More 3-bet pots.

Okay here are a couple of the 3 bet pots I played in today's session. This still an area I think I fail at, so all advice much appreciated.

1. Villain is a wierd/bad player - 35/18/13.5 (3-bet) and had been 3-betting this retarded size as standard both in and out of position. I was torn between jus raising to felt the flop (which felt fine) and calling here. Decided to flat and take it away on the turn a lot since his range was fairly wide and weak, calling also lets him barrel air again where I can either ship turns or call again and ship rivers. Thoughts on this?

On the turn I flatted because I felt my equity was just to shit on this card vs his felting range and that I could jam a bunch of rivers if I missed and he checked.

River seems std.

$0.25/$0.50 No Limit Holdem
6 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG Micak1 ($80.85)
UTG+1 Coltra ($49.25)
CO leftygrovev2 ($52.25)
BTN Hero ($51.50)
SB wallballs248 ($53.35)
BB wfox007 ($52.50)

Pre-Flop: ($0.75, 6 players) Hero is BTN
3 folds, Hero raises to $1.75, wallballs248 raises to $4.50, 1 fold, Hero calls $2.75

Flop: ($9.50, 2 players)
wallballs248 bets $5.50, Hero calls $5.50

Turn: ($20.50, 2 players)
wallballs248 bets $8.50, Hero calls $8.50

River: ($37.50, 2 players)
wallballs248 checks, Hero bets $33

2. Villain is 22/20/13(3bet) over a decent sample, prolly one of the better regs I've seen at 50NL. This is probably pretty damn standard but I want to make sure I'm doing okay in these types of spots. Sorry if it's dull. He expects me to defend lightly here I think as he's been 3 betting me a bit this session. I still didn't see him taking this line very often with just overs and there arent really any semi bluffs in his range.

$0.25/$0.50 No Limit Holdem
6 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG PillePalle63 ($118.65)
UTG+1 EvgenAleshki ($50)
CO Hero ($65.15)
BTN leftygrovev2 ($50)
SB LITTLEBIGGEN ($49.25)
BB NuahK ($50.75)

Pre-Flop: ($0.75, 6 players) Hero is CO
2 folds, Hero raises to $1.75, leftygrovev2 raises to $5.75, 2 folds, Hero calls $4

Flop: ($12.25, 2 players)
Hero checks, leftygrovev2 bets $8.25, Hero calls $8.25

Turn: ($28.75, 2 players)
Hero checks, leftygrovev2 bets $36, Hero folds

Final Pot: $64.75

leftygrovev2 wins $63.35 (net +$13.35)

Hero lost $14

thats a pretty awful flop to be chasing on in hand one, if you must call the flop then fold the turn for sure. as played bet smaller on the river, he cant call that much with worse, and he may even c/c flushes here since you look pretty strong. overall a pretty awful hand.

hand 2

since he is 3betting light and its a co button matchup you have a pretty dam strong hand here. i 4bet a lot here but its not too bad to just call since when u 4bet you fold all worse n hes prolly cbetting every flop. if you just flat make sure u can play with him post flop though

with this in mind id rather c/r the flop to pick up the extra 8.25 that you get from his weak hands because you didnt 4bet making the play more +EV then 4betting. as played id have trouble finding a fold on the turn tbh

Umm, I'm not sure hand 1 is "chasing" since I explained I thought his range was pretty weak due to his 3 bet frequency and I planned to take it away at some point. It's not like Im praying for an A or 9 with no plan. As for the river size, I thought he may well c/c a jack here so shoving would be good given it's less than a psb. I feel like he either has a jack or QQ-AA here and will call or he has a weak hand and will fold to pretty much most bet sizes that aren't tiny.

