*** Official Politics Shitposting Thread ***

[BananaStand]

First we need to establish he does watch it religously

Why? Was that in dispute? "religiously" is your word. You're using it to conjure up images of inescapable ritual and faith-based reverence. And you're doing that because you feel it makes Donald Trump look stupid, pliable, and brainwash-able. I'm willing to establish that he watches "often", or even "very often". But please leave all that other shit at the door.

I know you hate Vox,

Again you're using your own words to convey a chosen meaning designed to fit into your chosen echo chamber narrative. I don't believe I've said that I "hate" Vox. I find them to be a peddler of demagoguery lacking in journalistic integrity. That's different. The video you've posted is a clear example of this.

For example: Trump once tweeted a message of congratulations to F&F for winning some award or in some other way being recognized (by someone other than Trump) as being the "most influential show". Mr. Vox decided to play fast and loose with the facts there and say "Trump called F&F the most influential show". (0:48)

Take a guess as to what Trump did next in every case she or some of the others on the panel say(s) this.

Ok...I'll guess.

Did he draft, sign and implement an executive order?
Did he direct leaders in congress to change their legislative trajectory?
Did he authorize the use of military assets?
Did he appoint someone to a job who wasn't being considered otherwise?
Did he fire someone for reasons that were only reported on F&F?

I'm running out of guesses here.....

Let's see....I'll try one more.....did he maybe put out a tweet that said something along the lines of "here's something on TV that I liked"

And I swear to god I did not know about this video until today.

I've seen it before. After all, how could I judge Vox if I never actually pay attention to them? Similarly, I would ask you how much Fox News you watch. And if it's not much, on what basis are you criticizing them?

But there were countless examples of this exact phenomenon out there,

This "phenomenon" can be observed in virtually every single news-consuming citizen on earth. Pick a person. Any random person off the street. Then evaluate their facebook page and internet history. See what they've "liked", reblogged, retweeted, linked, DVR'd etc. Vox could make a "zomg he's brainwashed" video about almost anyone.

Here are just a few samples you can continue refusing that happened, as apparently they are not "reality" nor "within the realm of sanity"

Every single one of those examples references Trump's use of twitter. None of those examples show a correlation between a F&F story and a changing of Trump's policy agenda. All you've demonstrated is that Trump likes a show that presumes to speak for his constituents. By acknowledging their message, he's speaking to his voters and saying "I'm listening".

If you're going to leap from there to a position in which you believe that Trump wakes up every morning not knowing what the fuck he's gonna do until he gets his priorities from F&F, then you have left the realm of sanity.

You've never heard of the Presidential Daily Briefing right?

Movium el goalposticus

Your original statement says that Trump already has "all the news". As evidence you've cited an intelligence briefing. Not the same thing.

Is watching Fox and Friends the only way he can do this? Oh, here's a clue: it's a rhetorical question banana

I asked you a non-rhetorical question that you completely evaded with this bullshit, non-sensical answer.

[Jack Sawyer]

Why? Was that in dispute? "religiously" is your word. You're using it to conjure up images of inescapable ritual and faith-based reverence. And you're doing that because you feel it makes Donald Trump look stupid, pliable, and brainwash-able. I'm willing to establish that he watches "often", or even "very often". But please leave all that other shit at the door.

Note the second bullet point. Turns out it's possible for that particular word to mean something different than actually religion related.

Nice strawman attempt tho

Again you're using your own words to convey a chosen meaning designed to fit into your chosen echo chamber narrative. I don't believe I've said that I "hate" Vox.

Is this another Mandela effect on my part for not having been around in a long time? Cause I can quite vividly recall you claiming all sorts of shit about vox. I could search, but FTR's search function sucks and I'm too lazy to give a fuck, so I'll gladly take your word for it.

I find them to be a peddler of demagoguery lacking in journalistic integrity. That's different.

Ironic word used there. We'll address that later.

