How to play JJ

First hand of the villaion, thus no reads on him.

Fulltilt $2NL. 9-max
UTG ($1.66)
UTG+1 ($2.02)
MP1 ($2.41)
MP2 ($1.02)
MP3 ($0.89)
Villain (CO) ($0.80)
Button ($0.81)
SB ($0.54)
Hero BB ($2.57)

Preflop: Hero is BB with JdJh, Villain is CO posted 0.02.

1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.02, 1 fold, MP2 calls $0.02, 1 fold, CO raises to $0.11, Button calls $0.11, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.11, 2 folds

Flop: ($0.38) 2d, 5h, 6h (3 players)
Hero bets $0.39, Villain calls $0.39, 1 fold

Turn: ($1.16) 4d (2 players)
Hero checks, Villain bets $0.30 (All-in)
Hero ???

Also, comment on how I played this hand. Wasn't bet on the flop excessive? I wanted to eliminate any drawers.

call turn, pot odds are ridic. when u bet flop consider turn size, i.e. 25c then 50c not 39c leavin 30 behind.

overall how to play jj: maximize value vs your opponents range

inb4thevideoispostedagain

nice, call turn, pot sized bet on flop is good, i would over bet the pot on flop here sometimes, like 48cents, but i like to overbet.

Bet sizing on flop is fine due to the draws on the board, however, your reasoning is not really correct. You don't want to eliminate drawers. You do want to charge them a very steep price for chasing their draws. Snap call on the turn. Check is fine, though you might as well bet since he has so little behind.

This will help you with your turn spot: http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...in-t87954.html

Thanks for your effort in posting the hand history and thinking about your opponent's possible holdings. Now that you have 10 posts the hand converter should work properly. Best of luck!

Lets see:

Pot size is 1.16, villain bets .30 and you call .30.

You need at least .30 (your call) / 1.76 (total pot after call) = 17% equity vs his range of hands to call this bet.

Now lets look at villains range: he might have been on a straight draw or he might have been on a flush draw. If he was on the flush draw, the turn gave him an excellent opportunity to bluff a scare card.

So unless he's a very passive player who only bets when he has a very strong hand and never ever bluffs, there's enough air in his range to justify calling the bet.

Call all in.You should raise preflop.I think he is just steeling.He is scarring you with river bet because board is very dry for any hands after preflop raising.

Def turn is a clear call. Also, I would have re-raised preflop at those stakes..

am i the only one who doesn't understand why hero does not 3bet JJ in the bb? force the original raiser to define his hand, and put the squeeze on the button. you might even take it down pre-flop.

on the flop, donachello's advice is very important to internalize. the purpose of your bet is not to end the hand. it is to induce bad calls to maximize your $$, not only from drawing hands but from stations who pay you off with crappy 1pr's. even when they hit their draws, you make money over the long run because the odds are in your favor. the same way casinos always win in the long run.

ChezJ

At 2NL, against one opponent, and especially if I am OOP, I 3bet JJ most of the time. The hand is notorious to play badly after the flop, so I if I take it preflop, I am happy enough.

However, against two villains, at 2NL, there is very little chance that they will both fold. Squeezing at 2NL does not work because most people do not understand the show of force. Then you find yourself OOP in a super-bloated pot. Another argument against is that at 2NL, reraising often results in a raising war until everyone is all-in. This would most likely force you to lay down JJ and it has more chance of happening against two opponents than heads-up.

In the case above, this is mitigated by the fact that the raiser and caller are in the CO and button, so their range (if they understand position) are wider and your squeeze has some more chance of success. The CO bet sizing preflop indicates that he at least has a clue, but he is probably not on a steal since he raises two limpers in the CO. However, note also that both the CO and button are short stacks, so reraising would pretty much leave them only with the options of folding or going all-in. Calling would not make much sense. This means that most of the time, they will lay down worse hands and shove with better hands.

So I don't think it is stupid to call in this spot and play JJ for overpair/set value.

As played, on the flop, I am tempted to check/raise, but the risk of giving a free card is high. The flop misses most of villains ranges and we have no reads that CO cbets a lot, so donking is good. Pot size is good in theory. With such a board, you have good chances of being called by worse hands and a pot sized bet is the right price to prevent the strongest draws to call profitably. But notice again that facing a pot sized bet, normal opponents are left with little choice but folding or shoving over due to their stack sizes, so maybe in this case I would only bet 3/4 pot so that calling becomes a slightly more sensible option to them.

Finally, as played, obviously, call the turn based on pot odds.

Originally Posted by optimists

Turn: ($1.16) 4d (2 players)
Hero checks, Villain bets $0.30 (All-in)
Hero ???

LOL

3betting JJ pf at 2NL isn't bad imo

Random tidbit of information you guys might find useful at some point: the chance of flopping a set + chance of flopping an overpair with JJ is about 50%.

with JJ I played 3bet/call

Originally Posted by daviddem

At 2NL, against one opponent, and especially if I am OOP, I 3bet JJ most of the time. The hand is notorious to play badly after the flop, so I if I take it preflop, I am happy enough.

However, against two villains, at 2NL, there is very little chance that they will both fold. Squeezing at 2NL does not work because most people do not understand the show of force. Then you find yourself OOP in a super-bloated pot. Another argument against is that at 2NL, reraising often results in a raising war until everyone is all-in. This would most likely force you to lay down JJ and it has more chance of happening against two opponents than heads-up.

