Check-raising the flop after a preflop raise

I almost never do it. The only occasion I might do it is if I'm up against a short stack and am committed anyway, so I can get an extra bluff out of him that way.

When is it a good time to do this in general? Against floaters I like betting the flop, c/r turn better..

I think I wan't to start doing this with overpairs so I can ctart to do it with AK unimproved.

Originally Posted by Irisheyes

I think I wan't to start doing this with overpairs so I can ctart to do it with AK unimproved.

yep

i do it with everything from Ace high unimproved to a set and even the nut straight.

Originally Posted by Irisheyes

I think I wan't to start doing this with overpairs so I can ctart to do it with AK unimproved.

Let's say we c/r every raggy flop with JJ+/AK and a small % of other stuff.

What is the advantage of doing this over just cbetting everything?

Originally Posted by johnny_fish

Originally Posted by Irisheyes

I think I wan't to start doing this with overpairs so I can ctart to do it with AK unimproved.

Let's say we c/r every raggy flop with JJ+/AK and a small % of other stuff.

What is the advantage of doing this over just cbetting everything?

1st, we need to actually hit a raggy flop. If all we do is play premiums and pps then when we c/r a raggy flop our range is predictable. fwiw, playing/raising any two just once every 2or 3orbits does wonders for table image.

My thoughts on this are two fold
i either want my opponent to fold too much or i want him to make that horrible call where he is smoked.
If o constantly c/r a rg flop with both a mised hand and a set then how long before opp thinks 'i have AA fuck you' alternativly how long before he thinks 'meh AA no good here' becasue we c/r'ed our set before.

Therefore im looking either for a folding machine or someone who will fall in love with their hand just once.

Originally Posted by johnny_fish

Let's say we c/r every raggy flop with JJ+/AK and a small % of other stuff.

What is the advantage of doing this over just cbetting everything?

You get an extra bet out of opponents who habitually bet when checked to and often get another one when they call and then fold to your lead on a brick turn. I c/r with made hands early and draws later. You still need to c-bet obv, but it adds to your unpredictability and gets you more action, imo. Used to be a c/r was considered a really strong move but it's becoming so commonly used as a bluff that a lot of players seem to dig their heels in now and will often play back with second best hands.

If your hand is good enough, why not check/call all the way down if each street is a rag and give him more chances to bluff away his chips? If we check-raise the flop, we really want villian to fold, correct?

Originally Posted by Ltrain

If your hand is good enough, why not check/call all the way down if each street is a rag and give him more chances to bluff away his chips? If we check-raise the flop, we really want villian to fold, correct?

Sometimes. Sometimes we want him to think we want him to fold. Any decent opponent's radar goes up pretty quickly when you check/call the flop and the turn and then (usually) lead the river, so more often that line gives you check/call check/check bet/fold and you lose value.

Originally Posted by Miffed22001

My thoughts on this are two fold
i either want my opponent to fold too much or i want him to make that horrible call where he is smoked.

How do you get them to do that simultaneously? That's something I just don't understand. Or am I thinking the wrong way about this?

The major thing I don't understand about poker is how you can get a significant edge vs. players who also know the fundamentals (hand values, pot odds, equity, position, etc).

I guess the main thing is getting more information from others than the other way around. So mixing up your own play while looking for patterns in opponents play.

Originally Posted by johnny_fish

I guess the main thing is getting more information from others than the other way around. So mixing up your own play while looking for patterns in opponents play.

To quote gabe, "bingo bango bongo."

i give dumb action on cheap streets at times to encourage people to overplay their hands with me.
I also check rather than bet a whole lot more than most players