45 person SNG's on Pokerstars, need strategy help?

[Djanvk]

I'm been playing these 45 person SNG's on PS but have never been in the money yet after approx 15 entries, I do well for awhile and am usually bumped out around 15th place, closest being 10th. Somehow here I end up just crashing and slowly losing all my chips, mainly in one hand where I have a good hand but not the best.

What I'm looking for is later 45 person SNG's strategy, I do well in the early rounds.

Thanks

[drdeutsch]

Tighten up.

I play fairly loose in the beginning rounds so I can double up early and get a good stack. By the time the 75/150 blinds come around, and especially after the first break, I'm playing only premium hands or limping mediocre hands in position.

I don't think you can play the same way all the way through and expect to win... you definitely have to adapt your play to the table, blinds, and so on.

Find out what works for you.

[Djanvk]

see I"m playing just the opposite, Tight first looking for a big pot, then loosen up later on. Maybe to much now.

[Les_Worm]

It is my opinion that poker is not a game that should be played according to a strategy because the conditions are constantly changing. See what the cards/table are giving you and adjust, just play poker...

[drtofu66]

I'm been playing these 45 person SNG's on PS but have never been in the money yet after approx 15 entries, I do well for awhile and am usually bumped out around 15th place, closest being 10th. Somehow here I end up just crashing and slowly losing all my chips, mainly in one hand where I have a good hand but not the best.

What I'm looking for is later 45 person SNG's strategy, I do well in the early rounds.

Thanks

Just curious-- are the $5+.50 SnG's a lot tougher than the $1+.20 ones? The consensus seems to be that the Party $10+1 STT are not much different than the $5+1 ones; I was just wondering if this was unique to Party's loose play or if Stars $5 SnG's were low enough stakes for the sharks not to bother with anymore.

[Djanvk]

I actually just finished 2nd in a 5+.50 SNG on PS and the best I can get in the 1+.20 45person SNG is 10th, they start out loose but then people start tightening but later rounds after the bad players are weaned out.

[drdeutsch]

I just finished 3rd in a 5.50. I used to play the 1.20s, but I think those are just so loaded with fish that it's impossible to get deep because of all the pushing and drawing. The combined power of the fish is too much.

But I really like the 5.50s. They have their share of the fish, but by the time it gets down to the final table, or even 2 tables, there are generally only pretty good players left. If you're bankroll can afford it, I highly recommend sticking the 5.50s until you get good or feel you can move up according to your skill and bankroll.

[kashpot]

Just finished playing my first 45 person SNG on PokerStars. This is my assessment so far; you have to attack in the earlier portion of the tournement. Attempting to double up on your stack. Because when the blinds move up to 50/100 & 75/150 its becomes an all in fest.
Overall, its a good way to get MTT experience on the cheap. I played for 1hour 53 minutes for a 4th place finish. The experience was worth more than the $5 bucks I won. So dont think you'll become rich playing them.

I'll have to brush up on Rippy's strategies on tourney play as soon as he post the revised edition of his strategy.

[salt3d]

I'm been playing these 45 person SNG's on PS but have never been in the money yet after approx 15 entries, I do well for awhile and am usually bumped out around 15th place, closest being 10th. Somehow here I end up just crashing and slowly losing all my chips, mainly in one hand where I have a good hand but not the best.

What I'm looking for is later 45 person SNG's strategy, I do well in the early rounds.

Thanks

This post reminded me that I had $1.35 at PS, so I had a go at a $1+0.2 45 player SNG myself. My story sounds a lot like yours. I was doing ok until I thought my TPTK was good and blew my stack to QQ. I hung around for a while longer, but ended up 14th.

I played pretty tight. My cards helped in that respect; I was dealt a lot of nothing. It seemed to help later on when I blind stealing was worth it. Once I was short stacked, though, I was at the mercy of the cards. I quadrupled up once, but it was too late.

