I think I'm going to quit playing Poker.

It's just too addictive and too costly.
I've dropped $1000 in the past month.
I consider myself a good player, I usually am the big stack at the tables I play, but somehow I always end up suffering a bad beat, losing a good amount, and then throwing the remainder away on the next couple hands with aggressive bets on anything that looks half decent in some sort of effort to regain my winnings back as fast as possible. However, it always ends in disaster.

I'll start with $50, get up to say... $130, then lose $50, and then in a very short period of time lose another $50, and after that whatever I have left ($30 maybe) I'm just throwing it away with an All In on whatever 2 cards I get. It's the same cycle over and over, I know this is what "tilt" is, I know when I'm tilting, but there's still nothing I can do to prevent it. My emotions always take over.

Also, the site I'm on seems to be rigged pretty bad. They always give you those hands where you THINK you have the nuts, and there's only a couple possible hands that can beat you... and of course someone else is holding it. I'm not talking about straights vs flushes here, I'm talking 4 of a kinds versus full houses. like one I had recently... KKKQQ, and the other guy had QQQQ. It's like there's certain hands they give you purposefully to induce action (so they get a good rake), and you're always having to watch youre back and be careful you're not getting screwed, but in the process you're being careful and you end up letting your opponent catch cards for cheap. And sometimes there's even the players that come in and get all the good hands suddenly, and for the next 50 hands you're not catching anything except 7/2's, etc. It's almost like certain tables and certain players are just unlucky for me.

Not only that, but I was duped from the start. They told me I'd get a $600 bonus for depositing $1000 or something, and I even asked them if there was a catch and they said "No." I gullibly took their word for it, and then learned you have to earn like 1,000,000 points to ever get that $600. It takes me 3 hours in .25 cent blinds just to get a couple hundred points.... so you could imagine how long that takes.

I could also complain about the donks who get lucky when making bad calls with incorrect odds, and other sh1t, but we've all been there, I'm sure.

All of this together (and more) is leading me to believe I should quit. I really love the game (obviously), but I might just stick to play money. However, I don't think I'll ever get the same pleasure from that... so I think I should just quit Poker in general.

Anyone who's had similar experiences can share their story, feel free to try to talk me out of it, or encourage me to quit. I'm open to anything at this point. I'm just a little upset because I got some bills to pay soon... and I'm nearly broke, thanks to Poker.

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...poker-9214.htm

Originally Posted by Warpe

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/forum/poker-9214.htm

QFT

and

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...poker-8435.htm

Originally Posted by Atlplayer85

It's just too addictive and too costly.

If you really think you are getting addicted (and especially if you are losing at the same time then just go right ahead and quit. Poker is a fun game but its not worth ruining your life over.

Originally Posted by Atlplayer85

I consider myself a good player, I usually am the big stack at the tables I play, but somehow I always end up suffering a bad beat

Bad beats are the things that happen when you are a favorite to win. If you are one of the better players at the table you will be a favorite to win more often and you will take far more bad beats. You will also be winnning more than enough to make up over the long run for them since you are the favorite.

If you want to carry on then you really need to be dropping down in stakes ALOT since you obviously arent ready emotionally (and probably skillwise aswell). If you really think you are getting addicted and you think poker could make you neglect other parts of your life then do yourself a favour and get out now.

Dude, your so wrong on so many levels that I will let you start by reading the threads that warpe and givememyleg have posted. Get out of the bad beats and strategie forums, read all the posts and stickies in the beginner digest and then re-read them. You will see where you went wrong. Stop putting $$ in to your poker account till you learn something. Did you jump behind the wheel of a car for the first time and enter a race, prolly not. Do some learnin'!! Good Luck on your quest.

I lost a good $1000 over the course of 2005 before I became a winning player. Don't be that guy.

Originally Posted by Warpe

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/forum/poker-9214.htm

I read that thread before, and it's pretty much exactly the way it happened.
Even down to the Kings being busted 3 times in a day, I think that's when I started slipping. A couple weeks ago, I was up a few hundred dollars, then I just had one really bad day where I lost all of it and ever since that day it was pretty much downhill from there.

