4nl some hands vs. villain(HUnting The_nooch)

K, So i have some hands here vs. one of the very few villains that give me trouble on 4nl. I did a sweat w/ Weasel last night(thanks Wease)and he had mentioned it would prob be good to post some of these up and see what you guys think.

Villain is 25/21/6 cbF= 51, cbT=37, total AF= 3 , over 644 . he gets a bit aggro post-fl, and has put me in some tough spots recently. he has a tendency to ra' flop cbets, c/r , and ra' donk bets.

So, here are the hands. I don't think i really need to get all prose like w/ each one . Like I said it's not so much my play(except maybe reaction wise) , let me know if there is anything else i can add..

H1.

Revolution Gaming Network - $0.04 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

H1.


BB: $4.25
UTG: $5.25
MP: $3.78
CO: $1.76
Hero (BTN): $5.77
SB: $10.09

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.04

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.06) Hero has T 9

fold, fold, CO calls $0.04, Hero calls $0.04, SB calls $0.02, BB raises to $0.15, fold, Hero calls $0.11, fold

Flop: ($0.38, 2 players) 8 5 4
BB checks, Hero bets $0.26, BB calls $0.26

Turn: ($0.90, 2 players) 6
BB checks, Hero bets $0.45, BB raises to $0.90, Hero calls $0.45

River: ($2.70, 2 players) 7
BB bets $1.35, Hero raises to $4.05, BB calls $1.59 and is all-in


H2.

Revolution Gaming Network - $0.04 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: $4.45
SB: $8.52
BB: $2.42
UTG: $4.58
Hero (CO): $3.56

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.04

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.06) Hero has K K

fold, Hero raises to $0.12, fold, SB calls $0.10, BB calls $0.08

Flop: ($0.36, 3 players) 7 4 T
SB checks, BB bets $0.36, Hero raises to $0.72????

H3.

Revolution Gaming Network - $0.04 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

UTG: $3.88
CO: $4.00
BTN: $2.47
SB: $4.74
Hero (BB): $4.50

SB posts SB $0.02, Hero posts BB $0.04

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.06) Hero has K K

fold, CO raises to $0.11, BTN calls $0.11, fold, Hero raises to $0.46, CO calls $0.35, fold

Flop: ($1.05, 2 players) A 2 Q
Hero bets $0.70, CO raises to $1.93, ???

H4.
Revolution Gaming Network - $0.04 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

CO: $1.77
Hero (BTN): $4.00
SB: $4.66
BB: $7.12
UTG: $4.59
MP: $0.94

SB posts SB $0.02, BB posts BB $0.04

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.06) Hero has K J

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.10, fold, BB calls $0.06

Flop: ($0.22, 2 players) 4 J 3
BB checks, Hero bets $0.15, BB raises to $0.41,???

Yeah, so any comments are greatly appreciated... let me know if i can answer any questions.

Given reads, I'd shove turn hand one as we have plenty of fold equity and there's no a lot he'll expect us to carry on betting over two streets for value.

Hand 2 sizing is horrible, also reload pre. I'd go big at $1 or so and shove turns.

Hand 3 is pretty ugly but I'd probably just bet 60c, fold to raise.

Hand 4 I call and call him down.

Cool, thanx for advice pascal. i have to go to work, but i have some follow-ups for ya

hand 1 - pre isn't too terrible i guess. Flop is fine. Check back turn. River jam good obviously.
hand 2 - Raise flop bigger than min. +/-$1.10 is fine.
hand 3 - cbet a lot smaller if you are going to cbet. As played just fold.
hand 4 - call.

Originally Posted by daven

hand 1 - pre isn't too terrible i guess. Flop is fine. Check back turn. River jam good obviously.
hand 2 - Raise flop bigger than min. +/-$1.10 is fine.
hand 3 - cbet a lot smaller if you are going to cbet. As played just fold.
hand 4 - call.

I agree

i guess i really need to watch my sizing in 3b pots huh?

Maybe you guys need more info, but H1. he had KdQd that shows a couple things.
one is that he's a thinking player capable of semi-bluffing w / equity.

And he doesn't seem to mind being oop', that could be a tendency i could exploit right?

It just bothers me that he puts me in spots where I'm really not sure what to do...

he showed up with KQs in H1, I don't think that shows that he is capable of being a thinking player of semi-bluffing but rather a dumb fish who is badly loose agressive and doesn't like to fold hands (I mean he represents a 7 here and a 7 is simply very rarely in his preflop range, he wouldn't play the hand that way with a set, also why are you betting here?)

This makes me want to go to showdown light, bet for value with very marginal hands, c/r or slowplay big hands and simply fold all hands that I think are useless as I don't think he's going to fold often.

Hand 2 I'd reraise higher, like 1.3.

hand 3 Id just fold, board sucks, KK is same thing as bottom pair in this case

hand 4, given reads, I reraise very and be looking to get it in, if he flopped a set or something then so be it. Don't like calling because there's too many potential scare cards on turn and river that could come that would stop action.

