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Please read my hand (exercise)

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  1. #1

    Default Please read my hand (exercise)

    I haven't really thought this through yet, so not sure how it'll turn out.

    It occurred to me more and more recently that I tend to look at poker from the wrong perspective.

    I should first understand my opponents tendencies - understand how he plays certain types of hands, when that is balanced, unbalanced, game theory optimal, exploitative, if/when he adjusts, how he can adjust, if he ever overadjusts, if he bluffs a lot, bets for thin value etc - and understand what the weaknesses in his poker is. That's first.

    Second, I should look at his actions in the hand (and if there are multiple villains as there tends to be pre-flop, do the equivalent for all of them) and decide where his weaknesses are and what types of hands I want to play against him in and out of position, and in the current situation define a range of hands that I want to continue with and how I want to continue with them, and what kind of plan I want on different types of flops, knowing which hands I'll want to play against this opponent to extract value and which types of hands I'll play hoping to bluff and steal etc.

    Third, I'll glance at my cards, determine what part of the range it's in, and most likely fold. Or do whatever is right against the opponent, but the point is that just because most pocket holdings end up being correct to fold pre-flop doesn't mean I should look at my cards first.

    This process needs to repeat on every decision. I need to emphasise the parts of my opponents range I think will have acted in exactly this way and discount the parts of his range that will only have acted this way some of the time or rarely. Then I need to consider the hand combinations in each part of that range, my equity against the part of the range, weight it by emphasised/discounted hand combinations, approximate the EV of all possible hands in my hand range against each of these ranges, define some hand ranges for me to commit, pot control, bet for value, bet as bluff/semi-bluff, check/call, fold etc and THEN - only then - glance at my cards, determine which part of the range they're in and take the action for that hand range.

    I've been looking at my cards first. I'm doing it all wrong.

    In the spirit of encouraging the above (and keeping myself on track in pursuing the above and thinking about the above) I will in hand range analyses and responses from now on try to ignore the actual hand and focus instead of ranges and instead of commenting on the actual play of the hand I will instead state which part of the hero's range I expect is most likely correct to play that way on every street. If I'm right, there's a lesson there if you've played a hand that doesn't merit that line/plan in the hand. If I'm wrong, which is considerably more likely, hopefully someone will point out the error of my ways and I'll improve.

    To get back to our entertainment, I thought I'd start out with a couple of hands that I think are perhaps interesting to start this kind of thing with. I thought at the time I played them particularly well (massive ego, immensely pleased with myself, pulling my arm out of my socket patting myself on the back). I'll return to the thread a couple of times both to supply my own hand range analysis for myself and also if there is any interest to say what I actually played here, even though for now I'll try to start thinking of that as results oriented.

    Hand 1:
    I have been at this table for about 30 hands during which I've raised pre-flop 7 or so times and generally played aggressive poker and taken down some big pots, one of them AA that got played aggressively pre-flop and slow-played on a K-high flushy (flush completed on turn) where I correctly read the opponent as not having the K or the flush (he had QQ) and stacked him. Another was AQ that saw a 77T flop and a 7 turn and went all-in against a short stack (which called with QJ). I have never before limped or called pre-flop. I probably seem like an aggressive gambler. (although both those big pots were solidly supported by reads)

    Both villains in the hand have been at the table for as long as I have (longer) and have witnessed this. Both villains have stats of 15/3 or so and have raised pre-flop exactly once before.

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

    SB ($11.20)
    BB ($12.85)
    UTG ($14.10)
    MP ($11.30)
    Hero (Button) ($28.55)

    Preflop: Hero is Button with two cards
    1 fold, MP raises to $0.40, Hero calls $0.40, 1 fold, BB raises to $1.20, MP calls $0.80, Hero calls $0.80

    Flop: ($3.65) J, 6, 2 (3 players)
    BB checks, MP checks, Hero checks

    Turn: ($3.65) 4 (3 players)
    BB checks, MP bets $1.20, Hero raises to $4.50, 2 folds

    Hand 2:
    This hand is from a week ago, so I don't remember all the table dynamics. I had about 10 hands on MP running something like 30/0/1 and I had a 50ish hands on SB who runs something like 25/3/1.5 playing relatively straightforwardly and on multiple tables. On the BTN here I widened my calling range to include some speculative hands because the stacks were deep and I would be in position.