Originally Posted by givememyleg

Originally Posted by Warpe

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/forum/poker-9214.htm

QFT

and

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...poker-8435.htm

Haha, I've read that thread too.
I guess none of it sunk in, or went through one ear and out the other... who knows, it's easy to read about it... and alot harder to practice it.

[quote="Pelion"]

Originally Posted by Atlplayer85

It's just too addictive and too costly.

Originally Posted by Pelion

If you really think you are getting addicted (and especially if you are losing at the same time then just go right ahead and quit. Poker is a fun game but its not worth ruining your life over.

Or I might just take a long break. I know that if I redeposit now and try to get back in the game, I'm just going to be on a mission to get my $1k back. I'm going to feel that the money is owed to me, and I think that in itself is a losing mindset. Maybe if I take a break for a couple months, I can forget about the money I've lost and start fresh and perhaps learn from this experience. That and I'm going to read the "Psychology of Losing" thread over and over until it sinks in.

Originally Posted by Atlplayer85

I consider myself a good player, I usually am the big stack at the tables I play, but somehow I always end up suffering a bad beat

Originally Posted by Pelion

If you want to carry on then you really need to be dropping down in stakes ALOT since you obviously arent ready emotionally (and probably skillwise aswell). If you really think you are getting addicted and you think poker could make you neglect other parts of your life then do yourself a favour and get out now.

Well, the thing is... I started at the smallest blinds and worked my way up when I felt comfortable. I dominated 5 cent tables, then 10 cent tables, and I moved to 25 cent and I didn't do bad at all. As far as my skill goes, honestly I only play the 50 best hands. Some of the other players though, they'll be in there with 8/3 offsuit, call raises with it, and end up flopping two pair when you got TPTK. I think that's the main thing that messes with my emotions because I'll feel like the poker gods are out to get me for playing tight. It's almost contagious too, when the whole table is loose, I'll loosen up too because I'll figure that they're getting lucky, then I should be getting lucky too right? However, I'm always the one that never gets lucky with the trash hands. :P

Originally Posted by Trainer_jyms

Dude, your so wrong on so many levels that I will let you start by reading the threads that warpe and givememyleg have posted. Get out of the bad beats and strategie forums, read all the posts and stickies in the beginner digest and then re-read them. You will see where you went wrong. Stop putting $$ in to your poker account till you learn something. Did you jump behind the wheel of a car for the first time and enter a race, prolly not. Do some learnin'!! Good Luck on your quest.

Thank you, I'll heed your advice.

Originally Posted by givememyleg

I lost a good $1000 over the course of 2005 before I became a winning player. Don't be that guy.

ditto

It took me 6-9 months of making every mistake in the book before it finally started to click for me. FTR was what got me there. I'm by no means a shark, but this fish has a lot more teeth than he used to have. Stay disciplined, play tight poker and, above all, stay within your roll. And read everything here...

I have $6.04 left over from my $1k deposit.
I'm not going to redeposit until I get my $1k back.
Even if it takes me a year.

1 thing that i find helps when your feeling like this is to leave with little wins. Like you say you get up to $130 - LEAVE - Don't sit for hours trying to grind and grind back...Clock some small wins and leave early - You will feel better and your confidence will come back quickly - I do this whenever i've been in a rut and it works - I'll come back and hit a few buy ins (i play low stakes) and just leave - It gives me confidence and renews faith in my abilities...Grinding it out to win back what you "lost" is just a waste of time (if you take 50 to 130, then lose 50 of it, you didn't "LOSE" 50, you are still up 30...Don't keep chasing that money as if you lost it...)

just clock a few wins, leave early and get your confidence up...

Don't stop playing man. I believe you when you say you can be a winning player. I suffer from the same "emotional problems" or whatever the hell it is.. I kinda deal with it by only playing when I feel I'm up for it and pulling the plug immediately when I sense that overconfidence or tilt (the two demons that kill your winnings) are coming.

Discipline, it's a nice thing to have. But I don't have it, so I deal with it my way.. you should too. Find a way to quit asap when you sense tilt is coming. Play only when you are calm. Even if this means no poker for days.

