Capitalism Rules, Socialism and Communism Suck Thread

[TheSpoonald]

Venezuela has a lot of oil. Of course USA are meddling in their affairs

This is really an old old talking point. Between oil sands and fracking, North America has enough fossil fuels to last multiple centuries.

Neoconservatism is pretty much over.

[OngBonga]

Between oil sands and fracking, North America has enough fossil fuels to last multiple centuries.

I don't doubt it, but I think there's a little more to it than simply having enough to run your big thirsty engines. This is about maintaining the dollar as the dominant petrocurrency. I get the impression that it's a matter of "at all costs".

Neoconservatism is pretty much over.

Sure. It's hardly "neo" any more, it's just conservatism.

[OngBonga]

That said, the alternative would be far worse. I'd rather USA gets shitty with Iran and Venezuela than Russia and North Korea, purely from a nuclear pov.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Wait... you said North America? As in Panama to Canada?
That's not the US's oil, though.

[TheSpoonald]

Wait... you said North America? As in Panama to Canada?
That's not the US's oil, though.

Well it's mostly in canada. Not too worried about what's in panama.

And fuck canada, what are they gonna do? We have them surrounded.

[MadMojoMonkey]

This is really an old old talking point. Between oil sands and fracking, North America has enough fossil fuels to last multiple centuries.

Uhhh.... Where'd you get that data?

America consumes 7.28 billion barrels of petroleum products per year.
https://www.americangeosciences.org/...-united-states

Proven oil reserves in the United States were 36.4 billion barrels of crude oil as of the end of 2014, excluding the Strategic Petroleum Reserve
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_re..._United_States

The Strategic Petroleum Reserve is an emergency fuel storage of petroleum maintained underground in Louisiana and Texas by the DOE. It is the largest emergency supply in the world, with the capacity to hold up to 727 million barrels.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strate...United_States)

A U.S 42-gallon barrel of crude oil yields about 45 gallons of petroleum products in U.S. refineries because of refinery processing gain.
https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/...?page=oil_home

So that 36.4 B barrels amounts to 39 B barrels of petroleum products.
At a consumption rate of 7.28 B barrels per year, that gives us 5.35 years of reserve.

The SPR holds another 727 M * (45/42) / (7.28 B) = 0.11 more years.

Nowhere near centuries.

According to this link, Venezuela has the largest crude oil reserve in the world. 2nd to Saudi Arabia.
https://www.thebalance.com/oil-reser...argest-3305873

I have a friend who works as a plant engineer in the oil fields in Saudi. He has assured me that he will not be able to retire in that job because the oil will be gone within our lifetimes.
If the 2nd largest oil reserve is going to be depleted in the coming decades, then I'd say Venezuela has a prime position on the hot seat for the foreseeable future.

[TheSpoonald]

Uhhh.... Where'd you get that data?

I don't know man. I just hear shit and remember it. But some fast googling found this...

https://www.business-standard.com/ar...2201397_1.html

I'm not familiar with the source, but it agrees with me so it's probably good.

with technological advances, reserves that were previously deemed unviable to tap have kept coming on board. Various studies show that the total remaining recoverable oil resources would last 190 years, natural gas 230 years, and coal, a whopping 2900 years.

EDIT: I found something else that said 52 years + whatever else we find. I found another source that said the 32 years but was dated in 1980. So like most environmental/climate data.....no one fucking knows shit.

[Jack Sawyer]

EDIT: I found something else that said 52 years + whatever else we find. I found another source that said the 32 years but was dated in 1980. So like most environmental/climate data.....no one fucking knows shit.

Oh people know, it's just not in their current financial interests to act upon it.

Which is why they resort to denial. It's easier to just deny shit, to claim the sun isn't there by hiding it with your finger. And when other people claim they still see the sun despite the fact that you covered it with your finger, just keep claiming "fake news".

[TheSpoonald]

Oh people know, it's just not in their current financial interests to act upon it.

Stop. The dems are primed to drop $30 Trillion on this. They're dying to print money and spend it on any bonkers project with the word "green" in it.

"not in their current financial interests"....pffffffffffffffffffffffftt

[Jack Sawyer]

Stop. The dems are primed to drop $30 Trillion on this. They're dying to print money and spend it on any bonkers project with the word "green" in it.

"not in their current financial interests"....pffffffffffffffffffffffftt

What about the republicans?

[TheSpoonald]

What about the republicans?

What about them?

[MadMojoMonkey]

I don't know man. I just hear shit and remember it. But some fast googling found this...

https://www.business-standard.com/ar...2201397_1.html

I'm not familiar with the source, but it agrees with me so it's probably good.



EDIT: I found something else that said 52 years + whatever else we find. I found another source that said the 32 years but was dated in 1980. So like most environmental/climate data.....no one fucking knows shit.