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

    SB ($10)
    BB ($16.80)
    UTG ($10.15)
    MP ($15.30)
    CO ($13.55)
    Hero (Button) ($16.25)

    Preflop: Hero is Button with two cards
    UTG raises to $0.40, MP calls $0.40, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.40, SB calls $0.35, 1 fold

    Flop: ($1.70) 8, 7, 6 (4 players)
    SB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero bets $1.20, SB calls $1.20, 1 fold, MP raises to $5, Hero raises to $15.85 (All-In), 1 fold, MP calls $9.90 (All-In)

    Turn: ($32.70) K (2 players, 2 all-in)

    River: ($32.70) 3 (2 players, 2 all-in)

    I think the common theme for the two hands is this: Yes, you would play this way with the nuts. What other hands are correctly playing this way?

    (Edited to correct which villain the profile in hand 2 refers to)
  2. #2
    44

    66-88,9Ts
  3. #3
    erpel have't you set the words / post record yet, seems strange you're still tryin'

    Hand 2: spenda's pwn'd it

    Hand 1: you better not say 53cc
  4. #4
    1: 44
    2: 99
  5. #5
    kmind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigspenda73
    44

    66-88,9Ts
    This but I add 99 to the second range
  6. #6
    99 seems like a mediocre read seeing how we're 150bbs deep
  7. #7
    kmind's Avatar
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    I'm not saying it's good, but I'd say you see it at 10NL a lot
  8. #8
    Ok, I wanted to write my piece on these hands tonight, but I haven't had time yet and I'm due in bed now, so I'll just cover the first one.

    Probably a leak, but I generally don't have much in my preflop calling range than small/medium pocket pairs. When it comes around to me as a 3bet I definitely only have small/medium pocket pairs in my range as a general point.

    The two villains are interesting to me - they're really quite tight with a vpip of 15 and with a pfr of just 3 and a low AF they seem very much like people playing a fit or fold style of poker - wanting to see flops cheaply unless they're really strong and building a pot only with serious equity. Both these villains should be easy to bluff off missed hands in general. What I didn't mention in the post is that the checks they made on flop and turn were all pretty quick. Maybe not quite insta, but definitely not a hard decision to make.

    Edit to add this on their read of me: The description of me I put in there was mostly to underline that they should be able to put me on a low/medium pair - it's really obvious when I've only raised that when I call a bet and a 3bet I almost have to have a low/medium pair. The aggressive gambler thing I don't expect them to adjust to beyond actually making the wrong adjustment - playing more passive and weak tight when they miss and betting me more aggressively when they hit. I don't expect them to check/call more with monsters.

    My range for this preflop play is any pocket pair 22-TT.

    Both villains have a range around AJs+, AQo+, TT+ to the flop with MP perhaps more likely to hold 99. I shy away from putting lower pocket pairs in their range mainly because I think they would be more inclined to play them in a raised instead of a 3bet pot.

    Hand range for both villains based on preflop actions
    AK (16) AQ (16) AJs (4) AA (6) KK (6) QQ (6) JJ (6) TT (6) 99 (6)

    Hand range for both villains based on flop check:
    AK, AQ discounted to 14 each. Once for suited clubs and once for other plays. These villains are quite unlikely to bet here as any kind of bluffs so most of the range carries over.
    AJs - blockers make this 3 combinations now, normally betting so discounted down to 0.75 or so.
    AA, KK, QQ - each of these discounted down to 1.5 or so (from 6) as they are normally betting
    JJ - blockers make this 3 combos now, discounted down to around 0.75 as they are normally betting.
    TT - discounted down to 5 as it's sometimes betting but almost always checking.
    99 - stays at 6 combos

    To group them by types of hand that my range has types of equity against:
    AK/AQ: 28 combos
    AJ, JJ+: 6 combos
    TT/99: 11 combos

    Already both villains are showing weakness, and the type of villain who develops this type of stats tend to be fit or fold and in this case are telegraphing "I missed, now just let me get away".

