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2/4 - bottom end of wheel

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  1. #1

    Default 2/4 - bottom end of wheel

    I posted this hand in my blog, but thought I'd post this here too. Villain in this hand is a reg who is pretty aggro, and generally has a high cbet % (around 75%). I haven't seen him c/c flop often. I would generally expect most regs to cbet something like 66 here, or 56, though maybe not? River call..?


    $2/$4 No Limit Holdem
    6 Players
    Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

    Stacks:
    UTG ($639.95) 160bb
    UTG+1 ($436.60) 109bb
    griffey24 (CO) ($714.80) 179bb
    BTN ($156) 39bb
    SB ($391.60) 98bb
    BB ($184) 46bb

    Pre-Flop: ($6, 6 players) griffey24 is CO
    1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $12, griffey24 calls $12, 3 folds

    Flop: ($30, 2 players)
    UTG+1 checks, griffey24 bets $22, UTG+1 calls $22

    Turn: ($74, 2 players)
    UTG+1 checks, griffey24 bets $56, UTG+1 calls $56

    River: ($186, 2 players)
    UTG+1 checks, griffey24 bets $140, UTG+1 goes all-in $346.60, griffey24 calls ??
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay-Z
    I'm a couple hands down and I'm tryin' to get back
    I gave the other grip, I lost a flip for five stacks
  2. #2
    pocketfours's Avatar
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    I think your river bet is too big considering the low probability that villain has a set or even two pair to call with. I'd bet $50 instead and call a standard raise. As played I'd fold like a scared little girl.


  3. #3
    If you had QJdd, JTdd, any bricked draw are you betting this river? If so, are you betting $50?
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay-Z
    I'm a couple hands down and I'm tryin' to get back
    I gave the other grip, I lost a flip for five stacks
  4. #4
    pocketfours's Avatar
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    yeah of course


  5. #5
    Also hate the betsizing, smaller is better maybe half pot.
  6. #6
    OK better question since everyone seems to want to bet smaller here. What sizing are you using with 6x on the river? Certainly not this small bet sizing?

    If I'm in villains shoes, and I check and hero bets small, I'm way more likely to run a c/bomb bluff or just c/bomb with an ace. I feel like betting small here with the intention of b/f isn't too great. I'm assuming the intention is to b/f.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay-Z
    I'm a couple hands down and I'm tryin' to get back
    I gave the other grip, I lost a flip for five stacks
  7. #7
    pocketfours's Avatar
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    Well then against you we're def betting small with a six also, no?


  8. #8
    Was about to write my responce, but saw ur avatar and quit, sexy girl
    If things were to magically revert to January 1st, 2003, only I could take everything I know now in terms of poker ability/knowledge, bonus clearing, etc., I think it's safe to say that it would be trivially easy to make over a million dollars.
  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ISillyDurrrAK View Post
    Was about to write my responce, but saw ur avatar and quit, sexy girl
    Serious thread
  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by pocketfours View Post
    Well then against you we're def betting small with a six also, no?
    Sure.. but you'll probably have b/f 4 bluffs and 8 aces by the time you see my air

    I'm just saying, for the most part people won't bet small with 6x here IP I don't think. So I think c/bombing over most regs who bet small here would get folds.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay-Z
    I'm a couple hands down and I'm tryin' to get back
    I gave the other grip, I lost a flip for five stacks
  11. #11
    pocketfours's Avatar
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    I suppose, but why the hell did you just c/c twice on this board?


  12. #12
    I think the river spot is a proper flip a coin whether to call or not. Agree with smaller bet size.
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  13. #13
    Ditto, smaller bet on the river.
    Whether you call he shove probably depends on your alcohol consumption, aeh, on your reads. As played, his range is probably wider than 6x.
  14. #14
    why a smaller river sizing? It's not like we have a lot of Ax in our range.
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexos View Post
    why a smaller river sizing? It's not like we have a lot of Ax in our range.
    Yaah I'm pretty baffled by this as well. Seems like a perfect spot for big sizing if anything, because they would perceive us to bluff here often (and once they take c/c line, they often just have bluff catchers). Also as stated above, I dislike small sizing because I don't want to encourage a shove here if I plan on folding.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay-Z
    I'm a couple hands down and I'm tryin' to get back
    I gave the other grip, I lost a flip for five stacks
  16. #16
    1st reason should account for 90% of why to choose standard sizing as opposed to small
    2nd reason just like 10% imo. Cuz you can also say you want to induce a shove etc, but we digress.
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  17. #17
    It seems like most of the draws in villain's range on the turn have 33% equity versus TP, since they'll usually contain overcards. So betting 3/4ths pot on the turn doesn't make it a mistake for villain to call with a hand like QTdd. So I think a good play for our range here is to overbet bluff a very high percentage on this turn since it makes playing medium strength draws very difficult for villain. Thoughts?
    Quote Originally Posted by Carroters
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  18. #18
    Do you think draws like QTdd play c/c, c/c on this board?

    I do think an overbet bluff is good to make him fold medium strength hands though...
    Nine to five is how to survive - I ain't trying to survive / I'm trying to live it to the limit and love it a lot //

    Can offer RB deals on most sites, PM me.
  19. #19
    As it hasn't been rudely pointed out yet, would just like too politely note that the wheel by definition is the bottom end, if it where a 6 high straight it wouldn't be a wheel.
    There is no actual top end wheel, but we understand what you're trying to say.
  20. #20
    pocketfours's Avatar
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    By saying bottom end, griffey means that he is 'holding the bottom end of the wheel in his hand', so we know that he has either Ax on 2345 or A2 on 345, without even opening the thread. We could ignore his post altogether if we thought it's likely a mundane TPTK situation that rivered a wheel and is facing a check shove. He could be holding the top end if he had 45 on A23 or 5x on A234, no?


  21. #21
    i am new to this.Gathering information from here and there

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