I'd play the same way again. The 'play loose to double up early' strategy sounds too much like gambling to me. Of course, you can't apply 'I'd fold that all day long' logic to it, either. I try to keep in mind that the chances of a mediocre hand at a full table don't increase with the blinds.

[mouteut]

1.20$ on stars is probably the softest SNG you can find. 60-70% are fishes who are in the "big donators" category. My usual strategy is to stay quiet at beginning(quite tight) and when i get a hand i will very often double up since they love to go all in pre flop(dont be scared to reraise all in someone who seems to like his hand). The rule is don't even bother trying to give them bad odds, just push it. If they have any piece of it they will call.

In the later rounds(150 blinds+) the major fishes are usually gone and its usually time to loosen up some. You can start blind stealing with decent hands in late position. People usually care a bit when they get that far and they won't call you with trash anymore.

I would advise you not to hurry up too much, each chips are important. Once you get your hand, they WILL pay you off. As long as you have 1400-1500 chips, you be able to start blind stealing later on with higher blinds and thats all what counts. If you loose 800 chips with Q9o, then you just lost A LOT, since your 800 stack raise will be a lot less respected than a 1500 stack.

Don't bother trying to be fancy raising 87s or 44. They will raise hard all the time. Just wait for your hand and don't waste chips. even ATo UTG. Just fold the damn thing. Wait for a real hand.

Even thought i agree with other people that doubling up early is a good thing, i don't agree that you should loosen up. When you hit a decent hand, these guys will be there to pay you off. Theres no need to start limping bad hands just to fold them to a raise.


The 5.50 are usually a lot tougher ....the number of people calling all in pre flop with K9o reduce a lot.

[WhooFleuryScores]

I've come to realize with MTT and SNG's you basically have to play them like the WPT tables- Raise any good Ace/King in EP and MP,any PP,and know when to steal pots.If you try to wait for your premiums you will either not get paid off or get destakced if someone hits their set or two pair.In the bubble play aggressive and push.I pushed today in PArty MTT on the bubble with 33 and got called by KK.Do I regret it?No.I would rather push with the force of my chips and a hand then push woith only a hand/PP/any Ace/King good suited.

As much as it hurts to bubble;always remember the times you did takje first and get paid off for the times you missed.If you enevr play poker again at least you can remember you were good enougn once to take first.

[drmcboy]

I just had to add an LOL at the idea of 'sharks' in the 5 dollar SnGs.

Fear not.

Specific to the 1 dollar SNGs, I would play very tight all the way through, just raise premium hands, don't fold AK or JJ+ without good reason pre flop. Limp/call 3-5x early with scs and pps looking to flop two pair plus. Later it'll probably be mostly tighty short stacks left (steal from them) and wild big stacks (don't steal from them).

Above all remember you need cards to beat bad players, and people who play 1 dollar SNGs are bad players.

[STIdrivr]

most of the people in the 5.50 are fishies dont worry. Play the 27 player a couple times to get used to them

[naturaltan]

My experience has been that the PS 5 sng players aren't very good either. I have had many times where with four left, I've been able to bully my way to be the big stack at the table. Time after time I raise preflop to take the blinds.

[drtofu66]

Thanks for the input on the PS $5 SnG players. Seriously, all I ever hear about is how savvy the players on Stars are and while I'm sure that's true, I can never tell where they mostly reside, especially in the SnG's.

[naturaltan]

Don't get me wrong, there have been a few times where it's been a table of decent players, but from my experience, I've seen more bad than good players.

[mouteut]

i never said they were good(5$ sng guys). But they are a lot tougher than 1$ sng players especially in single table.

This don't mean they are tough, but they won't call your pre flop all in with K9o when you hit AA KK. And theres often 2-3 decent player, 4-3 players who have an idea what to do, and 1-2 big fish.

1$ sng are more like 80% big fish and 20% people who got an idea what to do.

beginners will have no problems beat 1$ sng, while 5$ ones(single table) can be more difficult for a newcommer.

