[5NL] 77 flop an overpair in 4 way pot. What to do?

Originally Posted by eugmac

I appreciate that you're thinking of the preflop pot odds you're getting offered but just how close to ATC do you mean by that?

Between 80 - 85% of hands...not calling with T2o, 94o-92o, 84o-82o, 74o-72o, 63o-62o, 53o-52o, 42o+, 32o. Not calling with like J4o-J2o, Q4o-Q2o, K4o-K2o either.

So I guess most of the 63/62/32 combo's are taken out of my B range as well.

Originally Posted by Cobra_1878

I will flat in the BB here with

Originally Posted by Cobra_1878

Between 80 - 85% of hands [, except TT+ and AK. Will sometimes 3bet with AQ/KQ]... not calling with T2o, 94o-92o, 84o-82o, 74o-72o, 63o-62o, 53o-52o, 42o+, 32o. Not calling with like J4o-J2o, Q4o-Q2o, K4o-K2o either.

So I guess most of the 63/62/32 combo's are taken out of my B range as well.

On the flop:

Range A) 22-33, 66, 54.

Range B) 63, 62, 23

Range C) 77-99, any 6x hand with no 2 or 3, A3

Range D) Everything else. Pretty much ATC that haven't connected with the flop. Would probably call one bet, depending on bet size, with 2 broadways.

That what you're looking for?

PRE:
{ 99-22,AQs-A2s,K2s+,Q2s+,J2s+,T2s+,92s+,82s+,72s+,62s+,52s+,4 2s+,32s,AQo-A2o,K5o+,Q5o+,J5o+,T5o+,95o+,85o+,75o+,64o+,54o }
is 944 combos

A) { 66,33-22,54s,54o } is 25 combos or 25/944 =
2.6% of your range

B) { 63s-62s,32s } is 6 combos or 6/944 =
0.6% of your range

C) { 99-77, A6s, K6s, Q6s, J6s, T6s, 96s, 86s, 76s, 62s+, A6o, K6o, Q6o, J6o, T6o, 96o, 86o, 76o, 64o+ } is 142 combos or 142/944 =
15.0% of your range

D) the rest is 771 combos or 771/944 =
81.7% or your range

See the way you're just throwing away money a huge majority of the time?

Just hands that you do NOT c/f is 173 combos
A) 25/173 = 14.5%
B) 6/173 = 3.5%
C) 142/173 = 82.1%

See that even when you're not throwing away money, you're playing a weak hand OOP, trying for a cheap showdown?

Those 2 things are not my point.

My point is to now look at those ranges and think about what would be better.

So, now that you see your range broken down like this, what changes do you think would improve the EV of your entire range?

Start by thinking of your ABCD range pre, in the BB with the villains and action described ITT. You said you'd tighten up, right? So how tight? Once you have that, then pick the range that calls this action pre and apply your knowledge of the flop and break that range down into ABCD.

Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey

My point is to now look at those ranges and think about what would be better.

So, now that you see your range broken down like this, what changes do you think would improve the EV of your entire range?

Start by thinking of your ABCD range pre, in the BB with the villains and action described ITT. You said you'd tighten up, right? So how tight? Once you have that, then pick the range that calls this action pre and apply your knowledge of the flop and break that range down into ABCD.

OK, I have given this another go.

I think my range may still be a little wide...we will see. Can't really fold too many hands getting 5:1.

Calling range pre is now; TT-22,AQs-A2s,KTs+,QTs+,J9s+,T8s+, 97s+,86s+,75s+,65s,54s,AQo-ATo,KTo+,QTo+,J9o+,T8o+,
97o+,86o+,75o+,65o,54o = 406 combo's.

On flop;

Range A) 66, 33-22, 54s, 54o - 34 combo's...8.3% of my range?

Range B) Not many hands in my range here I want to play for a big pot with. Maybe 99-TT, obv depending on turn & river cards - 12 combo's...2.9%?

Range C) 88-77, 55-44, 65s, 65o, 75s, 75o, 76s, 76o, 86s, 86o, A6s - 92 combo's...22.6%?

Range D) AQs-A7s,A5s-A2s,KTs+,QTs+,J9s+,T8s+,97s+,87s,AQo-ATo,KTo+,QTo+,J9o+,T8o+,97o+,87o - 268 combo's...66%?

I think my range pre hits a lot more boards, and are much stronger hands, the majority of the time. I doubt this flop is good for many people's ranges pre in this situation.

Edit - not sure if I have calculated my %'s correctly.