NBA PLAYOFFS!!!

[drmcboy]

are there any magic fans here who can describe what it's like when jj redick has your title on his fingers?

[bigspenda73]

hah i noticed that, I've never seen a player want the ball out of his hands faster than JJ on the last play of regulation.

[Lukie]

it does seem somewhat slanted, also, as well as SVG seemed to coach in the ECF he seems lost (rotations-wise) in this series.

Either way if Lee finishes off the alley-oop we have a sick good series, but with the 2-3-2 format the road team really has to win one of the first two games, b/c winning 3 in a row is so tough, no matter how big their home court advantage is.

is winning 3 in a row at home any tougher than winning specifically games 3, 4, and 6 at home?

seems like a commonly recited variant of gambler's fallacy to me.

maybe the psychological factor leads to a sort of placebo effect which gives it some credence?

[Lukie]

or extensive travel maybe tends to favor the home team?

[mcatdog]

is winning 3 in a row at home any tougher than winning specifically games 3, 4, and 6 at home?

seems like a commonly recited variant of gambler's fallacy to me.

no it's the same of course, nice post

[bigspenda73]

I have to disagree from a psychological standpoint there is more pressure as well as a comfort standpoint for the road team.

Plus a lot of the analysts who have been in these spots say it's different.

yes, yes, yes, I can agree for a game-by-game standpoint that it's the same. However, the fact is the finals have become more 6-game series based lately than 7th game.

Since 1985 which is when the 2-3-2 format started there have been 3 7-game series and 11 6-game series, tell me that would be the same with the 2-2-1-1-1 format.

[bigspenda73]

also with some quick scrolling math it seems before 1985 there were 13 7-game series played and 12 6-game series.

[mcatdog]

It's entirely possible (even likely) for 3-4-5 to be equally as tough as 3-4-6 but for 3-4-5 to make 6-game series more likely, DUCY?

As for the psychological differences I just always disagree with this type of argument because it seems to assume that professional athletes are weak-minded people who are easily bothered by pressure. Sure there's the occasional Chris Webber who does shrink under pressure but most top athletes have been trained from a young age to not let pressure get to them and perform at least as well when the pressure is high.

[nibbles]

Now it's a series. I absolutely loved how Kobe buckled like a belt down the stretch. The sad thing is that Orl played damn near perfect basketball and still just barely won. They can't count on a Kobe collapse to get the "W" in future games. But a win is a win.

[bigspenda73]

lol chokeaments

pretty horrid last minute the magic played in reg. and OT

Take the magic on the M.L. next game (game 5).the under is a lock also if the line is 200+.I hit the sides and the over but I bought 3 points on the over under bet.It would of pushed other wise and lost if you bet late.(Sports handicapper for 20 years)65% on M.L. bets in the playoffs this season.60% on totals.59% on bets with the point spread.I'm up $7k on the playoffs +14 units .!!!!!!!!!! I love this game..!!!

[Lukie]

One thing I really hate about the NBA and it only gets worse during the playoffs:

The players. Whine. So. Freaking. Much.

Seriously, when you start throwing your hands up in the officials face, yelling at them, or otherwise showing them up... it should be an automatic T. Calmly talking is obviously different.

Seriously tilts me to no end, hyachachach.

[UG]

Nice choke by the Magic, only saw the last five minutes of regulation and all of OT. Way to go, gg in 5 or 6.

To kind of hop on what Lukie started, the one thing I really hate about the NBA is that you can miss 95% of the game but if you make it for the last 5% of the game you're A-okay.

it's either

1) team is beating the shit out of the other team, blowout, nothing to see
2) it's close but not close so they're nailing free throws to win the game
3) it's super close and is going to come down to the last second

I'll save comparisons to NCAA basketball, NFL/NCAA Football, MLB, NHL, etc. for another thread. But I haven't been too happy at the end of games when I've watched the entire thing and realized I could have done something else with my 2+ hours. I would have gone apeshit for Lebron vs. Kobe, though, so I guess I'm just your casual fan so don't hate.

that karate flip guy is some funny shit...LMAO

[a500lbgorilla]

UG, watch the hockey game tonight bro. Prepare to have you face blown off by awesome

[Lukie]

To kind of hop on what Lukie started, the one thing I really hate about the NBA is that you can miss 95% of the game but if you make it for the last 5% of the game you're A-okay.

