WILD WEST WEREWOLF

the werewolf infestation has begun in the city of DEADWOLF. there are already rumors of multiple wolves taking up inhabitance. in september the town has scheduled its first meeting to discuss how to solve this problem
Game Starts MID September

Gameplay
Old timey justice prevails in this lawless camp town. Besides the usual mob lynchings, players can challenge any other player to a duel, where only 1 can survive.

You can challenge anyone to a duel at any time during the day phase by CHALLENGING PLAYER X TO A DUEL. Any challenge means the challenger and the challengee will meet at sunrise (basically the next day, when the next night phase is complete) for a duel. The first challenge issued on any day is the only challenge. Any other challenges will be ignored until the original duel is settled, and then the townies will have the option to challenge anyone to a duel. If a player set to be in a duel dies at night, the duel is cancelled and the game carries on as usual.

When a challenge for a duel is posted, the current day and night carry out as usual. A duel means the next day, the village must pick between the 2 players in the duel. There is no lynching, only deciding who dies in the duel. Voting happens in the same way, the only difference being you are not free to vote for anyone; your vote choice must be one of the duelists. Please bold your vote and try to avoid writing 'lynch' so everyone is clear it is a duel, not a normal lynch day. When one player reaches a majority, he will die and then it will be night time. You can challenge someone to a duel while a duel is going on if there is no duel already scheduled for the next day.

Special Roles
There are some unscrupulous dastards among the villagers who, despite being in agreement with the village on the need to vanquish the wolves, have the potential to commit criminal acts. The 3 criminal types are as follows:

Peeping tom - creeps around and can see the role of anyone requested
Horse Thief - steels a horse so the person can't show up to the town gathering, effectively silencing anyone for an entire day.
Murderer - cold blooded killer zimmerman style


To commit a crime, the criminal must PM me during the night phase. The night phase begins when a majority vote has been reached or when the time has run out. The night phase will last until I post in the game thread about sunrise. This means the wolves could immediately submit their kill to lower the chance a criminal has acted. I will not be waiting for criminals to PM me, either they have or they havent.

Each crime can be committed in unlimited number of nights (but only 1 per night). The criminal will never be revealed in the story, but some of their criminal acts will be.

The catch is that any player who has committed a criminal act will immediately lose any duel at sunrise. This is because their crime(s) have not gone unwitnessed, and will come to the light during the pressure of a duel. Crimes are usually unpunished, but when the mob mentality sets in while deciding a duel, the villagers can't help but bring up past transgressions.

When a criminal does enter a duel, he will be snap killed at sunrise and the day will continue as a normal day. Usually, a duel will take up an entire day and will be followed by the night phase. This is not the case when a criminal is challenged.

MAYHEM: When there are 6 players remaining, any villager can commit any crime ! This means that anyone (not a wolf) has the ability to act as a seer, vigilante, or silencer. However, if someone challenges you to a duel, you will die immediately at sunrise as you have committed a criminal act! Aiya!!!

The MVP of this game will be given a special role in the next game I host.

Specific rules will be posted in the actual game thread. Feel free to ask questions and discuss balance issues, although I'm pretty set on this format. This is my first game ever modding so bare with me !

sign up here and now!

Strategic notes:

• Duels are high stakes. They only allow the village to select from 2 people, which means if a villager challenges another villager, the village has a wasted day. There's no escaping a duel without someone dying. Challenge carefully
• Criminals immediately dying when challenged to a duel gives wolves incentive to enter duels
• If a criminal is challenged, he will die immediately at sunrise, which means at night he can commit 1 last crime.
• Being a criminal can be useful but if you do commit a crime, you can be stricken down with any player challenging you. All it takes is 1 sentence
• Wolves can challenge wolves if they want to trade a life for credibility
• There is strategy involved in how long the wolves take to decide their night kill, however there will be a maximum time they are allowed
• Unlike most games, there is a direct incentive for villagers to survive to late game, and that is to gain criminal powers during MAYHEM
• If you have committed a crime, and are challenged to a duel during the MAYHEM period, you can murder (or silence) anyone at night
• During MAYHEM, as it is more likely villagers will have committed crimes, it might be a bad idea to challenge someone to a duel who unless you are a wolf
• Similiarly, wolves should try to enter duels when it is likely most villagers have commit crimes. However, people should know this and suspect when a wolf is doing this
• Anyone can be silenced going into a duel, including one of the players in the duel

I think you should delay it by a few days (like September 1st nice round day) so I can actually play properly this time.

the date is flexible but not starting before aug 25 =]

okay, I definitely want to play but I get back from my trip on August 30th, and need a few days to get over the jet lag and adjust into my fall school schedule. If everyone else wants to do it sooner then count me out, 'cause I'd never expect you to change the date just for me.

