care what they are or how I should act in relation to what I see, I just want to condition myself to look at them. The moment its ingrained I'll have cleared the way for another item. The weakness I wish to eliminate next is tracking results while I play. According to Jarred Tendler from whom I'm borrowing this approach, it's important to state the reason behind these habits because reasons are more easily turned into recognition. And thru recognition we can begin to initiate change.

    On tracking results while I play: This is obviously not constructive in any way and has only ever led to tilt so the decision to stop doing this is easy. To truly do this I have to know the reason I do it and here's what I've come up with. Tracking results during play is nothing short of the combination of having unrealistic expectations, impatience and overestimating my skill. I know this for the simple fact that when I have tracked them in real-time in the past I've been 'happy' when I'm up and 'angry' when I'm down. This is completely irrational because, intellectually, I understand the inherent variance of the game. So it's clear that that I was denying the occurance of variance, wanting to make money quickly, and believing somehow that I should be good enough to make it happen (like I have witnessed/read about in others). So I've made a point when playing to keep results hidden from sight and should I catch myself wanting to sneak a peek I'll simply recognize the desire to do so, take a deep breath, and be rational about it. When I've repeated this enough times to know with certainty that the inclination is no longer there, I'll check it off my list.

    On looking at stack sizes: Poker is a game of information so it's obv why I'd want to make a habit of gathering as much of it as I can. The reason I think I don't do this enough is that at times I believe a particular situation to be static. (ex. it's folded around to me and I have AA in the CO and I make my standard 3.5x open and then notice the BB and I are nearly 200bb deep.) Poker is dynamic/fluid, every situation different. Any time I act in opposition to that idea I deny myself the opportunity to make the best possible decision. So when I notice that, before acting, I've been looking at relevant stack sizes each and every time without having to remind myself I'll check it off my list.

    As obsessive or "nitty" (to quote Alexos ) as this may appear its what I realize will work best for me. And that in itself was a difficult and important lesson for me to learn. I have more confidence moving forward now then I ever have. I urge anyone who is struggling with anything in their game (or life for that matter) to experiment and adapt a similar exercise.
  35. #35
    I decided recently to start using HUD again, which I hadn't been using for a few months. I'd realized that I had all this data up on the screen that I had very little idea how to interpret. So I stopped using it to concentrate more on table dynamics, game flow, and fundamental play - which really helped.

    For now I'll just be using it to avoid really evident mistakes (like getting into a 4betting war w/QQ vs a 9/7, 0 3bet%). And rather than overwhelm myself with a bunch of stats I won't look at or won't know what to do with, I'll start with vpip/pfr/3bet/hands and just build on that over time. And as oppose to before where I was using HUD as a major crutch, this time it'll be a supplement only, one which in its absence I could still play profitably.
  36. #36
    Recognized that I needed to take a break right after this hand, which I did. It's a huge victory.

    - Click Here for discussion -
    #13 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    CO ($42.44)
    Button ($33.71)
    SB ($26.77)
    BB ($24.90)
    Hero (UTG) ($36.42)
    MP ($14.58)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG with K, K
    Hero bets $0.85, 1 fold, CO calls $0.85, Button calls $0.85, 2 folds

    Flop: ($2.90) 3, 6, 4 (3 players)
    Hero bets $2.17, 1 fold, Button raises $8, Hero ?
  37. #37
    Raise more PF, unless 3.5x is your standard then thats fine.

    This is either the nuts (set) or like 77+ trying to take it down so it doesnt have to see an ugly turn, i call and c/eval on turn.
  38. #38
    If you've never seen him raise a flop before (especially a dry one) I think I might just muck...we're like 130bb deep facing a big raise here OOP and there aren't many villains capable of actually doing this as a pure bluff at this level - especially with these stack sizes. You're probably way behind alot here.
  39. #39
    m, u dont think he does this with like 99/TT/JJ?
  40. #40
    Board: 3c 6s 4h

    65.565% { KcKs }
    34.435% { TT-66, 44-33 }


    I have good equity, however, things to consider:
    - I'm UTG cbetting into the field (i.e. strong range)
    - Villain is likely a bit frustrated with me
    - He should not expect me to fold an overpair
    - His bet size indicates he's willing to stack off, imo

    Quote Originally Posted by dranger7070
    Raise more PF
    I've actually been meaning to get into the habit of opening for 4x UTG and varying the rest of my positional opens from 2.5x to 4x in relation to the BB's stack size. Any of you guys do this?
  41. #41
    I change up my bet sizing. 4x+1 per limper from pretty much everywhere. CO and BTN I usually do 3x, 2.5 if SB or BB is short.

