Randomness thread, part two.

[Renton]

Seeing as I believe in subjective value, I can't presume that it's not valuable to her to do this. I can and do presume that her value system could be affected by psychological issues. I think if someone wanted to donate his living heart to save someone's life, they are probably insane, and I put this in the same ballpark (an admittedly enormous ballpark). I wouldn't object to someone donating his living heart if that's his choice, though.

The reason I keep bringing up organ markets, is because I believe it would prevent people from ever having to consider such risky propositions to help others. If kidneys were 10 times as abundant as they currently are, even poor people would be able to afford them, even if it means going into massive debt. At least they live. And in the event that they can't, people like your friend can just buy the kidney for them instead of going under the knife.

[spoonitnow]

Seeing as I believe in subjective value, I can't presume that it's not valuable to her to do this. I can and do presume that her value system could be affected by psychological issues. I think if someone wanted to donate his living heart to save someone's life, they are probably insane, and I put this in the same ballpark (an admittedly enormous ballpark). I wouldn't object to someone donating his living heart if that's his choice, though.

The reason I keep bringing up organ markets, is because I believe it would prevent people from ever having to consider such risky propositions to help others. If kidneys were 10 times as abundant as they currently are, even poor people would be able to afford them, even if it means going into massive debt. At least they live. And in the event that they can't, people like your friend can just buy the kidney for them instead of going under the knife.

This bold part is one of the things that people really miss. When there's a market for something like organs, it allows charity in that department to happen.

[jackvance]

This woman is probably of Nordic descent (scandinavian). They're known for being suicidally moralistic. You can try to understand it but it's a genetic thing really.

[spoonitnow]

Yeah so is the fact that women can't drive for shit.

[aubreymcfate]

Yeah so is the fact that women can't drive for shit.

song choice + camera work: A+++ god this video makes me laugh so fucking hard

[aubreymcfate]

http://dailysignal.com/2015/04/24/st...e-sex-wedding/

Disgusting.

[oskar]

I once spent an entire summer watching woman driving videos and I still don't get why some people cannot reverse. A three year old on a tricycle can figure this out.

Also organ donation being opt-in instead of opt-out is fucking retarded.

[Renton]

Also organ donation being opt-in instead of opt-out is fucking retarded.

Hopefully you mean organ donation upon death.

Assuming so, I still don't think it would solve the scarcity problem. Without a direct monetary incentive to extract organs from the untimely dead, many will still go to rot. And without prices, I don't have much confidence in a state's ability to distribute the organs to where they are needed most.

[oskar]

Hopefully you mean organ donation upon death.

ಠ_ಠ

I'm no doctor but I'm pretty sure that you can't just gut a dude and put all the entrails in a freezer for later use. You probably have a very narrow time window and I assume that hospitals do their best to get fresh organs to the people who need them. According to wikipedia roughly 10% of the people in opt-in countries choose to be organ donors and virtually 100% stay organ donors in countries that are opt-out.

[rong]

What the generally held view on the atlantic magazine? Respectable? Trustworthy?

Their piece on isis and Islam in general is pretty eye-opening. Prior to reading that article I had assumed at its most basic level Islam was reasonably peaceful and prob not much better or worse than any other mainstream religion, but that article has changed that opinion somewhat.

[aubreymcfate]

Atlantic is definitely respectable.

[oskar]

What the generally held view on the atlantic magazine? Respectable? Trustworthy?

Their piece on isis and Islam in general is pretty eye-opening. Prior to reading that article I had assumed at its most basic level Islam was reasonably peaceful and prob not much better or worse than any other mainstream religion, but that article has changed that opinion somewhat.

oh yeah really no it's not respectable.

[a500lbgorilla]

[OngBonga]

If they're so clever, why don't they evolve thumbs and make guns?

[a500lbgorilla]

“For instance, on the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much—the wheel, New York, wars and so on—whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man—for precisely the same reasons.”


Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

[JKDS]

Theyre terrifying. Seal escaped onto the ice? Let's group together, and implement our knowledge of fluid dynamics to flip this shit over.

What? I feel threatened.

[OngBonga]

“For instance, on the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much—the wheel, New York, wars and so on—whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man—for precisely the same reasons.”


Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

This is possibly my favourite quote ever.

[boost]

Yeah, I think it's an intuitive liberal assumption to equate all religions, but it simply doesn't stand up to the slightest brush up with critical thought.

Here's a link to the article in question for anyone interested: http://www.theatlantic.com/features/...-wants/384980/

[spoonitnow]

“For instance, on the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much—the wheel, New York, wars and so on—whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man—for precisely the same reasons.”


Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

Typical bitchassness loser justification.

HURR HURR I'M GOING TO BE LIKE A DOLPHIN AND BE A SORRY SACK OF SHIT

[eugmac]

spoon only wrote this because ong liked the quote so much.

[jackvance]

I agree with Spoon. And that been happening way too much, should I rethink my life?

[eugmac]

i don't want to dampen your enthusiam, go get 'em tigers.

[jackvance]

Cashing in on SJWs by standing up to them is becoming the new thing? The times are they a-changing?

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015...tice-warriors/

[eugmac]

i mean we're the 6th mass extinction. we ARE it. that's fucking awesome. we're as awesome as a fucking asteroid.

[a500lbgorilla]

Typical bitchassness loser justification.

HURR HURR I'M GOING TO BE LIKE A DOLPHIN AND BE A SORRY SACK OF SHIT

"Curiously enough, the dolphins had long known of the impending destruction of the planet Earth and had made many attempts to alert mankind of the danger; but most of their communications were misinterpreted as amusing attempts to punch footballs or whistle for tidbits, so they eventually gave up and left the Earth by their own means shortly before the Vogons arrived."

Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

The Hitchhiker’s Guide is an absolute must read - unless you’re the sort to live a satisfying life without having read it, in which case, you can probably manage a pass.

[OngBonga]

HURR HURR I'M GOING TO BE LIKE A DOLPHIN AND BE A HAPPY SACK OF SHIT

[a500lbgorilla]

This is now a Hitchiker's Guide thread

"The Guide says there is an art to flying", said Ford, "or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."



“The Universe - some information to help you live in it.

Area: Infinite. The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy offer this definition of the word "Infinite."

Infinite: Bigger than the biggest thing ever and then some. Much bigger than that in fact, really amazingly immense, a totally stunning size, real 'wow, that's big', time. Infinity is just so big that by comparison, bigness itself looks really titchy. Gigantic multiplied by colossal multiplied by staggeringly huge is the sort of concept we're trying to get across here.

Imports: None. This is a by product of infinity; it is impossible to import things into something that has infinite volume because by definition there is no outside to import things from.

Exports: None. See Imports.

Population: None. It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not everyone one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all planets in the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the whole Universe is also zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely the products of a deranged imagination.

Monetary Units: None. Although there are three major units, (The Altairian Dollar, the Flainian Pobble Bead and the Triganic Pu) none of them count. The Altarian Dollar has recently collapsed, (again) the Flainian Pobble Bead is only exchangeable for other Flainian Pobble Beads, and the Triganic Pu has its own very special problems. Its exchange rate of eight Ningis to one Pu is simple enough, but since a Ningi is a triangular rubber coin six thousand eight hundred miles along each side, no one has ever collected enough to own one Pu. Ningis are not negotiable currency, because the Galactibanks refuse to deal in fiddling small change. From this basic premise it is very simple to prove that the Galactibanks are also the product of a deranged imagination.

Art: None. The function of art is to hold the mirror up to nature, and there simply isn't a mirror big enough - see point one.

Sex: None. Well, in fact there is an awful lot of this, largely because of the total lack of money, trade, banks, art or anything else that might keep all the nonexistent people of the Universe occupied. However, it is not worth embarking on a long discussion of it now because it really is terribly complicated. For further information see GUIDE Chapters seven, nine, ten, eleven, fourteen, sixteen, seventeen, nineteen, twenty-one to eighty-four inclusive, and in fact most of the rest of the Guide.”



