Why have I never done this? I'm up £200 in one day and expect to clear £1k in a month for little effort and no risk.
Printable View
Why have I never done this? I'm up £200 in one day and expect to clear £1k in a month for little effort and no risk.
Well that was a fun half an hour trying to restore access to my betfair account only to find out that I need to verify my age. Shame my passport is out of date and my driver's license is provisional. Plus I haven't got a scanner because who the fuck has a scanner. Fuck you betfair.
This is going to go well.
Explain?
Well, step 1, reactivate my betfair account is almost complete. I'm just waiting for their admin to determine if the poor quality photos I took of my provisional driving license and bank statement is enough to convince them that I didn't register ten years agao as a 7 y/o boy.
What's step two? I must have smoked at least four bongs to relieve the stress of desperately trying to upload photos to photobucket before my android browser redirects me to ewank where it offers me a porn app for £6. I'm pretty baked now, I don't even know what day it is.
Here's what I don't understand about this: shouldn't the bonus you can get be at best equivalent to 100% rakeback? I mean the people running these sites aren't complete idiots, are they?
matched betting? is that the same as parlay bets?
edit - nope, but i still don't understand.
Indeed, but the average person putting money onto a gambling website is a complete idiot... which means most people who register for a bookies and take advantage of free bets will end up losing significantly more than they won because they're gambling addicts.Quote:
I mean the people running these sites aren't complete idiots, are they?
If you have the discipline to walk away from the bookies when there's no more free bets to exploit, well then you're beating them. They don't mind people succeeding in doing this because you can bet your last dollar that there's a lot more people who do not walk.
Most of the time it's just laying off the free bet so you get to keep the free bet, minus the spread minus commission.
Sorry, I'm lost. How does laying off get us to keep the free bet? https://imagicon.info/cat/10-3/1.gif
Let's say £50 matched bet.
You bet 50 at evens. You lay off at evens. Regardless of outcome you break even minus 5% commission. So you are now down £2.50.
You have a free £50 bet.
You bet at evens, you lay at evens. If you win, you're £100 up for the bet and £50 down for the lay. If you lose you lost nothing for the bet as it was free and you're up £50 for the lay. Either way up £50. Minus 5% commission.
That's a simplified version as you often lose a small percentage from the spread. And if you don't get to keep the stake in the free bet which is often the case then you need to bet at higher odds to ensure a win and will generally only win about 80% of the free bet.
The free bet isn't usually going to return the stake. If you put a £50 free bet on at evens, you'll win £50, the same as if you lay it off for evens. Still a profit of course. Certainly that's the case at paddypower.
It's worth noting that if you're gonna lay off a £50 bet on betfair, you need to have in your account enough to cover the liability. At evens that's gonna be £50. That's what's holding me back at the moment. I understand how we're printing money, but you need to have some disposable funds, which I haven't got right now. Maybe next week I can cover £50.
It's also worth nothing you can make more money if you're paying attention to the markets, because the odds fluctuate more honestly on betfair. If you time it right, then you might be able to lay the bet off at worse odds than the bookies gave you, giving you an edge without even considering the free bet.
There's potentially a lot of money that can be made on betfair. Even from a pure gambling point of view, you're getting better odds than a bookies will offer you. Marginally better when it comes to favourites, and a great deal better when it comes to dark horses. But fuck gambling, if you understand how the markets fluctuate, and correctly predict if a price will go up or down, then you can make bets at better odds than you're laying off at, which is printing money. I'm gonna spend an hour or so every day just watching the markets, especially football. I'm thinking of taking on these free bets to build a betfair bankroll, and then try to beat the system. At worst I fail and lose all the free bets that I accumulated. At best I turn a free bankroll into a monster. Could be interesting.
You can't really make much from arbitrage as the spread is so thin you need to bet thousands to win a tiny amount and the risk of timing screwing you over isn't that small so with such a small return the risks out way the rewards.
I'm so far 200 quid up in 4 days using matched betting so it certainly works.
I understand why matched betting works so yeah I'm looking to take advantage as soon as I can cover the betfair liabilities.
And you're right about the spread being thin. But I'll be looking for patterns. Like, are big teams at home generally overbacked before kick off? idk, it's good that I can't cover the betfair liabilities yet, I need to watch the markets for a while without being able to bet.
Dude, start with the free 5 quid bet, that way 20 quid on bet fair will cover you. Then work your way up. There's convenient steps of 10, 20, 25, 50, 100, 200.
Dude you obviously haven't lived on the dole for a long time, if ever! £20 to me is the difference between smoke or no smoke. I've got more money in my stars account than bank account so I've cleared a small amount of my poker br for this purpose. Gotta wait on that.
You could always get a job for like a week and be rolled.
I've got a free 200 bet stake not returned that I wanna put on a 10-1, just need to convince the Mrs that I should put 2k onto a gambling site for the lay. she isn't so keen.
I'll admit, I laughed.Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
as did all the interviewers when they read his CV.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
Ahhh Keith!
I wonder if I pay more in tax per month than ong receives I'm benefits.
I get around £500 a month.
So it turns out I have a fourth dependant.
You could look at it like that. Or, you could instead consider all the money that is sent to the EU, or spent on military who then in turn bomb the shit out of people for having different ideals to our own. I would bet that my total benefit income is comparable to the expenses claimed by many politicians for their lunches.
Laziness is just a samll part of me not working. I have a serious problem with the system, and it takes me maybe a month of grinding at a job I hate before I start to feel very depressed and pissed off with the world. That is not what life is about. I'm not a confrontational guy at all, but when some cunt in a bad mood starts being an arsehole just because he's the boss, and those who aren't the boss have to tread on eggshells because if you tell the boss to stop being a fucking twat you'll lose your job... fuck that shit. For what? So I can pay my fair share of the war effort, EU bill and MP expenses?
No thanks. I'll have my £500 a month, which is enough for rent, food and a smoke, and very little else. I'm happy enough being a nobody with no assets in this fucked up world.
lol a quick bit of googling suggests MPs were getting £15 a day for lunch until the expenses scandal kicked off. That's pretty much what I get a day to live on, including rent. Which I'm fine with. I expect nothing more than food and shelter. I just think that those who think that the unemployed are sponges need to take a serious look at how the world actually works. There's a great many people sponging a lot more out of the system than I could ever dream of. All I want is to not be hungry and homeless. I don't think that's unreasonable to expect that from a supposedly civilised society.
I've just thought of a way to oblige ongie and cut the welfare budget as well.export him to the third world where living costs are cheap , so his food and rent will be a fraction of the price and his smoke is likely to be locally produced and therefore a lot cheaper. weather likely to be better than here as well. THerefore could probably cut his dole money to a third of what it is now and he would likely be better off.
Maybe they should legalise cannabis. That would stop me being unemployed very quickly.
