Quote Originally Posted by Lukie
Also.. unless they are reraising from the blinds, they will have position on you. If you do decide to call a reraise, you are going to be paying off AA anyway if there is no A on the flop.
You raise with KK and get re-raised. A certain amount of time they have AA, sometimes they have QQ, sometimes JJ, sometimes AK, sometimes nothing. AA might even be the most unlikely scenario. Now you push and get called. Do you think his range of holdings is now the same? Is this the play with the most +EV? Do you see why? (always wanted to say that rilla!)

Quote Originally Posted by Lukie
If they don't have AA (the FAR more likely scenario), then you just devalued KK incredibly.. if they hit the flop (A, 2p, set, whatever), then you are paying them off big, with the exception of the pair of aces. Even then you are still losing money against a hand that likely wouldn't have been in the hand if you rereraised. (Except maybe AK). If they don't hit, the best you can hope for is that they put you on a cont. bet and raise you with position.
No you are not devaluating your KK at all. You are seeing a flop with a better hand than your opponent (only AA is better). Your goal is to have your opponent put in the maximum amount of money in before the flop with a WORSE hand than your KK (ie anything other than AA) WHILE not dramatically increasing the chances that he does so with a better hand (AA) in the proccess. An example of that "dramatic increase" is in my oppinion the scenario when you push after you are re-raised and IF you get called. Now you might get outflopped, rivered or outplayed. Try to become a better player so, ideally, you can identify each of these scenarios, and make the right choices everytime. The mentality "I go all-in with Kings anyday" or anyother such "cliche" is wrong. It might make you money (and in this case it will cause no matter how bad you play Kings preflop (unless you fold them) is gonna be +EV, just depends how much) but it wont allow you to grow as a poker player especially if the "Kings pre-flop" scenario is not the only one that you play the same everytime because "thats the way it should be played".

Quote Originally Posted by Lukie
Anyway, the point: you should be rushing to put your money in with KK preflop. If you start folding KK everytime you think you are up against AA, I gaurantee that is -EV.
Hmm... let me think, if I am folding KK preflop everytime I think I am against AA I guarantee you it wont be -EV. I call/raise when I THINK I have a best hand, I fold when I THINK I have a worse, I bluff when I THINK I can steal the pot. Generally I make decisions at the table based on what I THINK (someone suggested that I would be better off calling Daniel Negraunu everytime I had a decision but I dismissed it as impractical). Sometimes I am right, sometimes I am wrong. My goal again is to become a better and better player so that my decisions are right a bigger percentage of the time, ideally 100% of the time.

Here is what I think of KK (or QQ or anyother hand relative speaking)
I want my opponent to put in AS MANY chips as it is possible but not in a way (such as ME PUSHING) that the % he has AA becomes way to big, then play the flop. I want him to put in as much as possible with his JJ, or AQ (cause putting them all is NOT realistic, though it would be nice) and then play it out. Then I hope that I am a good enough player (and try to become a better one) so that I make the most +EV decisions as the hand is played.

Maybe I think too much, maybe I am so bored at work that my mind makes up these thoughts to keep me occupied, maybe I should just "shove it in" with KK and hope for the best. Anyway this is my aproach to the game.

Bcool all.