You'll have to do better than an unknown source that starts with "It is argued" and no reference to by whom or what their data or credentials are. Then he waxes poetic about WTF, exactly? Cassandra of Troy?

I mean... I guess that's funny, but not evidence.

[TheSpoonald]

You'll have to do better

Oh? And what if I don't?

[MadMojoMonkey]

Oh? And what if I don't?

Then you admit you're making an irrational argument. Whether or not you say the words, it's what you've done.
Your position boils down to base nationalism. You don't want them illegals here, 'cause they're not from here, so they're bad for here.
If that's the whole of your argument, and there's literally no data or reality to back it up, then ... thanks for sharing. Run along, now. The grown-ups are talking. If you're not going to bother to ground your thoughts in reality, then your opinions on how we should work toward our best future are moot.

If you can't state a rational reason for your position, then you're not in the conversation. You're on the sidelines with the rest of the rabble, reacting to the whimsy of fake news that appeals to you.

If you want to be taken seriously, you can't behave like an idiot.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Then you admit you're making an irrational argument. Whether or not you say the words, it's what you've done.
Your position boils down to base nationalism. You don't want them illegals here, 'cause they're not from here, so they're bad for here.
If that's the whole of your argument, and there's literally no data or reality to back it up, then ... thanks for sharing. Run along, now. The grown-ups are talking. If you're not going to bother to ground your thoughts in reality, then your opinions on how we should work toward our best future are moot.

If you can't state a rational reason for your position, then you're not in the conversation. You're on the sidelines with the rest of the rabble, reacting to the whimsy of fake news that appeals to you.

If you want to be taken seriously, you can't behave like an idiot.

Oops. Wrong arguement.


I mean. Your position boils down to, I have no idea, so I'll just throw anything out there and stir up some shit.
Still not a rational argument.

[TheSpoonald]

Your position ..... nationalism.

Why's that bad?

no data or reality to back it up

Dey tuk er jobz!!

If you can't state a rational reason for your position, then you're not in the conversation.

I think I told you that your beef with the crime rate thing comes from the fact that the Yale guy *can't* know how many crimes illegals commit. Even though he says he does. He doesn't. I know he's lying because he is saying something that is impossible for him to know. It is literally illegal to collect the data he would need to make that claim. I don't know what else to tell you man. The guy is straight up lying. Or, more likely, he just presumed something erroneous and then confirmation biased himself into believing the data says something it doesn't. Does that ever happen to Ivy League Academics? Hint: Fuck yes it does.

If you want to believe that he somehow knows the citizenship status of people who are arrested just because he says he does, then you go right on believing that. Climate change is real too. Good luck with life.

rabble,

BAN

idiot

BAN

[Jack Sawyer]

This is really an old old talking point. Between oil sands and fracking, North America has enough fossil fuels to last multiple centuries.

Neoconservatism is pretty much over.

Why can't the US use its own oil and not import?

Because we can't drill it as cheaply as Saudi Arabia is willing to supply it.

This changed recently. With new drilling technologies (i.e. fracking), the U.S. has been able to greatly increase it's oil production. However, the cost of these new technologies is a bit high. So, even though the U.S. can almost compete with Saudi Arabia in quantity, it can't compete in cost.

That's what Saudi Arabia is showing the world right now with the current oil glut. The U.S. and Russia have developed new technologies to tap into previously out of reach oil fields. The U.S. with fracking, and Russia able to penetrate the Siberian permafrost.

Both the U.S. and Russia started flooding the market, attempting to export oil. Saudi Arabia got a little mad and crushed demand by oversupplying the market. Oil prices dropped to ridiculous levels and many U.S. and Russian oil fields are in danger of shutting down because neither country can drill for anywhere near the cost that Saudi Arabia is willing to sell their oil for.

It's hard to believe, but there's a secret war going on right now in the world between Russia, Saudi Arabia and the U.S.

Of course, the low gas prices look really good for the government and getting votes right now in the U.S., but it's a red herring. A lot of U.S. oil companies are in real financial danger right now. Most have just strapped in and hope they make it through the storm.

I Agree with Gary Leverich.

Further to add: You must also look at the approach that it is not wise to use the most important natural resource the USA MUST have in this day and age to function. What happens if Saudi Arabia wakes up one day and says, "We will not supply anymore." What if the supply lines get cut-off with war or natural disaster of some sort. Oil is played very politically and played with in part to with the majority of US Citizens affected. I do not think we know how much oil is left in the world. And if we did know, I am sure that it would be really bad for business to let anyone on the other side know how much. Proven reserves are not real reserves. OPEC is not our friend and neither is Saudi Arabia. It is all business and power structures beyond most could conceive. If I had the money and the market it is best to buy something of equal value or less somewhere else and save my goods for last. If it was a commodity everlasting. Oil is going to be pumped till the wells run dry.

I would like to add what is seen at the pump is highway robbery. One gallon of gasoline in Venezuela is $0.08/gallon.