But if sometime later in the first week of September works better for everyone else, then I'm game.

I'll play, don't care when.

Seems pretty imba toward wolves. The village gets one less power role (silencing clearly isn't nearly as good as protection), and the ones that remain come with a lot of caveats. I'm thinking maybe the wolf percentage is lower to make up for this? But that gets rid of a lot of the strategy on the wolves part because giving themselves up is going to be much less often a good strategy when they're so massively outnumbered by town.

Also, it seems like duels might never happen? It seems like it's only good for wolves, which means wolves will never do it either because it'll bring heat on themselves. Why would a villager want to limit the lynch options down to two for the next day, especially when doing so might get a special killed (remember, most early reads are "either he's wolf or he's special," so a challenge is really risky for any town-aligned player).

Don't get me wrong, I think it's awesome you're shaking things up and I'm willing to do all I can think of to make it work because I like all the wrinkles so long as we can get them to add to the game.

Saw "Deadwolf", typed /in.

That's a lot to read..

LOL, I get to be a popularity contest vigilante whenever i please? Lets do this shit! IN IN IN IN IN

PS: No one cares surviva, Im dueling mother fuckers.

Do i duel ppl i suspect are less popular than me...or do i duel ppl i suspect are wolves though. Hrmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. DONT CARE, MAYHM IS A COMMIN. I AM, THE DANGER. WA HA HA.

i'm murderer, imma gonna challenge every mofo to a duel, then imma gonna kill 'em overnight so i never have to fight - that's how it works, right?

note - only skimmed
note - in

Originally Posted by daven

i'm murderer, imma gonna challenge every mofo to a duel, then imma gonna kill 'em overnight so i never have to fight - that's how it works, right?

note - only skimmed
note - in

Note - you can't do that.

I'm developing a game that's even less standard than this. There are so many roles and night activities that it's taking a lot of revisions for me to be comfortable with the logistics/balance/strategy elements/etc of it. I figure this buys me some time because we won't want to do two non-standard games in a row, so I expect to maybe be modding a game in Nov/Dec area.

I also want a town of 30+, so it'll take a veritable werewolf marketing campaign before I can do it.

^^

whoa.

I wish my friends were as lame as me. Would be nice to spice up this sausage fest a bit. Maybe I can convince one or two to join in... That is, if you're okay with green players, gabe.

eta: actually I don't think this game is lame at all. self-deprecation is just second nature to me. but I wanted to make that clear, lol.

Haven't read yet, I'm in.

Don't forget the working stiffs have a labour day long weekend on the 2nd of september. That could slow the pool at the start.

are you going to use this game to test out your theory on editing?

Originally Posted by surviva316

Seems pretty imba toward wolves
....
Also, it seems like duels might never happen?

if duels never happen, then criminals can run rampant. so more murders and peeping tom creeping on people. your thoughts on it being imba for wolves are noted. luckily there is plenty of time and between start date (sept 1ish i gues?) to tinker with things

Originally Posted by daven

i'm murderer, imma gonna challenge every mofo to a duel, then imma gonna kill 'em overnight so i never have to fight - that's how it works, right?

note - only skimmed
note - in

this isnt clear in the rules. for the sake of the story, lets say if you murder someone at night (or a wolf kills them), it is only apparent at sunrise when the duel begins, so momentarily you would be a criminal in a duel and the village will have you killed. a criminal who issues a duel always dies.

also bonus strategic note: if a wolf gets put in a duel, the wolves can kill who challenged their wolf. lots of leveling opportunities here...

Originally Posted by aubreymcfate

^^

whoa.

I wish my friends were as lame as me. Would be nice to spice up this sausage fest a bit. Maybe I can convince one or two to join in... That is, if you're okay with green players, gabe.

eta: actually I don't think this game is lame at all. self-deprecation is just second nature to me. but I wanted to make that clear, lol.

im cool with anyone and everyone playing. i have even mentioned this to some of my poker homies so maybe they'll hop in. i have friends that might think its lame but im unashamed of how much fun i have. now i get to have fun modding and i get to give back some since people are always happy to mod when i play

unlimited editing wont be allowed but i'll likely not punish small edits. instead of arguing with people in the editing thread im just going to enact rules i think are smart and we'll see what happens (i expect no one to abuse anything)

Modding is just as much fun as playing.

another q - the horse thief can silence someone for a day. Is that silenced person eligible to be lynched that day?

yes, anything is possible. would suck to be in a duel and get silenced too

cool. i like the dueling... it's like organized bandwagons.

