2/4$ @ Stars, 2 hands i think i palyed poorly

PokerStars 2/4 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J, A.
3 folds, Hero raises, SB 3-bets, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) J, 4, 6 (3 players)
SB bets, BB calls, Hero raises, SB calls, BB calls.

Turn: (7.50 BB) 6 (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, SB raises, BB folds, Hero calls.

River: (11.50 BB) 5 (2 players)
SB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 13.50 BB

i think i missplayed the Turn here, i was almost feeling he had Jacks full but....maybe he could have AKs maybe he had AJ with the A of clubs, since i played a lot Hands with this Player i know he would have raised with an Overpair and even with AJ on the Flop, so the only hands i beat are AK and AQ with the A of clubs, is this enough to call?
Dont ask me why i called the River that was just stupid, no question.

PokerStars 2/4 Hold'em (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8, 7.
1 fold, MP calls, Button calls, SB raises, Hero calls, MP 3-bets, Button calls, SB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (12 SB) 8, 5, A (4 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP bets, Button folds, SB calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (7.50 BB) Q (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP bets, SB folds, Hero calls.

River: (9.50 BB) Q (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 11.50 BB

first, is this OK to Play Preflop for one bet from the Blind first with 1:7 and after his 3 bet with 11:1?
So i hit 2. pair so kicker and i get 14:1 to ine for a call, is this enough here to peel for a 7 or 8 in a reverse implied odds hand?
On the Turn i got a low Flushdraw and gettin 1:8,5 is this enough to peel for 7s 8s and a low Flush?
On the River i would alomst fold, would be folding correct getting 1:10 the Way he palyed this Hand, the Player was semi loose passive and smelled a lttle bit fishy.

First of all, welcome to SSHE. I saw your hands on 2+2 earlier today but I'll comment on them here.

Im not sure if I am disciplined enough to fold to villians c/r in hand 1 on the turn. I probably peel the river but once the board four flushes I definitely just c/f. I guess if you think villian is a total loose maniac that could have anything here you could actually b/f. But Id believe I was beat 99% of the time on the river from the previous action.

Hand 2 pf is very marginal. Plugging some ranges in for your 3 opponents I get 87o as holding 16% equity PF. Therefore, you are getting sufficient odds to call. Myself, I probably fold the flop as this is like you said, a reverse implied odds hand. The turn is an easy fold IMO as you beat absolutely nothing and have to be drawing extremely thin.

Once again, welcome to FTR.

thank you bigspenda73, yeah i begin to post my hand son different Forums because you can get more opinions and look out for the best ones, i was a a Poster only on german Forums @ the Pokertips.org, and there arent a lot experienced FL SS Players so i will Post my Hands also here and on 2+2 in the future and of course giving advice on hands where i think i can help other poeple for improving their Game.

I like your Post. On hand 1 i think the same as you.After the hand with my Read on this Player who i think he also knows that im a serious Player this was an easy laydown on the Turn since i had no single club in my hand and on the River of course this was the easiest laydwon ever, no question about that.

Hand 2 is becoming an even more easy laydown on the Flop the more i think about it, given that a unknown(the Palyer wasnt very noticeable wich generally means that hes a good player imho) Preflop limp raiser has a range JJ+ and betting the Turn without hesitation when 2 Palyers are after him to Act i thin i can over 50% sure that he has a Set of Aces so that becomes an easy fold, given him that Hand he could not have a heart in his Hand so the Turn is a call imho because if he have Kings or maybe jacks i still have 5 outs right?And if he has AA or KK i have also outs for the Flush so that i becomes an easyier call on the Turn then on the Flop. If he made this Play with AK or something with maybe the Kh im in bad shape but in think a unknown would make this Play to 90% with JJ+, what do you think?


Writing this text i realised i have to work on getting faster an and better reads on the Palyers to make better decisions in hands like this.This makes even more sense since i had a very good read on the Palyer in the first Hand and did not act on it.

Probably the next session i begin to start maing Notes on sheet of paper for each Player and look how it works.

King regards Toni

Calling the flop in hand 2 is probably the easiest call of them all. I fold this preflop everytime because it gets you in situations like this. In 6 max, cold calling with crap blows pretty hard.

Hand 1 is Meh. Depending on a read raising the flop isn't my favorite move, as he will probably fire second barrels with AK here more often than not and you pretty much are going to showdown regardless of the board. I really don't like calling the turn check/raise. His hand screams monster of the drawing dead kind and even if he has AcJ I don't like the call. If the guy is a maniac then obv I call it down. Once you call the turn you have to call the river.

Originally Posted by elipsesjeff

Once you call the turn you have to call the river.

On hand 1? Really?

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

Originally Posted by elipsesjeff

Once you call the turn you have to call the river.

On hand 1? Really?

it becomes a 2bb decision a lot of times when woundering weather to call the turn bet...
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IMO hand 1 it stinks ass that he has a big hand that's a typical tagg monster line... so i think you're beat... but jeff is right you cal lthe turn you gots to call the river... i said same thing as Jeff but i agree with him on this one...

hand 2 just plan sucks... i never even see the flop...

You beat a bluff(semi) on the turn, you don't beat one on the river

cold calling with crap blows pretty hard.

i was in BB

but jeff is right you call the turn you gots to call the river

I dont think i have to call the River here, im sure he isnt bluffing so the best what i can Hope for is a tie vs random is a call vs this Palyer ist a easy fold.

I thinking about just calling the Flop....whats better in calling Flop, whats about the BB, isnt it better to raise the Flop and on the Turn if the sB bets out again making him fold a 5 outer or KQ or domething like that because hes fearing a raise?Of course this only works with a Read on the BB the Flopraise was kind of reflex. But i think youre right if i raise the Turn and sB has a really strong hand i give himthe chance to checkraise the Turn an he got extra bets out of me, is that why yopu would just call the Flop, if you call the Flop whats your Plan on the Turn?

given that the pot will in return become large and make it almost impossible to fold the river for a bet in that spot... you are looking at a 2bb call on the turn... if you are sure he isn't bluffing then he's probably not bluffing the turn raise either... i mean there are some players that have the balls to c/r the turn as a bluff but it's rare, and even fewer of those players will fire the river....

you're right because they know in game theory that unless they have a read you tend to fold a lot on the river when you miss but call the turn... then they will probably give up on the river thinking you are going to call that last bet because you have given every indication you are going to with the turn call...

simply put i think that a majority of the time you'll be drawing dead or close to it to a majority of players at 2/4 that c/r the turn... so if you want to call the turn you have to look them up on the river as well... given you do call the turn raise... getting like 12.5:1 on the river.. You only have to be good one time in almost 13 hands to make it a break even call... someone correct me if my math is off... on the turn the board pairs and it completes a flush... what can you call the turn and fold the river with here? AcJx if it misses? IMO i think that you are pretty much fucked here with AsJs and should fold the c/r, you call the turn i don't see why you would be folding the river given that if he had u beat it was probably already on the turn...