playing many tourneys, good for beginners?

Hi, I enter plenty of freeroll tourneys on ub.com and I do well. I got a few top 100 out of like 2k of people but I tend to f' up later on. I'm still learning the game like raising and when to go all in. For example I had one hand where I had a,10 suited and it ws me and one guy. He went all IN and I followed. He came out KA unsuited but I lost to that K kicker cause no hearts came out. Was i wrong? Any suggestions would be helpful. Getting better but still very green!

Hey Chan, welcome. I have never played a freeroll myself. I think they are like playing the lottery because there are just too many people. Also, unlike the lottery, you will not see a good return for your time even if you win. However, it is a great place to get your feet wet and play a lot of hands with no risk to your bankroll. In fact, that is the whole point for those sites hosting them is to suck you in.

From what I have heard and can assume given the structure of a freeroll is that it is nothing like a single table tournament which begins with only 10 players. So, although it is good practice to see a lot of hands and read a lot of boards, there is not a lot of practical experience for a SNG. Most importantly, you get no short-handed ie. 5 or less players nor heads up experience which is essential for success in tournaments.

When I started, I played for "play money" in cash games for several months. I played as if it were real. I also read some books. Then I jumped right into cash games and later real money tournaments. I would recommend that if you want to play for real money in tournaments you go to the play money tournaments and play for a while. It will better prepare you for the structure of a usual tournament when compared to a freeroll.

With that said, I will give you the usual warning that play money is a lot different that real money both in the way you and your opponents play. I learned how to play tournaments with real money. Fortunately for me, it was a very steep learning curve and I did well right from the start probably because I had practiced for months and did a little research. If you feel like taking the short cut, jump right in but make sure you have a very solid bankroll to absorb that initial loss as you adjust to the game and start at the lowest stakes you can find.

Finally, since you have been playing freerolls with mass amounts of people, you may be tempted to take a shot at multi-table tournaments. I would suggest that you avoid them until you become profitable at cash games and smaller tournaments.

Good luck! Bet with your head, not over it.

thanks.. yeah well i've been doing some money games I got 2nd in one SNG tourney (33+1.5, won 90). What sucks with play money is people aren't true. They dont' care what they got they just bet until the river. Thanks for the write up. I'll do that.with massive amounts of reading from this site.

Originally Posted by chanman83

thanks.. yeah well i've been doing some money games I got 2nd in one SNG tourney (33+1.5, won 90). What sucks with play money is people aren't true. They dont' care what they got they just bet until the river. Thanks for the write up. I'll do that.with massive amounts of reading from this site.

Here is something I saw in a play money SnG at Party Poker.

1st hand. 6 people go all in pre-flop. Mostly high cards (AT, KQ etc,) and pocket pairs. 1 guy shows a 46o and pulls out 2 pair for the win. Moron?

2nd hand 4 people go all in pre-flop. Mr 46o shows a 93s and again pulls out a pair of 9s for the win.

3rd hand. There are 2 people left. He has 7,200 in chips and I have 800 in chips. I play pretty tight. I know this guy will go all-in on anything. I wait for made hands and attack when I can. I lasted 6 hands before he took me out with an A4o that he caught his A high flush.

I don't think I have played play money since. You can talk all day and night about maniacs, but you will never see worse play than you do at a play money game. Once I finally put some real money into poker, I have never even considered going back.

I entered a 6 man 20 + 2 tourney.. I played it very tight at the beginning and let the other guys kill themselves.. here are some hands please pick apart this beginner's luck


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Hand #2019123-32 at SnG-0022f (No Limit Hold'em Sit and Go)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 09/Jul/04 01:26:33

kiwi thunder is at seat 0 with 1735.
ozdoc is at seat 2 with 1540.
chanman83 is at seat 3 with 1600.
Jumper20 is at seat 5 with 1125.
The button is at seat 0.

ozdoc posts the small blind of 15.
chanman83 posts the big blind of 30.

kiwi thunder: -- --
ozdoc: -- --
chanman83: Kc 2c
Jumper20: -- --

Pre-flop:

Jumper20 raises to 60. kiwi thunder folds. ozdoc
calls. chanman83 calls.

Flop (board: 7d 4c 8c):

ozdoc checks. chanman83 bets 30. Jumper20 calls.
ozdoc calls.

Turn (board: 7d 4c 8c 9h):

ozdoc checks. chanman83 bets 270. Jumper20 calls.
ozdoc folds.

River (board: 7d 4c 8c 9h 5h):

chanman83 checks. Jumper20 goes all-in for 765.
chanman83 folds. Jumper20 is returned 765 (uncalled).


