vs a set

I think my biggest leak in the game is playing against a set. I have a hard time recognizing it. I play a relatively LAGgy game, and if I hit 2 pair and villian hits a set, I am often screwed.

Do u guys have any advice on this?
Any hand histories?

-beck

I think this is standard no?

STAGE #785296375: HOLDEM NO LIMIT $4 - 2007-10-09 17:12:52 (ET)
Table: CAMEROON HWY (Real Money) Seat #5 is the dealer
Seat 5 - REALBOOGJR ($154.20 in chips)
Seat 6 - WVUBCS2008 ($369.10 in chips)
Seat 2 - MIFFED22001 ($1161.50 in chips)
Seat 3 - JAPANESEMIND ($960.24 in chips)
Seat 4 - LOLPWNU ($794.30 in chips)
WVUBCS2008 - Posts small blind $2
MIFFED22001 - Posts big blind $4
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to MIFFED22001 [Ks Kc]
JAPANESEMIND - Raises $14 to $14
LOLPWNU - Folds
REALBOOGJR - Folds
WVUBCS2008 - Folds
MIFFED22001 - Raises $40 to $44
JAPANESEMIND - Calls $30
*** FLOP *** [6c 5d 10s]
MIFFED22001 - Bets $70
JAPANESEMIND - Raises $200 to $200
MIFFED22001 - Calls $130
*** TURN *** [6c 5d 10s] [Jh]
MIFFED22001 - Checks
JAPANESEMIND - Bets $270
MIFFED22001 - folds

if they have a set and you have 2 pr you should probably fold, yea, I'd fold and wait for a better spot. I generally like to have the set when they have the 2pr.

Here's a HH from my PT database

I raise AA to $4, BB calls

Flop comes A87
BB bets $7, Hero raises to $25, BB goes all-in, Hero calls

BB shows 87

That's the kind of hand you should be looking for, yea, get more hands like those in your database and you'll be fine.

You're just screwed.

1.Close second-best hands are the biggest money losers in poker.

2. As a LAG, it's your job to understand that players are going to play back at you with crap.

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

if they have a set and you have 2 pr you should probably fold, yea, I'd fold and wait for a better spot. I generally like to have the set when they have the 2pr.

Here's a HH from my PT database

I raise AA to $4, BB calls

Flop comes A87
BB bets $7, Hero raises to $25, BB goes all-in, Hero calls

BB shows 87

That's the kind of hand you should be looking for, yea, get more hands like those in your database and you'll be fine.

your point is good in general, but i think if we have a hidden two pair from CO/button this is a much more difficult spot.
If someone wants to get it all in on AQx rainbow and we have AQ, well yeah, id think you'd have to not outhink yourself and fold.

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

if they have a set and you have 2 pr you should probably fold, yea, I'd fold and wait for a better spot. I generally like to have the set when they have the 2pr.

Here's a HH from my PT database

I raise AA to $4, BB calls

Flop comes A87
BB bets $7, Hero raises to $25, BB goes all-in, Hero calls

BB shows 87

That's the kind of hand you should be looking for, yea, get more hands like those in your database and you'll be fine.

sorry dude, but that is not advice. Translation to what you said. "have better hand then villian and win."

As miffed said, playing lag, villians want to play against you with mediocre holdings, and play em strong. I have often won stacks with 2 pair against TPTK, TPGK, over pair, and so forth. Should I just accept that a set will stack me everytime when I am holding something? I am willing to fold 2 pair or over pair against a very tight player, but the average wacko, it is quite hard. flushes are easy to spot, straights a bit harder but are visible. its that set that screws me more often then not.

beck

BTW this thread just shows what I am often up against when playing lag
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...oker-63668.htm

this is the ebst example i have of my 25/22 game inducing a two pair call all in deep.