Lol just could you're a stoner doesn't mean legalised weed would somehow make you employable. What about all the people out there who have spent the last 10 years holding down a job and getting high.
lol the point I was making is that I'd be more than happy to grow weed rather than claim benefits. All that's stopping me right now is the idea that I could go to prison for doing something that I don't even consider the slightest bit immoral. If they legalise weed, I'd start growing and I'd be off benefits as soon as the first crop was harvested. What I'm not going to do is go and work for some cunt so that I can spend the rest of my life in misery.
LMFAO ........ don't you think everyone else would immediately think the same thing , grow their own weed and more besides to sell and then find that no one was buying cos they were all growing their own .
Is everyone growing tomatoes?
are tomatoes a high value crop?
Everyone won't do it for a number of reasons. For a start, people can't be arsed. The investment isn't insignificant. Also, it's not actually that easy. I've done it before. Things can go wrong. Pests and mould are a constant issue. Things like temperatue, humidity and ph levels need constant attention if you're going to get the best quality. People usually do one or two crops, making shit weed in the process that barely gets them high, and give up, because it's not as easy as they thought it would be. Not me. When I was growing I was making quality weed that people thought was being imported from Amsterdam. I just couldn't hack the paranoia.
For legal reasons I would like to say that the above post is just me lying through my teeth in a pathetic effort to impress my internet pretend friends. I have never broken any law ever, to the best of my knowledge. Fact.
in which case you will be up against the market garden scale producers, pests and moulds will be no problem as they will use insecticides and fungicides, heating costs will be reduced by using large greenhouses. they will be able to produce at a price that you won't be able to compete with. You would be really screwed if spain and france legalize too as spains costs of production would be a lot lower and they would have year round cheap production and cheap transport into in the uk.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
Yeah I'm pretty sure we can all agree that changes to the law would do very little to change the fact that ongbonga is a lazy scrounger. Maybe cutting benefit rates to the point where single people can't afford to live without doing some form of paid work would help. Lol at him getting the "not insignificant" investment as well.
Ok, on a more serious note, why do think it's reasonable for a civilised society to pay for you to survive. Because what you're saying is it's reasonable to expect me to pick up your tab. Your reasoning seems to be that because I pay for other things like politicians and bombs that I should also be willing to pay for you to bum around all day getting high and playing poker. I just don't see how you think that's reasonable.
I don't actually mind seeing that some people sponge of the system, because I see it as an unfortunate byproduct of a fantastic safety net. But your argument that your behavior and lifestyle is reasonable to expect to be paid for by the rest of us working is a bit pathetic.
Why do I think it's reasonable for a civilised society to pay for me to survive? A few reasons really. First of all, I'm forced into this society. It's not like I can opt out. Also the idea that a civilised society leaves the unemployed to simply fend for themselves, well it kind of negates the idea that it's a civilised society in the first place. What happens if benefits are cut? The welfare bill goes down, but at what cost? Yup, crime goes up massively, which in turn means the prison bill goes up. I can tell you it would cost a lot more to keep me in prison than it costs to keep me idle. But mainly, the real reason why a civilised society has a moral obligation to pick up the tab is because we abolished slavery a century ago. When somebody HAS to go to work to survive, they are a slave. People only have a choice when that choice is viable... and if there's no income for the unemployed, then people do not have a choice. Of course we do have a choice, we're not slaves. But the powers that be try their very best to make us slaves. They drum conformity into our heads from a young age. They sure like to press the idea that those who refuse to engage in the system are scroungers. Even you have the "why should I" attitude that the capitalist system breeds. But of course the real scroungers are the politicians who claim everything off the taxpayer, or the fatcat boss who plays golf while his employees work their asses off for him to be able to afford such a lifestyle. I'm not a scrounger for expecting £15 a day to avoid having to engage the system, beg or steal. The amount of money the taxpayer spends making sure the unemployed are not all homeless and hungry is insignificant when compared to the amount of money waste on other aspects of government.
Basically Dan, I refuse to engage in the system because I fucking hate the system. I'm fiercly anticapitalist and would rather rot away in my house sitting around getting stoned than to spend most of my adult life doing shit I don't want to do for some cunt I don't like for money I don't want.
Pests and moulds are still a problem because spraying your plants with shit is not a good idea. Not when people are gonna be smoking that shit. All you're doing here is demonstrating why it's harder than people realise. The top companies who are driving the prices down are going to be a problem, yes. But they will not be able to drive the prices down to the point it is unviable for me to do it at home, because a home crop that has constant attention will nearly always provide a better quality crop than a large scale industrial crop. Basically, I'm in no doubt I could find buyers for my weed, if I were to grow again. People want quality smoke, and that doesn't grow like the weeds you find in the garden.Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith
Oh and when you say year round, it gives the impression you think that my smoke is grown in the great outdoors, with beautiful rays of sunlight. Not so. I'll have a year round crop growing in the fucking tropics of a Midlands cellar.
I think you're problem is a complete lack of ambition which is possibly due to how much weed you smoke. I probably lived a version of your life when I was a student. But even then I had ambitions of something better. £500 per month is a pretty miserable existence. There's so many interesting things to see and do and experience and have sex with in the world. But you miss our on 99.999999% of it.
Also, you do engage the system when you take it's money each month. If you really wanted to live outside of the system you'd live in the woods in a shelter made of trees and eat berries and rodents until you died of a horrible disease at a young age. Your argument falls apart here because you'll take what you can from the system when it suits you and then cry foul when it doesn't.
Ok so I should go and be miserable at work so I can enjoy life? Is that what you call ambition?
Yes, living in the woods is a viable choice, you're totally right here. If I wanted to fuck the system good and proper, I'd just sit in the middle of the road until I got hit by a car or starved.Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
It's a sacrifice, a trade off. At the moment you sacrifice all of the good things life has to offer in order to sit around getting high. Not to mention the fact that you could always try and get a job you'd enjoy, but that would take time and effort which you aren't willing to spend.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
You're jumping to a few conclusions here. Let's just clear one thing up... I'm 35 years old and have done the working things before. I've had jobs that I enjoy. But even then I didn't like the people I was working for. And you assume that I'm unwilling to put time and effort into making my life better. What makes you think you know me even remotely well enough to draw these conclusions? You're wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
I refuse to engage the system because I hate the system. If I go to work, I'm paying tax, which in turn pays for us to bomb the shit out of whoever, and send money to greedy cunts in Europe whose sole mission it is to destroy democracy across the continent.
You think I'm just idle. I'm not. I'm just refusing to play their game.
Well you say you have no money, live off benefits and sit around all day getting high. Perhaps there's a whole range of activities you enjoy which you don't share on ftr and you live a fulfilling and exciting life. You're right, I have no idea.
But a lot of what you've said above is just bullshit. You complain about a system and blame the system for your current life yet are happy to sit there taking advantage of it. You are no better than those you criticise. You play the system the same as them. I guess you don't bomb anybody, I'll give you that. Congratulations on winning.
I don't blame the system for my current life. Tha's where you're jumping to the wrong conclusion You seem to get the impression I'm unahppy with my life. I'm very happy. It's other people who assume I shouldn't be happy.
