Quote Originally Posted by Thunder
Ash256,
I apologise if you think I want to take on good players, I don't. As I said in my first post, I want to avoid loose cannons and sharks. I just wanna play against people, like me, who are learning and have a desire to play properly. To replicate, just to even a small degree, the knowledge and play we see on TV and read in our magazines and books.

And I don't know why I am giving off the impression I think I am good - as I don't and I am doing my best to point this out. I have a good grasp of fundamentals - of ABC poker. That is all.

I think I've played circa 18,000 hands thus far. 5 times I deposited £20 and 5 times, I generated consistent results at $5 SNGs, realising money finishes every other game and turning each investment into £120 within 2 weeks.

And for sure I have huge leaks and I can't even begin to appreciate teh play of Negreanu and co, but in the bad beat examples I gave, the opponents played far, far worse than I

As for cash v tourney, it's strange. I can easily make as much money as cashing in a tourney in minutes - without having to defeat 7 others first! But once I do make it, I am reluctant to bet it for fear of losing LOL! And strangely enough, I find it easier to handle the variance in a tourney. If I lose 1/2 my chips, I am still in the game. If I lose 1/2 my chips in a ring game - I have a mild heart attack!

I want my cash game to get better - as that's where the big money lies but tourney play is where my results are better. And I also get more entertainment value (a 45m tourney for just $5) which is great right now.

As for finding somewhere to grind - that's why I've posted!

Thx guys!


ps: as a side issue that's popped up in replying here, can you please explain why cash & tourney are seen as completely different games. And, more importantly, why world class players in one can crash in the other?

Surely the concepts of good play is the same for both and I can't see how Helmuth, for example, can be such a poor cash player. He still knows his hands, can bluff, can read people as though he has x ray vision etc.

The only answer I've ever gotten is that cash can be more open as you're not afraid to bust out on a coin flip as you can rebuy. But the rebuy is obvious. It still doesn't explain, to me, why good players struggle to succeed, why they're seen as different or why any decent player would risk a 50-50 decision in either format, unless they had sound reason to do so.

(if this requires a separate thread - just let me know and I'll repost).

Thx
I seem to have misinterpreted your original post.. meh.

- You think you've played 18k hands, did you get that information from a PokerTracker database? If not, you need PokerTracker if you're a student of the game (specifically cash).

- "And strangely enough, I find it easier to handle the variance in a tourney. If I lose 1/2 my chips, I am still in the game. If I lose 1/2 my chips in a ring game - I have a mild heart attack!"
That's an example of the short-term thinking which you could do with getting out of - variance isn't losing 1/2 your chips in a ring game, variance is playing 20k hands of solid high-quality poker over 3 weeks and still being breakeven.

- Bankroll management is essential; 10-buyin downswings happen so 20 buyins is necessary in order to retain some level of comfort.

- Tourney players vs. cash players - I can't give you that much insight here, but I can tell you that stacks are much deeper in cash games than in tournaments and tournament players often lack the experience to play correctly with stacks that are several times deeper than what they're used to.

- Quite often the people you'll play with will be trying to learn about the game, it's just that they'll be much less intelligent than you and will have gone totally the wrong way about it.

- You regard £20 as an "investment". It's not an investment if you're not using proper bankroll management as you're not giving it the chance it should have to come through for you.

- Learning the game seriously can give you some insight into how the TV players think - it's great when you have a chunk of thought process which is similar to that of someone you see on High Stakes Poker because you have an idea of what they thought in order to make their decision.

- I recommend you deposit £100 and play 10NL 6-max on iPoker or somewhere and grind it regardless of the players there.