JJ/AK/AQ hands are a problem! What am i doing wrong? (Long)

Hi all,

I am at the 25NL tables and I seem to have a big problem with JJ & AK/AQ. I know I overvalue thes hands post flop but I just can't seem to work out what to do. Here is summary of the problems. Please let me know what the hell I am doing wrong.

With JJ I generally raise from all positions if I am opening and when there are limpers. If there is a raise in front and I am in LP I will sometimes re-raise and sometimes call. In any other position I will call a raise in front.

The problem comes post flop when the board flops with 1 overcard or rags.

With Rags I tend to bet every street and get called down to a higher pair or better. If I get raised on a rag flop I will usually call and see what the turn brings and see what my oppenent does.

With an overcard I sometimes C-bet but I seem to always get raised or called and then bet/raised into on the turn.

Here are 2 examples of how I played JJ.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

SB ($4.95)
BB ($11.85)
UTG ($41.95)
Hero ($31.40)
MP1 ($9.72)
MP2 ($25.65)
MP3 ($38.76)
CO ($4.05)
Button ($3.60)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with J, J. SB posts a blind of $0.10.
1 fold, Hero raises to $1, 2 folds, MP3 calls $1, CO calls $1, 3 folds.

Flop: ($3.35) 6, K, 2 (3 players)
Hero bets $2, MP3 calls $2, CO folds.

Turn: ($7.35) Q (2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 bets $2.5, Hero calls $2.50.

River: ($12.35) 2 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 bets $4.25, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $16.60



Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Button ($24.62)
Hero ($23.75)
BB ($20.26)
UTG ($7.62)
UTG+1 ($27.20)
MP1 ($11.70)
MP2 ($21.98)
MP3 ($19.20)
CO ($24)

Preflop: Hero is SB with J, J. Hero posts a blind of $0.10.
UTG calls $0.25, 2 folds, MP2 calls $0.25, MP3 raises to $1.5, 2 folds, Hero (poster) calls $1.40, 1 fold, UTG folds, MP2 folds.

Flop: ($3.75) 8, 6, 9 (2 players)
Hero bets $3, MP3 calls $3.

Turn: ($9.75) 3 (2 players)
Hero bets $7, MP3 calls $7.

River: ($23.75) 3 (2 players)
Hero bets $7.7, MP3 calls $19.20 (All-In).

Final Pot: $50.65

What is the best line with JJ?

With AK/AQ I raise them up Preflop and normally C-bet the flop if I don't hit and will get called and have to slow down on the turn and villain ends up leadng into me and I have to fold. Alternatively I miss, C-Bet and then get raised and have to fold.

I also try to bluff these hands to much, repping a good hand when I have missed on more than the flop. I will end up betting the turn and even the river and getting called and losing.

All this leads to lots of small $2-$4 pots being lost, and the occasional big pot when I have had enough and decide to play the hands strongly with nothing thinking that people are bluffing me. Everyone can't have a hand when they call the flop and raise the turn right? Dumbass!!!!!!

Here are a couple of hands to illustrate my points.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG ($9.80)
UTG+1 ($28.55)
UTG+2 ($24.75)
MP1 ($7.55)
Hero ($46.80)
MP3 ($23.85)
CO ($4.80)
Button ($40.45)
SB ($29.70)
BB ($24.75)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K, A. SB posts a blind of $0.10.
4 folds, Hero raises to $1, 2 folds, Button calls $1, SB (poster) calls $0.90, 1 fold.

Flop: ($3.25) 5, 3, 8 (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2.5, Button calls $2.50, SB folds.

Turn: ($8.25) 6 (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets $4, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $12.25

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

MP2 ($24.45)
MP3 ($27.30)
CO ($4.15)
Button ($4.65)
SB ($43.90)
BB ($4.75)
UTG ($14.25)
Hero ($15.10)
UTG+2 ($10.55)
MP1 ($45.21)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with A, K. SB posts a blind of $0.10.
1 fold, Hero raises to $1, 6 folds, SB (poster) calls $0.90, 1 fold.

Flop: ($2.25) 8, 9, 9 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2, SB calls $2.

Turn: ($6.25) Q (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $4, SB calls $4.

River: ($14.25) J (2 players)
SB bets $5, Hero calls $5.

Final Pot: $24.25

Now I may have already answered my own questions and know where I am going wrong, in which case please just re-iterate that to me. If not please tell me where the hell I am going wrong and what the best standard lines are for these hands as I know it is the basics that I am getting wrong with these.

By the way I know some of the above hands are awful, hence the analysis of my own play and post to get some help!

Thanks in advance

Hand 1: I check this flop quite often but I don't mind the bet. You got a great price on the river but you're still only beating a pure bluff. I don't know how often he's bluffing.

Hand 2: I almost always re-raise preflop here. The hand plays totally different then.As played c/c or c/f river depending on read. He has the flush here a high percentage of the time.

Hand 3: Fine

Hand 4: I don't think 2nd barreling at 25NL is a great idea unless you have a read. Fold river.

check flops sometimes when you miss with AK (also when you hit sometimes). Especially when the flop is all unders.