I don't "take advantage" of the system. You yourself acknowledge that £500 is a miserable existence. I would not call that "taking advantage", I think those who take advantage are taking MORE than their fair share. People who fuck others over so they can earn more money, they're the ones taking advantage of the system. I'm merely surviving. What do you suggest I do?
Lol £500 is not your fair share! You have no fair share. It's fair that the system provides when you need it through unfortunate circumstances. Its like a form of insurance for when you fall on hard times. That money is a portion of what the rest of us pay to ensure that if any of us fall on hard times there is a safety net. You are reducing the size of that safety net by being a non contributing drain on it.
You are fucking over others so you can make money. You're fucking over those who work hard and get fucked by circumstance for your £500. Because you taking it means they have less.
What do I suggest you do? I suggest you get a job and take responsibility for yourself rather than being everybody else's responsibility.
Ong, you are not stupid. I don't believe that you believe the crap you are spewing.
Or maybe join a hippy commune that is self sufficient.
I don't even mind your poncing that much. But at least admit you're a lazy cunt who sponges off the rest of us rather than spouting this self righteous bullshit.
I think the idea of "fair share" is massively skewed in a capitalist society.
You have the "why should I" attitude drummed into you. You're telling me that I need ambition and drive to be happy. You're telling me that I need to be productive to claim my fair share. I understand where you're coming from, but it's bullshit.
If you're saying to me that my "miserable existence" of £500 a month is not something that people should outright live on for survival, then you are saying that people have no choice but to work. That, my friend, is slavery, and I will not be a part of that, even if everyone else is too fucking stupid to see that's the way the world works.
Yeah I'm a sponge.Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
Meanwhile, Wayne Rooney is deserving of every penny he gets. The fat fucking granny bashing twat.
Ok. So lets rewin a few hundred thousand years. There is no society. You would have to work to eat and shelter yourself. That work would be physical hunter gatherer type stuff. If you didn't, you'd die.
Would that make you a slave.
You have to walk to the toilet to take a shit. Does that physical labour make you a slave?
Wayne Rooney is deserving of that money. Through his own effort he nurtured a skill that millions of people are willing to pay to see him perform. Those people pay that money willingly. If they didn't he wouldn't get it.
Ok, so does hunting and gathering have minimal benefit to me and huge benefit to someone telling me what to hunt and gather?Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
Does walking to take a shit take up 2/3 of my waking day?
No Wayne Rooney is not deserving of that money, but I get why you think he is. I don't blame Rooney for taking advantage of all the morons who think kicking a ball is a measure of success. But it definielty goes a long way to demonstrating how fucked up the world is. Rooney earns like £250k a week or whatever, it's sick money. I get £500 a month for doing shit all and I'm made to feel like I'm a bad person for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
That's because you take our money and aren't deserving, we willingly give him our money and he isn't deserving in a moral sense. But we give it to him and you take it from us, that's a big difference.
You take advantage of your fellow citizens by taking from our insurance pot.
You get job seekers allowance, right? Well It's kinda like stealing really. You con us out of our money. I mean if you went to sign on and actually said I'm not looking for work and have no intention of working and I just want this money for nothing then you wouldn't get it.
Oh my god you're right, I'm a terrible person. I'm a thief and a liar. I should go to prison.
Dan I have two choices - work, or sign on. There are other options, like find a hippie commune, or die, whatever. But, there's two viable options. I choose to sign on because working makes me very unhappy. You can try to paint me as a bad guy for sponging off the average citizen, but the fact is I have no problem accepting a meagre survival off the taxpayer. I had no problem with the unemployed when I was working, and if I work again in the future I won't have a problem with them. That's because I understand that not everyone is employable, not everyone wants to engage in the system, and that people most certainly should not be forced to.
I am not a bad person for satnding my ground on this issue. If I were pretending to be ill so I could claim sick benefits instead, well than you might have a point. But I'm not. So you can shove your guilt trip up your arse. I'm certainly not intending to take the first job I can find, because doing so will simply result in me being unhappy for six months before I finally have a breakdown and jack it in.
ehh, you were doing alright up to this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
Footballers wages are the victims of iterative process, it's the same with the top jobs in banks and business - there's an ever increasing spiral between the top firms to outbid each other in order to attract the best, and it's led to over inflation of the true worth of the position. It's a 'creep' in price that isn't specific to football. If I worked my bollocks off my whole life as an accountant the best I could hope for is maybe CEO of an international bank (£10m a year) by the age of 50 and I feel that paying someone £100m a year for any physical skill and sporting talent is just so, so wrong.
As for Ong, yes people living on benefits is a drain on the economy but it's not the biggest budgetary problem we have. IMO a bigger worry is that average lifespan is increasing faster than predicted and that retirement age is likely to go up again before I reach 65 (and even a second increase will not be enough to cover the massive pension deficit in this country).
http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/...-tax-r-001.jpg
https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...udget-2014.xls
I'm not really sure what you want from ong here, rong. He's admitted that he's living off us taxpayers, and you've admitted that it's a fairly meagre existence. Is it that he got your back up by framing his unemployment around some 1980s style anti capitalist rhetoric? Because I'm just not that bothered about the dolie bums
It was more the fair share comment that annoyed me. Bumming off the state is one thing but trying to justify it as anything but living off of everyone else's hard work is just plain wrong.
Well I was born into this shitting country and it's fucking system, so yes I hold the opinion that the nation owes me a meagre living. Next year I'll be voting for the Greens. I've never voted before, and while I briefly flirted with the idea of voting UKIP, I'm very likely to lean Greens, simply because they want to legalise all drugs, ban animal tesing, and give EVERYONE a living income, which would mean I don't have to bullshit a job search every two weeks, and it means you don't have to cry about my pissy survival because you too would get what I get, plus whatever you earn.Quote:
Originally Posted by rong
Don't blame me for the system sucking. Blame the powers that be.
Yeah I can see why the sense of entitlement might irk you. There was a period in my life where I had less disposable income doing full time work than my brother did signing on, and it was easy to feel a little disheartened with the system. Why work when I'd be financially better off just to go have 3 or 4 kids and sign on? It actually took a fair bit of life grind on my part to reverse that trend and I kinda agree with ong about the system, the jump from unemployment to employment works out at like £1/hr or something for a lot of people so there's not a huge incentive to give up 40 hours of your life to go and do itQuote:
Originally Posted by rong
But whatever, I chose to work and I'm happy with my choice. Ong you choose not to and that's also fine with me, more power to you bro.