Hand 2: you really like my equity enough to just 4-bet call this off pre? This guy's aggro but I'm not sure he's felting super light preflop vs me yet. I feared that I may be folding out all worse and doing poorly vs AK JJ+ if we felted.

lol at doing anything in 1 besides calling flop and folding turn

Hand 2: you really like my equity enough to just 4-bet call this off pre? This guy's aggro but I'm not sure he's felting super light preflop vs me yet. I feared that I may be folding out all worse and doing poorly vs AK JJ+ if we felted.

ya, but it sucks so bad to flat 3bets oop a fold to the 3bet sucks as well so i either say call and c/r decent flops or 4bet... its an annoying spot though and im not positive what is ideal so we can see what others think.



if hand 1 is a float to steal and not a chase, i would suggest not doing it against bad players. also

I feel like he either has a jack or QQ-AA here and will call

if this is true then you shouldnt be floating because those would be weak hands to call with and those weak hands would be what you would be floating to take away later.

h2 c/power min raise

Hey. I'm the villain in hand 2. Like the egomaniac I am, I googled my name and found this thread. Hand 2 is actually very interesting because I didn't remember it at all, and I was trying to put my self on a hand, and I couldn't really do it.

A player 3-betting 13% is probably 3-betting a lot of buttons... maybe 20%, I don't know. If you assume villains value range is AQ+ 99+, then 4-betting and calling a shove is almost certainly profitable preflop. You said you thought I was one of the better regs in 50NL (thanks), so it probably sucks to try to outplay a tough villain out of position. I'd just try to get it in pre in your spot.

Once you see this flop of low cards, you should probably just check-raise. Most regs are going to be flatting 77 44 33 preflop, so the only hands that crush you are 56 and JJ+. Those are all coolers in a CO vs BU situation where BU is 3betting so often.

After the flat on the flop, the turn is just weird. With stack sizes I just see most regs betting sets and straights 2/3 pot hoping the villain will shove over it with worse. So I honestly thought that most of my range is semibluffs there... hands like 8-x or even overcards... and JJ+. I guess I'd have to call with TT but it's close.

I looked in my HEM database and I saw I had 89o, which I guess now makes sense.

I totally dont remember who you are now, whats your avatar like? That might jog some memory. You moved up to 100NL yet so I can seek revenge for that hand?

Hmm, my avatar is a picture of a hot blonde girl. I forget when I changed it. It was nothing for a while, then John Clayton for a while, and now it's hot blonde girl. Usually when people ask "is that you, sexy?" or "is that your girlfriend" i assume that they're fish. It's my fish identifier system.

I dabble between 50NL and 200NL but I want to decrease my variance the most, because I have tuition payments coming up, so I spend a huge majority of my time at 50NL and the other time at SnG's.

Originally Posted by nutsinho

lol at doing anything in 1 besides calling flop and folding turn

even when villain bets less than 1/2 pot and you have 2 overs?

In the first hand I call flop, but fold the turn.

In the second hand I 4bet pre, or just call the 3bet and c/r this flop.

lead flop in #2

Originally Posted by XTR1000

lead flop in #2

without a read that villain is likely to spazz shove overcards, we're surely better off c/c or c/r to get him to put money in with AK, AQ, random junk, no?

I don't agree with leading in hand 2. We still have no idea if we should stack of to a raise and there's so much air that want a cbet from.
Turn is a save c/f imo.

If you're readless about villains postflop play there's merit in 4betting pre and/or moving tables imo.

disagree with lead also. if we want villains range to be weakest when we hold a pretty meh hand vs his stackoff range we want his range to be widest and c/r allows him to put the last bet in therefore he can still be bluffing! if we lead and he raises he wont call a ship w/o anything that has us beat so leading sort of makes the hand less profitable, even if its profitable in itself, i think c/r is best because it widens our range and we can now call 3bets and c/r dry flops as bluffs

I see where you´re coming from. I dont see however the point in trying to keep a range wide which is already narrow as hell and I can´t imagine a villain expecting us to c/r/f in this spot with these stacks. It seems like I´m way off here, but I´d imagine many players will check back their overs a lot and float them to a lead no less often than they would expose themselves to a c/r.