With JJ overpairs, just try to avoid playing for stacks unless villian is a KNOWN moron. This means sometimes giving free cards.

First JJ hand, I check turn looking to fold really. What do you beat with 2 overs and 3-flush out? His bet is really small though... sometimes I toss in a raise on the turn here. Folding is not terrible if you think he's bad and passive. I don't like the call if you are just going to fold to a 1/2 pot river bet on a relative blank (you think he has a 3?)

2nd JJ hand is just rough. I suppose you could have checked to PFR on flop, but you don't want to give overs/diamonds a free card. Checking the river might be better, induces more bluffs and you lose less when you call and are behind. Only thing that calls your value bet here (that you beat) are TT and 9X. Stacks are kind of short for a blocking bet (as you can see when he raises).

Um, at microstakes... you are playing against mostly calling stations. Don't bet unless you want to be called (don't bluff, careful w/ semibluffs). I like your solid pf raises- yep when you'll get 2-3 callers with those there's no need to get fancy.

Thing is, you have to play honest poker with calling stations. Don't worry, 9/10 guys aren't paying attention anyway, and the same proportion suffer from bouts of "bluff syndrome" and will defiantly call you down with crap. Thus the strategy is:

1. C-bet on appropriate flops- (uncoordinated, raggy) and only against players who know where the 'fold' button is. If called, shutdown mostly- the guy will call you down with his midpair + to the river. Don't bluff!

-this means no leading with AK for two streets when you miss... or really any strong bets with air, w/o the "right flop" or a read.

2. When you have it- bet it- do NOT NOT NOT be afraid of 'scaring off the fish.' They always call your flop cbets with crap- why do you think they're gonna change now? Best $ making strategy on microstakes with TPGK+ :
bet, call, bet, call, bet (fold / call with loser). Yes sometimes it pays to check top pair of kings on an uncoordinated flop, but mostly betting will bring in the most of it. Remember, microstakes donkeys have bluff syndrome, and they love to chase.

3. Resistance means you're f**ked! Don't play scared, but if someone raises you on the turn or river... they've usually got it. If they call a big bet on the flop, be wary... but proceed as if they're chasing until you learn otherwise. Assume the likely, not the worst. The flop is the BS street; the turn: the "truth-telling" street. Generally that description is true.

Okay, back to your AQ+ / JJ problem. Your trouble is that, when you're dealt these monsters preflop, your heart starts racing, you smile towards the screen, life is good... then those positive feelings move over to the flop- any flop- no matter how crappy. You're "married" to your hand. You think you "deserve to win" this particular pot. A very dangerous mindset.

Hand 1: You lead out with midpair into 2 players... that's fine, but on that turn you're usually beat. The edge you have over the donks is that you CAN fold marginal hands when you feel you're beat.

2: More modest turn bet, if any; you're in the dark here... you're only gonna be called by winners... or maybe a miracle A9 or TT- but I wouldn't count on it.

3 / 4 : Don't bluff at donkstakes multipot, even with AK.

I agree that JJ hand 2 with 2 limpers and a raise you should probably re-raise from the SB, because (as you can see) being OOP sucks. If you think EP limpers are never going away, I guess you can call

Hi all,

Thanks for taking the time to read my post and post very detailed responses. They have all helped my play.

I have to stop getting "married" to these hands and listen to what I am being told by the villains at these stakes. It very rarely happens that a reraise at these stakes, even on the flop in some cases, is a bluff and I have to remember this.

Another leak or problem I have noticed is not thinking hands through at the time I am playing. There have been several occasions when directly after I have lost a hand I have assessed the hand history and realised that there was very little I would beat in the hand and if I had just taken my time and thought about it maybe I could have got away from it. This hand in particularI felt that I could have got away from:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Hero ($24.50)
MP2 ($24)
MP3 ($25.29)
CO ($5)
Button ($21.23)
SB ($25.45)
BB ($16.85)
UTG ($28.98)
UTG+1 ($4.25)
UTG+2 ($5.15)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K, K. SB posts a blind of $0.10.
3 folds, Hero raises to $1, 1 fold, MP3 calls $1, 3 folds, BB calls $0.75.

Flop: ($3.10) 4, 6, 5 (3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $2.75, MP3 folds, BB calls $2.75.

Turn: ($8.60) 4 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $6, BB calls $16.60 (All-In), Hero calls $7.10.

River: ($38.30) 8 (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: $38.30

If I had thought about it, what possible hands could he have that would play like this? any 4, 55, 66, 23, 78, poss all the pairs but I can't see anyone playing 77-TT this strongly. I had no reads on the guy and so I should have given him the benefit of the doubt on the turn but I got married to my hand and lost the pot to 7s4s in the end for a straight but was beat on the turn to trips.

These plays are the plays I want the fishes and donks to make to me i.e. stacking off with overpair/TPTK but I need to be able to get away from these hands when I am being catagorically told I am beat!

Anyway, I am waffling again so I will shutup.

Thanks again.

Sucks... VERY had to fold getting >4:1 with KK there. The problem here is that his stack is too shallow for you to get away. If he flat called, how you you not betting or calling 7 more one the river? Even if the straight hits?