[saxdaddy]

The 1.20 45 player toureys are good training grounds IMO. Success is all about goals. From 45 you need to make it to the top 27. Then from 27 you need to make it to top 18. Then from 18 you need to make it to final table. Then you need to make it to top 7 (ITM). To get this far you sometimes have to fold some pretty major holdings sometimes. I laid down a set of Js to an all in with 3 clubs and a str8 draw on board and another caller in fromt of me. I figured at least one of them had me beat. They both did. I went on to win the dam thing. Best hand i played was that laydown.

Just a little math on all-ins:
Lets say I have AA and go all in with some yoyo. I probably have at least a 75% chance of winning or busting out of the tourney. Now lets say I get AA three more times and someone goes all in in front of me for al my chips. Do you think it is +EV to play them all? Hell no!

.75*.75*.75*.75 = 0.31640625

~70% of the time i will bust out! And that is playing AA!

even three all-ins is bad .75*.75*.75 = 0.421875

~60% of the time i will bust out! And that is playing AA!

You simply cannot play may All-ins calling if you want to stay in the game to the end. I will fold QQ to an all-in early in a tourney any day unless there is a re-buy option. If I am the one betting on the button to a weak raise I might risk it, but not as a caller.

I learned this playing the 1.20 tourneys.

Tourney is a survival game as many know. Much different strategy than in ring. Call an all-in only if you have the guy covered by at least 2x his stack preferrably 3x or 4x.

I don't play alot of tourneys any more but I haven't forgot the math behind the all-in situations. You should really avoid them like the plague. There will be occations after the flop to go all in when u have the nuts or close to it, those are the times you want to go up againt another players stack.

One tme in a MTT I bet 500 on the first hand and got 5 callers at a 9 player table. Dam if I idn't get AJT on the flop too and went all in only to get called by four other players, one with AJ one with JT and two had KQ. SHt I was out on the first hand, but I'll never forget it! That was POKER.

Keep playin!

[saxdaddy]

By the way, I had AA on that first hand when I busted out.

[kashpot]

While i will agree that not all of the players at the 1.20 45 person sngs are good; I cant agree that if they are playing these sngs that they are ALL bad. I have been winning at the PS 45s and I have to say it has given me some invaluable experience at navigating through MTT matches.

Also, my bankroll is not at the level that is required in order for me to advance to the next leve. When I hit $100-150, than I will make a move to the next level. Thats approx 20-30 buyins. By that time I have all but mastered the $1.20 level and READY to move to the next level.

As for strategy, what has proven to be successful for me in this level at least; is to play loosely early. Ax and K9s and above in order to see the flop cheaply. Should the flop hit me, I bet out real strong. Machine gunning bets in order to keep the table at bay. As mentioned, I watch out for wild big stacks that can hurt me. In fact, I called an allin with AKo, against KK. I didn't fare too well.

gl

[biondino]

So you fold AA pre-flop when someone else pushes, saxdaddy?,

[krimson]

Just a little math on all-ins:
Lets say I have AA and go all in with some yoyo. I probably have at least a 75% chance of winning or busting out of the tourney. Now lets say I get AA three more times and someone goes all in in front of me for al my chips. Do you think it is +EV to play them all? Hell no!

.75*.75*.75*.75 = 0.31640625

~70% of the time i will bust out! And that is playing AA!

even three all-ins is bad .75*.75*.75 = 0.421875

~60% of the time i will bust out! And that is playing AA!

You simply cannot play many All-ins calling if you want to stay in the game to the end.

Sorry, but I think this is horrible advice.
The first point (which is the less important one) is that your maths is off. Your chances of winning a preflop AI with AA against a single opponent are never as bad as 75%. The worst case is if your opponent has suited connectors, in which case you have about 77% equity. Against a lower PP you have about 82%. A more reasonable estimate for your chances of winning against a range of pushing hands would be about 85%.
Now to the important point: if the probability that you'll win a single AI is 85% then the probability that you'll win 4 in a row is about 50%. OK, so half the time you bust out. But the other 50% of the time you SIXTEENDOUBLE UP! That is +EV staring you right in the face.