Your play?

Also, do you bet the flop? I'll show what happened after I get some replys...

***** Hand History for Game 2277861766 *****
$400 NL Hold'em - Tuesday, June 28, 17:31:47 EDT 2005
Table Table 36530 (Real Money)
Seat 10 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: keystone34 ( $545.2 )
Seat 2: StevieRevone ( $368.9 )
Seat 3: luckylardy ( $395.5 )
Seat 5: JCarver2 ( $450.2 )
Seat 6: Guyeoman ( $100 )
Seat 7: peculia ( $519.3 )
Seat 8: Joppe_6 ( $403.6 )
Seat 9: go_player ( $1285.7 )
Seat 10: EvilEcstasy_ ( $194 )
Seat 4: letsdoitup ( $400 )
keystone34 posts small blind [$2].
StevieRevone posts big blind [$4].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to EvilEcstasy_ [ Kd Ah ]
luckylardy folds.
JCarver2 raises [$15].
Guyeoman folds.
peculia folds.
Joppe_6 calls [$15].
go_player folds.
EvilEcstasy_ calls [$15].
keystone34 folds.
StevieRevone folds.
** Dealing Flop ** [ Ks, Qd, Jh ]
JCarver2 checks.
Joppe_6 checks.
EvilEcstasy_ checks.
** Dealing Turn ** [ 6s ]
JCarver2 bets [$20].
Joppe_6 raises [$50].
EvilEcstasy_ ???

I think fold, only because you were not the raiser preflop. If you had reraised preflop, and weeded out JQ or KJ possiblities, then yes, I would call, but the odds of someone having ace ten or that type of hand is too good. I lay it down.

You're obviously beaten, and you put yourself in a hard spot beacause you did not bet the flop when it was checked to you to see where you're at. Why are you checking here??? All you're doing is letting your opponent see a free card. Bet the flop, and play it from there.

Originally Posted by allLiving

You're obviously beaten, and you put yourself in a hard spot beacause you did not bet the flop when it was checked to you to see where you're at. Why are you checking here??? All you're doing is letting your opponent see a free card. Bet the flop, and play it from there.

This is why:

EvilEcstasy_ folds.
JCarver2 raises [$105].
Joppe_6 raises [$150].
JCarver2 is all-In [$310.2]
Joppe_6 is all-In [$188.6]
** Dealing River ** [ 9c ]
Joppe_6 shows [ Kh, Kc ] three of a kind, kings.
JCarver2 shows [ Qh, Qs ] three of a kind, queens.
JCarver2 wins $46.6 from side pot #1 with three of a kind, queens.
Joppe_6 wins $825.2 from the main pot with three of a kind, kings.
>You have options at Table 36831 Table!.
ouch


Think about what sorts of hands are hanging around in a raised pot (espically raised in EARLY position) and you begin to realize why AKo is not that good here. I was praying for a ten to show up so I could destack them both, which is why I checked. Any bet I make on the flop will get raised. I will never see a turn card lol.

Hands that had me beat: KJ, KQ, QJ, AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AT, T9
Possiblity one of these hands was around: very likely

You played the hand perfectly, there is no criticism possible. the flop should not have been bet, 2 checks to you including the preflop raiser looks way too suspicious to me. nice smart play and laydown.

Now this is coming from a shorthanded guy so bear that in mind when reading my reply.

With AK, I do not like cold calling a raise because its hard telling where I stand post flop, and if all undercards come, I could be folding to an AQ high. Especially with position I prefer to reraise it hard so that people will bow down to me postflop and will usually only play back if they have a great hand.

Considering the aggression level and ugly board, I am definitely with checking behind and seeing what happens after a free turn card.


Why would the sets both check and give the board a free chance to make 4 to the straight? Were they just counting on a checkraise opportunity?

Originally Posted by SmackinYaUp

Now this is coming from a shorthanded guy so bear that in mind when reading my reply.

With AK, I do not like cold calling a raise because its hard telling where I stand post flop, and if all undercards come, I could be folding to an AQ high. Especially with position I prefer to reraise it hard so that people will bow down to me postflop and will usually only play back if they have a great hand.

Considering the aggression level and ugly board, I am definitely with checking behind and seeing what happens after a free turn card.


Why would the sets both check and give the board a free chance to make 4 to the straight? Were they just counting on a checkraise opportunity?

