Quote Originally Posted by benny999
I think raising is better - if you cbet/bluff less, use pot control and overall have a big post flop edge, then you get more value starting off with an 8-12bb pot vs. a 3bb pot.

and you get added benefits of possibly tilting them and picking up more small pots too. you're also probably ahead of their calling ranges pre flop anyway.
agreed.
How would these players react to me say limping from the button with AT when they have A3o for example and i get them to play a fair sized pot over 3 streets to the river in comparison to me opening from the button and them *maybe* mucking preflop but sometime calling and c/c c/f'ing when i show strength over two streets.
Is their more value to be gained from allowing them to think they can bet the best hand with a trash kicker because they play too much, or just hoping they may go to far in raised pots (fwiw, a 200nl fishmight take A7o to showdown in a unraised pot but probably wont in a raised pot)

In other words, because they suck horribly, does preflop raising give them an excuse to fold the worse hands they defend with and means i gain more from constant raising and stealing without flops and/or showdowns when i show two streets of strength?