    And on your hand, him raising so huge makes it more weighted towards sets and like 99/88 imo. There are a lot of turn cards that are bad for his hand so I call this just to piss him off and if a "scare card J, Q, K, A comes I c/eval. If he bets big again ez to let it go. If he goes like 1/2 pot hes probz FOS. (this is a blanket statement and i hate making it, but meh.)
  42. #42
    I think these are all standard except the #16. It wasn't as clear to me what I should do in that hand, especially on the Flop.

    #14 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    BB ($24.75)
    UTG ($10.85)
    MP ($23.92)
    CO ($27.34)
    Button ($14.51)
    Hero (SB) ($26.78)

    Preflop: Hero is SB with A, 10
    1 fold, MP bets $0.85, 1 fold, Button calls $0.85, Hero calls $0.75, 1 fold

    Flop: ($2.80) 4, 3, 9 (3 players)
    Hero checks, MP bets $2.80, 1 fold, Hero raises $7.94, MP raises $20.27 (All-In), Hero calls $15.13


    #15 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    SB ($13.98)
    BB ($11.98)
    Hero (UTG) ($47.91)
    MP ($25)
    CO ($15.06)
    Button ($26.97)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG with A, 6
    Hero bets $0.85, 2 folds, Button calls $0.85, SB calls $0.75, 1 fold

    Flop: ($2.80) 9, A, J (3 players)
    SB checks, Hero bets $2.12, Button raises $6, 1 fold, Hero raises $13.78, Button raises $20.12 (All-In), Hero calls $10.22

    - Click Here for discussion -
    #16 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed)

    Villain is 53/17 - 7%3bet over 70 hands

    SB ($6.61)
    Hero (BB) ($26.55)
    UTG ($14.38)
    MP ($15.22)
    Button ($14.53)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with 10, A
    UTG calls $0.25, 2 folds, SB calls $0.15, Hero checks

    Flop: ($0.75) 8, J, 10 (3 players)
    SB bets $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, UTG raises $3, 1 fold, Hero calls $2.50

    Turn: ($7.25) 10 (2 players)
    Hero checks, UTG bets $11.13 (All-In), Hero ?
  43. #43
    last hand: pretty damn close... his 3bet% here is irrelevant, id rather want to see his AF. Anyways, you pretty much have the odds to call if he has a flush.
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  44. #44
    Yea I shippity ship it on this turn, you have the NFD, trips + TK, so even if he DOES have the flush, you have 7 outs to the flush, 3 A's, 3 J's, 3 8's, and 1 T. So you have like 17 outs if you ARE behind. 17*2= ~34% equity to suckout if behind. Pot odds = 37%. So like, you're only making a -EV call when he has the flush, or a FH, but its still a fist pump call imo.
  45. #45
    Great, thx guys. fwiw I closed my eyes, clicked call, & spiked a 'A'. Next time however I'd rather not just be clicking buttons but understand why I'm doing what I'm doing. This was helpful.
  46. #46
    Just use pokerstove more often though. You're 38% vs 56cc (i think?), and its very unlikely he overbets with a FH or SF here. Also possible he has some 9cX here. Depending on reads you just plug in some ranges in there and voila!

    Gj on binking the A though.
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  47. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos
    ...its very unlikely he overbets with a FH or SF here...
    This was the precise thought I had that led me to call actually. The fact that I came up with a good 'reason' before acting is already miles ahead of where I was not long ago. Pokerstove is opening my eyes to a lot of things too. I'll keep on it for sure.
  48. #48
    laaaaammmme. been attempting to remove malware from my pc most of the day which was preventing HM from launching. During the down time I've been having fun with a bit of poker math and intermittently strummed my guitar. I got a few hundred hands in at 50nl before the fiasco so the day wasn't a complete waste. Hopefully everything will be operational again soon.
  49. #49
    Since I couldn't play much yesterday I really picked apart a few hands I played recently. Doing so eventually led me to needing to do some math, which in turn led me to creating this > Poker Math Spreadsheet.