I take it we won't know when someone has been silenced. It's not like someone would come back to town telling everyone they stole a horse and are a criminal.

well I assume gabe would notify us when criminal actions have been committed and whom they've affected. otherwise we'd just waste the whole day frothing at the mouth about where so-and-so went off to.

ill make it obvious when someone doesnt show up for the town meeting because theyre dead or their horse got stolen. no info on peeping tom though. (s)hes too stealthy

Originally Posted by gabe

if duels never happen, then criminals can run rampant. so more murders and peeping tom creeping on people. your thoughts on it being imba for wolves are noted. luckily there is plenty of time and between start date (sept 1ish i gues?) to tinker with things

I guess what I'm saying is that challenging people to duels is clearly advantageous for wolves, and since everyone's win condition involves not being suspected of being a wolf, no one will want to do something in the public eye that is a clear advantage to the wolves, unless the wolves are desperate for some reason. I also wonder if duel days will change the dynamic of discussion so much on those days that the village won't be able to get anything done since such a small percentage of players are under pressure.

One possible to solution to both of these is to mandate that every even day is a duel day. This way, someone HAS to challenge someone else to a duel, so the town will surely peer pressure someone into doing it. Maybe they can't lynch until a duel is setup, so if no duel is set by sundown, then it's a no-lynch for the village, the wolves get a kill, and the town starts all over again.

Another idea I thought of is to have an unlynchable wolf role, though this would be cumbersome. I thought maybe if a majority is reached on that wolf, then that wolf instead lynches the person of their choice, then gets the standard night kill, then if the vig kills him at night, it's a 1-for-1. So basically the village is incentivized as all fuck to find this wolf through dueling instead of giving up 3 villagers for 1 wolf. I don't think that works; I'm just going with the flow of the creative process.

A possible idea to balance the game: make the criminals where bullet-proof vests. This balances the fact that there's no angel and it makes the wolves more desperate to start duels. I can't decide if they'd be single bullet proof or can't be night killed at all ever, or if they all have their own night kill defenses. Maybe the vig 1-for-1s, the seer is 1-shot bulletproof and the Horse Thief always manages to steel a horse and get away in the nick of time. If only there were a way for him to steal the WOLF's horse without auto-confirming one of the wolves, but that seems tough. Maybe he steals the wolf's horse and stays low for the next day, so there are two people the village has to wonder might be the wolf with neither there to defend themselves, and that leaves the wolves a day to coordinate accordingly. Hell, maybe the Horse Thief could steal the horse he PMed the mod to steal, steal the wolf's horse AND stay low for a day, so that 3 suspects are silenced the next day, haha.

These wrinkles probably it imba towards the village. Maybe if each has their special variety of bulletproof, and there's an Counter-lynching wolf special role combined with mandatory even day duel days, that'll make for a ton of incentive to duel + give both sides some pretty strong roles.

Or maybe I'm just bat shit crazy.

those are some good ideas that i'll think about. but im not definitely convinced it needs changing.

"I guess what I'm saying is that challenging people to duels is clearly advantageous for wolves"
this isnt necessarily true. it would be true if everyone was in equally unskilled player, but there are tons of skilled WW vets hanging around. because a wolf doesnt want to get into a duel (from the grand point of view), the village can deduce that the survivor of a duel is usually cleared town. clearing villagers is good for the town. but also a wolf can see that a duel is a way to clear their name, so they might want to risk starting a duel themselves, and bonus incentive they might hit a criminal and get an immediate villager kill

i think its cool to have the rules posted early so people can start planning the advanced strategies. i also like the idea of letting the wolves know their role a day or 2 before the game starts. so maybe the game kicks off sept 1 or 2 and signups end aug 29ish

The only way I could see a villager challenging someone to a duel is if it's advantageous to the town. Seeing as how the only people who know everyone's alignment is the wolves, a villager can't know that they're getting themselves into a coinflip against a wolf, so the only person that could claim to be giving the village a 50/50 chance at a wolf is a wolf. Everyone else is just taking who they think might be a wolf, and instead of lynching them, cutting the odds of them dying in half and sharing the other half of that probability with themselves (a known villager from their perspective). At least if they can't get a lynch wagon going against their favorite target, then they're not choosing between someone they think is a wolf and a known villager--they're choosing between someone they think is a wolf and an unknown but equally probable field.

