PSA: Huge rant - read or get banned

<ANON> fuck sake 6BI below EV today , 3 yesterday when this shit is going to end

<m2mbrb> what the fuck are you donig looking at ev

<kiwiMark> prolly when you stop looking at itttt

<ANON> to see how am really playing

<kiwiMark> post hands
<kiwiMark> to see how are really playing

<m2mbrb> lol wtf???
<m2mbrb> all in ev
<m2mbrb> HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HOW YOU ARE PLAYING

<ANON> better to see EV than actual winnings at least isnt it

<m2mbrb> lol no?

<ANON> hows that

<kiwiMark> prolly not, but you raise a good point
<kiwiMark> the fuck are you doing looking at any garfs daily? :P

<m2mbrb> explain to me the benfits of looking at aiev
<m2mbrb> go
<m2mbrb> thats right
<m2mbrb> you cant even come up with a single reason
<m2mbrb> delete aiev from your tracking program and start focusing on getting better at poker

<ANON> cuz you see what you expect to win in the long run more accurately

<CBATafk> look @ ur graph everyday for fun imo

<m2mbrb> no you dont?

<muzz> aiev is for gays
<CBATafk> but if it affects your play

<m2mbrb> aiev doesnt accuont for pots you win without sd

<CBATafk> which 99.9% of the time it does

<kiwiMark> 1. no 2. in what kinda depressing universe are you gonna be playing exactly the same as you are now for long enough for the long run to come about?

<CBATafk> then dont look at it

<m2mbrb> or calling off your stack
<m2mbrb> etc
<m2mbrb> it has nothing to do with how well you play
<m2mbrb> what your 'aiev' says you 'should' be winning is not an indication of how much you 'should' be winning
<m2mbrb> you are not winning as much as you could because you suck
<m2mbrb> not because you are cursed with run bad

<ANON> dont think so, it only reflects all in, not the whole thing
<ANON> but that doesnt mean that has no value
<ANON> its better than actual winnings

<luck> better for what?

<m2mbrb> LOL
<m2mbrb> WHAT
<m2mbrb> FUCKING VALUE

<ANON> i mean more precise on your play

<m2mbrb> DOES AIEV HAVE?
<m2mbrb> ALL IT DOES
<m2mbrb> IS MAKE YOU BITCH
<m2mbrb> AND GET DEPRESSD
<m2mbrb> ABOUT HOW YOU COULD BE UP MORE
<m2mbrb> THAN WHAT YOU ARE
<m2mbrb> EXPLAIN TO ME THE BENEFIT THIS HAS ON YOUR POKER GAME

<muzz> eiev if for bitches who dont win

<m2mbrb> ^ THISSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
<m2mbrb> NOW STFU AND START WORKING ON YOUR GAME

<luck> didn't agree with m2m for long time, but for me it just makes me tilt. and gives nothing back cause analyzing ur hands is far more +ev than see oh if i didn't run bad i would be up x

<m2mbrb> NEVER EVER SAY THE WORDS 'AIEV' IN THIS CHAT EVER AGAIN
<m2mbrb> NEVER POST A GRAPH THAT SHOWS YOUR EV

<yaawn> sup

<m2mbrb> EVER
<m2mbrb> EVER
<m2mbrb> EVER




It's time to get past AIEV and start getting better.

I swear to god I will see to it that the next person to EVER mention AIEV anywhere outside the tilt forum will indeed be BANNED.

Now go forth and get better at poker

agree. AIEV has no possible way to increase our EV over our opponents at a poker table. and it has some possible obvious ways to decrease it. on the whole, sounds -EV to me. good post.

Holy shit we've created a monster....

lmao

win

with all the fucking win graffs from 2p2 u want to ban aiev. diagf sir diagf

that graph is the best thing i have ever seen on the internet. and what is diagf

Die in a grease fire. I had to look it up one day.

Most of the OP could have been talking about the winnings column or any graph in general.

the problem with aiev graphs, imo, is that placing any importance on them creates a mindset that we should work on getting it all-in good more often, when we should clearly be getting it in bad sometimes, too.

Oh, and sucking at this game it took me awhile to figure out what the aiev gragh was. Once I figured it out I couldn't firgure out what use it could be, so I stopped looking at it.

Originally Posted by spoonitnow

Most of the OP could have been talking about the winnings column or any graph in general.

agree, though we need to start somewhere.

and one could argue that just a regular graph is an okay indicator of where your bankroll is at or whatever.

but cutting the winnings column out of your tracker program is really awesome, especially if you get rid of your hourly rate column too.

Relevant 2p2 post: aiev is a horrible measure of luck

also ty m2m did not know that you could cut out winnings column. This works on holdem manager I'm assuming?

Originally Posted by supahaole

Die in a grease fire. I had to look it up one day.

dats funny never heard it myself either!

Thats fucked up if you really do ban someone for bitching about aiev

lol aiev.

let's say, there's a session where you get AAvKK AIPF 10 times in a week. all ten times, you have AA. three of those ten times, the KK sucks out on you. you are running below AIEV. you're still running good 'cause you're positive in AIPF AAvKK situations, which is essentially b/e 100bb's deep.

let's say there are 5 spots in a month where you get middle set all in on the flop 250bbs deep against a nit whose range is {sets}. all five of those times the nit just happens to have bottom set even though it's a complete 50/50 whether he has the better set or the worster set. he sucks out on you one of these times and catches quads. you're running -AIEV, but you are running really really relaly hot 'cause this is a breakeven spot in the long run.

let's say in a week you catch your nut flush on the river and get all the money in on the river 10/10 times you have a NFD on the turn. you are running absurdly hot, but you're b/e AIEV.

let's say you catch two pair on the river before stacks get in, etc etc etc etc.

aiev measures really specific, not at all relevant bullshit. also spots where you get all in before the river is like once every 300 hands or something, so even a sample size of like 100k hands is a really small sample size for aiev.

etc etc etc. aiev is bullshit

nice post

About as much value in this thread as there is in AIEV.

Zing?

Originally Posted by oskar

About as much value in this thread as there is in AIEV.

right....

you are a moron.

Originally Posted by Micro2Macro

<m2mbrb> NEVER EVER SAY THE WORDS 'AIEV' IN THIS CHAT EVER AGAIN
<m2mbrb> NEVER POST A GRAPH THAT SHOWS YOUR EV
...
I swear to god I will see to it that the next person to EVER mention AIEV anywhere outside the tilt forum will indeed be BANNED.

i would love to watch m2m explode as he clicks this link

go on, you know you want to

highlight below after clicking
actually, i'm guessing he'd just laugh - that's my intent anyway

That was about trying to figure out some leaks, not AIEV. I am up a huge ton of EV at 99BB and under, check that graph. I was working on my big pot game and spent quite a bit of time on MSN with a couple people discussing it. Not the same thing. It's also 8 months of continuos AIEV decline. Gotta admit, that's brutal though, 30% at showdown in 96BB+ pots

Originally Posted by jyms

Gotta admit, that's brutal though, 30% at showdown in 96BB+ pots

agree absolutely, no offence intended obviously! now ffs run better in big pots for a while, ok?!

Those things actually aren't accurate anyway. I can't think of any good examples but I remember a hand where I was thinking hmmm aiev graph will be fucked up cause of this. Like a 3 way pot where a shortstack goes AI before or on flop and 2 ppl stack later exc.

U SHOULDN'T BE ALL IN ANYWAYS!

now who has the nicest rack in poker? much more intresting thread