Quite the same as I think about Fox mostly. I even posted a thread on here uttering my dislike on Fox. Sure you can find it if you need any reference.

The video you've posted is a clear example of this.

The video I posted is an example of Trump's behaviour. How Fox & Friends is currently affecting legislation in your country.

For example: Trump once tweeted a message of congratulations to F&F for winning some award or in some other way being recognized (by someone other than Trump) as being the "most influential show". Mr. Vox decided to play fast and loose with the facts there and say "Trump called F&F the most influential show". (0:48)

Yeah about that. That's why it's called a feedback loop. You are kind of making vox' point.

This is the loop in action

President Donald Trump favorite Fox & Friends has been named 2017's most influential show in media by news and opinion blog Mediaite, probably because the president himself tweets, talks about, and cites the show so often on his Twitter account.

http://www.newsweek.com/trump-fox-fr...uential-755116

I don't think I have to explain this in any more detail as it should be overwhelmingly an obvious point, even to you

Ok...I'll guess.

Did he draft, sign and implement an executive order?
Did he direct leaders in congress to change their legislative trajectory?
Did he authorize the use of military assets?
Did he appoint someone to a job who wasn't being considered otherwise?
Did he fire someone for reasons that were only reported on F&F?

I'm running out of guesses here.....

Let's see....I'll try one more.....did he maybe put out a tweet that said something along the lines of "here's something on TV that I liked"

I'm sure if I analyze the minutiae I could come up with a million examples of when he did, rather than just last week's one(s).

I'm sure someone else is doing that at the moment though ...

Oh would you look at that! A nicely written article on this subject! And "old" too!

https://www.thenation.com/article/th...s-fox-friends/

Just for shits and giggles, here's another recent example
https://www.npr.org/2018/04/08/60061...ite-tv-channel

GARCIA-NAVARRO: And reports he watches on "Fox & Friends" actually influence policy.

(SOUNDBITE OF TV SHOW, "FOX & FRIENDS")

PETE HEGSETH: We talked about this group of migrants, 1,200 marching to America...

GARCIA-NAVARRO: Just last week, after a segment on a caravan of Central American migrants, President Trump called his defense secretary to the White House. And he's now deployed National Guard troops to the U.S.-Mexico border. Fox News may be the most important news organization in America right now simply because it has a devoted audience inside the Oval Office of one. David Folkenflik is our media correspondent and our resident Fox expert. He told me what the president sees when he turns on the network.

I've seen it before. After all, how could I judge Vox if I never actually pay attention to them? Similarly, I would ask you how much Fox News you watch. And if it's not much, on what basis are you criticizing them?

I hate Fox News.

https://www.flopturnriver.com/pokerf...nt-154830.html

In the meantime, they have just dropped all pretense and just tripled down on their *actual* demagoguery. I already linked to the why they themselves do not consider themselves to be a news organization, not gonna do so again as there is no use

This "phenomenon" can be observed in virtually every single news-consuming citizen on earth. Pick a person. Any random person off the street. Then evaluate their facebook page and internet history. See what they've "liked", reblogged, retweeted, linked, DVR'd etc. Vox could make a "zomg he's brainwashed" video about almost anyone.

He's the goddamned president. The one who holds the nuke codes. He should know better.

Every single one of those examples references Trump's use of twitter.

I just gave another which wasn't. I can go on, but there is no need

None of those examples show a correlation between a F&F story and a changing of Trump's policy agenda

I just gave one that showed exact correlation between Fox and Friends saying and Trump doing.

All you've demonstrated is that Trump likes a show that presumes to speak for his constituents. By acknowledging their message, he's speaking to his voters and saying "I'm listening".

This is the tough part. I could wager that not all republicans favor Faux, but the overwhelming majority who watch Fox are republicans. Like 99:1.

If you're going to leap from there to a position in which you believe that Trump wakes up every morning not knowing what the fuck he's gonna do until he gets his priorities from F&F, then you have left the realm of sanity.