uhhhh.... i can't see how i related to this in any way, not even kind of. <3

i mean, if you just want to see who wins, you're right, but that's more a function of not caring a whole lot and you might as well just watch the sportscenter highlights or read about it in the paper.

i'd argue that seeing the whole game, or at least a good portion of it, makes the ending a lot sweeter and more exciting. you also get to see a lot of good basketball (hopefully).

it also implies that there are a lot of close, exciting finishes, which is actually a plus even if not in this tiny scope/context. compare to the snoozefest baseball zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz what? (we've had this convo before, i know it)

also how is it different than any other sport or competitive event, of course you can just turn it on in the last minutes and see the winner, and maybe a nice ending if you're lucky. it's not really a substitute for watching the whole event, provided that you're an actual fan of said event and enjoy watching it.

blah blah blah ramble ramble ramble blah blah blah

[drmcboy]

are there any magic fans here who can describe what it's like when jj redick has your title on his fingers & delivers a nice game, howard has a triple double, and you still lose?

fmp

[drmcboy]

Being down 0-2 sucks no matter what format they play. sometimes I think if the first two games split 22111 helps the road team a bit but.

what doesn't make sense is why they change at all since clearly they think 22111 is better. I assume they still site travel as the reason but that looks pretty silly since every time they travel this series it's with one day off and all the extra days are in the same city.

[UG]

Lukie, that was the "one thing that I hate about the NBA," it had nothing to do with your post except you also stated your "one thing you hate about the NBA" or whatever.

Bleh, it was just a semi-drunk post and I shouldn't have posted it. All it does is just rain on your guy's parade, I'm retarded....another time, another place we'll have this discussion.

[Lukie]

Lukie, that was the "one thing that I hate about the NBA," it had nothing to do with your post except you also stated your "one thing you hate about the NBA" or whatever.

Bleh, it was just a semi-drunk post and I shouldn't have posted it. All it does is just rain on your guy's parade, I'm retarded....another time, another place we'll have this discussion.

this seems like the perfect time and place for this dicussion

[bigspenda73]

pretty ridiculous how 1 missed FT might have cost us one of the best Finals in a long time.

[drmcboy]

yeah I don't really care who wins but I wanted 2-2

[nibbles]

The Magic have been so disappointing. They would/could/should be up 3-1 right now instead of being down it. I'm not a Magic fan (love da Knicks), just hatin' on the Lakers. The fat lady is clearing her throat, cos I don't see how Orlando can recover from this. Damn they had game four pretty much sewn up and gave it away.

I was so looking forward to part 2 of this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLJ65...eature=related Now we'll never get to hear it.

I tend to stick to money line bets in the nba, but with the magic being at -150 to open I'm going to advise my clients to avoid betting on the sides and take the under.It opened at 197.5 and is at 198.5 now i think it will be at 200 by game time so wait it out.The public likes to bet over on the NBA so of course the value is on under bets.Totals are actually a hard way to make a profit in the nba but the 3 points is going to be tough to cover but very likely could happen.In other words it's a gamble or a coin flip.The total on the other hand would be under 200 points 7 out of ten times in this game scenario.G.L. all

http://linecrushers.zoomshare.com

[baudib]

Total choke job by the Magic.

Howard had one of the greatest defensive performances I've ever seen...and one of the worst offensive ones. It's amazing that he can score 20 ppg and be so awful. When you are like the strongest guy in the league, you can't carry the ball low and let people like Kobe and Fisher prevent you from getting a shot off.

If he can develop a scoring move, he'll be better than Shaq IMO.

[bigspenda73]

it's annoying, all he has to do is hold the ball high, like a lot of other big men that aren't nearly as strong as him. Yao and TimmyD come to mind, I'm sure there are others that are relatively weak but don't get stripped nearly as much and when they do fouls get called b/c it's in plain view, not down in the scrum.

[baudib]

yeah he has like 17 turnovers and 16 baskets in 4 games.

It does seem like he has a great attitude, is humble and tries hard to improve. It's a little scary because he's a dominant player but has so much room for improvement.