I'm glad you're not bothered luco. Ofc it makes no difference if I work or not, dan's tax burden will remain unaffected by my employment status. But I understand why it pisses people off, I've had this argument with close friends. Not all of my friends are happy to see me lazing around while they go and work. But they seem to forget that they have wives, kids, cars, mortgages. That's what they're making the sacrifice for. I'd feel a lot differently about working if I had kids to support, and I'd very likely have very little interest in the political rantings of a layabout stoner. So I see where dan is coming from. But I'm certainly not going to apologise to anyone for my refusal to engage. I'm not doing anything wrong. I hate the way the world works, wish to play as little a role in it as possible, and as such I'm simply defaulting to the path of least resistance.
oooo so much to comment on
really ? ever heard of suicide? Certainly you have a strange view of a civilised society.You want all of the benefits of a collective responsibility but to pass on the the obligations of a collective responsibility.You're just fucking selfish.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
And for you to continue to take unemployment with intending to look for and stick at a job and contibute towards other peoples welfare just means that you are not civilised.Quote:
Also the idea that a civilised society leaves the unemployed to simply fend for themselves, well it kind of negates the idea that it's a civilised society in the first place.
what a load of bollocks . crime would only go up as a result of bone idle scumbags preferring to steal from others because they lack morals rather than going out and finding a job.Its just an extension ogf what they are already doing by sitting on the dole year in year out swilling their cheap lager and getting stoned.Quote:
What happens if benefits are cut? The welfare bill goes down, but at what cost? Yup, crime goes up massively, which in turn means the prison bill goes up. I can tell you it would cost a lot more to keep me in prison than it costs to keep me idle.
did you even think about that ??? you say forcing you to take a job is slavery .....so instead you force everyone else to work so that you can sit on your arse all day...how is that not slavery. By your argument it should be stopped because we abolished slavery . therefore we shouldn't have to contribute towards your lifestyle and you should have the choice to find a job or starve.Quote:
But mainly, the real reason why a civilised society has a moral obligation to pick up the tab is because we abolished slavery a century ago. When somebody HAS to go to work to survive, they are a slave. People only have a choice when that choice is viable... and if there's no income for the unemployed, then people do not have a choice. Of course we do have a choice, we're not slaves. But the powers that be try their very best to make us slaves.
lol @fat cat boss playing golf is stereo typical bullshit........many bosses in the private sector will put in many more hours than the employees do and the profits from their companies will keep you in lager and weed for years. To denigrate them for playing golf while you sit watching jereny kyle every day is laughable just to continue with the stereo type).The only part of your argument that has some merit is the politicians.......many of them are career politicians/lawyers/union officials and never done a days real work in their lives .There should be a requirement that people standin for parliament should have 20 years workplace experience before they can stand so that they have some idea how budgets are calculated and spent rather than the incompetents who can't hack it in the workforce and consequently make a complete balls up when running the country, leading to all the waste that you mention.Quote:
They drum conformity into our heads from a young age. They sure like to press the idea that those who refuse to engage in the system are scroungers. Even you have the "why should I" attitude that the capitalist system breeds. But of course the real scroungers are the politicians who claim everything off the taxpayer, or the fatcat boss who plays golf while his employees work their asses off for him to be able to afford such a lifestyle. I'm not a scrounger for expecting £15 a day to avoid having to engage the system, beg or steal. The amount of money the taxpayer spends making sure the unemployed are not all homeless and hungry is insignificant when compared to the amount of money waste on other aspects of government.
bollocks, you engage with the system every time you sign on and collect your paymentQuote:
Basically Dan, I refuse to engage in the system because I fucking hate the system.
lol at a stoner "fiercely" bit of a contradiction isnt it?How do you contribute back to society then Ong? . DO you do voluntary work visiting lonely pensioners (without nicking their weekly pension or savings) and giving them some company, or helping at a hospice so that the terminally ill can have some extra help in their last days. DO you help with after school clubs or youth centres to give kids an outlet or interest rather than loitering around the streets and getting into gangs/violence/a life of crime. None of these things are helping some fatcat or furthering capitalism but they all put something back into a civilised society. but like the lazy cunt you are you just want to sit at home getting stoned all day.Quote:
I'm fiercly anticapitalist and would rather rot away in my house sitting around getting stoned than to spend most of my adult life doing shit I don't want to do for some cunt I don't like for money I don't want.
------------------------------------------
interesting link http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/abou...s-cause-cancerQuote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
Quote:
The substances in cannabis smoke
Cannabis smoke contains many of the same cancer causing substances (carcinogens) as tobacco - at least 50 of them. In addition, cannabis is often mixed with tobacco when smoked.
One of these carcinogens is benzyprene. Benzyprene is in the tar of both tobacco and cannabis cigarettes. We know that benzyprene causes cancer. It alters a gene called p53, which is a tumour suppressor gene. We know that 3 out of 4 lung cancers (75%) occur in people who have faulty p53 genes. The p53 gene is also linked to many other cancers.
Cannabis also contains a substance called THC (tetrahydrocannabinol). It is the THC in the cannabis that changes your mood and behaviour. The amount of THC in a cannabis cigarette varies considerably. Researchers have shown that THC causes benzpyrene to promote the p53 gene to change. But other researchers have looked at the effects of pure THC on brain tumour cells and found that it killed them in laboratory tests. This is a long way from using it as a treatment. But you can see from this that the evidence on cannabis causing cancer is confusing.
The way people smoke cannabis
People inhale cannabis smoke for longer than cigarette smoke. This is to get the full effect of the cannabis. But it means that the smoke is in contact with the lungs for longer.
so you are taking 50 + known carcinogens into your body when you smoke the weed and now you are getting all fussy because of insectides and pesticides being used on the plants with no carcinogenic properties attributed to those chemicals( cos they get banned and withdrawn from use if that is discovered)
lol yeah ....cloud cuckoo land .....ever heard of cost efficiencies from scale of production. the pests and mould problems are a side effect of the plant density that you are forced to crop in with illegal " gardens". insecticides and fungicides that you would have access to are probably £10 per 500ml at B&Q or a garden centre , agriculture is typically paying £10 per 25l of the same chemical. that is the kind of disparity in pricing that you would be facing.If its legal, companies would be growing weed in india/africa/south america or other similar countries where land is cheap, labour is cheap , drying costs are negligible climate is favourable and delivery costs round the world are minute as a container would be loaded on a ship. Compared to this you have minimal space to grow your crop (a cellar), you have no daylight (since in cellar) so big electric cost for lights,same thing goes for heating , cold climate and you need to get the temperature (another big cost) up to speed up growth but this then leads to the pest and fungal problems since you have the plants crowded together. Your heating and light costs are going to dwarf the costs that commercial crops will be grown for and you will not be able to compete.Quote:
All you're doing here is demonstrating why it's harder than people realise. The top companies who are driving the prices down are going to be a problem, yes. But they will not be able to drive the prices down to the point it is unviable for me to do it at home, because a home crop that has constant attention will nearly always provide a better quality crop than a large scale industrial crop.
the commercial crop wouldn't be grown like the weeds in our garden , your efforts would look amateurish in comparison.Oh ....just pointing out another slip up with the word "again"Quote:
Basically, I'm in no doubt I could find buyers for my weed, if I were to grow again. People want quality smoke, and that doesn't grow like the weeds you find in the garden.
