Trying the "19 hands" method to start -- opinions

First off, I really, really want to thank AOK for all the knowledge he's put into this forum. As a BRAND new player, it's helped me immensely.

Given his teachings, I would love an opinion on this hand...

***** Hand History for Game 3646150807 *****
$5 NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, March 01, 11:25:56 ET 2006
Table Beginners Legato (Real Money)
Seat 9 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: Trevor130471 ( $4.11 )
Seat 4: SS_Camaro_68 ( $2.42 )
Seat 6: morgang111 ( $11.47 )
Seat 7: Skyliner666 ( $5 )
Seat 8: petstoppets ( $4.68 )
Seat 9: NLBaz ( $2.85 )
Seat 3: NoSocksLLC ( $5.24 )
Seat 5: kowal_spi ( $4.69 )
Seat 2: skylersoft ( $5 )
Seat 10: MR_REW ( $5 )
Trevor130471 posts small blind [$0.02].
skylersoft posts big blind [$0.04].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to NoSocksLLC [ Ac Jd ]
NoSocksLLC calls [$0.04].
SS_Camaro_68 folds.
kowal_spi folds.
morgang111 calls [$0.04].
Skyliner666 calls [$0.04].
petstoppets calls [$0.04].
>You have options at Beginners Chancy Table!.
NLBaz calls [$0.04].
Trevor130471 calls [$0.02].
skylersoft checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2s, 7d, 5h ]
Trevor130471 checks.
>You have options at Beginners Chancy Table!.
skylersoft bets [$0.04].
NoSocksLLC raises [$0.16].
morgang111 folds.
Skyliner666 folds.
petstoppets folds.
NLBaz calls [$0.16].
Trevor130471 folds.
skylersoft calls [$0.12].
** Dealing Turn ** [ Qs ]
skylersoft checks.
NoSocksLLC checks.
NLBaz bets [$1.08].
skylersoft calls [$1.08].
NoSocksLLC folds.
** Dealing River ** [ Tc ]
skylersoft bets [$0.04].
NLBaz is all-In [$1.57]
skylersoft folds.
NLBaz does not show cards.
NLBaz wins $4.38

Thanks to everyone. Hope you have a great day playing!

Best,
EW

On the heels of a hand I wasn't really sure if I played right...I had this one. AOK, I really have to thank you on this -- because, for me, it was my favorite poker hand so far. Why? I knew I was in control, and playing cards that, as far as I could tell were the best. Agreed?

***** Hand History for Game 3646174978 *****
$5 NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, March 01, 11:34:16 ET 2006
Table Beginners Legato (Real Money)
Seat 7 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 4: SS_Camaro_68 ( $2.36 )
Seat 6: morgang111 ( $11.33 )
Seat 7: Skyliner666 ( $4.02 )
Seat 8: petstoppets ( $4.52 )
Seat 9: NLBaz ( $3.41 )
Seat 3: NoSocksLLC ( $4.98 )
Seat 5: kowal_spi ( $6.90 )
Seat 10: MR_REW ( $5.92 )
Seat 2: kbanger ( $4.23 )
Seat 1: Duke_71ger ( $5 )
petstoppets posts small blind [$0.02].
NLBaz posts big blind [$0.04].
Duke_71ger posts big blind [$0.04].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to NoSocksLLC [ Ks Jc ]
MR_REW calls [$0.04].
Duke_71ger checks.
kbanger calls [$0.04].
NoSocksLLC calls [$0.04].
SS_Camaro_68 folds.
kowal_spi folds.
morgang111 folds.
Skyliner666 calls [$0.04].
petstoppets calls [$0.02].
NLBaz checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 9d, 6s, Jd ]
petstoppets checks.
>You have options at Beginners Smile Table!.
NLBaz checks.
MR_REW checks.
Duke_71ger checks.
kbanger checks.
NoSocksLLC bets [$0.15].
Skyliner666 folds.
petstoppets calls [$0.15].
NLBaz folds.
MR_REW folds.
Duke_71ger calls [$0.15].
kbanger calls [$0.15].
** Dealing Turn ** [ Js ]
petstoppets checks.
Duke_71ger checks.
kbanger checks.
NoSocksLLC bets [$0.40].
petstoppets calls [$0.40].
Duke_71ger calls [$0.40].
kbanger folds.
** Dealing River ** [ 4h ]
petstoppets checks.
Duke_71ger checks.
NoSocksLLC bets [$1].
petstoppets folds.
Duke_71ger folds.
NoSocksLLC does not show cards.
NoSocksLLC wins $2.98

Thanks again.

Best,
EW

Hand 1 is horrible.