If you tilt as easily as you say, you're not a good player at all. No matter how good you are when you are not tilting, you will just give it back. Learn how to control the tilt, and you will probably be a good player. That's your hurdle. Before you play another hand, you need to look inside and figure out how to control your emotions and play your best game no matter what crap happens at the table.

Originally Posted by Atlplayer85

I have $6.04 left over from my $1k deposit.
I'm not going to redeposit until I get my $1k back.
Even if it takes me a year.

Hope your site has microstakes

Originally Posted by Atlplayer85

I have $6.04 left over from my $1k deposit.
I'm not going to redeposit until I get my $1k back.
Even if it takes me a year.

Actually this is quite similar to me.

I made my first ever deposit to online poker in May 2005. $50 was huge for me at the time. I put it on and used my leet (not really) home game skills. I proceeded to lose that $50 in 2 hours. I was stunned. I had been winning at my home games for about a year; and I thought I was pretty damn good at poker. Problem was, I was born by WSOP in ESPN, and raised by home game poker where no one knew what they were doing. I did not want to accept the fact that these people were better than me.

I put on another $50 about a month later, and then it all turned around. I ran that up to about $400 within the course of the month. Finally! The bad beats stopped and the fish were getting what they deserved! With my huge bankroll of $400 I started playing 50nl. I was pwning these nubs. I ran my $400 up to around $900 in a couple of weeks. Once I hit $900 I was rolled for 200nl!!! I knew I could beat the game, because I was a good player. I wanted to be where the money was!

Reality is a painful thing at times, and this was one of those times. In just one sad day, my entire $900 bankroll had erased itself from existance. That was a sad day in my past. I felt sick, mad, depressed, angry, worthless, etc etc. I look back at it now and I am so glad that it happened.

I pretty much decided I was never playing again. At that time, $900 was such a large amount of money to me making $6/hour at my current job, that I couldn't even fatham going through it again. Well, once the pain started to fade, I brought the idea back up to myself. I started thinking, maybe I was doing something wrong.... maybe it wasn't just all "bad beats." I put on my last $500 that I could find, and this time I was going to do it right. At this time it was around October 2005. I put it on and realized there was such a thing as "bankroll management." I started doing the $11 sngs (not the $33s - $55s like I had been !!) and I got... bored. I knew the "smart" thing was to build it up and wait, but once again I hadn't learned. I also hadn't bene learning any new strategy, nothing really to improve my game. I still had the same home game image, and to make a long story short, I was back down to my last $10. It was absolutely terrible... not only had I lost my multiple deposits, but I had lost a few of my MTT cashes and all my profits.

I had no more patience. I was convinced that I sucked at poker and that had to have been it. I didn't touch Pokerstars for a while. When November rolled around, I found FTR. I read the articles that were suggested, and I realized "hey, I can change things around." I saw this community as a last hope scenario. I have personally thanked aok in Nov, because the Psychology of Losing really did turn my attitude around.

With my last $10, I played a 5 table, $10 tournament. Unbelievablely, I took first. This was an unexplainable relief as now I didn't have to deposit again. It was different this time because now I had FTR and I learned what it would take to become successful. Ever since January when I got serious and "got my shit together," I have been positive ever since. It was slow and steady at first, but now it is starting to rise faster. It can change.

FWIW Atl, If you even read this post, I just want you to know, I went through what you are going through. You can turn this around. Take some time off and learn more of the game before you go back again, but if you are serious, and want to be a winning player; you can be. If you don't want to give up, then don't. I hope just knowing that someone personally shared the same experience, it can help you turn it around! Good luck!

I lost a good $1000 over the course of 2005 before I became a winning player. Don't be that guy.

um, i lost a thousand dollars YESTERday. lol. stick with it, youll learn the game and progress without even noticing. the trick is to play stakes you can afford. if that means playing one-two cent, then do that. you could dump 5 buyins a day and not hurt yourself. and micro can be a lot of fun: beats the hell out of play money.

Just to echo what people are saying, it's a marathon, not a race. I put in $50 just like everyone else, lost that, put in $50 more, ran that up to $200 and then had a really bad spell that caused me to step away, realizing that I was playing way too much poker and neglecting other parts of my life.