In 6-max you can easily reraise with AKo, as its a much stronger hand there. In 10-max the same play will earn an all-in reraise a lot of the time. In this case the guy with KK probably goes all in and your f'ed lol!

Yes, I think they were looking for the checkraise opportunity, but to be honest im unsure why the both checked.. they arent the best players i know lol

yeah that joppe guy is a big fish for sure, don't know of the other guy. You played the hand fine, lost a minimal amount of money, but i still think you should re-raise w/ AK preflop, especially in position. you lose alot less if you make it 40 or something and he comes over the top of you, then if you call 15 fold 2/3's of the time when you don't hit, and when you do hit on a Kxx or Axx you are bound to lose much more.

Originally Posted by spino1i

Originally Posted by allLiving

You're obviously beaten, and you put yourself in a hard spot beacause you did not bet the flop when it was checked to you to see where you're at. Why are you checking here??? All you're doing is letting your opponent see a free card. Bet the flop, and play it from there.

This is why:

EvilEcstasy_ folds.
JCarver2 raises [$105].
Joppe_6 raises [$150].
JCarver2 is all-In [$310.2]
Joppe_6 is all-In [$188.6]
** Dealing River ** [ 9c ]
Joppe_6 shows [ Kh, Kc ] three of a kind, kings.
JCarver2 shows [ Qh, Qs ] three of a kind, queens.
JCarver2 wins $46.6 from side pot #1 with three of a kind, queens.
Joppe_6 wins $825.2 from the main pot with three of a kind, kings.
>You have options at Table 36831 Table!.
ouch


Think about what sorts of hands are hanging around in a raised pot (espically raised in EARLY position) and you begin to realize why AKo is not that good here. I was praying for a ten to show up so I could destack them both, which is why I checked. Any bet I make on the flop will get raised. I will never see a turn card lol.

Hands that had me beat: KJ, KQ, QJ, AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AT, T9
Possiblity one of these hands was around: very likely

This is exactly my point. You need to bet the flop to see where you're at. You said "this is why" as if you KNEW you were beat, so why didn't you just fold preflop since you're an expert reader? Checking here isn't good espcecially when you're last to act against the other two players.

Originally Posted by allLiving

This is exactly my point. You need to bet the flop to see where you're at. You said "this is why" as if you KNEW you were beat, so why didn't you just fold preflop since you're an expert reader? Checking here isn't good espcecially when you're last to act against the other two players.

The reason I didnt fold preflop is because if an ace shows on a board with no kings or queens, I make a LOT of money off the KK and QQ. And I was sure one of them had either KK or QQ maybe both.

Easiest fold of your young life. You beat nothing.

-'rilla

Originally Posted by allLiving

Originally Posted by spino1i

Originally Posted by allLiving

You're obviously beaten, and you put yourself in a hard spot beacause you did not bet the flop when it was checked to you to see where you're at. Why are you checking here??? All you're doing is letting your opponent see a free card. Bet the flop, and play it from there.

This is why:

EvilEcstasy_ folds.
JCarver2 raises [$105].
Joppe_6 raises [$150].
JCarver2 is all-In [$310.2]
Joppe_6 is all-In [$188.6]
** Dealing River ** [ 9c ]
Joppe_6 shows [ Kh, Kc ] three of a kind, kings.
JCarver2 shows [ Qh, Qs ] three of a kind, queens.
JCarver2 wins $46.6 from side pot #1 with three of a kind, queens.
Joppe_6 wins $825.2 from the main pot with three of a kind, kings.
>You have options at Table 36831 Table!.
ouch


Think about what sorts of hands are hanging around in a raised pot (espically raised in EARLY position) and you begin to realize why AKo is not that good here. I was praying for a ten to show up so I could destack them both, which is why I checked. Any bet I make on the flop will get raised. I will never see a turn card lol.

Hands that had me beat: KJ, KQ, QJ, AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AT, T9
Possiblity one of these hands was around: very likely

This is exactly my point. You need to bet the flop to see where you're at. You said "this is why" as if you KNEW you were beat, so why didn't you just fold preflop since you're an expert reader? Checking here isn't good espcecially when you're last to act against the other two players.

you're totally wrong. he doesnt need to bet the flop because he already knows where he is at. AK might be good here 5% of the time. and by the river it will be good prolly 1% of the time. there is no reason to waste chips betting at a pot with those cards when you know you are beat. just like when you have 22 and the flop comes out AKQ, theres no reason to bet even though you probably had the best hand preflop. he played it well.