Defending Blinds

Hi everyone. I'm a newcomer to FTR but have been veiwing posts for a while and really have found some great info and analysis here.

I was wondering about blind defense strategies. How often is profitable, and what types of hands are everyone going with?

HH's are more than welcome, and this is a very general question. Feel free to give ANY thoughts.

Defending blinds is relatively unimportant in NL cash games, b/c blinds are so small compared to stack sizes. It can be very important in SNGs and MTTs though. In 6-max cash games it's slightly more important, b/c the blinds come around more often. But mainly, defending blinds in cash games is not about the blinds themselves, but about taking advantage of the blind stealers wide range to win their pre-flop raise or their raise plus a c-bet.

stakes?
Probably the most important question.

Originally Posted by zook

But mainly, defending blinds in cash games is not about the blinds themselves, but about taking advantage of the blind stealers wide range to win their pre-flop raise or their raise plus a c-bet.

QFT.

Originally Posted by HalvSame

Originally Posted by zook

But mainly, defending blinds in cash games is not about the blinds themselves, but about taking advantage of the blind stealers wide range to win their pre-flop raise or their raise plus a c-bet.

QFT.

QFT?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=QFT

QFT. The branch of quantum physics that is concerned with the theory of fields; it was motivated by the question of how an atom radiates light as its electrons jump from excited states.

Fluctuations of vacuum fields are irregular, but their averaged effects can be calculated using quantum field theory (QFT).

QFT

Also, FTR's own What the hell does [x] mean?

you dont really need to defend the blinds much at the lower stakes.
however being aggressive stealing the blinds properly can really increase your winrate.

QFT = "thats what i woulda said."

Assumming the blinds are very small relative to the average chip stack, I do not believe in "defending my blind." I view them as "a cost of doing business;" it's already invested money. The key is to mix up your game as you would at any other position at the table, depending on your competition. The key is to keep your competition off balance in regards to your style of play.

although i agree (that the blinds are very low in relation to your 100 bb stack), i also believe that stealing the blinds is a very worthwhile endeavor.

i looked inside PT last night on both my brother's computer and mine.

here's what i found using the hand filters...

over 10k hands i have won $142 at 25 full ring NL (winrate is another topic). if i stick to my "core holdings (another topic)," i would have won $311. if i look at "either blind," i find they cost me $219.

my brother had 12k hands at a mix of 100, 50, and 25 NL 6 max. his winnings were very poor...$50 or so. if he would have stuck to his "core holdings," he would be up $800. however, the blinds cost him $600+, as well.

my point is: Wouldn't we all have a better winrate w/o the blinds? Doesnt it make more sense to steal them instead of just let them battle it out amongst themselves? And, if they cost you as much, or more than your net winnings over a decent sample, shouldn't you defend them, too, as opposed to letting them go without a fight?

i dont defend near as often as i should WHEN I SUSPECT SOMEONE IS STEALING THEM, and i doubt many of us do...even at the "smaller" stakes. and i also doubt we steal them over 30% of the time, either, and we should.

my .02

zook's statement is very true about taking the raise and cbet on top of the successful defense of a blind. usually, this only takes a check-raise on the flop. and adds value when the guys to your right lay off your blinds knowing you will aggressively defend them.

wtf is sticking with your "core holdings"??

like i said, its another topic. but simply stated, its the hands i have shown to be profitable in the specific ways I play them. things like broadways, pp's, sc's, etc. not speculatives like gappers.

wish i kept the link to the article using PT to monitor your self-discipline. showed filters and how to stick to only the hands that you play profitably. but i am pretty sure the article just turns you into a friggin' rock. even 4-tabling, i get bored if i play only pp's and brodways when in postion w/o cbetting misssed flops....bla bla bla...borrriiinnggg.

stealing blinds is crucial, I see so many rocks with -ve BB/hr only because they don't bother stealing a blind here and there. Generally as you get closer to the button your PFR range should go up. thereby you are already inadvertantly stealing blinds with speculative hands.

As for defense, I prefer taking more then defending.

