Ok - What's needed?

Final post before bedtime. 3:47am - sheesh!

What's needed - add ons/software to make me better, to highlight flaws and leaks in my game?

I hear terms like Pahud and PokerTracker and from what I've heard these are just stat machines. When I play on the ipoker network, stats are provided for post/pre flop play, flops seen, % win rate at each stage as well as complete hand history for all the games.

It also seems to work your odds/outs but I do this myself (and have a poker calculator if needed) so I am not sure how useful it would be.

A bit of blurb about it says you can track how many times you played UTG or how many full houses you had. I can't see how this is helpful - but I am new so I am probably wrong.

I also checked my stats on Sharkscope and they didn't help much. It ust charted my success rate. Eg: When I was on a downswing, it illustrated this, but didn't tell me anything I didn't alreadyknow.

Anyway, over to you for some sound advice. I am wary of extra software as I remember Calculatem Pro being hailed as essential and I hardly ever use it.


Cheers.

Everyone here uses PokerTracker. It isn't for just one session it'll track all your sessions. With it we can look at your stats and tell you what you may or may not be doing wrong. Download the trial version, you get 1K hands. Play and then ask how to post them. We will tell you what is needed and then you can decide if you want it. This is the only program you will need until you stop playing poker online, and the Hud.

ps. I have over 200,000 hands in mine that I can use to look at mine and other peoples stats. Thats right other players stats too. Some guys here will have 100K hands on their opponents stats, now that is invaluable. How would you like to look at the biggest winner in your level and see his stats? how he plays UTG and what he does post flop?

Advice. Go to the pokertracker website. Download the trial for free. Log your free 1000 hands. Figure out that you want it. Buy it.

Assuming you're playing NLHE, I recommend not getting PokerTracker until you're playing 25nl or 50nl. PAHUD overlays the PT stats on your table, but there's free programs to do this also, like GameTime+. You might also want to check out some AHK scripts (AutoHotKey, a Windows macro program) for things like betting the pot with mouse keys, auto-opening tables, auto-reloading, etc., and AHK scripts are free.

I think I remember seeing from one of your other posts that you play SNGs - if you want to play SNGs seriously, then SNG Wiz or SNGPT (I probably pick Wiz since it has a bit more functionality) is a must.

The other thing about Pokertracker is that you need it for the heads-up display software (Gametime+ or PAHUD) that can display opps' stats on the table as you play.

Once again guys, thx for the advice.

I've been checking out the software and getting overwhelmed! Not only with all the screenshots but each page contains a link to another "must have" tool and I have about 20 windows open, lol!

And this is on top of trying to watch the vids/read the essays/check out the other forums areas!

Taipan, some questions about SNGWiz.

1) I don't mean to sound cynical but it sounds too good to be true and is written in a style very similar to the Calculatem Pro pitch: "figures the odds, makes you a better player, advises you on correct play, earn $$$$". Yet it didn't. The "play" it suggests was based on your cards and not at all with the situation - and as we all know, poker is a game of situations. On top of this, the advice certainly wasn't aggressive orientated but cautious in nature. Anyone who follows it's advice will miss vital opportunities to steal the blinds, squeeze players and bluff. The only aspect I could trust was it's odds calculations but I can do this myself.

So, bearing this in mind, how good/essential is SNGWiz?


2) The blurb says: "you will learn when to push and when to fold" but again, poker is situational and depends on the players at the table & their stacks as much as their M. I'm currently of the belief that you can't bottle this in some programmable formula but can only be based after many hands and experience. We can all read books for poker play but they will always be generic in nature as they aren't sat at your table with your players. Therefore I am wary of any software as it has to miss out the human aspect.


3) I also want to get better and know I am getting better. That's why I learnt odds and outs as I wanted to understand why it's right to make a certain play rather than just do it because the software told me to. Again, will SNGWiz help in this respect?


4) The quiz looks like it could be useful but as stated, there is a big difference between what is the correct play in theory, based on percentages etc, and what is the correct play against real people. Eg: If I am on the bubble and play is tightening up, it can be correct to make a move with Q4os and pick up the blinds. If an opponent is making all in moves to stay alive, then it won't be. Either way, mathematically, in theory, making a move with Q4os is a no no and it is doubtful any quiz would sanction such play - even though it can work. Like all bluffs.


5) And is it just limited to SNGs or can aspects of the knowledge given be transferred to cash play?


6) Going back to doing it yourself. As I am new, I don't know how good you are Taipan, but in using SNGWiz, will you get to a level where you don't need it anymore? After all, you can't take it into the WSOP and my aim is to be able to play on my own, like all good players, and not be reliant on 3rd party applications. Don't get me wrong, I will always use tools in an online setting, but I'd like to become good enough where I can handle myself - and know I am good - rather than only winning because something else is pulling the strings.

I wanna understand and be a good player - not a puppet. I want to be good enough where tools supplement and aid me, rather than be the sole reason I have any success.