So I think that wolves will want to get in duels, but have no way to argue that it's a villager motive because a villager would never feel that doing it gives them a better chance then just trying to lynch the suspect outright.

Bulletproofing every special is probably extreme. 1-shot protection for seer and 1-for-1'ing the vig is probably all the village needs since the Horse Thief isn't really a power role so much as it is a way to get wuf to shut the fuck up.

Just playin' wuf

Originally Posted by aubreymcfate

Maybe I can convince one or two to join in...

owlface

Keep in mind that you were handpicked. Only the rarest of people have what it takes to acknowledge the greatness of WW and the dedication to keep it unblemished

"so the only person that could claim to be giving the village a 50/50 chance at a wolf is a wolf"

"a villager would never feel that doing it gives them a better chance then just trying to lynch the suspect outright."

no, we have skilled players that can make nice reads on people. if they know the village is making a huge mistake lynching someone, they can throw down a duel challenge instead.


also i think you might behave in a certain way when trying to make it to mayhem and MVP, but other players might take a very different approach

when a duel goes down the village should be very interested in making the right decision. it shouldnt be left to the 2 participants to make all the case. this will make people take sides in a very interesting way that will hopefully help the village sniff out wolfiness


i cant wait to see who makes it to mayhem. if its 4 wolves ill feel dumb...but like i said im still considering small changes

I have no comments about imba and am willing to just trust gabe and test it out. Most of what is learned about the game comes after a trial run

That said, there will be a dramatic shift in my play. There always is a moderate evolution after each game, but this will be much bigger. I finally need to merge my different styles and stick to a more theoretically sound approach instead of just trying to be uber villager

Originally Posted by gabe

when a duel goes down the village should be very interested in making the right decision. it shouldnt be left to the 2 participants to make all the case. this will make people take sides in a very interesting way that will hopefully help the village sniff out wolfiness


i cant wait to see who makes it to mayhem. if its 4 wolves ill feel dumb...but like i said im still considering small changes

If MAYHEM is 6 players then wouldn't 4 remaining wolves already have won on the previous Day when there were 8 players remaining?

depending on the criminals who are out, a tie between villagers and wolves might not mean the game is over.

example: 6 town and 4 wolves. someone challenges someone to a duel. a villager gets lynched and another gets eaten. so its now 4 v 4 with a duel coming up at sunrise. the horse thief silences a wolf, so the wolves cant reach a majority on the duel unless they convince a villager to vote on their side. village bags a wolf, wolves eat someone at night, then its 3v3 during mayhem. obviously its very hard for the village to ship it in this situation but they have outs. i will try to make a clear win condition in the game thread


tie votes for lynching and duels will be settled same as usual

Originally Posted by wufwugy

owlface

Keep in mind that you were handpicked. Only the rarest of people have what it takes to acknowledge the greatness of WW and the dedication to keep it unblemished

I hear you. Still, I know one person that might be a good fit. She already thinks the game sounds super interesting. And she's a big gamer, so she has the necessary stamina.

My only worry is that this game is too nonstandard for a beginner. Hmm..

IN and 100% able to promise full participation

Originally Posted by aubreymcfate

My only worry is that this game is too nonstandard for a beginner. Hmm..

Meh, it might make her all the more capable. We'll be approaching it one way, and if she's a big gamer, maybe her ability to come at the mechanics fresh will allow her to break some fallacies we would follow as people used to games going a certain way.

Originally Posted by JKDS

LOL, I get to be a popularity contest vigilante whenever i please? Lets do this shit! IN IN IN IN IN

PS: No one cares surviva, Im dueling mother fuckers.

nah bro, you'll challenge someone to a duel at sunrise tomorrow, but we'll lynch you today
no duel for you

Goddam this one looks fun and I'm gonna miss it. May I request access to the dead thread when it gets up and running?

I'm baaaccckkk. In.

I challenge boog to a duel!

Originally Posted by BooG690

I'm baaaccckkk. In.

Boog is back from Songdowon / Nk labor camp / whatevs!

I'm in but also confused. Shooting someone in the face might clear things up.

Originally Posted by Luco

I'm in but also confused.

jkds made a joke about starting a duel. this isnt the actual game thread. the game starts in a few weeks

and ongbonga if you got time to read the dead thread then you have time to play!

I'm in, btw.

Originally Posted by gabe

jkds made a joke about starting a duel. this isnt the actual game thread.