That is the only rational conclusion one can take, judging by how he behaves himself. One morning he has position A on a subject, by night it's B, by next morning it's C and by lunchtime that day it's position D, and yet his base will argue everytime he has any one of those positions that that was his exact position all along! It's simply amazing.

Movium el goalposticus

This is the president's job description:

The Constitution assigns the president two roles: chief executive of the federal government and Commander in Chief of the armed forces. As Commander in Chief, the president has the authority to send troops into combat, and is the only one who can decide whether to use nuclear weapons.

As chief executive, he enforces laws, treaties, and court rulings; develops federal policies; prepares the national budget; and appoints federal officials. He also approves or vetoes acts of Congress and grants pardons.

In those roles, he should be the one making the news. As such, he should not have any god damned time left to watch TV, let alone TV shows pretending to be news shows.

If he needs to know what is relevant to him, what is actually going on, you know, the stuff that news doesn't know, that 's why he has the President's Daily Brief. He does not need to be told, ever, WTF is going on NOR how to act on anything by Fox News/& Friends.

Your original statement says that Trump already has "all the news". As evidence you've cited an intelligence briefing. Not the same thing.

I wonder if you actually know the distinction between the two. Please enlighten us with your ever expanding wisdom. Do remember that time is precious and should be spent doing actually useful things, particularly when you are the president of any random country.

I asked you a non-rhetorical question that you completely evaded with this bullshit, non-sensical answer.

What question? Like, really, 'cause I missed it apparently

[BananaStand]

Nice strawman attempt tho

Nonsense. You know exactly what you were doing.

I can quite vividly recall you claiming all sorts of shit about vox.

Did I use the word "hate" or not? Why is this important to you? Isn't "peddlers of demagoguery without journalistic integrity" enough?

Ironic word used there. We'll address that later.

You kinda didn't. You just kinda said "But I think Fox is demagogues"

The video I posted is an example of Trump's behaviour. How Fox & Friends is currently affecting legislation in your country.

Which legislation exactly? I still haven't seen a shred of evidence that says Trump did something he wouldn't otherwise have done but for F&F. You just keep presenting instances of a F&F piece leading to a tweet or statement of some kind. I really can't state it more clearly than I already have. So, I'll just quote myself here:

Every single one of those examples references Trump's use of twitter. None of those examples show a correlation between a F&F story and a changing of Trump's policy agenda. All you've demonstrated is that Trump likes a show that presumes to speak for his constituents. By acknowledging their message, he's speaking to his voters and saying "I'm listening".

This is the loop in action

"action" is kind of a loaded term here. Trump likes a show. That makes the show influential. That's why Trump likes it. etc. etc. So what? What outcome has that led to that you object to?

I don't think I have to explain this in any more detail as it should be overwhelmingly an obvious point, even to you

It should be obvious to you that Vox was playing fast and loose with the facts. And regardless, you still have NOT demonstrated any obvious consequence to Trump liking a show. Why is this so much worse than if his favorite show was 60 Minutes, or HeeHaw?

I'm sure if I analyze the minutiae I could come up with a million examples of when he did, rather than just last week's one(s).

That's a cop out. What you're really saying here is "yeah Banana, you're right. Trump watching F&F hasn't led to anything more than tweeting. I can't think of or find a single example of when a F&F story compelled Trump to take an action he wouldn't have otherwise taken. There really is no evidence that Trump is a blank-minded idiot who needs to be spoon fed his priorities from a bimbo, a square, and a guy who looks like a cabbage patch doll"

A nicely written article on this subject! And "old" too!

I call FOUL on this! The article opens with a few paragraphs about how Bannon is a jerk. Then goes on to call F&F "news for dummies". Where in this article are you seeing a direct causal link between a F&F story and a change in policy?

this is the closest I could find:

These people have substantial influence over the president’s policy agenda and day-to-day priorities. That is not a conspiracy theory but a demonstrable fact.