    Try it out and let me know what you think. I tried to make it as intuitive as possible and because I suck at math I essentially wanted to find a fast, no-brainer way to calculate break-even semi- bluff shoves. I also threw in a 'facing all in' ev calculation. If some of you feel like testing it out and everything appears to work correctly maybe I can post it in the 'Tools' forum. Feel free to tweak, adapt, etc. and/or let me know what I've missed. Thx.
  50. #50
    btw if anybody didn t know this, i figured i d out Al and let you know he was a pretty balling music producer before giving the poker grind a shot.

    if this was confidential info, oh well, fk me. just in case you guys doubted that he was awesome or something.

    in the KK hand where you get raised, I d fold and pretty much expect to be owning him. no I don t think he s raising 99-JJ all that much. ppl who flat pre don t usually raise for value post...
    when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
  51. #51
    I had a feeling this guy seemed pretty cool, but music producer? sick life man sick life. tell us moar!!
  52. #52
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    753
    Location
    B.C. Canada
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos
    yeah its ridiculous.. im almost 100% sure, that if we were to play only between midnight and 5am, our winrate would at least triple
    That's when I play (err... 'lose').
  53. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Genitruc
    btw if anybody didn t know this, i figured i d out Al and let you know he was a pretty balling music producer before giving the poker grind a shot.

    if this was confidential info, oh well, fk me. just in case you guys doubted that he was awesome or something.
    lol, it's all good G. You make it sound more exciting than it actually was. Thx for the vote of confidence though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Micro2Macro
    I had a feeling this guy seemed pretty cool, but music producer? sick life man sick life. tell us moar!!
    After high school I founded and ran a recording studio in the Windsor/Detroit area up until last year. The grind of the entertainment biz allowed me to work with some very talented people from whom I learned a great deal but it wasn't without its fair share of variance too.

    Some peeps I worked with:
    Pat Robitaille
    Mr.Chill
    Purple Orange
    + some solo stuff I put together in my spare time..
    Blind Hitherto
    Into The Night (album)
    Mind Division (album)
    Believe (video)
    *albums also available on iTunes under "al yell"


    After a few years I just started to lose interest and it really started to feel like 'work'. So I decided to pursue something else. Now if I could just figure out how not to be a donk....
  54. #54
    Took another shot at 50nl tonight that didn't go so well. Stopped after losing 2 bi's. Felt some subtle tilt/frustration so gtfo. My first losing session in several days, so overall things are going well.

    Couple hands I'm not sure about:


    - Click Here for discussion -
    #17 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (4 handed)

    Villain is 22/19/60%FCB over 170

    Button ($109.52)
    SB ($18.92)
    BB ($68.17)
    Hero (UTG) ($58.05)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG with 5, A
    1 fold, BB bets $1.50, Hero calls $1.50, 1 fold

    On this dry flop my plan was to call up to two streets and steal it if checked to on Turn or River depending on board.

    Flop: ($3.50) 7, 2, K (2 players)
    BB bets $2.50, Hero calls $2.50

    Turn: ($8.50) 9 (2 players)
    BB bets $6, Hero calls $6

    River: ($20.50) J (2 players)
    BB checks, Hero bets $13.88


    - Click Here for discussion -
    #18 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed)

    Villain: 26/14/82%FCB over 173

    UTG ($59.49)
    MP ($37.41)
    CO ($51.17)
    Button ($46.26)
    SB ($46.44)
    Hero (BB) ($56.62)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with A, J
    2 folds, CO bets $2, 2 folds, Hero calls $1.50

    Flop: ($4.25) 9, 7, 10 (2 players)
    Hero checks, CO bets $3, Hero raises $10.34, CO calls $7.34

    Not sure about my Turn check or how to proceed as played...