As i showed above .....that is the high cost of production route leading to expensive weed, the commercial crop will drive those costs through the floor and people will have to be stoned to buy your shit rather than the commercially grown stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
lol at destroying democracy from the guy who admits to never having voted......presumably because he's too fucking lazy to walk to the nearest voting station when he could be watching jeremy kyle instead.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
erm some optionsQuote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
1/ get a fucking job that satisfies your criteria
2/ do some voluntary work
3/ visit the elderly/disabled
4/ get some qualifications
note how none of the above involve sitting around getting stoned.
like i said before , if you don't want to engage , don't sign on .if you sign on put something back into society.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
so theres something wrong with saying that those claiming to be ill to get the sickness payments are scum of the earth for lying , but theres nothing wrong with you claiming to be looking for work when you have no intention of working so that you can get your dole money?. hypocrit or what?Quote:
I am not a bad person for satnding my ground on this issue. If I were pretending to be ill so I could claim sick benefits instead, well than you might have a point. But I'm not. So you can shove your guilt trip up your arse.
This bit is a really good point, that isn't too critical of you and your lifestyle in it's essence.
Quote:
How do you contribute back to society then Ong? . DO you do voluntary work visiting lonely pensioners and giving them some company, or helping at a hospice so that the terminally ill can have some extra help in their last days. DO you help with after school clubs or youth centres to give kids an outlet or interest rather than loitering around the streets and getting into gangs/violence/a life of crime. None of these things are helping some fatcat or furthering capitalism but they all put something back into a civilised society.
tl;dr
I'm a busy man keith, I haven't the time to read all that. All I'll say is you're wrong and I'm right.
Oh ffs I saw this...
I don't particularly consider this an insult. Give me one good reason why I shouldn't be selfish.Quote:
You're just fucking selfish.
Wait, what? You're suggesting suicide is a viable option? Fucking hell keith, a bit strong. I realise I won that game of ww and you're pissed, but encouraging me to top myself is heavy shit.Quote:
really ? ever heard of suicide?
keith, suicide is not an option. Suggesting otherwise is really short sighted. I mean are you saying that you'd rather me top myself than claim benefits? And you dare to call me selfish? Fuck me.
No keith, you're just making shit up here. I can say you're not civlised for not wearing a top hat. And I have about as much ground to stand on as you do. Working / no working is not what determines if someone is civilised. I'm civilised because I don't do bad things, I'm polite, especially to women and old folk. If you disagree, well our definitions of the word "civilised" differs, and you suggesting I'm not fitting your definition of civilised, well again forgive me for not being insulted.Quote:
And for you to continue to take unemployment with intending to look for and stick at a job and contibute towards other peoples welfare just means that you are not civilised.
Yeah you're half right here. But how many people are on the dole? How many vacant jobs are there at any given time? Do you actually believe that everyone on the dole can just get work at the drop of a hat? You're fucking kidding yourself. You think I'm bone idle? You clearly haven't spent more than a few minutes at your local jobcentre. The majority of those claiming benefits are even more idle than I am, and lack the morals that stop me from stealing. So you're right, crime would go up for the reasons you state. This is one reason why it's necessary to have unemployment benefits. Because a lot of people will steal rather than work, if forced to do one or the other. I'd sooner work, but if you consider claiming benefits to be stealing, then again our different definitions take us to different places.Quote:
what a load of bollocks . crime would only go up as a result of bone idle scumbags preferring to steal from others because they lack morals rather than going out and finding a job.Its just an extension ogf what they are already doing by sitting on the dole year in year out swilling their cheap lager and getting stoned.
God this post of yours is huge, I'll read more later.
keith logic. It's only one step up from ong logic. I'm not forcing anyone to work. Saying I am is like me saying you're forcing me to type words right now.Quote:
did you even think about that ??? you say forcing you to take a job is slavery .....so instead you force everyone else to work so that you can sit on your arse all day...how is that not slavery. By your argument it should be stopped because we abolished slavery . therefore we shouldn't have to contribute towards your lifestyle and you should have the choice to find a job or starve.
When my options are to a) work, b) starve, then yes, working is slavery. If those are the only two options I have, then I work. But they're not the only two options I have. Fortunately I'm not a slave.
I'm not even sure what your point is. So I'm generalising. The point is, bosses tend to treat their employees like shit. But ofc if it wasn't for the employees, boss wouldn't have a fucking job himself. Boss should show employees more fucking respect.Quote:
lol @fat cat boss playing golf is stereo typical bullshit
Fair enough. But I don't see any other viable options. Emphasis on viable before you make more crazy suggestions, like joining a circus maybe. It's either work or claim benefits. Claiming is at least taking from the system instead of giving. It's not even a selfishness thing here. I'd be happy to give to the system if I felt the system was fair and honest. But it's not. So fuck the system. I'd love to withdraw entirely from the system, but how do I pay my rent and buy food?Quote:
bollocks, you engage with the system every time you sign on and collect your payment
I've actually considered charity work, and it might still be something I do. It's not as simple as just going and doing it. For some faggot ass reason, the benefits system frowns upon it, so if I go and work, even for no money, then it compromises my benefits. Go figure.Quote:
lol at a stoner "fiercely" bit of a contradiction isnt it?How do you contribute back to society then Ong? . DO you do voluntary work visiting lonely pensioners (without nicking their weekly pension or savings) and giving them some company, or helping at a hospice so that the terminally ill can have some extra help in their last days. DO you help with after school clubs or youth centres to give kids an outlet or interest rather than loitering around the streets and getting into gangs/violence/a life of crime. None of these things are helping some fatcat or furthering capitalism but they all put something back into a civilised society. but like the lazy cunt you are you just want to sit at home getting stoned all day.
Also, "lazy cunt" is not something that I find insulting either. You're gonna have to try harder if you're trying to piss me off.
Are you fucking serious? That's like saying you should happily eat a radioactive chocolate bar because chocolate is bad for you. Fucking hell keith you're really reaching hard here. Furthermore, spraying shit onto cannabis plants affects the taste, and therefore the quality. The fungicides when smoked are a lot fucking worse than the cannabis itself, because they're not designed for smoking, and people don't tend to wash their weed before smoking it. It's not like a tomato. When it comes to the risk associated with cannabis, that's a risk that people are willing to take, for the same reason people take risks when it comes to alchol. People like to get wasted. Just because cannabis isn't good for you, does not mean that makes it ok to spray it to high hell with whatever shit you like. You're talking crazy here keith.Quote:
so you are taking 50 + known carcinogens into your body when you smoke the weed and now you are getting all fussy because of insectides and pesticides being used on the plants with no carcinogenic properties attributed to those chemicals( cos they get banned and withdrawn from use if that is discovered)
You are wrong. They might make more money than me because they'd go large scale, but when it comes to quality, mine would be superior because mine would get the close attention the plants need to thrive. You're a farmer aren't you keith? Do you really think that an industrial crop can match the quality of a home crop? Whose tomatoes are going to be better? Nan's from the greenhouse? Or Tesco Value tomatoes?Quote:
the commercial crop wouldn't be grown like the weeds in our garden , your efforts would look amateurish in comparison.Oh ....just pointing out another slip up with the word "again"
Let's entertain you for a minute and say you're right, that I couldn't compete with international companies. Hooray cheap as fuck weed. It's win-win for me either way.Quote:
lol yeah ....cloud cuckoo land .....