It doesn't actually "demonstrate" any fact though. That sentence just contains a link to yet another story about a correlation between F&F and Trump's tweets.

Just for shits and giggles, here's another recent example

Are you really suggesting that if Trump had heard about the immigrant caravan from CNN, that he would have done something different? Or that he wouldn't have heard about the caravan had he not watched F&F that day? Is that what you're suggesting? Seriously?

You're not telling me anything other than "Trump watches TV". You haven't demonstrated, at all, how it's influencing his thinking. Again, Fox is speaking, ostensibly, for Trump voters. When he acknowledges them with a tweet, he's saying "I'm listening". To infer anything beyond that, without a shred of evidence, is outside the realm of sanity.

In the meantime, they have just dropped all pretense and just tripled down on their *actual* demagoguery.

I'm not going to play the "who's a bigger demagogue" game with you here. I'm just going to say that if what you're implying with you're use of, and emphasis on the word "actual", is that Vox is NOT demagogue-ing, then you've left the realm of sanity.

He's the goddamned president. The one who holds the nuke codes. He should know better.

Know better than to what? Retweet things? Than to watch TV? Then to acknowledge his constituents when they speak to him?

Explain to me why Trump tweeting something he saw on F&F is not simply an acknowledgement of "i'm listening". Explain to me why it just HAS to be caveman-Trump saying "Mmm, me like TV. Pretty girl say laws. Me go make what she say. Oooga booga"

I just gave another which wasn't. I can go on, but there is no need

No...you didn't.

I just gave one that showed exact correlation between Fox and Friends saying and Trump doing

.
No...you didn't

This is the tough part. I could wager that not all republicans favor Faux, but the overwhelming majority who watch Fox are republicans. Like 99:1

That's kinda my point. People who vote for Trump-- republicans-- watch Fox. They watch Fox because they like what Fox says. When Trump watches Fox, he hears what his voters like. Why do you have a problem with that?

That is the only rational conclusion one can take, judging by how he behaves himself.

You have yet to show any "rational" link between a F&F piece, and a change in Trump's "behavior". I'll say it again. You're playing a really juvenile correlation/causation game that you really should be ashamed of.

One morning he has position A on a subject, by night it's B, by next morning it's C and by lunchtime that day it's position D, and yet his base will argue everytime he has any one of those positions that that was his exact position all along! It's simply amazing.

^Demagoguery. Right there. You should go ask David Pakman if you can be on his show.

In those roles, he should be the one making the news.

I'm stunned right now. Are you saying Trump is not making the news? Are you really saying that?

As such, he should not have any god damned time left to watch TV, let alone TV shows pretending to be news shows.

I'm further stunned. If you're saying that you think it's best that the President not consume news media, you've left the realm of sanity. Even Washington read newspapers for fuck's sake!

If he needs to know what is relevant to him, what is actually going on, you know, the stuff that news doesn't know, that 's why he has the President's Daily Brief.

If you're saying that news media and the Presidential Daily Brief are redundant, please cite your source. Does the PDB tell Trump how his voting base *feels* about what's going on?

He does not need to be told, ever, WTF is going on NOR how to act on anything by Fox News/& Friends.

can you demonstrate, a single instance where Trump wouldn't have known something if he wasn't watching F&F? Furthermore, can you demonstrate a single instance where Trump acted differently than he otherwise would have had he not seen something on F&F? The only exception to that obviously being tweets. Even in the case of tweets though, that's not an act influencing policy. It's simply an acknowledgement of "I'm listening"

I wonder if you actually know the distinction between the two. Please enlighten us with your ever expanding wisdom. Do remember that time is precious and should be spent doing actually useful things, particularly when you are the president of any random country

Since time is precious, why don't you just cite me a source that says the PDB tells Trump how popular opinion is reacting to current events.

What question? Like, really, 'cause I missed it apparently

Really? You quoted it! Here it is again:

How do you propose the President remain in touch with popular opinion regarding current events and government policy?