Need some advice

Ok had this hand come up. I want to know if I made the right call or if I should have gotten out at the raise to my cbet. My thinking at the time was, pocket 4's and 5's should have bailed pre-flop and if they didn't then sucks to be me, I'll gain in the long run from those type of calls. However I failed to consider that preflop he had over 3 to 1 expressed pot odds. Which makes his call not a bad idea.

So bottom line is should I have ditched at the re-raise or went ahead with the assumtion that I was best hand at that moment. I realize that his check raise showed strength that I shouldn't have discounted, but Jack or better (which is how I interpreted his check raise) wasn't represented pre-flop.

Normally I wouldn't ask, but I am having a rather bad results day, losing $200 instead of my usual 5-600, and as such wondering If my play is the issue.

FYI hand history is edited for clarity


Full Tilt Poker Game #3321478334: Table Revere - $1/$2 - No Limit Hold'em - 15:36:14 ET - 2007/08/21
Seat 1: ComfyCouches ($254.90)
Seat 2: CDNLooseMoose ($82.30)
Seat 3: TheSnake-28 ($208.30)
Seat 4: tvcsa ($263.50)
Seat 5: proedros ($370.40)
Seat 6: 0_Drunkenboxer ($200)
Seat 7: Johnnyboy24 ($214.45)
Seat 8: lostcobra ($101.15)
Seat 9: Dashieq ($208.20)
tvcsa posts the small blind of $1
proedros posts the big blind of $2
The button is in seat #3
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Dashieq [Jc Ac]
0_Drunkenboxer folds
Johnnyboy24 folds
lostcobra folds
Dashieq raises to $7
ComfyCouches folds
CDNLooseMoose calls $7
TheSnake-28 folds
tvcsa folds
proedros calls $5
*** FLOP *** [5h Jd 4c]
proedros checks
Dashieq bets $15
CDNLooseMoose folds
proedros raises to $35
Dashieq calls $20
*** TURN *** [5h Jd 4c] [8d]
proedros checks
Dashieq checks
*** RIVER *** [5h Jd 4c 8d] [Td]
proedros bets $45
Dashieq calls $45
*** SHOW DOWN ***
proedros shows [5c 5d] three of a kind, Fives
Dashieq mucks
proedros wins the pot ($179) with three of a kind, Fives

Dashi

a.k.a Dashieq on Full Tilt

Any Reads?

Don't show results in future it might hinder some responses.

Opps thought I editted the results out.

Didn't have any hard info on him as he hadn't shown his hand yet. However he would enter around 20% of the pots and 50% of those he play he bet as if he had at least TPTK. This told me that he was either A. on a great run of cards, or B. he bluffed on a fairly regular basis or around 15-20% post flop. My gut said he was case B.

pocket 4's/5's fits the 2 cold callers perfect. with no real draws out there (maybe 67s), i think you can get away to the reraise. As played im still not calling the river bet.

the raise to my cbet

you have top pair-top kicker. Is your raise really a c-bet?

50% of those he play he bet as if he had at least TPTK

He's not playing this like top pair, top kicker. I fold to his check-raise.

Seems today is the day for me to get rocked by low sets. I am wondering if I should take a whole new approach to my own playing of low PP's and doing more than limping in.

What pot odds warrant calling with low pairs? I've read the sticky'd post when your dealing with a another higher pocket pair that you can stack him and clearly see the logic behind it. But if you can't put him on a high pair simply because of a lack of action before him, then at what point is the call worth it?

1 in 7 of hitting the set, but he also need to hit the flop as well to get a chunk of his stack. Hows does that play into the implied odds calculations?

Originally Posted by Dashi

Seems today is the day for me to get rocked by low sets. I am wondering if I should take a whole new approach to my own playing of low PP's and doing more than limping in.

What pot odds warrant calling with low pairs? I've read the sticky'd post when your dealing with a another higher pocket pair that you can stack him and clearly see the logic behind it. But if you can't put him on a high pair simply because of a lack of action before him, then at what point is the call worth it?

1 in 7 of hitting the set, but he also need to hit the flop as well to get a chunk of his stack. Hows does that play into the implied odds calculations?

Your might want to get better at laying down top pair, rather than just "getting even" with sets yourself. As a general rule however, you shouldn't call a bet/raise looking to hit a set unless the bet/raise is less than 10x your stack and the opps stack, so you can win at least 10x the opps bet/raise. Many here will argue for better odds than that, depending on whether or not given opp is capable of stacking off.

Ok I'll follow the 10 to 1 rule with chasing a set myself.

I may have mis-stated myself. I wasn't conisdering that I'd "get even" by hitting my own small sets, what I was referring to is would I be ahead long term with the money gained by low pairs calling and not hitting their set vs them hitting thier set and my associated loses.

Thinking about it I think my question has been answered already with the 10 to 1 rule of thumb. and not being a retard and laying down TPTK before pushing

Originally Posted by Dashi

Ok I'll follow the 10 to 1 rule with chasing a set myself.

I may have mis-stated myself. I wasn't conisdering that I'd "get even" by hitting my own small sets, what I was referring to is would I be ahead long term with the money gained by low pairs calling and not hitting their set vs them hitting thier set and my associated loses.

Thinking about it I think my question has been answered already with the 10 to 1 rule of thumb. and not being a retard and laying down TPTK before pushing

10 to 1 rule sucks...don't go by that. If you call 10bb's (10% of a full stack) 8 times with a pp (you flop a set roughly 1 out of 8 times) then you will have spent 80bb's and will have to win that much when you hit to break even. Obviously that is not realistic.