Check you out jumping to the wrong conclusion. I've never voted because I despise British mainstream politics. I've never been particularly political through my younger years, so didn't really bother to find out what the Greens were all about. So I was left facing a choice between dog shit and cat shit, because that's basically the two options we have when it's Lab/Tory. I'm not voting for either of those. Next year I will vote, because I found a party that suits my ideals. And when we finally get an EU referendum, I'll be voting then too, make no mistake.Quote:
lol at destroying democracy from the guy who admits to never having voted......presumably because he's too fucking lazy to walk to the nearest voting station when he could be watching jeremy kyle instead.
But please keith, don't be one of those stupid people who thinks that apathy = undemocratic. There's actually quite a few people who have for a long time been very much disillusioned with the political system in this country. That's how apathy creeps in. Some people are just plain lazy and don't care, but the majority of non-voters usually have a legitimate reason. And you have no right to judge them for that reason, no right whatsoever. It's no better than me saying you're a terrible human for voting Tory/Labour.
Here you're really letting me know what your problem is. It's not that I don't want to play the game. It's that I'm enjoying my time rather than being more miserable than those who are working. You have a problem with me getting stoned while you're farming. I get that. But remember you called me fucking selfish? You're no better if you expect me to work at some shitty job to make you feel happier about paying tax.Quote:
erm some options
1/ get a fucking job that satisfies your criteria
2/ do some voluntary work
3/ visit the elderly/disabled
4/ get some qualifications
note how none of the above involve sitting around getting stoned.
It's a matter of options. If I say I don't want to work, then do I get benefit? I don't know, I don't really want to test the water in that respect. But there's a big difference in pretending to look for work and pretending to be sick. The latter gets me more money, so not only is it lying in order to survive, but it's acting fraudulently in order to get more money. I actually have a moral problem with that. I don't have a moral problem with pretending to find work because they don't exactly give me any option in that respect.Quote:
so theres something wrong with saying that those claiming to be ill to get the sickness payments are scum of the earth for lying , but theres nothing wrong with you claiming to be looking for work when you have no intention of working so that you can get your dole money?. hypocrit or what?
Whew that was fun.
Oh and for someone who didn't like me stereotyping, I'd like to point out that I don't drink beer, and I despise Jeremy Kyle. I drink tea while watching lectures on particle phsyics, I'm not your average layabout dole scum.
I think the worst thing about jeremy kyle is that I get into it quite quickly. Like, these people are bottom of the barrel and the show is bollocks but goddamn I need to know those lie detector results!Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
no , you said there was no other option. I just pointed out another one to show another, however there are lots more , join a hippy commune , or go to israel and join a kibbutz which are all effectively self sustaining communities.Only problem there is you would have to work to put back into the community.There is also a similar styled community on one of the scottish isles where the residents put on courses that people pay to go on which then sustains the "resident" community. These are all option which fit your ethos of not engaging with capitalism but unfortunately require you to work.Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
looking at the definition at http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionarie...lish/civilized and the 3rd definition "3 having or showing polite and reasonable behaviour" . How is sitting around doing nothing and just drawing the dole money with no intention of looking for a job "reasonable behaviour".The definition doesn't stop at polite or say polite "OR" reasonable behaviour.Quote:
No keith, you're just making shit up here. I can say you're not civlised for not wearing a top hat. And I have about as much ground to stand on as you do. Working / no working is not what determines if someone is civilised. I'm civilised because I don't do bad things, I'm polite, especially to women and old folk. If you disagree, well our definitions of the word "civilised" differs, and you suggesting I'm not fitting your definition of civilised, well again forgive me for not being insulted.
where did i say that claiming benefits is stealing? Benefits should be there to benefit the disabled,the sick , those made redundant whilst they look for another job etc . THey shouldn't be a lifestyle choice made by the bone idle who are too lazy to work or contribute back to society.Quote:
Yeah you're half right here. But how many people are on the dole? How many vacant jobs are there at any given time? Do you actually believe that everyone on the dole can just get work at the drop of a hat? You're fucking kidding yourself. You think I'm bone idle? You clearly haven't spent more than a few minutes at your local jobcentre. The majority of those claiming benefits are even more idle than I am, and lack the morals that stop me from stealing. So you're right, crime would go up for the reasons you state. This is one reason why it's necessary to have unemployment benefits. Because a lot of people will steal rather than work, if forced to do one or the other. I'd sooner work, but if you consider claiming benefits to be stealing, then again our different definitions take us to different places.
God this post of yours is huge, I'll read more later.
I said stealing. It's more gaining funds though fraudulent means but it amounts to the same thing.
defeating you own argument with your own logic is funny.if working is slavery when there are only two options work or stave that means that by extension when you have more options working is no longer slavery so why are you opposed to working on the grounds that working is slavery?Quote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
This cuts both ways Ong. Bosses that treat their employees like shit don't generally get a productive workforce as morale is low and the employees don't give a shit . The flip side of that is that employees who show their boss/company no respect tend to get no respect from their bosses/employers. The guys who float around doing as little as possible tend to end up with the grotty jobs nobody else wants to do, not offered overtime when its available or have someone on their backs all the time making sure they aren't slacking off. the guys that work hard , and show interest get promoted , get the overtime when available and tend to be left to get on with their work as the bosses know that they will get the job done.Quote:
I'm not even sure what your point is. So I'm generalising. The point is, bosses tend to treat their employees like shit. But ofc if it wasn't for the employees, boss wouldn't have a fucking job himself. Boss should show employees more fucking respect.
see previous response about communes , kibbutz or other self sustaining commuities. If you want to opt out of capitalism on principal there are ways of doing so . Don't expect to lie in bed all day and smoke weed all night though if you go that route.Quote:
Fair enough. But I don't see any other viable options. Emphasis on viable before you make more crazy suggestions, like joining a circus maybe. It's either work or claim benefits. Claiming is at least taking from the system instead of giving. It's not even a selfishness thing here. I'd be happy to give to the system if I felt the system was fair and honest. But it's not. So fuck the system. I'd love to withdraw entirely from the system, but how do I pay my rent and buy food?
http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/volunteer...fits.pdf?rev=1Quote:
I've actually considered charity work, and it might still be something I do. It's not as simple as just going and doing it. For some faggot ass reason, the benefits system frowns upon it, so if I go and work, even for no money, then it compromises my benefits. Go figure.
that seems to explain it clearly enough. you should be able to volunteer to do charity work which wouldn't normally be done by a paid employee in order to gain experience in order to get a job in the future as long as it doesn't interfere with your ability to go to an interview or be available for work.
