Why I prefer live games to online play for hold 'em

Love 'em both, but recognizing the differences is helping my online play:

Pros of online play are numerous and have been covered. My favorites:

- can always find a game to my liking
- can play in my underwear
- don't have to drive an hour each way

But B&M's, and house games for that matter, are more profitable for me. Since taking this up seriously in January, I'm up just over $1000 in games where I can see the people (not counting a charity tournament win that boosted me $4100), and have been struggling to get back to even in on-line play (was down about $700 playing low limit, now just cracking even on-line +$121 at this moment in time). Here's why (I think):

- When I play B&M its typical to have the same 4-6 people at the table for stretches of two hours or more. Online someone leaves or enters the game every ten minutes or so (I'd like to see some stats on that)
- At a B&M its really clear when someone comes or goes. Online, they sneak in and out and I don't always pick up on it.
- At a B&M you can tell, just by looking, if someone is a fish or a shark. Even watching them stack their chips can sometimes tell you alot. Tells aside, you can see how much experience they have and how comfortable they are.
- I focus more in a live game. I'm there to play poker. Its too easy to read e:mail, let the dog out, answer the phone when I'm playing online.

- I clear my thoughts when I've got to drive to a casino or a home game. When I show up, I'm ready to play poker. When I play online, I often just jump on, and I find that I sometimes lose a couple of big hands before I even really start thinking.

- At home games, we play with the same crowd (with a very few new faces) every week. I have picked up real tells on a few of the regulars, and know who is solid and who isn't.

- When I get ahead in B&M I tend to stay more level-headed. When I get ahead online, I often get too loose, looking for that big killing. I think this has something to do with having a bunch of chips stacked in front of me, rather than a number. Not sure though, but its true.

-I think more in a live game. I have better recall about who raised, etc. I feel more comfortable thinking hard about a call/raise when I can look at the person. I can reach for my chips as a stall tactic, and put them back if I change my mind. Online its just so easy to "click" without going through all the possibilities, and once you click, you're in. Plus, I hate real slow players, and am probably too worried about becoming one, so I sometimes act too fast. (Same reason I hook my drive into the woods when there's a group close behind me in golf)


I love online play because I get to practice and learn and see lots of hands. The fact that I consistently win in live games, and struggle with online play has more to do with me than with the format. Just thought I'd see if anybody else has experienced the same things.

Good post, Heatman.

In defense of rookie players like me, I'd say we definitely have an advantage playing online poker as opposed to B&M poker. Mostly, for the reasons you specified in reverse. :lol:

For example, I have only played in B&M Casinos 10 times in my life (Damn you, east coast!) Of course, I have played many many home games and ring games with friends, but it is not the same thing. Playing in the real casino is a completely jarring experience, and it very quickly becomes easy to pick out the rookies by the way they hold/stack chips, by the way they react to lingo, by the way they address the dealer and other players at the table, etc. Playing online saves me the embarrassment of being a 'marked man' for my B&M inexperience, and allows me to play with the skills I have (crunching numbers, playing players).

Yeah, don't get me wrong, I didn't mean to claim to be a casino pro, and I've got way too much to learn. I have had good luck in my limited experience with live formal games though.

Originally Posted by heatman

- At home games, we play with the same crowd (with a very few new faces) every week. I have picked up real tells on a few of the regulars, and know who is solid and who isn't.

Awesome post. I never played in a casino or even a half-serious home game, but I'd like to after reading your post.

I quoted the point above because I think there really is something to be said for playing a game, any game or sport involving strategy, with the same people over and over. This is a situation where you really have a chance to try out new strategies and see how effective they are. If you're playing against randoms all the time, its hard to determine what works and what doesn't because the caliber and style of your opponents is constantly changing.

Also, when playing with the same people you have a chance to develop an image or style and then use it to your advantage. You can also try to get a read on your opponent's playing styles, tells, etc., like you said. That just adds a whole new element to the game.

heatman, You should enter your post in the Poker Thoughts Contest.

The details are on the http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=503 page.

Good points. But I have a couple other points. First, online has more games available ie. casinos don't generally have .25/.50 NL games available. To get a good game you have to go 4/8, 5/10 and up which is much more expensive for the casual player - especially someone just learing. In fact the only NL, I've seen in Vegas and Atlantic City were $100 minimum buy in. Sounds great until everyone buys in w/ a grand.

Second, you play many many more hands/hour online. It allows you to be more selective in starting hands. I have had 8 hour sessions in casino where the cards were dry and it was just a boring foldfest.

I find myself making some of the mistakes that you mentioned like getting distracted and not paying attention. But when I tighten up and get serious, online has been profitable in ring games and tournaments. In fact, I started playing a regular home game tournemnt every 2 months w/ 15-20 players, and I have found myself getting short stacked and playing stupid after 4 hours.

Originally Posted by SteveO

I find myself making some of the mistakes that you mentioned like getting distracted and not paying attention. But when I tighten up and get serious, online has been profitable in ring games and tournaments.

All great points. I especially agree with the need to just block out some time and concentrate. Once I started doing that I stopped the slide of making too many bad calls and playing while half engaged. I've been consistently profitable on line for awhile now, and this is probably a bigger factor than anything else.