"He (Zaphod) then had another quick one (drink) to follow the first one down and check that it was all right. [...] sent a third drink down to see why the second one hadn't yet reported on the condition of the first. [...] He poured a drink down his other throat with the plan it would head the other one off at the pass, join forces with it, and together they would get the second to pull itself together, give it a good talking to and maybe a bit of a sing as well. He felt uncertain as to whether the fourth drink had understood all that, so he sent down a fifth drink to explain the plan more fully and a sixth for moral support."

[jackvance]

I still have to read it. Just found an audiobook.

[a500lbgorilla]

I still have to read it. Just found an audiobook.

Truly my favorite book. His quote about flying is a spot on description of an orbit. All satellites are in free fall, they simply fall in such a way as to perpetually miss.

[a500lbgorilla]

Couple of solid reads.

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/20...gineers-lament

Emotion versus logic in the domain of public debate.

http://www.wired.com/2015/04/silk-road-1/

First half of how the rise and fall of Ross Ublricht/The Silk Road.

[OngBonga]

This is how you guys make me feel with your bullying.

[spoonitnow]

I hate how it's a thing to love being the underdog. Fuck being the underdog. It's the biggest cop out ever. If you win, then it's supposed to be a big fucking deal because you were the underdog. But if you lose, then it's not such a big deal and all consequences of the loss are out the window because omfg you're the underdog. Being the underdog is some pussy bitch fuckboy shit. I want to be the overwhelming favorite #1 who destroys the #2 through #10 consistently. Fuck the underdog.

[OngBonga]

I think I know what your problem is spoon.

Hate.

[rpm]

I hate how it's a thing to love being the underdog. Fuck being the underdog. It's the biggest cop out ever. If you win, then it's supposed to be a big fucking deal because you were the underdog. But if you lose, then it's not such a big deal and all consequences of the loss are out the window because omfg you're the underdog. Being the underdog is some pussy bitch fuckboy shit. I want to be the overwhelming favorite #1 who destroys the #2 through #10 consistently. Fuck the underdog.

which consequences change?

[spoonitnow]

which consequences change?

Responsibility for the loss. You can just throw your hands up and be like, "Well I was the underdog, I was supposed to lose!"

[OngBonga]

Someone's gotta be the underdog. If there's no underdogs, then either we're in a perfectly balanced world where every competitor is equal, or there's one champion who is unable to get a challenge because the udnerdog goes fuck being the underdog and doesn't bother competing.

If there's no underdogs spoon, what you gonna do for a living? Do you think Chris Moneymaker needs your services?

[spoonitnow]

Someone's gotta be the underdog.

Excellent analysis.

If there's no underdogs, then either we're in a perfectly balanced world where every competitor is equal

Not true. The world could just have no concept of winning/losing or of keeping score.

or there's one champion who is unable to get a challenge because the udnerdog goes fuck being the underdog and doesn't bother competing.

Also not true. They would still be the underdog regardless of whether or not they compete.

If there's no underdogs spoon, what you gonna do for a living?

Continue taking welfare money from people who use it to buy pot and lottery tickets instead of getting a job.

Do you think Chris Moneymaker needs your services?

Yes if he wants to avoid being the underdog in the online gambling affiliate game.

[spoonitnow]

I hate how it's a thing to love being the underdog. ... Fuck the underdog.

Here's the TL;DR version for the reading comprehension-impaired among us.

[a500lbgorilla]

[OngBonga]

I don't buy lottery tickets.

[spoonitnow]

What exactly does marriage offer men today? “Men know there’s a good chance they’ll lose their friends, their respect, their space, their sex life, their money and — if it all goes wrong — their family,” says Helen Smith, Ph.D., author of "Men on Strike." “They don’t want to enter into a legal contract with someone who could effectively take half their savings, pension and property when the honeymoon period is over.Men aren’t wimping out by staying unmarried or being commitment phobes. They’re being smart.”