[bigspenda73]

who do you blame, it's his 5th year and he's missing a basic component of all the great post players

[drmcboy]

god making him pay for terribad olympics

www.linecrushers.zoomshare.com Ok as far as getting a side bet in on Sundays game if you have the ability to buy points buy the 3 points on the lakers taking it to +6 no way the magic covers 6 points this will get you $58.50 back on a $100 bet and it will almost be a sure thing.The under still looks very promising as I dont see either team breaking 100 points after going to over time the last game.It should end with a total of between 170 to 195.the only way this thing goes over the total is with multiable over times.

[baudib]

There have been HOF centers who weren't great interior scorers, like Bill Russell, Wes Unseld or Dave Cowens who were great passers, and in the case of Cowens, a good perimeter shooter. But Howard obviously has the potential to do it. I wonder if Patrick Ewing is working with him on a yet-to-be-revealed 15-foot jumper? He should consider getting coaching from Moses Malone instead.

Sometimes it takes a big man a little bit longer to develope fully than say a guard.I think Howard will be a dominate player within 3 years on both ends of the court.

I'm really pushing this under bet on the total on Sundays game now.I've done a lot of home work. I'm not going to break it down like a double barrel shot gun right here but the fact that it went to over time the other night is a good reason alone.Here's another the lakers may just lay down so they can seal the deal in front of the home crowd.
Screw it here's the real reason I have it on good authority from my man in Orlando that half the lakers team were out clubbing tonight and still are out as we speak and were also out last night.So they should be damn tired.This makes me inclined to remove my recommendation to buy 3 points and take the lakers.
Let's just steer clear of the betting on either team and take the under as I said before it is going to have to go to double O.T. to go over 200 points total.I project the final score will be in the range of 170 to 195 points.Closer to the 170 end of it.
I guess you could deduce that this means the magic will win the game and I think they will with this new info but cover 3 points um maybe ,maybe not. & I don't want to have to bet 1.5 to get 1 on them the way they have choked down the stretch do you?This is the M.L. right now magic -150.

[bigspenda73]

I wonder if Patrick Ewing is working with him on a yet-to-be-revealed 15-foot jumper?

you mean a FT?

[d5mccabe]

Coyboy you're a clown. Lakers can go out and pop bottles and still make it rain on the Magic....and they will.

[d5mccabe]

Lakers by 10 for the win tonight.

[ttwarrior1]

magic will win this game, lakers want to win at home

[bulsport]

lakers win 100%

[bigspenda73]

seriously wtf are you fucking trolls doing

{locked} til the freeroll is over and you all leave

[a500lbgorilla]

im in yer locked nba thread, predicting a lakers victory

[UG]

{unlocked because the playoffs are over and I think the majority of freetrollers are gone}


Lakers/Kobe win another title. Discuss.

As I suggested the under was a lock.at 185 total points.The Lakers still won the game despite a little party time the last 2 nights.I bet on the Lakers and bought 3 points but it was a modest bet of 1 unit.I put 5 units on the under.
I hope some of you took my advice on the two tips I gave on the last two games.I'll post some M.L.B. games here this week once I feel like I'm in the flow of it.I don't mess with Base Ball till N.B.A. is done.You see the perception is that sports handicappers like the NFL the truth is most of us like the NBA more because its on 2 3rds of the year with games almost every night of the week.Gives us lots of options.But the NFL is a money maker in its own right.G.L. all

I love that karate flip guy..LMAO again.

[baudib]

I have Kobe in my top 5 for all-time NBA(/ABA) guards:

1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Oscar Robertson
4. West
5. Kobe

I think you can make an argument that he's better than LOGO, but my guess is Lakers fans would say no. I don't see how he could surpass any of the top 3. To be honest I'd take Chris Paul over Kobe (Paul deserved MVP in 2008 IMO) but I guess I should wait until he gets to a conference final or has 5 NBA seasons in first. Personally I prefer Dwyane Wade, when healthy, but it's debatable and it's unlikely he will ever match what Kobe has already done in his career.

If old-timers like Clyde Frazier, I won't argue, but he's clearly better than any shooting guard (although West is probably a SG in today's game) not named Michael and probably better than any non-scoring point guards (Stockton, Kidd, etc.).

Where he ranks among all players...I don't know. My guess is he's somewhere between 10th and 15th greatest player.