You have no hand, the pot is tiny, you have no story and you are up against calling stations. If you want to take a pop at these then raise preflop. If you dont know what i mean by having a story i mean that you have shown no strength before the flop, then you suddenly come out and say you are strong after the flop when you actually have nothing.

Hand 2

If you want to limp and see a flop then limp. If you want to raise (presumably to knock people out) then raise a meaningful amount. At these stakes thats probably going to be around 10c - 12c.

Postflop is fine. You had a hand, they didnt, they folded.

My suggestion for KJ is to fold in early position, limp in late position (when there arent many people left to act who could raise) and only continue if you hit a K or J or straight draw on the flop.


edit: also consider using the hand history converter. It hurts my eyes less

Originally Posted by Pelion

Hand 1 is horrible.

You have no hand, the pot is tiny, you have no story and you are up against calling stations. If you want to take a pop at these then raise preflop. If you dont know what i mean by having a story i mean that you have shown no strength before the flop, then you suddenly come out and say you are strong after the flop when you actually have nothing.

Hand 2

If you want to limp and see a flop then limp. If you want to raise (presumably to knock people out) then raise a meaningful amount. At these stakes thats probably going to be around 10c - 12c.

Postflop is fine. You had a hand, they didnt, they folded.

My suggestion for KJ is to fold in early position, limp in late position (when there arent many people left to act who could raise) and only continue if you hit a K or J or straight draw on the flop.


edit: also consider using the hand history converter. It hurts my eyes less

if he's playing by aok's rec these are both limpers.
hand 1, the very idea is to rep random 2pair or set, thereby stealing. doesn't work here, so turn is an easy checkfold.
hand 2, standard

aok's stuff is about making your decisions easier. you can bet confidently with KJ when you pair up and the pot's unraised.

Originally Posted by LeFou

if he's playing by aok's rec these are both limpers.

I know but he isnt playing them like that.

Hand 1 he limped then bet the flop after he missed. He should have just check/folded the flo. All I was saying is that if you want to have a chance of making them fold postflop you need to raise preflop.

Hand 2 I misread and thought he minraised preflop (dunno where i got that???). So hand 2 is fine since the only thing I critisised was the imaginary minraise preflop.

On the contrary, i think obvious c-bets are more likely to get called than these random donkbets.

Originally Posted by LeFou

On the contrary, i think obvious c-bets are more likely to get called than these random donkbets.

Not at these stakes. People at these stakes dont really know what a cbet is. They see you raise and think you are strong but they dont want to fold before theyve seen if theyll hit 2 pair on the flop.

The most important thing about the preflop raise in this case though is that it cuts down the field so that you only need 1 or 2 people to have missed their 2 pair on the flop to take it down

In hand 1, hero limped and then bet into 6 opponents (many of whom are likely to be calling stations and 1 of whom has already bet out himself). There is virtually no chance 5 people have totally missed the flop, and if theyve hit even a little bit they will probably call.

If he had raised instead, he would be up against fewer opponents, there would be less of a chance someone has hit something, and he would have shown some preflop strength to back up his bet.

Overall though I think the best play is probably the preflop limp followed check/fold the unimproved flop.

i think you would be better off folding AJo under the gun.

No way. AJo does great at low limits because you will be called by A2. I will play AJ in any position but I will fold it to a raise.

hand 1 is a shitbag. limp it and drop it. Everyone is right there.

Hand 2 was correct. How much to bet on each street is where you start maximizing your profits. But we're talking basic 19 hand strategy here.

The Ace Jack hand I wanted to say, "don't mention my name with this hand" lol. I don't teach to try to bluff a table full of calling stations on the flop with no hand and no legit draw. But I'm laughing because I like the fact that you posted it. You just did it in the wrong area. But we'll give you a break since you're new. lol

Keep it up.

I don't think the flop bluff is "the right play" by any means. Purely a mixup. The flop sucks, a guy minbets into a big field -- I feel like he's just begging for a reason to fold.

I've got a question about this method. I'm a newbie and I'm giving this a try for a couple weeks. One question is about the buy-in. I play .05/.10 tables right now and I started with the minimum buy-in of $4. It sounds like this strategy is to fold a lot of minor hands and capitalize on the big hands. So I would assume I should buy-in at the max. $10 for leverage when I get a good hand?

yes.
and if you lose 20% even, you top off. you need to be able to double up when the hand comes.

never play NL unless you are willing to buyin for a full amount. People who buyin short are: pick one or two
1. scared they going to lose
2. playing outside their bankroll
3. restricting thier potential winnings
4. unable to protect a strong hand with continuous pot sized bets