    My hand range at this point has 3+3 combos of sets and 7*6 combos of pocket pairs. In this spot I check my entire range, including my sets. The pot is big enough relative to the stacks that I can get all-in on two streets and I'm heavily discounting the few flush draws that are possible. I think by checking my sets here I get more value out of them on later streets. Additionally, there is no part of my range that I bet here as a bluff, so I don't need to bet here with my monster hands to protect my bluffing range. Checking the entire range here is in part based on my read that these two villains both are looking for excuses to fold - when I have strong hands I don't want them to fold but to put more money in. Even the weakest part of my range is probably ahead of the most numerous part of the villains range unimproved.

    I figure that they're most likely to have AK/AQ type hands so the 12 possible A/K/Q cards that can come on the next street I can effectively discount down to somewhere between 8 and 9 - there are about 8 or 9 cards that will change the equity of the part of my range that is not sets, but most of the time the turn card will leave the part of my range that is only pocket pairs still ahead of my villains ranges. At this point I don't feel strongly about my hand. I missed my set and I'm perfectly content to be folding to any bet on the flop. When it checks through I'm happy to check it for pot control and to maximise EV from weaker, I know that if the turn checks around I probably have the best hand and it's time to bet most if not all of my range and probably for value.

    Turn range for BB check:
    AK discounted to 10 combos
    AQ still at 14 combos
    AA/KK/QQ discounted down to 0.5 combos each
    AJ/JJ discounted down to 0.25 combos each
    TT discounted down to 3 combos
    99 discounted down to 5 combos

    Turn range for MP 1/3 PSB:
    AK still at 14 combos (ok we all have trash, I have the better kicker to my ace!)
    AQ discounted to 6 combos
    AA/KK/QQ discounted down 0.5 combos each (or lower)
    AJ/JJ discounted down to 0.25 combos each (or lower)
    TT still at 5 combos
    99 discounted down to 3 combos

    When it comes around to me here I think I can probably bet my whole range for value. 99/TT for both villains are likely folds here (ok, so for those it's as a bluff when I have pocket pairs) and the only calls they have in their ranges are AA/KK/QQ/JJ/AJ that I've discounted down to 2ish hand combos with 20+ weaker combos in their range. Even if 99/TT call sometimes this is still a profitable bluff for me imo.

    That said, I probably wouldn't fire too recklessly here. I have 9 set combos in my range and 36 pair combos. While I think I can profitable adopt a bet ATC with these particular villains and this particular action I would probably fold those that do not at least have outs or something else to recommend them. This means my betting range here is:
    22-66, TT
    33 and 55 have gutshot outs together with their set outs. TT is a blocker for TT hands and beats the occasional calling 99 hand.

    And I fold 77-99, even the times when they are the best hand. They're hitting reverse implied odds hard with no more than 2 outs.

    The bet size is not too big, and that's on purpose. PNL makes a point of saying that if you're betting as on an earlier street as a bluff it's a good idea to look at stack sizes and ensure that you have enough behind to be able to make a believable bluff on a later street - not thereby said that you should bluff on a later street, but it makes the threat of your bluff on this street more intimidating if the villain can see that you have enough money to give him another tough decision if he calls here with a marginal hand. The bet size is an effective $3.3 into $6.05 - so little more than half PSB (for MP) - leading to a $12.65 pot with $5.8 effective behind. It's actually a committing bet, but when I make it I've already decided that the 55/33/TT part of my range is checking or folding the river if an A/K/Q comes and shoving otherwise. Further the 33/55/TT part of my range is folding to a shove on the turn.

    At this point I just estimate AA/KK/QQ/JJ/AJ hands are such a tiny part of the villains ranges compared to the overwhelming presence of AK/AQ type hands that even if I'm called I'm more often up against an optimistic AK/AQ hand and I'm a favourite to win with a pocket pair if they don't improve.

    I know very well in the hand (and knew at the time) that I was representing 44. I had 55.

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