STAGE #785113731: HOLDEM NO LIMIT $4 - 2007-10-09 12:46:24 (ET)
Table: CANARY AVE (Real Money) Seat #1 is the dealer
Seat 1 - CHA12ULZ ($183.40 in chips)
Seat 3 - HIOHARGENT ($1000.80 in chips)
Seat 4 - TOTIS2121 ($666.30 in chips)
Seat 5 - MIFFED22001 ($854.50 in chips)
Seat 6 - JOHNNYPOOMS ($177.10 in chips)
HIOHARGENT - Posts small blind $2
TOTIS2121 - Posts big blind $4
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to MIFFED22001 [Jc Js]
MIFFED22001 - Raises $16 to $16
JOHNNYPOOMS - Calls $16
CHA12ULZ - Folds
HIOHARGENT - Folds
TOTIS2121 - Calls $12
*** FLOP *** [Jd 6h 5h]
TOTIS2121 - Checks
MIFFED22001 - Bets $35
JOHNNYPOOMS - Folds
TOTIS2121 - Raises $106 to $106
MIFFED22001 - All-In(Raise) $803.50 to $838.50
TOTIS2121 - All-In $544.30
MIFFED22001 - returned ($188.20) : not called
*** TURN *** [Jd 6h 5h] [10d]
*** RIVER *** [Jd 6h 5h 10d] [9s]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
TOTIS2121 - Shows [5s 6s] (Two Pair, sixes and fives)
MIFFED22001 - Shows [Jc Js] (Three of a kind, jacks)
MIFFED22001 Collects $1347.10 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total Pot($1350.60) | Rake ($3) | Jackpot Rake ($0.50)
Board [Jd 6h 5h 10d 9s]
Seat 1: CHA12ULZ (dealer) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 3: HIOHARGENT (small blind) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 4: TOTIS2121 (big blind) HI:lost with Two Pair, sixes and fives [5s 6s - P:6s,B:6h,P:5s,B:5h,B:Jd]
Seat 5: MIFFED22001 won Total ($1347.10) All-In HI$1347.10) with Three of a kind, jacks [Jc Js - P:Js,B:Jd,P:Jc,B:10d,B:9s]
Seat 6: JOHNNYPOOMS Folded on the FLOP

Originally Posted by Beck

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

if they have a set and you have 2 pr you should probably fold, yea, I'd fold and wait for a better spot. I generally like to have the set when they have the 2pr.

Here's a HH from my PT database

I raise AA to $4, BB calls

Flop comes A87
BB bets $7, Hero raises to $25, BB goes all-in, Hero calls

BB shows 87

That's the kind of hand you should be looking for, yea, get more hands like those in your database and you'll be fine.

sorry dude, but that is not advice.

Meh, it was on par with the level of the original question.

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

Originally Posted by Beck

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

if they have a set and you have 2 pr you should probably fold, yea, I'd fold and wait for a better spot. I generally like to have the set when they have the 2pr.

Here's a HH from my PT database

I raise AA to $4, BB calls

Flop comes A87
BB bets $7, Hero raises to $25, BB goes all-in, Hero calls

BB shows 87

That's the kind of hand you should be looking for, yea, get more hands like those in your database and you'll be fine.

sorry dude, but that is not advice.

Meh, it was on par with the level of the original question.

OK, maybe the question should be a bit clearer. I was hoping for some hands where u fealt u were obviously beat by a set, or visa versa

If ure a high-volume-player felting toppairs vs set is just standard. That is unless ur up against the biggest nits and setminers.

so u r saying that its ok if I felt against a set here and there, it is just inevitable?

I had 2 hands recently where i got a c/b called on flop then c/r on turn. i flopped 2 pair on flop and the other i turned 2 pair. boards where ultra dry like AK2 or xxKQ, i double barrled and got c/r'd (oh by TAGs BTW). now ill think if checking behind turns for river value.

Yes Beck. I think so.

I think its okay, some times loose to a set, but not always, i may think 'way is he calling this high with a pair?' and u can find that the villan must have something or his pocket!

If someone who never bets or calls comes alive post flop, fold anything short of the nuts. Otherwise it's tough to avoid, folding 2 pair to any aggression has to be -EV. Tough breaks, but you'll get your fair share of trips vs 2 pair.

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

I generally like to have the set when they have the 2pr.

I finally found something to quote in my sig

Well, I feel a bit better about it. guess I still need some more experience maybe what I need to do is go through all of my hands where I ended up loosing to a set. I wonder if PT can filter that out for me. never tried.

thanx

i thought bigspenda was funny... but w/e

To the original poster: There's not much you can do when you flop 2pair on a QT7 rainbow board and are still behind, you just have to stick it in and hope for the best.

If ur Villain do no tells, its hard to not be screwed

If ur Villain do no tells, its hard to not be screwed

I was wondering if anyone took me seriously in this thread, appears at least one person did, unfortunately that was the OP.