    Turn: ($24.93) J (2 players)
    Hero checks, CO bets $16, Hero ?
  55. #55
    hand 17 is good agaist good aggro thinkers but i think you can assume that t nl50 most ppl don t fall into this category and you can happily give up your float on the turn when he dbl barrels.

    if you check tun in hand 18 i think it has to be to check fold. it s so unlikely he s bluffing in this spot after pulling some elaborate float on the flop. bet-calling is an option but it s pretty spewy since he can be playing a flopped flush or straight like this plenty.
    when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
  56. #56
    I thought about this one for a long time and just couldn't talk myself out of calling. My post hand analysis indicates this call is a slightly losing play. gogo luckbox

    #19 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    SB ($2.30)
    BB ($36)
    UTG ($27.19)
    MP ($18.08)
    CO ($9.91)
    Hero (Button) ($25.40)

    Preflop: Hero is Button with 9, 8
    2 folds, CO calls $0.25, Hero bets $1.10, 1 fold, BB calls $0.85, CO calls $0.85

    Flop: ($3.40) A, 6, 7 (3 players)
    BB checks, CO checks, Hero bets $2.70, BB calls $2.70, 1 fold

    Turn: ($8.80) J (2 players)
    BB checks, Hero bets $6.71, BB raises $32.20 (All-In), Hero calls $14.89 (All-In)

    River: ($52) 5 (2 players, 2 all-in)

    Total pot: $52

    Results:
    Hero had 9, 8 (straight, nine high).
    BB had A, J (two pair, Aces and Jacks).
    Outcome: Hero won $49.40

    Heading downtown 2nite to have a Guinness and some grub. I may just be tempted to make an appearance in the poker room afterward as well for a little live $1/$2 action.
  57. #57
    Didn't hit the casino last night, just a nice night out w/friends. Live poker is something I've been giving a lot of thought though and I am going to start thinking about how I can make a regular go of it.

    Haven't played much in the past couple days. Stamina/focus is diminished so I may take a day off tmr to recharge. I haven't been listening to my body when it tells me it's time to sleep and it's thrown my routine off. It's a subtle form of self-sabotage imo, the reason for which I have no clue but it'll be important for me to figure it out.

    This vid struck a chord with me...
    Elizabeth Gilbert: A new way to think about creativity
  58. #58
    sigh, i haz the flu.


    - Click Here for discussion -
    #20 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed)

    Villain is 35/28 over 54, attempt to steal is 69%. How would you have played it?

    Hero (BB) ($50)
    UTG ($58.89)
    MP ($42.65)
    CO ($44.75)
    Button ($54.09)
    SB ($53.70)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with A, Q
    4 folds, SB bets $1.50, Hero calls $1.25

    Flop: ($3.50) 4, A, 4 (2 players)
    SB bets $3.25, Hero calls $3.25

    Turn: ($10) K (2 players)
    SB bets $7, Hero calls $7

    River: ($24) 5 (2 players)
    SB bets $17, Hero ?
  59. #59
    very very close. even if he s very aggro, it sure looks like you hav Ax at the very least...

    i d fold
    when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
  60. #60
    Back in the swing of things; feeling much better. Despite this it was a rough reemergence. The sessions I had today were swingy as all hell due mostly to some terrible play. I'm just thankful that I was able to keep my cool for the most part, refocus, and end up with nothing worse than a break-even day.

    I'm almost certain that my winrate has improved lately thanks to the things that I have avoided/eliminated as oppose to things I may have added. Most of my energy has been focused on self management. I've seen a big leap in stamina, sustained focus, emotional equilibrium and reduced physical strain. I'm excited to see what will happen when I've reached the point of delving deeper into the game itself. For now I'm still undergoing this sort of metamorphosis - one that is preparing me for a much more earnest and dedicated effort.

    It's almost as though there were things about this endeavor that I needed to become accustomed to and accept before truly committing to it. Up until recently I may not have been ready to accept its non-linear progression or the limited control over its inherent variance. Especially for someone for whom most things come easy. It could be that I was reluctant to turn the page or was unable to let go of this image of myself that I'd spent so many years building up - that of the "artist". In its way poker has helped me gain perspective. I did one thing for a number of years, poker will simply be the next, and will likely be followed by something else. Now that I have chosen this path, embracing it wholeheartedly (including the moments of doubt it will present) will be instrumental in my success.