wasn't trying to be insulting , just an accurate description of the image you portray.Quote:
Also, "lazy cunt" is not something that I find insulting either. You're gonna have to try harder if you're trying to piss me off.
all you do there ong is demonstrate your ignorance. Doesn't 50+ carcinogenic compounds in weed smoke scream out to you that weed isn't designed to be smoked either. What the fuck difference will 50+ carcinogenic compounds or 51+ carcinogenic compounds make? What evidence have you that "taste" will be effected.How do you know that the moulds on the weed you produce don't cause cancer either?. Check out aflatoxins.Quote:
Are you fucking serious? That's like saying you should happily eat a radioactive chocolate bar because chocolate is bad for you. Fucking hell keith you're really reaching hard here. Furthermore, spraying shit onto cannabis plants affects the taste, and therefore the quality. The fungicides when smoked are a lot fucking worse than the cannabis itself, because they're not designed for smoking, and people don't tend to wash their weed before smoking it. It's not like a tomato. When it comes to the risk associated with cannabis, that's a risk that people are willing to take, for the same reason people take risks when it comes to alchol. People like to get wasted. Just because cannabis isn't good for you, does not mean that makes it ok to spray it to high hell with whatever shit you like. You're talking crazy here keith.
the difference is that nan isn't going to make a living off the tomatoes from her small greenhouse as she won't be able to charge enough to cover the small scale and most people refusing to pay much more for her tomatoes than for tescos value tomatoes. What are the kids binge drinking getting drunk on ? its not the expensive lagers and spirits , its the cheapest ciders and lagers that they can get hold of.Sme thing will apply to them getting high. why will they get high twice on your expensive weed when they could get high 4 or 5 times on tescos value brand.Quote:
You are wrong. They might make more money than me because they'd go large scale, but when it comes to quality, mine would be superior because mine would get the close attention the plants need to thrive. You're a farmer aren't you keith? Do you really think that an industrial crop can match the quality of a home crop? Whose tomatoes are going to be better? Nan's from the greenhouse? Or Tesco Value tomatoes?
yeah and the end of you producing weed instead of working/dole , you still just be sat on the dole smoking weed and probably less likely to actually be fit to hold down a job.Quote:
Let's entertain you for a minute and say you're right, that I couldn't compete with international companies. Hooray cheap as fuck weed. It's win-win for me either way.
and when everyone is promised a living wage for doing nothing and takes them up on it and does nothing , where the the money going to come from . Its a typical slogan of the unelectable , they promise unrealistic policies because they will never have to put them into practise. You hate capitalism , how did communism work out, all you ended up with were fatcat party bosses living lives of luxury at the expense of the majority of the population.Quote:
Check you out jumping to the wrong conclusion. I've never voted because I despise British mainstream politics. I've never been particularly political through my younger years, so didn't really bother to find out what the Greens were all about. So I was left facing a choice between dog shit and cat shit, because that's basically the two options we have when it's Lab/Tory. I'm not voting for either of those. Next year I will vote, because I found a party that suits my ideals. And when we finally get an EU referendum, I'll be voting then too, make no mistake.
If they don't vote they have no right to complain. THeres plenty of protest candidates in every election so vote for one of them if you don't like the main stream parties and register you disapproval of the mainstream parties. look how ukip votes are scaring lab/tories shitless . that is a result of people registering their protest votes and not sitting at home and doing nothing.Quote:
But please keith, don't be one of those stupid people who thinks that apathy = undemocratic. There's actually quite a few people who have for a long time been very much disillusioned with the political system in this country. That's how apathy creeps in. Some people are just plain lazy and don't care, but the majority of non-voters usually have a legitimate reason. And you have no right to judge them for that reason, no right whatsoever. It's no better than me saying you're a terrible human for voting Tory/Labour.
lol...you want to take from society and put nothing back, its as simple as that.Quote:
Here you're really letting me know what your problem is. It's not that I don't want to play the game. It's that I'm enjoying my time rather than being more miserable than those who are working. You have a problem with me getting stoned while you're farming. I get that. But remember you called me fucking selfish? You're no better if you expect me to work at some shitty job to make you feel happier about paying tax.
And saying that you are looking for work when you have no intention of actually working isn't fraudulent? Or are you just discerning in how fraudulent you want to be?.Quote:
It's a matter of options. If I say I don't want to work, then do I get benefit? I don't know, I don't really want to test the water in that respect. But there's a big difference in pretending to look for work and pretending to be sick. The latter gets me more money, so not only is it lying in order to survive, but it's acting fraudulently in order to get more money. I actually have a moral problem with that. I don't have a moral problem with pretending to find work because they don't exactly give me any option in that respect.
Whew that was fun.
Ok so basically you decide who is civilised and who isn't by judging whether their behaviour is reasonable or not. I see now.Quote:
looking at the definition at http://www.oxfordlearnersdictionarie...lish/civilized and the 3rd definition "3 having or showing polite and reasonable behaviour" . How is sitting around doing nothing and just drawing the dole money with no intention of looking for a job "reasonable behaviour".The definition doesn't stop at polite or say polite "OR" reasonable behaviour.
I'm opposed to work for many reasons. "Slavery" is pretty obviously a buzzword I'm trhwoing in there. Do I think those who work day in day out are slaves? No, because they have a choice. The fact they don't exercise that choice does not make them slaves. If the choice were to work or starve, then slavery is exactly what it is. That seems to be what you're advocating. It seems like the dumb general public think that slavery is acceptable. Yes keith, you're the dumb general public.Quote:
defeating you own argument with your own logic is funny.if working is slavery when there are only two options work or stave that means that by extension when you have more options working is no longer slavery so why are you opposed to working on the grounds that working is slavery?
You're right in this paragraph.Quote:
This cuts both ways Ong.
I thought I emphasises viable. Going to Israel is certainly not a viable option. In fact suicice is preferable to going to fucking Israel. That is literally the last place on the planet I would like to be. Yeah I'd rather be on a raft in the ocean living off fish and rainwater. In case my feelings aren't obvious, fuck Israel. They're the most capitalist pigs out there ffs. They run the world. They're the fuckers responsible for my anticapitalist feelings. We can go down this round if you like, and you can stop calling me lazy and start calling me paranoid.Quote:
see previous response about communes , kibbutz or other self sustaining commuities. If you want to opt out of capitalism on principal there are ways of doing so . Don't expect to lie in bed all day and smoke weed all night though if you go that route.
Hippie communes don't exactly advertise at the jobcentre, fyi. If someone invited me to one, I'd be interested to see how they support themselves. That *might* be viable.
I have worked at a charity shop before while on benefits, and raised this subject with my advisor a few months ago. He said it was possible but not something I can just go an do, I'd need to get agreement. This actually might happen. Or it might not, idk. I'm certainly not unwilling to work in a charity shop.Quote:
that seems to explain it clearly enough. you should be able to volunteer to do charity work which wouldn't normally be done by a paid employee in order to gain experience in order to get a job in the future as long as it doesn't interfere with your ability to go to an interview or be available for work.