[bikes]

....god fucking damnit

[bigspenda73]

ya sorry passed out during the 2nd quarter, forgot to unlock

gg Magic, really didn't see them just falling apart in game 5 but that's life. I know a lot of ppl hate Kobe and while he gives a lot of reasons to dislike him I just find his game too "pretty" to not love. He just seems like the most fluently athletic person on the floor and that's what separates him in my mind from Lebron/DWade.

[Lukie]

what separates kobe from lebron is that kobe has phil jackson, pau gasol, andrew bynum, and lamar odom where lebron has mike brown, anderson varejao, zydrunas ilgauskas, and ben wallace.

really, that's it

no comparison

[a500lbgorilla]

but didnt lebron and those guys win an ass-ton of games this season?

[bigspenda73]

Does it upset you that Adam Morrison has a ring and LBJ doesn't.

[baudib]

but didnt lebron and those guys win an ass-ton of games this season?

Yes...I'm quite certain that the 08-09 Cavs are teh worst 65+ win team in NBA history, by a wide margin. They happened to run into a team in the ECF that has their number and was able to expose them. They would have beaten Boston, but I'm not sure about the Lakers.

[Lukie]

but didnt lebron and those guys win an ass-ton of games this season?

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

Lebron James PER rating of 31.76 is incredible. Compare that to Michael Jordan's high water mark of 31.89, and you could use the same supporting cast argument there as well.

blah blah meow chow

[rebuyman]

Lebron had highest PER for a post season by a wide margin this year.

[bigspenda73]

how was his PER in the finals?

[UG]

snap

[Da GOAT]

imo kobe>lebron and i dont really like kobe

[Jack Sawyer]

Rumors about Shaq to Cavs. Thoughts?

If I were the Cavs, I would give my first born for Chris Paul and Carlos Boozer instead.

[a500lbgorilla]

thats a horrible deal, you're an athlete man. You know your first born is gonna be LeBron x 2.

[Jack Sawyer]

I would trade my second or third born back for him when he would be draft ready.

I was watching old MJ games, of the Bulls-Jazz finals, and I noticed MJ had a left armband almost at his elbow, just like Kobe does now. Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery?

[Lukie]

Rumors about Shaq to Cavs. Thoughts?

If I were the Cavs, I would give my first born for Chris Paul and Carlos Boozer instead.

Assuming we give up very little to get him, I'm all for it. He was actually very effective this year... off the top of my head something like 17/8 on 60%+ FG%.

Plus he's always been one of my favorite guys in the NBA from an entertainment perspective.

[mcatdog]

Two comments -

1. It took way too long for that clown promoting his dumbassed handicapping site to get banned, I guess the radmins were busy partying in Vegas though.

2. The Cavs trading for Shaq would be Billups-for-Iverson caliber stupidity, and would have the same result of turning a title contender into an also ran. Why do really good teams that lose a tough series that could have gone either way, always feel the need to drastically change themselves in the offseason? The Cavs were at worst the second best team in the NBA this year, but there's variance in sports and the better team doesn't always win a series. They should make minor changes and that's it.

[mcatdog]

Also if the Cavs trade for Shaq I'll hate them so much that I'll even root for Boston against them. I didn't think it was possible for me to root for the Celtics against anybody.

[Jack Sawyer]

[bigspenda73]

I'll see your Shaq and raise you RJ

[Lukie]

i can hear the blood bubbling in mike's veins right now

[Jack Sawyer]

I'll see your Shaq and raise you RJ

All the cavs got to do now is kick Mo Williams, Big Z and Varejao out of there, and get this guy , one low salary true shooting guard, and one low salary small forward, and boom! Kick em all out and give boozer something in the 15-18 mizzle range.


Is it possible to get a more intimidating starting lineup than Boozer, James, Shaq, Ronald McDonald and Mickey Mouse out there?
The only other guy I'd like to see there is the fully tatooed mohawk kid from the nuggets (I don't know his name). He'd be there in full Rodman style, no skills needed whatsoever. He'd be a great Varejao replacement.

[bigspenda73]

I kinda like:

C: Duncan
PF: Sheed
SF: Jefferson
SG: Ginobili
PG: Parker

Not saying we get Sheed, but I would not be surprised if it went down.

[Jack Sawyer]

How about Hedo instead of Sheed?

