50nl - weird spot with KK pre

[Micro2Macro]

First hand on the table, no reads on UTG, though probably bad given his min-raise. Not sure what to think of this 3bet given the player and the best way to respond...I have hands on him from another session and his stats popped up just as he re-raised.

3bettor is 12/8 over 50 hands, 14% ATS, hasn't 3bet yet...it's these spots where I'd really wish Stars would allow datamining :/

Cold 4betting just looks so strong (I guess) and turns my hand into a bluff (I guess) but flatting the 3bet and being OOP vs both these guys is worse/better?

halp

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

MP3 ($50)
CO ($97.50)
Button ($50.75)
SB ($53)
Hero (BB) ($50)
UTG ($71.70)
UTG+1 ($82.05)
MP1 ($118.50)
MP2 ($57.85)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K, K
UTG bets $1, 5 folds, Button raises to $3.50, 1 fold, Hero???

[spoonitnow]

This is a serious question: What in the fucking shit do you mean it turns your hand into a bluff?

[Micro2Macro]

well yeah I guess he could call with worse since the sizing won't be more than like $10.

but like, his 5bet range would have to be KK+...?

[spoonitnow]

well yeah I guess he could call with worse since the sizing won't be more than like $10.

but like, his 5bet range would have to be KK+...?

And this has nothing to do with your hand being "turned into a bluff", so I'll ask my question again

[Micro2Macro]

so 4bet/folding is okay? seems kinda gross I guess :/

..though assuming he only 5bets KK+ I'd be sitting around 22% equity

[spoonitnow]

so 4bet/folding is okay? seems kinda gross I guess :/

..though assuming KK+ I'd be sitting around 22% equity

omfg do you know what a bluff is

[Micro2Macro]

No.

[Micro2Macro]

Accoridng to Wikipedia:

"In the card game of poker, to bluff is to bet or raise with a hand that will fold enough better hands to be profitable."

lol I can't bluff with kings preflop.

[acoss3006]

UTG is a complete knob. 3bettor has seen this minbet crap from him before and think its time to shut him the hell up.

I am a complete noob and would 4bet KK down both their throats..

[DoanDiggy]

You are only turning your hand into a bluff when you feel it is behind your opponent's range and you are trying to make them fold often enough for the bluff to be profitable. In this case, Button doesn't have to have a super-strong hand. As acoss3006 said, if UTG has minraised like this before, Button's reraise could easily be an iso-3bet.

As for what to do, I have to lean towards 4betting. I think Button has an A in his hand a lot, and otherwise he probably has like 99+. We have no idea what UTG has, but he's certainly coming along if we just call. Regardless, we aren't going to be very comfortable when a lot of money starts going in postflop... On a J93 flop, does Button have QQ, AJ, KJs, AX, KQ, or is it AA, 99, JJ? Does UTG have T8, QT, any two spades, A9, top pair, or is it J9, 33, 99, JJ?

With AA in this spot, I would be more likely to consider flatting. We don't have to worry about an A coming and killing our hand for one, and postflop there is one less hand we have to worry about that beats us. But still I probably 4bet smallish (to somewhere around $9) instead because UTG might just be bad enough to flat it, another reason that 4betting KK is good as well.

[XTR1000]

ez flat. keep the fish in and the buttons range weak and dominated.

[Azazel]

i 4b to $10 for sure (planning to get it in obv), rather not play this hand 3way oop. also i would never 4b/fold at 50nl unless some nit is cold 5bing.

[daven]

um, good luck bluffing KK pre-flop.

also, note that button 3-bet a min-donk. UTG has low pairs/random shit here all the time, button knows this and his range is pretty wide.

KK is way ahead of button range.

Don't flat unless you want to see a flop multiway and oop.
'4-bet sizing?' is more interesting than 'should i 4bet?'

[Micro2Macro]

I made it $10, fish folds and button insta snap 5bets to $30 even.

[badgers]

fucking shove already

[mxiu]

i just realized this was 50nl and utg minraised.

given that, a 12/8 could 3b AT+, 77+'ish from the button. pretty loose range, but you get the idea.

4-betting JJ would be a make the thread somewhat interesting

omg i hate getting kings they always let me down

but yeah you went all right i guees

anyway one time i got QQ UTG and this guy had 45 spades long story short


Pot :$120
Flop: 37Q
Turn:K (i think)
River: unlivable a 6 wow

[mxiu]

omg i hate getting kings
River: unlivable a 6 wow

[Deanglow]

Is this a poker forum or a bunch of degens discussing a hand at the las vegas dmv?

A lot of arguments can be made for folding to the 5bet pre and both flatting and 4betting pre are fine.

[BankItDrew]

This thread had potential, surpassed its climax, and is now on the downswing.

[Micro2Macro]

Yeah actually I am suprised no one took me seriously when I said he snap 5bet to a nice round $30 (as opposed to just shoving). Reading about 'Bayes Theorum' now...

[badgers]

Don't 4bet if you aren't shoving. 4bet/fold is terrible. You 4bet, so presumably you did so with the intention of shoving instead of 4betting to find out if he had aces because that would be retarded.

[jessyj]

ez flat. keep the fish in and the buttons range weak and dominated.

+1. I think 4betting rly sucks here.

[wordtothewise]

Ok so you call with KK and the flop comes monotone (you don't have the suit). The flop contains an ace? This is why it is important for you to have a looser image in fr vs. all of these nits so you don't even worry getting in KK in this spot. Also, if you believe he is only going to 5 bet you with AA then you really answered your own question.