    For those reading that play poker you'll probably relate when I say that through poker's unconventionality, independence and multidimensional challenges, I continually learn so many things that I never imagined a deceptively simple card game could teach me.
  61. #61
    I hear ya.
  62. #62
    Disappointing but not altogether unexpected of course.. had a session at 50nl today where nothing went my way. I adhered to my stop-loss and immediately started winding down when, just to add insult to injury, on my very last hand I get 100BB in w/QQ vs AK on a 6274 only to be rivered by the 'A'.

    So with the exception of a sick heater at 25nl I prob will not play anymore 50nl until November. I just find I have way too tough a time dealing with the swings without a much larger buffer zone. Not to mention, as inconceivable as it may seem, the game is tougher at 50nl than 25nl imo.
  63. #63
    Whoa! Dropped down to 25nl and absolutely ran over the tables for 45 minutes. Nearly climbed my way back to even from my earlier 50nl session. I kicked on that 'fuck you' mode <{edit: wtf? censorship is fucking lame) and my opponents were powerless. These are all hands I felt I played well. (Prob all obv/standard stuff for most of you).


    #21 $0.25 BB (5 handed)

    SB ($29.32)
    BB ($26.60)
    UTG ($11.01)
    Hero (MP) ($25.99)
    Button ($23.74)

    Preflop: Hero is MP with A, 10
    1 fold, Hero bets $0.85, Button calls $0.85, 2 folds

    Flop: ($2.05) K, 9, 4 (2 players)
    Hero bets $1.33, Button calls $1.33

    Turn: ($4.71) 6 (2 players)
    Hero bets $3.11, Button calls $3.11

    River: ($10.93) 4 (2 players)
    Hero bets $7.16, 1 fold



    #22 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) -

    CO ($24.90)
    Button ($8.92)
    SB ($31.67)
    BB ($24.50)
    Hero (UTG) ($28.63)
    MP ($13.76)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG with 10, 10
    Hero bets $0.85, MP calls $0.85, 4 folds

    Flop: ($2.05) Q, 4, 9 (2 players)
    Hero checks, MP bets $1.02, Hero calls $1.02

    Turn: ($4.09) 3 (2 players)
    Hero checks, MP checks

    River: ($4.09) 2 (2 players)
    Hero bets $2.97, MP calls $2.97

    Total pot: $10.03

    Results:
    Hero had 10, 10 (one pair, tens).
    MP had 9, A (one pair, nines).
    Outcome: Hero won $9.53



    #23 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    UTG ($31.07)
    MP ($25.40)
    Hero (CO) ($47.65)
    Button ($29.09)
    SB ($3.58)
    BB ($14)

    Preflop: Hero is CO with A, Q
    1 fold, MP calls $0.25, Hero bets $1.10, 3 folds, MP calls $0.85

    Flop: ($2.55) 2, 4, 6 (2 players)
    MP checks, Hero checks

    Turn: ($2.55) J (2 players)
    MP checks, Hero bets $1.87, MP calls $1.87

    River: ($6.29) K (2 players)
    MP checks, Hero bets $4.73, 1 fold


    Got a call from the neighbor earlier saying, "I think your dog is loose." Being the escape artist that she is, Yuki, my wolf/husky dug her way under the fence... again. Fortunately I found the simple solution of lining the perimeter of the fence with her shit. She won't go near it! I just hadn't "refreshed" it in a while.
  64. #64
    in H1 3 barrin' is questionable w/o reads though with some idea of how he's playing I like it..maybe only a 2 barrel is wise here though however I could be wrong. be interested in any reads here.

    for H2 I probably bet turn vs almost anyone.

    as for the last hand..I'd be interested in your reasoning behind every street. it looks like its played fine but I think you should explain yourself on this one and see if anyone can spot something from your thoughts. like vs some villains cbetting is probably ideal, though you chose not too so I'd like to hear the play by play commentary for this.
  65. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Micro2Macro
    in H1 3 barrin' is questionable w/o reads...
    No reads. Just figured I could fold out the multitude of draws that missed in addition to most 9x and weak K's. It was early in the sesh so, worse case, if called I establish an image. (?)

    Quote Originally Posted by Micro2Macro
    for H2 I probably bet turn vs almost anyone.
    in other words your saying we should lead the Turn?