-beck

I steal with all sorts of nonsense if the blinds are tight. Especially if I know they are playing lots of tables. Ideally, I want people who will not call but rather fold/re-raise (and the latter infrequently). Whatever the marginal direct EV of this play is, I think it's important for image (i.e, I do not want to be percieved as tight preflop).

I will not really defend my blind without something playable, being OOP against an aggressive player sucks. Re-raising light is good, but I like to have a hand the first time, until you know if they are just raising lite and will meekly fold, or they are crazy aggro and want to play re-raised pots with garbage.

Weak hands OOP in raised pots is a recepie for slow and painful busto which is magnified by passivity when you only have one way to win pots.

Exceptions not included.

Defending should probably only be attempted when you are confident of your hand reading skills. Even then, wouldn't you rather defend you're button? Then you're protecting 1.5 blinds with position and more information.

You cannot defend what is not yours.

In a 1-2nl cash game the pot is $3 to begin with before the cards are dealt. You may have contributed to this pot but any chips thrown into the middle become chips of the pot and no longer chips of your own. So, do not try to defend anything, because nothing in the middle is yours.

Instead of looking at it as 'blind defense' (which it is not), look at it as taking advantage of aggressive players.

So echoing some of the above posts:

Defending you blind is only important if someone is constantly raising you from late position. Clearly he cant have great cards every time your in the BB. But, you should definely have some kind of playable hand.

But, re-raising out of position should be done sparingly regardless of cards. Position is a huge deal.

Also, It's an automatic play for me to re-raise the SB limper regardless of my cards. He's out of position with a weakish hand, so you gotta make his life painfull.

I dont do a lot of defending unless I feel I'm getting bullied, and then I still need some kind of hand to push back. I also only try to steal from the cutoff or 1 off and usually call if I'm played back at because:
1. I have position
2. I want to maintain (my image)that I have a playable (strong)hand.

If people think I'm constantly trying to steal they will play back at you all the time, putting you on weakish hands. It's always better to invest a little money to maintain a tight image IMO. A tight image also makes your steal attempts more successfull.

Originally Posted by BankItDrew

Instead of looking at it as 'blind defense' (which it is not), look at it as taking advantage of aggressive players.

I like that

Do you just call his raise or reraise 2x his bet hoping to get him to fold before the flop. I play more limit online and never ever call any thing I either raise or fold but wander how this would work in NL?

If I choose to defend my blind against a known blind stealer, I repop to (generally) 3X his raise. I like to have a hand with potential to do this, but I sometimes do with rags. I also like to sometimes call the raise and donk into him on the flop, or even check/call then donk the turn. Depends on the player.

Conversely, if stats say someone will defend their blind heavily, that opens up the opportunity to repop their resteal on occasion (I really need a hand for this). Usually if they defend that vigorously I leave their blinds alone and pick on others....

Defending blinds and stealing blinds are two different animals. Don't defend your blinds. Why play a marginal, if not completely shit holding, to save 1/2 or 1BB. In NL when you get to the river, a lot of bets are +30BB, that's 15 orbits worth of blinds, in one street. Tighten up in the blinds, don't loosen up to win a BB, that's limit talk because most pots are 12 or 13BB. as for stealing blinds, I don't bother at $50NL and under, guys are too willing to stack of with shit hands, I'll get their money. Edges are unnecassary.

There is a lot of truth to that TJ. I do this against known blind stealers, against an unknown I let it go. What I do has more to do with metagame, I suppose. Sending the message to a guy that if he chooses to come after my blinds, he better be prepared to go to war. In effect, it's not just the one blind I am defending, it is X number of blinds while that guy sits next to me. It also can slow them down in hands that don't involve the blinds and button, taking some pots here or there when they appear weak or allowing a cheap draw they would have bet normally. I am also speaking of $100 NL games that are a little more aggressive. And FWIW, I tend to have a hand more often than not, and ALWAYS when I take the delayed line.

I wouldn't pull this at $25, that's for sure.

Originally Posted by Beck

Originally Posted by BankItDrew

Instead of looking at it as 'blind defense' (which it is not), look at it as taking advantage of aggressive players.

I like that

Me too!