In the case above, this is mitigated by the fact that the raiser and caller are in the CO and button, so their range (if they understand position) are wider and your squeeze has some more chance of success. The CO bet sizing preflop indicates that he at least has a clue, but he is probably not on a steal since he raises two limpers in the CO. However, note also that both the CO and button are short stacks, so reraising would pretty much leave them only with the options of folding or going all-in. Calling would not make much sense. This means that most of the time, they will lay down worse hands and shove with better hands.

So I don't think it is stupid to call in this spot and play JJ for overpair/set value.

As played, on the flop, I am tempted to check/raise, but the risk of giving a free card is high. The flop misses most of villains ranges and we have no reads that CO cbets a lot, so donking is good. Pot size is good in theory. With such a board, you have good chances of being called by worse hands and a pot sized bet is the right price to prevent the strongest draws to call profitably. But notice again that facing a pot sized bet, normal opponents are left with little choice but folding or shoving over due to their stack sizes, so maybe in this case I would only bet 3/4 pot so that calling becomes a slightly more sensible option to them.

Finally, as played, obviously, call the turn based on pot odds.

So you're set hunting with jacks?

As I said, I often 3-bet jacks heads up, but in this situation, with one raiser, a caller, two limpers who still have a word to say, and this being 2NL, I am saying that I don't think that it is totally stupid to just call and play for set or overpair value, and even with one overcard you still have showdown value. So I would not call it pure set hunting, like with, say, 55.

I am agree with anyone suggest a 3Bet PF. The turn showing a very nasty board with all the projects possible. The way villian has played suggesting that he/she old an Ace, so, you should fold big time without any doubt.

I'll put in my 2cents at the risk of being criticized cause I don't really care:

JJ has a 50% chance of hitting pre-flop. chances of over cards is about 97xx/1 or something of the sort as is chances of lower cards being flopped, 97xx/1
In this situation you hit the top 50% and is really the second best flop you could hope for other then hitting your trips.
I've read so many different ways to play JJ, and all of them lead to the same point. There is no right way to play them.
Compare playing JJ to pulling out of an intersection. If you're pulling out into the road and you see a car coming you have two choices. Gun it and pull out before the car can clip you, or slam on the brakes and let the car pass. If you're already too far out you have a big choice to make. Knowing when to slam on the brakes is the most important thing.

In this situation I think I'd have gunned it. But that's just me
There's a million ways to play it

Lol, good analogy mason, i'll remember that.

You probably want to 3 bet JJ here against the shawtie, depending on your read of the button (and of the CO).

If you think button is a poor player calling pretty light, I'd 3 bet CO shawtie all in and hope button folds his trash SC or whatever he's playing. If CO is letting himself get as short stacked as 40BB in a 50BB minimum buy in he's most likely playing the game like an SnG and will probably wait to make a stand all in with junk like Ax, and maybe even QK type hands. You have a pretty sweet equity against that range. If he shows up with QQ-AA i'd probs consider it a cooler and try stacking him with AA next time :P

Originally Posted by optimists

First hand of the villaion, thus no reads on him.

Fulltilt $2NL. 9-max
UTG ($1.66)
UTG+1 ($2.02)
MP1 ($2.41)
MP2 ($1.02)
MP3 ($0.89)
Villain (CO) ($0.80)
Button ($0.81)
SB ($0.54)
Hero BB ($2.57)

Preflop: Hero is BB with JdJh, Villain is CO posted 0.02.

1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.02, 1 fold, MP2 calls $0.02, 1 fold, CO raises to $0.11, Button calls $0.11, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.11, 2 folds

Flop: ($0.38) 2d, 5h, 6h (3 players)
Hero bets $0.39, Villain calls $0.39, 1 fold

Turn: ($1.16) 4d (2 players)
Hero checks, Villain bets $0.30 (All-in)
Hero ???

Also, comment on how I played this hand. Wasn't bet on the flop excessive? I wanted to eliminate any drawers.

I would have just shoved the flop because he was so short stacked.

Originally Posted by jaytoi

Lol, good analogy mason, i'll remember that.

thanks, lol... just thought of it while i was writting cause it happened to me on the way into work... for some reason I find myself comparing life decisions with poker decisions, lol

can't believe i'm the first person to post this: http://www.flopturnriver.com/pokerfo...ll-173396.html

do this and show your work here.

as for the PF debate, i'd say that unknowns at 2nl USUALLY have a leak of calling too much preflop and not understanding the strength of a 3b, so we can exploit this by 3b/foling JJ. This, on top of the fact that there's someone who flatted, so he doesn't often have a hand that dominates us. of course they're not likely to call squeezes lighter than normal 3b's, but that doesn't matter 'cause they're calling wide enough to be exploited anyway.

flatting and playing a hand that is rarely flopping anything more than marginal OOP in a 3-way (and prolly 4 or 5-way) with a high SPR isn't fun. also "bloating" the pot with our hand is actually a good thing because that means our SPR's going to be lower, and we'll be in better shape when we stack off with an overpair (oftentimes only needing him to call two streets).

as for flop, i like leading out, and what erogette said about sizing.

as for turn, i'd rather lead

^^ I did in my first reply. OP did not deliver.