Hand Problems

This hand right at the end of my session, led me to think - can u fold Kings preflop! The number of times this happens leads me to think that sometimes u can!

POKERSTARS GAME #14701712740: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($0.10/$0.25) - 2008/01/20 - 17:15:40 (ET)
Table 'Nortia' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: veryrocky ($28.95 in chips)
Seat 2: Bumbele ($15.60 in chips)
Seat 3: Herndogg ($13.25 in chips)
Seat 4: qqch13 ($30.45 in chips)
Seat 5: DennisTheDwa ($11.95 in chips)
Seat 6: Reesy118 ($35.95 in chips)
veryrocky: posts small blind $0.10
Bumbele: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Reesy118 [Ks Kd]
Herndogg: folds
qqch13: raises $0.75 to $1
DennisTheDwa: folds
Reesy118: raises $2 to $3
veryrocky: folds
Bumbele: folds
qqch13: raises $6 to $9
Reesy118: calls $6
*** FLOP *** [9s Jh 2d]
qqch13: checks
Reesy118: bets $10.25
qqch13: raises $11.20 to $21.45 and is all-in
Reesy118: calls $11.20
*** TURN *** [9s Jh 2d] [4c]
*** RIVER *** [9s Jh 2d 4c] [Th]

Wot are peoples feelings on this hand pls?? lookin back, think i played it poorly!!

Instead of calling on the end preflop just shove.

Yeah this is easy, shove flop after his last bet

I would 3 bet to 4.5 pre and shove over his 4 bet. As played you definitely want to be getting it all in regardless if he had AA or JJ it would be a huge mistake to do any different.

3bet slightly bigger pre and shove over his 4bet. dont ever think about folding KK pre at these stakes. 2 nights ago i got 4bet by a 14/8 playing 25nl and almost talked myself into folding KK. I ended up shoving and he snap called flipping over JJ.

thanx! just that a few times recently i hav had the gut feeling pre that i was up agaisnt AA esp after a re reraise preflop! but dont think that it is sensible to really think about folding, as i imagine the majority of the time you r ahead anyway!!

I do not subscribe to the notion that folding KK preflop is always bad. I've done it 5 times and so far it's been +EV. Follow your read. If your read says villain is ahead, follow your implied odds brain calculator. If your IOBC says to fold, then fucking do it already!

Originally Posted by BankItDrew

If your IOBC says to fold, then fucking do it already!

I love that line

I also agree there are times when you are "sure" your opp has AA (or sometimes the other two Ks but obviously that's rare (6 times less likely i think) and barely impacts any EV calculations if their range is KK+) and can get away from your KK. But you have to be VERY sure.

The problem is most people are paranoid and love to put villians on a single hand range. Being 'sure' and being 'afraid' are two different things.

Originally Posted by Reesy

qqch13: raises $0.75 to $1
DennisTheDwa: folds
Reesy118: raises $2 to $3
veryrocky: folds
Bumbele: folds
qqch13: raises $6 to $9
Reesy118: calls $6
*** FLOP *** [9s Jh 2d]
qqch13: checks

LOL @ his line.

Originally Posted by BankItDrew

I do not subscribe to the notion that folding KK preflop is always bad. I've done it 5 times and so far it's been +EV. Follow your read. If your read says villain is ahead, follow your implied odds brain calculator. If your IOBC says to fold, then fucking do it already!

HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($0.10/$0.25)

el dee oh

I've seen KK vs. AA @ levels 25NL and below.

Originally Posted by nickthefool

I also agree there are times when you are "sure" your opp has AA (or sometimes the other two Ks but obviously that's rare (6 times less likely i think) and barely impacts any EV calculations if their range is KK+

Let's say we put villain on one of the following hands: the other KK, or one of the other six AA's. Let's assume that we are heads up and all in and the average stack size is 100bb. Our long-term EV is - 66.6bb/hand. This calculation impacts our EV greatly.

Of course if you are sure villain has AA you should fold. But you just never are.

QQ is almost as often in there, combined with AKs or JJ sometimes makes it you can't fold.

QQ would be a different story.

Yesterday I was pretty sure he had AA when I had KK and I was pretty sure I should fold. Then I called, and he had AA, but then I hit a K on the river and won 100 dollars. Good thing I didn't fold

i have been sure several times that "AA is the ONLY hand that does that" and i have been right once. i saw JJ, ATo, 52o, and 88 in several 4bet pots preflop.

you need to shove this pre and take your medicine if its AA.