Hi WeldPhaser,

Maybe my perspective can help?

H1: A goofy hand, and one of my dumber ones I believe. Generally speaking something between hoping my equity would come through and playing on what I believed was your tendency to fold too easily (see: H4.) Seemed to me you were one of the more "sensible" players who would fold as default value if faced with enough ambiguity/uncertainty. The c/minraise would have been part of that (not specifically to represent a 7 btw) as the minraise would be so out of the ordinary for me. Let's say you don't have a 9, and I shove the river. What would you have done?

H2: Coolerized.

H3: Don't remember specifically, but with TPTK I probably figured that if you didn't like the A you weren't putting any more in anyway, and if I flat there are lots of cards I don't wanna see on the turn.

H4: QJ.

Oh, was going to mention...

Your general assessment is correct I think. I do at least attempt to think, and I do have some knowledge of the game. Not saying the thinking makes sense, but hey. Perhaps a bit more than the fish who can't fold as theorized. (Denial?)

Overall I was kinda expecting you to start getting stickier and start playing back more. Didn't really happen. I think it would have helped your cause.

Lemme know if there are more hands you were curious about, or hands with some of the other 4nl dudes. I think I've got a handle on at least some of them.

Why is this guy playing 4nl?

Iunno...

H1- I raise pre. I do like betting the turn but I prolly shove when he raises.

H2- Call the flop cuz we hold the Kd and he's either donking full pot with sets or air or a huge combo draw which basically constists of 89dd or JTdd. We're probably behind his range but I'm not folding until I what happens on the turn.

H3- what daven said.

H4- see H3.

*more editing* meant J9dd

After reading the rest of the thread and seeing he showed up with KQ in hand 1 I feel different about hand 2.

*edit* Holy crap... props to the nooch for showing up in this one. How did you find out about this?

Originally Posted by supa

...How did you find out about this?

Boredom + Google?

Actually I've frequently found my way to FlopTurnRiver when looking up poker stuff, just never posted anything.

H1 i prefer to raise pre but limping would almost certainly be +EV. I CB the flop smaller, $0.2 at most. i actually don't mind checking back the turn (unless you think firing 3 will be +EV) despite picking up a ton of equity, as just about anything that calls flop won't fold this turn. plus we prevent villain C/Ring us if that happened to be his plan. river obviously standard w/the nuts

hand 2 if you're going to raise flop then raise at least 2.5x, and don't do it unless you have already made an assessment of what villain will lead/jam with and are comfortable calling it off.

hand 3 i'd CB/F around $0.6 versus this villain

hand 4 i definitely take another card because the value range he's trying to rep is very thin and we have a read that this player likes to C/R and is aggressive.

Originally Posted by Pascal

Hand 2 sizing is horrible, also reload pre. I'd go big at $1 or so and shove turns.

Hand 3 is pretty ugly but I'd probably just bet 60c, fold to raise.

Hand 4 I call and call him down.

glad we agree . ignoring hand 1 obv

it's totally awesome ya showed up here nooch... good playing too BTW , i hope ya don't mind i used ur SN.... I just couldn't help it ur name has the perfect villain-esk nemesis quality to it..

you def put me in a couple interesting spots. take H1. for ex. what was ur thought on the turn after i called?

And really after H2 when ya showed up wit TT, ya got me to fold H4.

on h4 i really think your FOS , i just think u know my cbet range is almost my whole range , i would n't think im folding this spot very often , but i suppose u got in my head a bit. Touche'

Originally Posted by the_nooch

Lemme know if there are more hands you were curious about, or hands with some of the other 4nl dudes. I think I've got a handle on at least some of them.

for sure . I would def like your input on some villains @ the 4nl ... My skype is Weldphaser also..

Hit me up nooch

Originally Posted by WeldPhaser

i hope ya don't mind i used ur SN.... I just couldn't help it ur name has the perfect villain-esk nemesis quality to it..

Don't mind -- although I never realized it sounded sinister to anyone...

Originally Posted by WeldPhaser

...take H1. for ex. what was ur thought on the turn after i called?

Well that was a problem -- not much to think at that point. Like I said it was probably a maneuver intended to create ambiguity -- possibly with some SPR concern thrown in to make it worse. Problem is I didn't have much to go on for your hand either at that point, and a check/minraise does absolutely nothing to clear anything up for me. If anything was confusing about that it's probably due to the fact that it was just dumb.

Originally Posted by WeldPhaser

And really after H2 when ya showed up wit TT, ya got me to fold H4.

on h4 i really think your FOS , i just think u know my cbet range is almost my whole range , i would n't think im folding this spot very often , but i suppose u got in my head a bit. Touche'

Seems like a lot of trouble to try and level you with misinformation about one hand.

Originally Posted by the_nooch

Seems like a lot of trouble to try and level you with misinformation about one hand.

yeah, to a degree, but the bootom line is ya kept me guessing.