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Played so bad right?

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  1. #1

    Default Played so bad right?

    Villain is 11/8, agg 5.0, button steals 10%, continuation bet 100% and fold to 3bet 50% over 201 hands.

    I have 3bet from the BB Vs a steal 8% of the time.

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (9 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

    MP2 ($9.81)
    MP3 ($13.60)
    CO ($23.24)
    Button ($5.69)
    SB ($10.25)
    Hero (BB) ($11.03)
    UTG ($10)
    UTG+1 ($10.20)
    MP1 ($5.54)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with K, K
    6 folds, Button bets $0.20, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.10

    Here I'm thinking I have a good hand that will play well against his aggressive post flop play and he has folded to a 3bet 50% of the time so I didn't want to push him out by raising.
    Does anyone recommend 3betting here?

    He has only tried to steal from the button once out of 10 opportunities so I'm putting him on any pp, A8o+, A9s+, KJo+ and KQs+.

    Flop: ($0.45) 8, 7, Q (2 players)
    Hero checks, Button checks

    I really go for the check raise way to much I've decided! hahaha

    Seriously though, the guy has cbet 100% of the time so I was fully expecting to get a check raise in. Obviously with 2 clubs I should not be playing around.

    After his check I discount AA-77, AQ, and AK as I think he would definitely have cbet those. I figure any of the rest of his preflop range is still in there.

    Turn: ($0.45) 5 (2 players)
    Hero bets $0.30, Button raises to $1, Hero calls $0.70

    Ok, so I figure with 3 clubs out there I can't afford to be mucking around anymore.

    After his raise I narrow his range to a flush or set he has played coy. I can't really see him making this move with much of else. Perhaps AcX. I call because I have the Kc.

    River: ($2.45) 7 (2 players)
    Hero checks, Button bets $0.90, Hero calls $0.90

    Total pot: $4.25 | Rake: $0.20

    Really should have folded the river as I had him on a flush or set but I call anyway. GRRRR.

    Thoughts?
  2. #2
    daviddem's Avatar
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    His steal% is very low, his fold to 3bet is very low, so basically he does not steal, he raises his normal raising range in LP, and this range is strong so there is a very considerable chance that he will continue facing your 3b.

    So 3b pre. As played donk flop and shove if he raises. As played bet/fold turn. Your Kc isn't worth much when the Ac is out there. As played fold river.
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  3. #3
    Shotglass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PKKFW View Post
    Here I'm thinking I have a good hand that will play well against his aggressive post flop play and he has folded to a 3bet 50% of the time so I didn't want to push him out by raising.
    Don't worry about pushing him out of the pot pre-flop. You've got 2nd best pf but it get's vulnerable as more streets hit.
    Does anyone recommend 3betting here?
    YES! Think of his min-raise as a limp and 3bet to about $0.50. Look to get it in if he 4 bets.
    If he folds, so be; it there was no money to win from him anyways.

    Flop:
    the guy has cbet 100% of the time so I was fully expecting to get a check raise in.
    Good thinking but def this:
    Obviously with 2 clubs I should not be playing around.
    Lead the flop to about 3/4 pot and shove to a raise.
    Turn:
    After his raise I narrow his range to a flush or set he has played coy.
    Yeah, I agree. His line really looks like a set or completed flush.
    You call because you have the K? Are you hoping to spike a fourth otr and loose your stack? You really cannot count any as an out, so you're basically drawing to 3 outs. Maybe 4 if you want to count the A but don't.
    I'd fold since you're not getting the odds to chase 3 outs.

    Really should have folded the river as I had him on a flush or set but I call anyway.
    Bold is a big problem. If he had a set then he just filled up. His bet sizing looks like either a suck to get you to call the paired board with a flush or a blocker to price a cheap showdown.

    Quote Originally Posted by givememyleg View Post
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  4. #4
    Villain is still otb his opening range wont be insanely strong, even for an 11/8. Pre-flop you can 3 bet or flat there is no right or wrong, It depends on what you think is best at the time considering prior play.

    C/r flop is good if you expect him to c bet a lot of flops.

    Turn is fine, as we are ahead sometimes here and even against a set our flush outs will be clean unless the river pairs. If the flush does come off you can prolly just b/f the river bc I would not expect villain to bet or raise with anything worse than our hand.

    River is fine because of the price you're getting, you hardly need to be right here to break even.

    **Also it is not possible for the for villains river bet to be considered a blocking bet because he is in position.
    Last edited by Sorcery11; 05-13-2011 at 05:39 PM.
    Get twenty thousand worth of ones. Start lettin' that money go. Let it fly. Throw some twenties when my ones gettin' low. Fifty stack. I'ma show you how to ball. Triple that.
  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by daviddem View Post
    His steal% is very low, his fold to 3bet is very low, so basically he does not steal, he raises his normal raising range in LP, and this range is strong so there is a very considerable chance that he will continue facing your 3b.
    Yeah with hingsight I see there was a good chance he was raising with his usual tight range and there was a very good chance he would have called a 3bet.
    Quote Originally Posted by daviddem
    So 3b pre. As played donk flop and shove if he raises. As played bet/fold turn. Your Kc isn't worth much when the Ac is out there. As played fold river.
    Good thoughts. Thanks.
  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Shotglass View Post
    Don't worry about pushing him out of the pot pre-flop. You've got 2nd best pf but it get's vulnerable as more streets hit.

    YES! Think of his min-raise as a limp and 3bet to about $0.50. Look to get it in if he 4 bets.
    If he folds, so be; it there was no money to win from him anyways.
    This is definitely what I should have done and I normally do exactly this in this situation. Guess I got to thinking about it too much and over analysed his stats a little too much.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shotglass
    Flop:
    Good thinking but def this: Lead the flop to about 3/4 pot and shove to a raise.
    Yeah, I'm done with c/r's in the future. Pretty much every time I've tried to get tricky it has back fired on me. Back to ABC poker methinks
    Quote Originally Posted by Shotglass
    Turn:

    Yeah, I agree. His line really looks like a set or completed flush.
    You call because you have the K? Are you hoping to spike a fourth otr and loose your stack? You really cannot count any as an out, so you're basically drawing to 3 outs. Maybe 4 if you want to count the A but don't.
    I'd fold since you're not getting the odds to chase 3 outs.
    Well my intention if I had spiked a club otr was to c/c up to a psb as I would have been wary of the Ac. Was never going to raise the river regardless. Still not a good a plan anyway as you've shown here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shotglass
    Bold is a big problem. If he had a set then he just filled up. His bet sizing looks like either a suck to get you to call the paired board with a flush or a blocker to price a cheap showdown.
    Yep, it is a big problem! I had intended to c/c the river only if a club that didn't pair the board came. What do I go and do? Call anyway! I pretty much knew I was beat and threw money away regardless. Definitely something I have to work on.
  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcery11 View Post
    Villain is still otb his opening range wont be insanely strong, even for an 11/8. Pre-flop you can 3 bet or flat there is no right or wrong, It depends on what you think is best at the time considering prior play.

    C/r flop is good if you expect him to c bet a lot of flops.

    Turn is fine, as we are ahead sometimes here and even against a set our flush outs will be clean unless the river pairs. If the flush does come off you can prolly just b/f the river bc I would not expect villain to bet or raise with anything worse than our hand.

    River is fine because of the price you're getting, you hardly need to be right here to break even.

    **Also it is not possible for the for villains river bet to be considered a blocking bet because he is in position.
    Thanks for the thoughts.
  8. #8
    Tree bets yo. Treeeeee bets.

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