Jumper20 opts to show Qc Ts.
Jumper20 has Qc Ts 7d 8c 9h: queen high.

I got caught here. I checked on the river and got F'ed I knew it!

Hand #2019123-32 Summary:

No rake is taken for this hand.
Jumper20 wins 810.


Getting Hand History Information...
----------------------------------------------------------------

Hand #2019123-36 at SnG-0022f (No Limit Hold'em Sit and Go)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 09/Jul/04 01:29:45

kiwi thunder is at seat 0 with 1675.
ozdoc is at seat 2 with 1310.
chanman83 is at seat 3 with 1360.
Jumper20 is at seat 5 with 1655.
The button is at seat 0.

ozdoc posts the small blind of 20.
chanman83 posts the big blind of 40.

kiwi thunder: -- --
ozdoc: -- --
chanman83: Ah As
Jumper20: -- --

Pre-flop:

Jumper20 raises to 140. kiwi thunder folds. ozdoc
folds. chanman83 re-raises to 240. Jumper20 goes
all-in for 1655. chanman83 goes all-in for 1360.
Jumper20 is returned 295 (uncalled).

Tournament all-in showdown -- players show:

chanman83 shows Ah As.
Jumper20 shows Qh Qs.


Flop (board: 8c 7s 4d):

(no action in this round)


Turn (board: 8c 7s 4d 4s):

(no action in this round)


River (board: 8c 7s 4d 4s 6h):

(no action in this round)




Showdown:

chanman83 has Ah As 8c 4d 4s: two pair, aces and fours.
Jumper20 has Qh Qs 8c 4d 4s: two pair, queens and fours.


Hand #2019123-36 Summary:

No rake is taken for this hand.
chanman83 wins 2740 with two pair, aces and fours.

this guy was a total A hole! He got cocky so He got what he deserved!

Getting Hand History Information...
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Hand #2019123-76 at SnG-0022f (No Limit Hold'em Sit and Go)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 09/Jul/04 01:45:35

kiwi thunder is at seat 0 with 670.
ozdoc is at seat 2 with 2390.
chanman83 is at seat 3 with 2940.
The button is at seat 0.

ozdoc posts the small blind of 50.
chanman83 posts the big blind of 100.

kiwi thunder: -- --
ozdoc: -- --
chanman83: 4h 3h

Pre-flop:

kiwi thunder folds. ozdoc calls. chanman83 checks.


Flop (board: Qs 2c 3s):

ozdoc bets 200. chanman83 calls.

Turn (board: Qs 2c 3s 4c):

ozdoc bets 600. chanman83 raises to 1200. ozdoc
calls.

River (board: Qs 2c 3s 4c 4s):

ozdoc checks. chanman83 goes all-in for 1440. ozdoc
goes all-in for 890. chanman83 is returned 550
(uncalled).

Tournament all-in showdown -- players show:

ozdoc shows Qh Jc.
chanman83 shows 4h 3h.




Showdown:

ozdoc has Qh Jc Qs 4c 4s: two pair, queens and fours.
chanman83 has 4h 3h 3s 4c 4s: full house, fours full of threes.


Hand #2019123-76 Summary:

No rake is taken for this hand.
chanman83 wins 4780 with full house, fours full of threes.

Getting Hand History Information...
----------------------------------------------------------------

Hand #2019123-76 at SnG-0022f (No Limit Hold'em Sit and Go)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 09/Jul/04 01:45:35

kiwi thunder is at seat 0 with 670.
ozdoc is at seat 2 with 2390.
chanman83 is at seat 3 with 2940.
The button is at seat 0.

ozdoc posts the small blind of 50.
chanman83 posts the big blind of 100.

kiwi thunder: -- --
ozdoc: -- --
chanman83: 4h 3h

Pre-flop:

kiwi thunder folds. ozdoc calls. chanman83 checks.


Flop (board: Qs 2c 3s):

ozdoc bets 200. chanman83 calls.

Turn (board: Qs 2c 3s 4c):

ozdoc bets 600. chanman83 raises to 1200. ozdoc
calls.

River (board: Qs 2c 3s 4c 4s):

ozdoc checks. chanman83 goes all-in for 1440. ozdoc
goes all-in for 890. chanman83 is returned 550
(uncalled).

Tournament all-in showdown -- players show:

ozdoc shows Qh Jc.
chanman83 shows 4h 3h.




Showdown:

ozdoc has Qh Jc Qs 4c 4s: two pair, queens and fours.
chanman83 has 4h 3h 3s 4c 4s: full house, fours full of threes.


