Party 400NL: Play this flop for me please.

[Iwind]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

BB ($815.80)
UTG ($515.50)
MP ($404)
CO ($547.78)
Button ($0)
Hero ($660.83)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 9, 9. Hero posts a blind of $2.
1 fold, MP calls $4, CO raises to $20, Hero (poster) calls $18, 2 folds.

Flop: ($48) 7, 7, 5 (3 players)

What do I do on this flop? I have no reads on the other player.

[Warpe]

These stakes are out of my league, but leading out makes sense to me...$30-ish?

[Renton]

I'm with Warpe on the out of my league stuff so take this fwiw.

I think chances are overwhelmingly in your favor that you are ahead. However, betting out here would only get a call from something that beats you, or they think your bluffing, or occasionaly a spade draw.

I would continue to let villain take the lead in the hand. If he's aggressive at all, he will be c-bet with any two here, and then you've got him. I would either checkraise this flop or occasionally check/call, and then bet out the turn.

[Iwind]

Option 1:
Leading out $30-ish. Problem is that a lot of players raise on this type of flop with any two here, I don't know how aggressive this guy is though.

Option 2:
Check-raise, how much? Problem is if he bets out big here like $40, then I need to checkraise to at least $100, and it gets quite expensive if I'm behind. And he can easily call in position with a hand I beat and see what I do on turn. I see several call in this spot with AK. And what do I do on a blank turn? A turn with an overcard?

Any other options?

[Warpe]

I think leading out is the cheaper solution to finding out where you stand. If he's raising AK/AQ pre-flop and he's missed, he's going to be reluctant to call/raise. If he's raising an overpair, he's coming over the top.

Lots of discussion about this situation in this thread:

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...oker-30974.htm

[gabe]

check/call is definitely an option and the one i usually take.

[Iwind]

It's the one I usually take as well, in this hand:
Iwind checks.
CO bets $48.

But, this is really expensive, and knowing nothing of his betting patterns I decided to fold here. Else I often check/call flop, and either bet out turn or check-raise turn if his bet looks weak.

[alias2211]

i like to get an extra bet out of an aggro w/ the check/call line.

for TAGS, you should lead out and if they play back, they have something they like.

for passives, you have to bet on the flop and then see if any overcards come that you think might have hit them given the range you're putting them on with their call.

[gabe]

for TAGS, you should lead out and if they play back, they have something they like.

i dont think this is true. for instance, if i was villiand and i had AK and hero lead into me, i raise almost always

[UG]

for TAGS, you should lead out and if they play back, they have something they like.

i dont think this is true. for instance, if i was villiand and i had AK and hero lead into me, i raise almost always

Yup. When somebody leads into me like that it usually says to me, "I have a good hand, is yours better than mine?" I hammer it back at them and say, "umm yes you are dead," and they fold.

[dsaxton]

Open fold.

[Demiparadigm]

You cannot lead. It is considered weak too often.

Strange thought from the LAgg guy. but I really like your check fold.

You can not effectively control the size of the pot out of position. You have no information of the strength of your opponents hand. IF you have the best hand, you will win a small pot. If you have the worst hand you will lose a large one. Even of you have the best hand now your opponent has outs to beat you. If you have the worst hand you are drawing incredibly slim.

Other options are to chack call the flop and lead or check raise the turn, or fold to another large bet.
Either way, your goal is to play a small pot with your 99.

Standard play in limit is to check call, check call, lead.

[Iwind]

Especially leading on a paired board, it's so easy for him to raise. What I was thinking was that I don't want to play a big pot with 99 out of position on this flop, and when he makes this pot-sized bet, a big pot is what we have if I call. Good to hear some people thinking my fold wasn't too weak here.

[aislephive]

I really think you should lead out here, not for some pathetic half-pot sized bet, but a pot-sized bet. You will get raised occasionally and you will usually have to fold, but it depends on how aggressive this guy is. They don't always raise when you lead out, and if you find that they're doing it a lot then start leading out with sets and things like that. A check-raise is pretty expensive, but I do think you have the best hand here so I would never check-fold this flop. Check-calling is okay, but it sucks when they hit one of their overcards. Just my two cents.

[nutsinho]

do not lead out in this hand if your opponent doesnt suck

A minraise followed by a 3/5 pot bet on nonspade turn will take this pot down against all but fish

If youre playing your cards rather than your opponent however, which is incorrect in this spot, the fold is fine

[Iwind]

Well, a minraise tells me nothing about the other guy`s hand, he might call that in position with several different hands. Overpair will call this, flush draws will for sure given these odds, he might even call with just overcards. Not a big chance he will put me on a 7 if he is a thinking player, I certainly wouldnt and not that many players would call this raise from the blinds with a hand containing a 7 apart from 77, and there is also 55 for the FH. And flopping a FH here most players would either bet out or slowplay by calling, then check-minraise looks weak to me. This sets me up to loose a huge pot if I am behind here, and doesnt give me any info on where I am. A ten to ace on the turn is also a scare-card, just like a spade would be, if he has a spade draw it will contain two overs for sure.

I still think call, see what he does on turn and then check-raise on a blank turn is the better option if I am going further with this hand.

[alias2211]

Standard play in limit is to check call, check call, lead.

Yeah, I've been thinking about this one a lot in the last couple of days. And the asswhupping I took for my comments. Thank you sirs, may I have another. I think what I was getting at was more about the different ways one COULD try to play then hand given what they know about their opponent. But my comments didn't really reflect that, so thanks for the help in direction.

I agree that the default line should be something close to the above from Demi, when you don't know your opponent. You don't want to play a huge pot here, and it doesn't get any smaller when you lead OOP on the flop. I applied this concept several times yesterday and happily came away with a few smaller pots, and got off a little easier on some pots that the villian did actually have a better hand (like when he has 1010 over your 99).

[bair]

AK bets and raises here everytime. check/call or check/raise, depending on vpip

[Demiparadigm]

AK bets and raises here everytime. check/call or check/raise, depending on vpip

So does TT-AA. Just because you can think of a hand that you beat, does not mean the best play is to go to showdown.