Well thanks for clearing that up but that's not what I'm confused about. More like roles, strategy, balance, that sort of thing. More than happy to figure it out as we go though.

Seriously, I'd need a major derp to miss the giant letters declaring the start date

Originally Posted by Luco

Well thanks for clearing that up but that's not what I'm confused about.

OOOO ok =p

we are all confused about balance id think. but it will work. wolves gonna die

Originally Posted by gabe

OOOO ok =p

we are all confused about balance id think. but it will work. wolves gonna die

With a name like deadwolf there should be some lycanthrope fatalities. But as long as there's death in general it's gonna be fun on a bun!

VVV super important question about the game - am I allowed to say pew pew for firing my gun or does it have to be bang bang? I know pew pew is more of a laser noise, so I don't want to spoil things...

Originally Posted by Luco

With a name like deadwolf there should be some lycanthrope fatalities. But as long as there's death in general it's gonna be fun on a bun!

VVV super important question about the game - am I allowed to say pew pew for firing my gun or does it have to be bang bang? I know pew pew is more of a laser noise, so I don't want to spoil things...

bada bing is my vote

Originally Posted by Luco

With a name like deadwolf there should be some lycanthrope fatalities. But as long as there's death in general it's gonna be fun on a bun!

VVV super important question about the game - am I allowed to say pew pew for firing my gun or does it have to be bang bang? I know pew pew is more of a laser noise, so I don't want to spoil things...

It's brap brap these days old man.

Originally Posted by ImSavy

It's brap brap these days old man.

Old? I'm a spry 29

Originally Posted by surviva316

I'm in, btw.

So you play his game and not mine. Fcuk you Sir Viva!

brap brap represent

Sounds mental, I'm in.

random thought I haven't considered too deeply: what if the wolves could not night kill anyone during mayhem? or something similar. I'm going to think about it

Originally Posted by gabe

random thought I haven't considered too deeply: what if the wolves could not night kill anyone during mayhem? or something similar. I'm going to think about it

Then the village just wouldn't commit crimes.

Of course, this assumes that people care about strategy more than just goin' balls out and having fun, and it seems like it's more-so the latter.

But I love all these cool twists and brainstorming. Keep them comin'!

Originally Posted by gabe

and ongbonga if you got time to read the dead thread then you have time to play!

I'm unavailable between 7th and 14th, I'll be on a boat in the middle of nowhere with zero chance of internet. There's a good chance this will be during the climax of the game. I can't sign up knowing I'm going to miss the most important stage. I wanna play, but it's bad timing for me.

gotcha yea u can glimpse the secret threads. but i dont want anyone else to use this as a reason not to play, so they can just sweat those threads

gonna sit this one out, but you guys have fun.

gonna sit this one and probably the next one out as harvest time so won't have time toplay......although the chance of becoming the horse stealer and nicking wuf's horse everyday does appeal but would seem to be obvious.Horse stealer using this strat would be certain to be MVP for gabe's next game.

oh that reminds me

every time we've done silencing on this forum, it hasn't gone over well. im not sure the role works

^ wufworried

I'm not a fan of silencing. I can see how it can be used strategically but I think it detracts from the fun. If anything a minimum post power would be better ie chosen player must post min 20 posts that day or silenced the next day for example.

I think we should just be letting Gabe run his game.

Originally Posted by JKDS

I think we should just be letting Gabe run his game.

Yup.

i havent played a game with silencing that i can remember. maybe the silencer role would be better if there was another type of role that had something to do with it. idk. i think silencing will come in to play because of the duel and mayhem dynamics. its alot more useful (+fun) in a game like this compared to a standard angel/seer/vig game.

i was talking to a friend about new roles and he suggested a rapist role that would make people shut up for a while. the rapist became the horse thief

btw i posted a new start date of september 2nd, i will be chillin throughout september so i wouldnt care if the date was changed again. if we can squeeze a few more regs in by having it a week later, that would be fine with me. im going to ask a bunch of old school ftr people to play though so hopefully the game will fill out

I do believe I created the rapist role. It's in trip's tavern. People didn't like it .

LOL i didnt realize that. anyway i think theres more to it than just the role by itself

Originally Posted by gabe

im going to ask a bunch of old school ftr people to play though so hopefully the game will fill out

Nice. When I saw you were interested in modding, I was gonna make a joke about talking other old-school FTR gods to mod a WW game just to give them an obligation to be around FTR a lot.

BTW, I'm not actually silly enough to think this will make SHNL a bumpin' place again, but it would be nice to at the very least see some of the old names posting again.