    Quote Originally Posted by Micro2Macro
    as for the last hand..I'd be interested in your reasoning behind every street.
    here it is with donkishness filter turned off...
    pf: punish
    flop: i figured his most likely l/c holding was small pp & Ax, none of which I expect him to fold to a bet, plus I can't rep much on this board aside from maybe an overpair, but my assumption to this point is that he's just looking at his cards.
    turn: taking a stab at the pot. No reason for me not to have a J. I would have bet any face card here.
    river: The K is a good card for me. He would have raised his set/two-pair type hands on the Turn so I put him on a pair type hand which I expect to lose to if I check. A flush is unlikely. So I bet. More often than not though I do check the River expecting to be good some of the time. I guess it may have been a flow thing.

    Does any of that seem reasonable or flawed logic? I understand that a lot of this is opponent dependent so I'm wondering if maybe in some cases, against unknowns, the attempt is justified just by the potential information gained + image building when caught, etc.
  66. #66
    in hand 2 (TT) you can get at least 2 streets of value by betting as the aggresor. let him call with draws, 9x, etc and prevent him from hitting a 6 outer for free.
    when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
  67. #67



    Too soon to tell if this had anything to do with it but I experimented a little today. I did two things out of the ordinary: a) played bird song continually in background, b) set an alarm at 20 minute intervals to get up and do jumping jacks for roughly 30 seconds.

    Only a couple hands that stood out from this session:

    #24No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed)

    CO ($27.64)
    Button ($32.96)
    Hero (SB) ($44.85)
    BB ($25)
    UTG ($10.68)
    MP ($26.60)

    Preflop: Hero is SB with K, Q
    3 folds, Button calls $0.25, Hero bets $1, BB calls $0.85, Button calls $0.85

    Flop: ($3.30) 4, Q, 10 (3 players)
    Hero bets $2.34, BB calls $2.34, Button calls $2.34

    I considered calling the Turn but my gut made me fold. The way the hand played out I'm fairly confident I saved myself some money.

    Turn: ($10.32) 5 (3 players)
    Hero checks, BB bets $5.16, Button calls $5.16, Hero folds

    River: ($20.64) K (2 players)
    BB bets $16.40 (All-In), 1 fold



    #25 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (4 handed)

    UTG ($55.86)
    Button ($23.27)
    SB ($28.88)
    Hero (BB) ($33.09)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with J, J
    UTG bets $1, 2 folds, Hero raises $3.25, UTG calls $2.50

    I have no idea what inspired me to power min-raise here. I just knew I didn't want to call, fold or raise. Some insight here would be greatly appreciated.

    Flop: ($7.10) K, 9, K (2 players)
    Hero checks, UTG bets $4, Hero raises $9, 1 fold
  68. #68
    for #24 i d just bet-fold turn. your line is kinda nitty but i don t hate it. you def see a set here a decent % of the time when it plays out like this 3 way

    #25 i d just bet flop fo value with no reads that villain is aggro. it helps having the Js.

    what to do in the face of a raise is pretty player-dependant...
    when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
  69. #69
    Celebrity is an interesting phenomenon. Some friends and I picked a local sports bar at random to grab some drinks and former UFC heavyweight champ Maurice Smith was there with his entourage to watch the fight. His appearance must have been publicized because people were coming in droves asking for autographs/pictures. I, on the other hand, was far more intrigued by the guy across from us with two broken arms, wearing casts, trying to drink his beer from a bottle. He had to clasp it with masterful precision just to elevate it to his mouth.
  70. #70
    My session's graph today looks like an 'W' sitting under the $0 line. Somehow I find that easier to accept than an 'M' on top of the line.

    Most interesting hand of the night imo:

    #26 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed)

    BB ($37.42)
    UTG ($65.13)
    MP ($57.31)
    Hero (CO) ($50)
    Button ($81.40)
    Aggro3bettor (SB) ($141.63)

    I'm convinced Villain, a reg, had placed a target on me as he was often 3betting me. I adjusted somewhat by widening my calling range IP (not necessarily pertinent to this hand) but I had been flatting his 3bets for a little while by this point and gave up more often than not. Until...