However, recently I'm back at it and forcing myself to play small stakes and grind up my bankroll slowly until I can play bigger tables. Think of it as a learning experience so that when you get back up there you can really play properly and proper play wins consistently over time. We all have days where we lose and days where we win, but applying yourself every time you play will even things out and make sure you walk away in a year with a profit. And next year with more.

Trust me, sitting at a table with $5 feels like nothing but it also means you are playing within your means and can relax and play the right way because you don't tilt after those bad beats. Give it a try.

Originally Posted by siknd

I lost a good $1000 over the course of 2005 before I became a winning player. Don't be that guy.

um, i lost a thousand dollars YESTERday. lol. stick with it, youll learn the game and progress without even noticing. the trick is to play stakes you can afford. if that means playing one-two cent, then do that. you could dump 5 buyins a day and not hurt yourself. and micro can be a lot of fun: beats the hell out of play money.

The difference is you could handle it; that 1k was everything I had. I had lost well over $1000 in 2005, but it was $1000 from my pocket. I had deposited around 1k, made some profit, and lost everything... I don't even know how much it was as I didn't take stats.

The difference is you could handle it; that 1k was everything I had.

we hav the same point. im not trying to be pretentious by saying that at all. i mean that what seems insurmountable now will happen naturally in time if you dont force it. my goal someday is to be good enough to be able to lose 10k in one day.

poker is the one game where the harder you try, the worse you do.

Take a break, you seem like you are on extended multisession tilt.

What stakes are you playing? How many buiyns?

Revisit your strategy, start over again playing basic nit-style conservative poker on lowest stakes. Reload if you lose some portion of stack, keep it minimum 90BB. Multitable and clear bonus faster. Nit style of play will help avoid swings in light 15-20 buyins bankroll.

Bad beats? LOL haha I get sucked out about 5-10 times in a session, get destacked at least once, but I have 20-50 buyins and it's nothing. Table without people going too far with second best hand or draw is not so good table.

Originally Posted by siknd

my goal someday is to be good enough to be able to lose 10k in one day.

Or win 10k in one day.

I totally understand what you mean.

Originally Posted by siknd

my goal someday is to be good enough to be able to lose 10k in one day.

That quote is nothing short of poetic. (seriously)

Originally Posted by LimpinAintEZ

1 thing that i find helps when your feeling like this is to leave with little wins. Like you say you get up to $130 - LEAVE - Don't sit for hours trying to grind and grind back...Clock some small wins and leave early - You will feel better and your confidence will come back quickly - I do this whenever i've been in a rut and it works - I'll come back and hit a few buy ins (i play low stakes) and just leave - It gives me confidence and renews faith in my abilities...Grinding it out to win back what you "lost" is just a waste of time (if you take 50 to 130, then lose 50 of it, you didn't "LOSE" 50, you are still up 30...Don't keep chasing that money as if you lost it...)

just clock a few wins, leave early and get your confidence up...

Greed takes over sometimes.
Every time I doubled or tripled my buy in, I KNEW I should get out before my luck ran out. But you're thinking "I'm the big stack, I can bully, I can afford to play more pots with mediocre hands, let's see if I can't get ANOTHER $50" and by that time, when you're greedy for more, the poker gods punish you and take your stack. It's true, you feel like the money belongs to you after you win it, and after you lose it... it's similar to losing a buy in because you spent a couple hours getting that much just to lose it one or two hands.

That's one thing I definitely need to discipline myself to do, (to get out with winnings before it's too late).

Originally Posted by Xanadu

If you tilt as easily as you say, you're not a good player at all. No matter how good you are when you are not tilting, you will just give it back. Learn how to control the tilt, and you will probably be a good player. That's your hurdle. Before you play another hand, you need to look inside and figure out how to control your emotions and play your best game no matter what crap happens at the table.

This is true, it's the one thing (tilt) what makes me a "fish" or a "donk". Not my starting hands, not my inability to get a read (I think this is perhaps my best asset, I can usually put someone on their exact hand 70-80% of the time), or any other factor.