Hand #2019123-76 Summary:

No rake is taken for this hand.
chanman83 wins 4780 with full house, fours full of threes.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Getting Hand History Information...
----------------------------------------------------------------

Hand #2019123-82 at SnG-0022f (No Limit Hold'em Sit and Go)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 09/Jul/04 01:47:36

kiwi thunder is at seat 0 with 1140.
chanman83 is at seat 3 with 4860.
The button is at seat 0.

kiwi thunder posts the small blind of 50.
chanman83 posts the big blind of 100.

kiwi thunder: -- --
chanman83: Ad Qh

Pre-flop:

kiwi thunder calls. chanman83 raises to 200. kiwi
thunder calls.

Flop (board: 5h Ac Td):

chanman83 bets 400. kiwi thunder calls.

Turn (board: 5h Ac Td Jd):

chanman83 bets 540. kiwi thunder goes all-in for 540.


Tournament all-in showdown -- players show:

kiwi thunder shows Qd Jh.
chanman83 shows Ad Qh.


River (board: 5h Ac Td Jd 8h):

(no action in this round)



Showdown:

kiwi thunder has Qd Jh Ac Td Jd: a pair of jacks.
chanman83 has Ad Qh Ac Td Jd: a pair of aces.


Hand #2019123-82 Summary:

No rake is taken for this hand.
chanman83 wins 2280 with a pair of aces

That it.. $100 in acct -22 for buy in. 1st place = $84 (+62 profit)

In the first hand (unless the history has messed up) you never had a flush, the bet on the flop was fine with a 4 flush but i don't understand the 270 on the turn, unless you're bluffing a straight, then on the river the other guy almost certainly has a straight so there's no way you can call as any pair or ace beats you.

2nd hand is fine, if you can get heads up against a lower pocket pair you're a 4.5:1 favourite or something like that.

3rd hand, i don't think i'd have called the flop bet of 200 but once you catch the 4 you're in pretty good shape, and its unlikely you're holding 4,3 as its such a crap hand. The last 4 is just icing on the cake.

The last hand the other guy probably shouldn't have called an all in with 2nd pair, in fact he should have folded after the flop as you don't really want to be chasing when its going to cost you your whole stack and you've only got 4 outs for the straight.

If you want lots of cheap SNG action check out vcpoker.com, they have SNG's starting at 4c buy in, i started there and have turned a $0 initial stake into $20 and it's steadily increasing, all at zero risk to my bank balance.

I understand that there are idiots but there are also plenty of people who are also trying to learn the game without losing any real money. When I taught my wife how to play a few months ago we started with play money on PP. Some tournaments were as described above. Others were full of very nice and solid players.

Also, I played only limit when I learned. They didn't have NL play money tables, nor did they have many NL real money for that matter.

Originally Posted by Legendash

In the first hand (unless the history has messed up) you never had a flush, the bet on the flop was fine with a 4 flush but i don't understand the 270 on the turn, unless you're bluffing a straight, then on the river the other guy almost certainly has a straight so there's no way you can call as any pair or ace beats you.
.

I was bluffing until I messed up the check call! Thanks for your insight! as I'm still learning! That one I got the full house 4's the guy was very inconsistant on his better so I used that to call to see IF he really had something.. again thanks for the tips and I'll keep at it!

Pretty straight forward. You got real lucky on that 3/4H big blind special though. Maybe I'm just a tightwad, but 200 for a pair of 3's with a face card on board is too much against an even stacked opponent. It just happened to work out for you.

Wow.. I won another sng but it makes up for the 2 i lost earlier this morning.. I won a 10 + 1.50 today and I was down in the hole too.. Sorry I lost the hands but I got lucky twice and then got him all in on a nut flush I had!

It was a 10 players and I pocketed $50 bucks so today i'm +13 for the day..

well played two more and in one i got beat by a lucky river card!
but rebounded and took care of business with a one on one in a 5+.50 winner take call for 10 bucks! I have the hand histories but its pretty long.. wow I come here to learn and I've been doing well! thank guys.. .well actually I beat the guy one on one in 9 hands but eh.. not like you pros!

I'm a relatively newer player, so I happen to like freerolls. I play on dynamitepoker, and the free rolls are usually only 90 - 140 people deep. It's a nice mix ranging from maniacs to sharks.

The prize pool isn't really worth a lot, but it's free money, and free practice, so I'll usually play them. I'm a pretty regular final table player when I get the chance to play on there. The fish that the word free brings out is fun to watch, if nothing else.

Yeah, just a comment about the beginning of this thread. Freerolls are WAY closer to regular money poker in terms of play than play money is. Play money is usually absolutely ridiculous (all in with junk hands preflop type of thing), while freerolls have a lot of fish, but the people typically try at least. But in both, you're likely to get a lot more chasing, calls on weak hands, etc.