Is limping ever viable?

Hey guys... long time site reader, first time poster.

I'm pretty new to the game, I've read several books... online guides, etc. There's one thing I can't seem to get a solid understanding about: what cards to play pre-flop.

Most online guides I read seem to say the best route is strict and tight. Raise with AA, KK. Call with decent facecards... but anything in your hand less than 10 is insta-fold.

Is tighter always better? From the games I've played TONS of people limp in with utter crap, and often win because of lucky flops. I guess my basic question is why are the guides recommending playing super tight, yet most players I go up against limp in alot. Are they just bad players? Or is there more to this?

Those players limping in alot are losing their money. U wait until you have a better hand than what they are limping in with, and u win the money!!!

Winning players don't strive to 'get lucky' ...but it is nice when it happens. =)

anyways once u are good post flop player u can open up your game to playr suited connectors, pp's etc and from different pos. it is good to change your game up so as to not become predictable. But in the micro stakes, ABC poker is best, play good hands aggressively in position. Learn fundamentals first.

Originally Posted by Zao1

most players I go up against limp in alot. Are they just bad players?

yes

Originally Posted by Zao1

Or is there more to this?

no

as for your general question, playing "super tight" isn't "always right," but as a beginning player it wouldn't hurt to start out at 2nl FR and play 12/8 poker and flop sets--make money. over time you'll get more accostumed to the advantages of playing in position and learn how and when to bluff and when to identify when someone's repping nothing and all that fancy stuff and know how to iso bad players and so forth and before you know it (by that i mean like 6 months from now) you'll be a 24/20 6m playin' PAgg.

just learn for now, and just accept free money, even if that means 3 tabling 2nl 6m at a 5BB/100 winrate for a while.

Limping is viable, but if you have to ask, your not supposed to limp. There are very specific reasons to limp and they are too few and far between to need to know, plus it would never be necessary at the micros.

In the NLHE games you'll play, it's almost never going to be the best play to limp. In something like Limit Omaha 8 or better, it's different and you can limp a lot.

Originally Posted by spoonitnow

In the NLHE games you'll play, it's almost never going to be the best play to limp. In something like Limit Omaha 8 or better, it's different and you can limp a lot.

spoon, i'm surprised you didn't link him to one of your many awesome articles yourself: http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...rs-t66631.html

the examples discussed here are like the only time i ever utilize limping, and i'd be surprised if i searched my PT3 database and found any more than a handful of times that i limped in 6max (and at least half of those handfuls are misclicks with AA).

not saying that just 'cause i don't do it at 6m, or just 'cause spoon's example in that link is the ONLY time i do it, doesn't mean that it's THE ONLY TIME it's ever the most EV play (i actually do a lot of open limping in BM poker because the game's so passive), but sufficed to say you can get by a long long time in poker without ever having to learn ways to use limping as a weapon.

in fact, you can get up to 25nl pretty much without ever flatting a raise, especially OOP. you'll be missing out on value for sure, but i'm pretty sure there are like zero 2nl regs (2p2ers, FTRer's, whatever) who actually run a profit off of cold calling preflop because they're not good at putting players on ranges yet (even when they're thin ranges) and they either play super fit or fold and fold 60% of flops when their AQ doesn't hit or they spew like crazy

god i ramble in these threads