Equity - am I getting it right?

I don't have the hand history on this computer, maybe don't need it. Let's see.

I was dealt KTs on the BB and villain (UTG, I think) called. I raised to 5x BB and he 3-bet me to something like 15x BB.

I did not know the equity or the player and played safe by folding.

Now I have tried to use PokerStove to see what my equity looked like.

First off I plugged in my hand vs. random getting 61% equity.

But then I figured I should be looking at his range. Tough that because I am not confident at all about it. But using the distribution thing I plucked a 10% figure to get a range of 77+,A9s+,KTs+,QTs+,AJo+,KQo and the equity reversed to him, 62%.

That range looked a bit too wide for that play, so I narrowed it to 5% to get a range of 88+,AJs+,KQs,AKo, that looked more likely (assuming his hand was not being misrepresented). Equity moving up for him to 66%.

So if any of my assumptions were right about his range, I was right to fold.

But then I have to factor in the fact that he only called until I raised. I would have thought that that opens up a real possibility that he was trying to bully me out of the pot.

So I assume that he would not try to do that with nothing in his hole cards at all and shoved the distribution bar up until it included all suited Aces, 23% giving him a range of 66+,A2s+,K6s+,Q8s+,J9s+,T9s,A8o+,K9o+,QTo+,JTo, pretty wide!) even then he had equity of 52%.

I'm not so much interested in whether my ranges are right because I am going from memory. Having said that all comment on the villain's range will help me.

The real question is though, am I starting to understand how I can use PokerStove to review my hands?

I know I will not be able to use it like that in-game, but I will start to remember situations if I work them out right. Repeat: If I am working them out right!

So comment on method rather than results first (then, if you think you can help some more, comment on the answers too).

Well this situation can be solved without worrying about equity. Micro'ers love making the l/r play from EP when they have AA, KK or sometimes AK, QQ. In any case, you're whooped here.

Plugging the 5% figure in isn't a very good method of estimating someone's range. You see that 88 is included in that range, but no one is ever making this play with 88. You should look at it from an angle of "What hands really make sense here?".

Also, the type of player that makes this play typically refuses to fold postflop (OMFG POCKET ACES!!!!). It's nice to just limp with suited connectors or pocket pairs against this guy (or check your BB) because you'll stack him with the right flop.

there are a lot more things to consider preflop than just your equity. this is because the effective stacks are deeper than on later streets, and this means that positional advantage and skill advantage become slightly more important (than when the effective stack is more shallow compared to the pot). on your question of using equity calculators in your hand reviews to help your in-game i will just say this: if you practice forming a range for your opponents based on their actions, and you begin to train yourself to get a feel for what your equity against that range would be, you will be doing a very good thing for your poker game. fwiw, developing that "feel", at least in my experience, comes from studying/reviewing hundreds of hundreds of hand histories and continually estimating (and checking in stove) what your hands' equity is versus a hand range.

also yeah, as chusko mentioned, try not to rely on the slider-bar for forming your opponents ranges. you'd do far better for your development if you just thought "what hands would he do this with?"

OK, thanks guys. Cut out the slider bar. Got it!

Originally Posted by binky bee

Cut out the slider bar

no, no....you can USE it; jus' don't RELY on it

As i understand it, the 'hand rankings' in 'Stove are based on All-In Equity, which means that they don't take into account how playayble a hand might be with further betting to come.

Which means that you can use them as 'gospel' for defining a player's range.

Originally Posted by DoubleJ

no, no....you can USE it; jus' don't RELY on it

As i understand it, the 'hand rankings' in 'Stove are based on All-In Equity, which means that they don't take into account how playayble a hand might be with further betting to come.

Which means that you can't use them as 'gospel' for defining a player's range.

fyp

thufferin' thuccotash!

thanks supa

What sort of hands might you limp under the gun then 3bet vs a raise?

Though i am by no means an expert i spent quite a bit of time playing 2NL and 5NL and a lot of players do the whole limp/3-bet thing with AK/QQ+. These are the same players that will min bet the flop and turn with a big hand then bet big on the river. I'd fold preflop to this kind of play at the micros unless you have a strong starting hand or a decent pair and the stacks give you good odds, because they love to stack off with overpairs.