Unlike women, men lose all power after they say “I do.” Their masculinity dies, too.

What’s left of it, that is. In the span of just a few decades, America has demoted men from respected providers and protectors of the family to superfluous buffoons. Today’s sitcoms and commercials routinely paint a portrait of the idiot husband whose wife is smarter and more capable than he.

There was a time when wives respected their husbands. There was a time when wives took care of their husbands as they expected their husbands to take care of them.

Or perhaps therein lies the rub. If women no longer expect or even want men to “take care of” them — since women can do everything men can do and better, thank you very much, feminism — perhaps the flipside is the assumption that women don’t need to take care of husbands, either. And if no one’s taking care of anyone, why the hell marry?

.

[rpm]

Responsibility for the loss. You can just throw your hands up and be like, "Well I was the underdog, I was supposed to lose!"

responsibility to do what? and responsible to whom?

[eugmac]

Many people would be happier with their lives if they just realize that they're second best to somebody, and that that's totally ok.

[eugmac]

Nothing worse than having work colleagues with inferiority complexes.

[OngBonga]

Nothing worse than having work colleagues with inferiority complexes.

Obviously you've never been gang raped by a bunch of Norwegian bikers.

[spoonitnow]

responsibility to do what? and responsible to whom?

Responsibility for the loss (as opposed to placing blame on external factors like 'being an underdog'.)

For the sake of clarity, I'll point out again that I'm talking about the popularity of wanting to be the underdog because of the ability to skirt responsibility here, not being the underdog in and of itself.

[a500lbgorilla]

So you're angry at people's tendency toward psychological content.

[a500lbgorilla]

I haven't finished the book, but I'm betting one of the laws of power has something to do with capable motivation; and being the underdog is an obvious forcer for performance. No one believes you can do it, you have nothing to lose, the brass ring is just out of reach, give it 100+momentum and see what can be done.

edit: Nah, I'm wrong. It would be commitment to the goal while being the underdog that would be the motivator but being the one in position of having everything to lose is also a (maybe more) powerful motivator.

[OngBonga]

He's just angry.

[spoonitnow]

So you're angry at people's tendency toward psychological content.

Yes, an institutionalized and cultural tendency towards being content with mediocrity or worse.

[a500lbgorilla]

Flush first fellas

Save him though

[a500lbgorilla]

Yes, an institutionalized and cultural tendency towards being content with mediocrity or worse.

It floats over culture and institutions. You'll never beat this.

It's human.

[spoonitnow]

It floats over culture and institutions. You'll never beat this.

It's human.

It's not in my best interests to beat it. It's better for me to profit from it.

[a500lbgorilla]

It's not in my best interests to beat it. It's better for me to profit from it.

Yes.

[a500lbgorilla]

Alright yogafolk, how do you meditate?

I've tried every day this past week and a half, one time I blinked away 15 minutes, every other time I gave up after 3. How do you manage it?

I try silent, darkish space, comfortable position with my back straight, constant refocus on breathing naturally.

[spoonitnow]

Alright yogafolk, how do you meditate?

I've tried every day this past week and a half, one time I blinked away 15 minutes, every other time I gave up after 3. How do you manage it?

I try silent, darkish space, comfortable position with my back straight, constant refocus on breathing naturally.

Long, slow deep breaths. Count 1-10 (if you get to ten, start back at one) on every out breath. When you realize you've lost count or lost focus, just go back to it and start at 1. Focus completely on your breathing. A major part of growth in this is realizing you've lost focus and coming back to focusing on your breathing.

[jackvance]

A few weeks ago I tried the meditation thing of counting my breathing. At times it worked, sorta, at other times not so much. In one instance I counted breaths to almost a thousand and then stopped out of boredom. I think the degree to which you can relax relates to what is stressing you at the time. I noticed I sometimes have this avoidant tendency towards stressors (which are typically responsibilities or things I want to do). But avoiding just tends to make stress build up more and more. Facing issues with confidence and resolve is a good way to become a more relaxed person I have found. But the breath counting meditation is definitely still in my arsenal for long flights.