I know I need to control it, but HOW do I control it? I know you're supposed to take a break and quit playing, but the thing about tilt is that it makes you want to play MORE!

Originally Posted by givememyleg

Originally Posted by Atlplayer85

I have $6.04 left over from my $1k deposit.
I'm not going to redeposit until I get my $1k back.
Even if it takes me a year.

With my last $10, I played a 5 table, $10 tournament. Unbelievablely, I took first. This was an unexplainable relief as now I didn't have to deposit again. It was different this time because now I had FTR and I learned what it would take to become successful. Ever since January when I got serious and "got my shit together," I have been positive ever since. It was slow and steady at first, but now it is starting to rise faster. It can change.

FWIW Atl, If you even read this post, I just want you to know, I went through what you are going through. You can turn this around. Take some time off and learn more of the game before you go back again, but if you are serious, and want to be a winning player; you can be. If you don't want to give up, then don't. I hope just knowing that someone personally shared the same experience, it can help you turn it around! Good luck!

That was really inspiring, and it almost brought me to tears! Haha, excellent post, thanks for your story, and good luck to you as well!

Originally Posted by siknd

I lost a good $1000 over the course of 2005 before I became a winning player. Don't be that guy.

um, i lost a thousand dollars YESTERday. lol. stick with it, youll learn the game and progress without even noticing. the trick is to play stakes you can afford. if that means playing one-two cent, then do that. you could dump 5 buyins a day and not hurt yourself. and micro can be a lot of fun: beats the hell out of play money.

To be honest, this is how it happened.
I was up $400 at one point, so I was at $1400.
One day I played, and tilted, and lost that $400.
In an effort to get it back ASAP, I tried my luck at the 1 dollar blind tables, needless to say, I dropped $200 in about 30 mins. Those guys were just too good for me. So now I'm back down to $800, and it took me another few weeks with lots of variance (obviously mostly negative variance) to lose that back at the original stakes I was playing (.25 cent).

I've only been playing for about 6 months. I've played just about every day in that 6 months tho, so I've got some experience, and I don't think I'd ever be satisfied playing micro even though it's probably much safer.

Originally Posted by ponyboy

Trust me, sitting at a table with $5 feels like nothing but it also means you are playing within your means and can relax and play the right way because you don't tilt after those bad beats. Give it a try.

Yeah, I'll give it a try. It almost seems like I'll be in reverse, since my play is so adjusted to the .25 cent blinds, but at this point, if I do end up redepositing, it'll be the minimum (since that's basically all I can afford right now), and I'll pretty much be forced to play lower stakes where every other player goes all in whenever he finds himself with AJ offsuit.

I nearly quit this past Monday after I ran through another bankroll. But after my first weekend collecting info from this cool site, I felt renewed confidence in my developing game. Now, I realize that my biggest errors were bad bankroll management (big surprise….) and playing too loose (50% of hands…it sounds absurd now).

Now, I play about 30% of the hands and I’ve really come to appreciate the instances when I fold mediocre hands almost as much as when I do win hands. Patience, patience, patience…Being able to hover around the buy-in limit until a playable hand presents itself is a great feeling.

So, after two days with an adequate bankroll (for once), I’ve managed to turn a modest profit of 80 bucks. Thanks for the insight fellas and good luck ATLplayer.

I do have one noob question: I seem to suffer from raise-itis (preflop). And when I do, even if the flop doesn’t improve my hand, I feel obligated to place a substantial bet (maintain aggessiveness) . I realize that one should only play 30-35% of their hands and place larger raises in later positions. Of the played hands, on average, how many of those hands should be raised? Just looking for a rough estimate-I realize it depends alot on position, type of players at the table, etc.

Even 30% is a bit too loose for me to justify playing. My worse days are all signified by my VP$IP raising to more than about 20%. Half the time this is just trying to play a hand when cards have been scarce. I start dropping down from my normal 23 handed starting requirements and that's when I start getting whupped.
Right now I am about 17% average VP$IP, with a PFR of about 6%. Ideally I'd like to raise both to about 20% and 10% respectively, but that will come with time.