7) Last of all, how has it affected and improved your game Taipan, and your winnings?

One thing to note, SNG Wiz is no use unless you're playing 1-table SNGs. It's not applicable for cash games or MTTs.

Originally Posted by Thunder

1) I don't mean to sound cynical but it sounds too good to be true and is written in a style very similar to the Calculatem Pro pitch: "figures the odds, makes you a better player, advises you on correct play, earn $$$$". Yet it didn't. The "play" it suggests was based on your cards and not at all with the situation - and as we all know, poker is a game of situations. On top of this, the advice certainly wasn't aggressive orientated but cautious in nature. Anyone who follows it's advice will miss vital opportunities to steal the blinds, squeeze players and bluff. The only aspect I could trust was it's odds calculations but I can do this myself.

One thing that's key with any of these tools - you incorporate the reads that you have on your opps by altering the ranges in the program. It's a case of garbage in = garbage out. I don't necessarily agree with what you're saying that following its advice will cause you to miss opportunities to bluff - the "standard" <10x BB shove when folded to in the SB is exactly a bluff, no?

As I said, I think SNG Wiz is essential if you are serious about playing 1-table SNGs. SNGs are very different to cash games and MTTs because they are very short stacked games. 70-80% of your EV at SNGs (maybe a bit less at normals rather than turbos) comes from knowing how to push/fold in the late game.

Originally Posted by Thunder

2) The blurb says: "you will learn when to push and when to fold" but again, poker is situational and depends on the players at the table & their stacks as much as their M. I'm currently of the belief that you can't bottle this in some programmable formula but can only be based after many hands and experience. We can all read books for poker play but they will always be generic in nature as they aren't sat at your table with your players. Therefore I am wary of any software as it has to miss out the human aspect.

As I said above, you incorporate your reads on the table by adjusting the calling or raising ranges in the program. They can make a HUGE difference to the results.

Originally Posted by Thunder

3) I also want to get better and know I am getting better. That's why I learnt odds and outs as I wanted to understand why it's right to make a certain play rather than just do it because the software told me to. Again, will SNGWiz help in this respect?

Yes! All the calculations are set out in detail and you can play with the variables (stack sizes, blinds, cards, calling/raising ranges) and learn how to make the plays on your own.

Originally Posted by Thunder

4) The quiz looks like it could be useful but as stated, there is a big difference between what is the correct play in theory, based on percentages etc, and what is the correct play against real people. Eg: If I am on the bubble and play is tightening up, it can be correct to make a move with Q4os and pick up the blinds. If an opponent is making all in moves to stay alive, then it won't be. Either way, mathematically, in theory, making a move with Q4os is a no no and it is doubtful any quiz would sanction such play - even though it can work. Like all bluffs.

As I said, you would adjust the calling ranges which would then cause Wiz to say that the move is -EV or +EV.

Originally Posted by Thunder

5) And is it just limited to SNGs or can aspects of the knowledge given be transferred to cash play?

SNG Wiz is no use unless you're playing 1-table SNGs. It's not applicable for cash games or MTTs.

Originally Posted by Thunder

6) Going back to doing it yourself. As I am new, I don't know how good you are Taipan, but in using SNGWiz, will you get to a level where you don't need it anymore? After all, you can't take it into the WSOP and my aim is to be able to play on my own, like all good players, and not be reliant on 3rd party applications. Don't get me wrong, I will always use tools in an online setting, but I'd like to become good enough where I can handle myself - and know I am good - rather than only winning because something else is pulling the strings.

You can't use Wiz real time. You use it to review a game after you've played it to see whether you played right or wrong. So to this extent it does build your knowledge base. I still use Wiz (actually SNGPT) on decisions which I think are close to see whether I was right or wrong, but I am aware of most of the obvious situations after 1,300 SNGs.

Originally Posted by Thunder

7) Last of all, how has it affected and improved your game Taipan, and your winnings?

Sort of hard to isolate the financial impact of the software but there's no doubt in my mind that it has helped me to improve my game.

Why not download the 30-day free trial and give it a go, you'll see the above points for yourself.

thunder, if you decide to forgo PT for awhile, or some other program, i would recommend watching Trainer Jyms video FIRST!

learn table/seat selection. seriously, even if you think you practice good selection, watch the vid.

and from there, abc poker should get you past 10NL (.05/.10). when you have $550 in your bankroll, buy a program.

the programs not only allow you to analyze the play of others, but also, yourself. you can go back (in PT) hundreds of thousands of hands and see how you played a particular hand.

great for session reviews. also in TJ's vid....and/or bigspenda's. both are highly recommended "must see TV."

Thanks Chopper, I appreciate that. Wait till you see what else we have in store.

any chance you'd pm me with the "top-secret, super-privileged" info?

oh, and get some more buff babes over on the other thread, too. the competition is starting to wane.