[spoonitnow]

A few weeks ago I tried the meditation thing of counting my breathing. At times it worked, sorta, at other times not so much. In one instance I counted breaths to almost a thousand and then stopped out of boredom. I think the degree to which you can relax relates to what is stressing you at the time. I noticed I sometimes have this avoidant tendency towards stressors (which are typically responsibilities or things I want to do). But avoiding just tends to make stress build up more and more. Facing issues with confidence and resolve is a good way to become a more relaxed person I have found. But the breath counting meditation is definitely still in my arsenal for long flights.

If the bold was correct, then this should have taken you more than five hours if you're breathing at the rate that you're supposed to.

[a500lbgorilla]

What does your mind sound/look like when you're meditating?

Even the 3 minute sessions demonstrate their value to me. I can feel the relief in internal pressure just for the exercise.

[jackvance]

If the bold was correct, then this should have taken you more than five hours if you're breathing at the rate that you're supposed to.

I clock like 15 counts per minute, I counted to around 900 so 900/15 = 60 minutes or one hour. Was probably a bit more as my breathing slowed a bit but not five hours. That's insane, you're breathing only 3 times per minute?

[boost]

Alright yogafolk, how do you meditate?

I've tried every day this past week and a half, one time I blinked away 15 minutes, every other time I gave up after 3. How do you manage it?

I try silent, darkish space, comfortable position with my back straight, constant refocus on breathing naturally.

Just eat some mushrooms.

[boost]

I clock like 15 counts per minute, I counted to around 900 so 900/15 = 60 minutes or one hour. Was probably a bit more as my breathing slowed a bit but not five hours. That's insane, you're breathing only 3 times per minute?

You find the idea of taking ten seconds to breath in and ten to breath out "insane?" You're not holding your breath, you're just slowing the pace.

[jackvance]

I can't breathe that slowly without holding my breath. Smoker problems maybe.

Also Kingmaker is a must see!

[spoonitnow]

That's insane, you're breathing only 3 times per minute?

Uhhh yeah lol. That's where the long, slow, deep breaths thing comes in. If you're breathing as quickly as you said you were, then you probably aren't going to get much out of it.

[eugmac]

lol i never thought i'd walk into this thread to spoon and jackvance doing yoga.

[spoonitnow]

I can't breathe that slowly without holding my breath. Smoker problems maybe.

Also Kingmaker is a must see!

I just now saw this. It could be the case. I've had walking pneumonia before, and it hindered it in a similar way.

[a500lbgorilla]

Pneumonia put me in the hospital when I was a boy. I remember the arts and crafts available after I pulled through.

[OngBonga]

When I move house next, I'm retiring my ongbonga account, leaving it some time, then coming back with a new profile, a new IP address, and a new persona. I'm gonna make friends with spoon and he'll never know it's me. Well, until he offers me a game of chess and I beat him.

Anyway, I'm just saying this so that when I do leave, spoon will be paranoid that every new member is me attempting to troll him.

[rpm]

@ rilla re meditation:

i lie on my back on a flat surface with a small pillow under my head (apparently its better seated with erect spine but i cbf overcoming the physical discomforts/distractions involved there) take a few deep breaths, close my eyes, and let my breathing settle. then i turn to mindfulness, which is my main goal. you can be mindful of anything any time but the breath is the best object of mindfulness because its always with us, and calming our breath has the physiological (?) effect of calming our minds as well. anyway, i spend 10-15 minutes being mindful of the following phenomena in no order other than the breath always comes first (for 10-15 minutes before these other ones): physical sensations (hot/cold, still/moving air around you, soft/hard objects touching you, etc), auditory stimuli (birds are great, but whatever's there. just notice it appear and then decay in consciousness), cognitive events (what's going on in consciousness? do your thoughts appear as words or pictures or impulses/emotions? what emotions do you feel right now and what are their physical/mental signs that make you know you're feeling x emotion? observe them. etc) you can also do visual or taste, but i tend not to.