    Preflop: Hero is CO with Q, A
    2 folds, Hero bets $1.75, 1 fold, Aggro3bettor raises $5.50, 1 fold, Hero calls $4

    Flop: ($12) 8, 3, 9 (2 players)
    Aggro3bettor checks, Hero bets $7.64, Aggro3bettor calls $7.64

    Turn: ($27.28) K (2 players)
    Aggro3bettor bets $13.64, Hero SNAP shoves $36.61 (All-In), 1 fold


    Anyhow, things have been going fairly well. I'm camping out at 50nl for longer and longer periods of time. There's haven't been any heaters there yet, but no huge downswings either. While I learn to fine tune things I'm happy to collect that rake+bonus money and let the BR slowly grow. I've also recently started experimenting with adding a couple more tables now and again (up to 8). The tempo seems just right.
  71. #71
    Ravageur's Avatar
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    i like the aq shove....i'm not sure any decently aggro reg is c/calling that flop with AK and sometime i guess he could fold it. Regardless, you have f/e and outs if called so i like.
    Family Cruise IMO
  72. #72
    I like the AQ hand given the descirbed dynamic as well. I doubt you're going to see Kx often, but make a note when you do.
  73. #73
    wtf, has anyone been getting a warning when trying to visit FTR? Apparently, according to my browser, it's been spotted as a host of malicious software. Hope it's nothing serious because I instructed my browser to ignore it.

    A few things that I needed to remind myself of today:
    - long, break-even stretches are std + still profitable
    - several break-even sessions does not mean you're not playing well and don't necessarily call for a change in style (esp. just for the sake of changing it).
    - even someone playing optimal poker can log a losing session, it's the nature of the game.
    - ride it out, swings always seem more detrimental when you're in the thick of it.
  74. #74
    Yea, pretty much everyone I've talked to has been getting it. I just ignored it too. :P
  75. #75
    Made some big calls in my 'breakfast' session this morning (?)

    #27 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed)

    Hero (SB) ($90.40)
    BB ($9.78)
    UTG ($20)
    MP ($38.57)
    CO ($47.05)
    23/3 over 184 (Button) ($53)

    Preflop: Hero is SB with A, 10
    3 folds, Button calls $0.50, Hero bets $1.75, 1 fold, Button calls $1.50

    Flop: ($4.50) 5, 6, 10 (2 players)
    Hero bets $3.11, Button calls $3.11

    Turn: ($10.72) 7 (2 players)
    Hero bets $6.87, Button calls $6.87

    River: ($24.46) 10 (2 players)
    Hero bets $17.51, Button raises $41.02 (All-In), Hero calls $23.51

    Total pot: $106.50

    Results:
    Button had Q, 10 (three of a kind, tens).
    Hero had A, 10 (three of a kind, tens).
    Outcome: Hero won $103.50



    #28 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (5 handed)

    Hero (UTG) ($55.47)
    MP ($15.03)
    Button ($21.16)
    SB ($39.57)
    31/3 over 247 (BB) ($28.81)

    Preflop: Hero is UTG with K, J
    Hero bets $1.75, 3 folds, BB calls $1.25

    Flop: ($3.75) 3, 6, J (2 players)
    BB checks, Hero bets $2.71, BB calls $2.71

    Turn: ($9.17) 5 (2 players)
    BB checks, Hero bets $6.34, BB raises $24.35 (All-In), Hero calls $18.01

    River: ($57.87) J (2 players, 1 all-in)

    Total pot: $57.87

    Results:
    BB had A, Q (one pair, Jacks).
    Hero had K, J (three of a kind, Jacks).
    Outcome: Hero won $55.87



    #29 No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed)

    MP ($59.80)
    Hero (CO) ($75.54)
    Button ($38.17)
    SB ($98.55)
    BB ($50)
    38/14 over 65 (UTG) ($92.73)

    Preflop: Hero is CO with 10, 9
    UTG bets $1.50, 1 fold, Hero calls $1.50, 3 folds

    Flop: ($3.75) 7, 3, 10 (2 players)
    UTG $2.50, Hero calls $2.50

    Turn: ($8.75) 9 (2 players)
    UTG bets $6.50, Hero raises $14.84, UTG calls $8.34

    River: ($38.43) 3 (2 players)
    UTG bets $23, Hero calls $23

    Total pot: $84.43

    Results:
    UTG had J, Q (one pair, threes).
    Hero had 10, 9 (two pair, tens and nines).
    Outcome: Hero won $81.43

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