[bigspenda73]

Spurs gave him a run 4-5 years ago, didn't work out

[bode]

I kinda like:

C: Duncan
PF: Sheed
SF: Jefferson
SG: Ginobili
PG: Parker

Not saying we get Sheed, but I would not be surprised if it went down.

i never thought it would be possible for me to hate the spurs worse, but if they get sheed...

i do like R Jeff though.

[Lukie]

I'll see your Shaq and raise you RJ

All the cavs got to do now is kick Mo Williams, Big Z and Varejao out of there, and get this guy , one low salary true shooting guard, and one low salary small forward, and boom! Kick em all out and give boozer something in the 15-18 mizzle range.


Is it possible to get a more intimidating starting lineup than Boozer, James, Shaq, Ronald McDonald and Mickey Mouse out there?
The only other guy I'd like to see there is the fully tatooed mohawk kid from the nuggets (I don't know his name). He'd be there in full Rodman style, no skills needed whatsoever. He'd be a great Varejao replacement.

This would smell of what mcat was talking about a lot more than the shaq trade-- retooling an excellent team that lost a tough series.

Z and Andy work great together and both need to stay-- as the second team hopefully. Mo and DWest make a very solid backcourt so I'm not sure you want to mess with that.

Ignoring any past experiences the Cavs had with Boozer, how could we realistically get him? (genuine question)

[mcatdog]

That picture of LeBron and Shaq is infuriating but I take comfort in the fact that they're only the 3rd best team in the East now. All they need to do is make the moves that Jack Sawyer suggested and they can lose in the 1st round instead of the 2nd round.

[bigspenda73]

I'm worried about our front court depth atm, gave up Thomas and Oberto to get RJ and there's no guarantee Gooden will resign. Drafting Blair should help a little and an old foreign pick, Ian Mahinmi looks to finally be ready for NBA play, but that's going to leave us quite young off the bench.

I'm not a huge Gooden fan but he'll be the best option, oh well.

[Jack Sawyer]

Ignoring any past experiences the Cavs had with Boozer, how could we realistically get him? (genuine question)

Jettisoning Big Z would be a good start. These guys are good, but their salary is way too much for what they bring to the table. Which is why I suggested the trades, all in an effort to bring the team salary back down, bring in 3 big guys who can pretty much pwn any other team on their own, and then hope the Delonte and Gibson can be good enough at steals and dishes to decimate the opposition.


My intention is not to

retooling an excellent team that lost a tough series

but rather get that salary cap more down to earth while making them as dominant as possible. like it or not, the team revolves around James and Shaq now, everyone else is sideshow and expendable.

If I was the actual GM, I would give the world to trade for either Bosh or Boozer though. But Boozer is better because he's very physical; the prototype power forward. Bosh is more lanky, can't get truly physical and would need a better shot and better release to be truly dominant.

Good defense plus good board play, and you are in the finals. Clutch wins the finals.

[Jack Sawyer]

Re this

retooling an excellent team that lost a tough series

Is not entirely true. I did not follow the cavs playing in the regular season, and basically I only saw the Cavs-Magic series. A few things I could remark, in a totally unbiased observer kind of way:
1) It was all about Lebron.
2) They played Pass it to Will.
3) Lebron chokes, the whole team chokes. If they triple teamed the man, two guys should be free but they now want to try jumpers instead of driving the fuck to the rim.
4) The magic got free looks all the time, and they punished Mike Brown for that.
5) Coach of the year? Please.

Ben Wallace was like a huge vortex of money. Varejao was dissapeared. Ilgauskas did not look to me like a guy who should be getting 11 Mil this year.


IMO they got that far on Lebron's back, but when Lebron got the attention and got pwned, he did not have any supporting cast. 2 more starting reliable big men and they have a dynasty, not worrying about a puny series. Shaq only has at most 3 years in the tank left, so if cleveland wants to actually win a championship in pro sports for once (before he's gone and we'd be back at step 1), get Carlos fucking Boozer or Chris Bosh, and jettison all the dead weight you can.

[bigspenda73]

One thing that I'd like to league to take from this year is to not hand out awards until after the post-season.

[swiggidy]

I'm not a huge Gooden fan but he'll be the best option, oh well.

ahhahahahahahahahahahhahahah

There are very few situations where you can say this and have it be a good thing.

Orlando fucked them selves with the VC trade. Boston is old. Call me a homer, but the cavs are going to be tops in the east again.