the goal for a session is to spend as much time being mindful of the object of mindfulness as i can. every time i notice i'm not being mindful, i return myself to being mindful. the benefits are both immediate and long-term. after a positive session i can notice a distinct shift in consciousness when i return the world. i can focus better, thoughts appear to be "happening" slower and are far more coherent/discernible, i'm calmer and so on and so forth. the long-term benefits i cannot attest to (aside from the aforementioned ones, which are traits i assume become more habitual with more practice) because i am not a scientist. however they have something to do with increased activity in the parts of the brain which deal with emotional regulation, and also a reduction (or increase, whichever's good) in grey or white matter density or something. google it. i'm dumb.

oh and i also do another probably less-applicable meditation involving evoking negative thoughts/emotions/images and tricking my brain to react to them better.

anyway, the point (of what i practife) is to be mindful and observant, almost like an independent third-party, of your experiences in consciousness. it looks/sounds like a mind in a state of astute, impartial awareness of the flow of physical/mental experiences as they arise and fall, ideally ; )

check out sam harris. he's a philosopher/neuroscientist/meditation advocate/organised religion critic. he has lots of material about meditation why's, how's etc. and he's clever.

[rpm]

why do you want to meditate?

[spoonitnow]

When I move house next, I'm retiring my ongbonga account, leaving it some time, then coming back with a new profile, a new IP address, and a new persona. I'm gonna make friends with spoon and he'll never know it's me. Well, until he offers me a game of chess and I beat him.

Anyway, I'm just saying this so that when I do leave, spoon will be paranoid that every new member is me attempting to troll him.

lol no

[boost]

What if Ong actually went through with this, but in an attempt to get along with everyone he reflected on every interaction he had on here and this resulted in his life turning around, getting off welfare, becoming a productive member of society, and all around he just began to own at life.

[rpm]

... and started coaching spoonitnow in "life" for $100/hr

[rong]

What if Ong actually went through with this, but in an attempt to get along with everyone he reflected on every interaction he had on here and this resulted in his life turning around, getting off welfare, becoming a productive member of society, and all around he just began to own at life.

Lol no.

[OngBonga]

What if Ong actually went through with this, but in an attempt to get along with everyone he reflected on every interaction he had on here and this resulted in his life turning around, getting off welfare, becoming a productive member of society, and all around he just began to own at life.

Haha! I already own at life!

I don't really care if I get along with people I've never met on a poker forum. I'm the kind of dick who thrives on stupid arguments. I don't even care if everyone thinks I'm an idiot. My real friends don't think I'm an idiot, and I'm happy, so my life rocks. I get a great deal of amusement out of the conversations I have in this forum, if I didn't I'd have fucked off long ago.

Some people seem to have a problem with me because I refuse to work. I get that. I used to get up every day at 8am and hate those who didn't. I used to be pissed off until 5pm, then go home, have a spliff and a bite to eat, watch shit tv, go to sleep then do it again four more times before I get some proper me time at the weekend. Then I took a look at the two million or so people who are basically unemployable. A great deal is made about welfare and if we should provide an income for those who refuse to work, but the vast majority of those on welfare are the kind of people who you would not employ if you owned a business. Why should I be forced to work just because I'm not as lazy and feckless as these people? Why shouldn't I be able to sit on my arse all day while the stupid unemployable people watch Jeremy Kyle and drink Special Brew? I have to work just because I'm potentially useful?

I don't want to work because I hate the way the system works. I don't want to pay tax for us to maintain nuclear weapons and start wars with countries who should not be our enemies. I also reject the concept that I HAVE to work.

But my biggest problem is that I can't grow a plant for consenting adults to smoke. I'm not going to work in a factory or maccie fucking dees just because the law says I can't do what I'm actually good at and enjoy doing. Fuck. That. Shit.