Accurate description full stop.Quote:
wasn't trying to be insulting , just an accurate description of the image you portray.
keith you're still talking crazy on this matter. Just because some webiste says that weed has 50+ carcinogenic compounds, that does not make it ok to spray shit that can cause harm onto the plants. It's not ok to make something that is bad for you even worse. I don't even think you believe what you say here, you're just being argumentative for the sake of it. I do that, argue a point I have no belief in, just because it's fun. It's like saying it's ok to drink canal water and vodka because the vodka is bad for you so who gives a crap about the canal water. Seriously keith. And yes the moulds aren't good to smoke either. I've had to throw a reasonable amount of weed on a fire because it was mouldy. A few hundred quid, up in flames. That was a bag that I left for too long. If that was the crop during its cycle it would've been thousands lost. Mouldy weed doesn't make it on to the market because noone wants to smoke it for free, let alone buy it. It's possible that a few particles of mould go unchecked, that's the case when you eat bread too. But any noticable sign of mould means that it is worthless and to be disposed of quickly.Quote:
all you do there ong is demonstrate your ignorance. Doesn't 50+ carcinogenic compounds in weed smoke scream out to you that weed isn't designed to be smoked either. What the fuck difference will 50+ carcinogenic compounds or 51+ carcinogenic compounds make? What evidence have you that "taste" will be effected.How do you know that the moulds on the weed you produce don't cause cancer either?. Check out aflatoxins.
No, you're right that Nan isn't going to make a living off tomatoes. I'm talking about quality here. When it comes to the point you're making, the difference between Nan's tomatoes and my weed is value. Weed is never going to be as cheap as tomatoes.Quote:
the difference is that nan isn't going to make a living off the tomatoes from her small greenhouse as she won't be able to charge enough to cover the small scale and most people refusing to pay much more for her tomatoes than for tescos value tomatoes. What are the kids binge drinking getting drunk on ? its not the expensive lagers and spirits , its the cheapest ciders and lagers that they can get hold of.Sme thing will apply to them getting high. why wi ll they get high twice on your expensive weed when they could get high 4 or 5 times on tescos value brand.
I understand what you're getting at, but you're wrong to assume there would be no means of income for me if it was legal for me to grow weed. I might not have the profit margins of the big companies, but believe me my weed will be nicer, and it will still be profitable because it will always have a significant value. It's not a competition between me and the big company to see who makes the most money. I just want an income, which would be easy.
And your point about cheap lager is also missing the point. I'm a cider drinker, but I'm very fussy about the quality. I want nice flat cider, not fizzy shit. The kids are all drinking nasty cider, and you can bet your life that Strongbow make a lot more money that Lilley's, who make my favourite cider. But Lilley's is still a viable business, because there are enough people who deem quality more important that value.
Well if it makes you happy I'd rather be gwoing weed than living off the state. When I was growing weed, I wasn't claiming dole. I'm sorry keith but here you can blame the law for my current state of idleness. Legalising weed would reduce benfits, boost the economy, and save taking a lot of people to court.Quote:
yeah and the end of you producing weed instead of working/dole , you still just be sat on the dole smoking weed and probably less likely to actually be fit to hold down a job.
If you actually think that I wouldn't be able to make money growing weed if it were legal, then all I can say is you're wrong. Even if the price crashed to £50 per ounce, well a 60 ounce crop will return £1k a month, just enough to scrape a living. That's a big crop, but probably the maximum I could handle efficiently. And after paying overheads, including rent, I'd still have around £400 disposable income a month. The price is currently around £150 per ounce, I'd expect that to crash to £100 if it went legal. My crop target would be £5k, that would give me at least £1k a month income after overheads. At £100 per ounce, I'd need a 50 ounce crop. That's ten very good plants, or twenty average ones. Yeah that's easily manageable.
Communism never happened.Quote:
and when everyone is promised a living wage for doing nothing and takes them up on it and does nothing , where the the money going to come from . Its a typical slogan of the unelectable , they promise unrealistic policies because they will never have to put them into practise. You hate capitalism , how did communism work out, all you ended up with were fatcat party bosses living lives of luxury at the expense of the majority of the population.
And you're wrong if you think everyone will leave their jobs so they can do fuck all with their £500 a month or whatever the greens dish out. Will dan be able to support his family on £500? Nope. The only people who will laze about doing fuck all are the people who do that anyway.
Utter bullshit. You're stupid if you think this.Quote:
If they don't vote they have no right to complain.
And that bothers you why exactly?Quote:
lol...you want to take from society and put nothing back, its as simple as that.
I have no choice but to lie to them. The alternative is to get nothing. Am I fraudulent? Well actually no I'm not. They ask me what I've been doing. I give them a list of jobs. I don't say I actually applied for them, not anywhere where I put my signature anyway, I give them a list of jobs. I tell them I'm looking for jobs. Well I am looking for jobs. For my list that I have to give them. So no I'm not acting fraudulently. And even still, when the alternative is to become quickly homeless and hungry, your point is still moot because it's hardly a crime for someone to lie in order to survive.Quote:
And saying that you are looking for work when you have no intention of actually working isn't fraudulent? Or are you just discerning in how fraudulent you want to be?.
try google then .....http://blitzedape.blogspot.co.uk/201...nes-in-uk.htmlQuote:
Originally Posted by OngBonga
A list of Intentional Communes in the UK
Alto Sax Tantra Community (near Stansted Airport, England, United Kingdom) Re-Forming
Beannachar Camphill Community (Aberdeen, Scotland, United Kingdom)
Beech Hill Community (Devon, England, United Kingdom)
Braziers Park (Wallingford, England, United Kingdom)
Camphill Communities in Britain and Ireland, Association of (England, United Kingdom)
Camphill Village, Newton Dee (Aberdeen, Scotland, United Kingdom)
Canon Frome Court Community (Ledbury, England, United Kingdom)
Centre for Alternative Technology - CAT (Powys, Wales, United Kingdom)
Chicken Shack Housing Cooperative (Gwynedd, Wales, United Kingdom)
Clanabogan Camphill Community (Co Tyrone BT78 1TJ, N. Ireland, United Kingdom)
Coastal Community (United Kingdom) Forming
CoFlats Stroud (Stroud, England, United Kingdom)
The Community Project (Lewes, England, United Kingdom)
Corani Housing and Land Co-op (Leicester, England, United Kingdom)
Cornerstone Housing Cooperative (West Yorkshire, England, United Kingdom) (Leeds, England, United Kingdom)
Couple Seeking Therapeutic Community UK (Brentwood, Essex, England, United Kingdom) Forming
Earthworm Housing Co-op (Shropshire SH7 0LH, England, United Kingdom)
Ecovillage Network UK (Bristol BS99 3JP, England, United Kingdom)
Enlinca (Cambridge, United Kingdom) Forming
Findhorn Foundation and Community (Findhorn, Scotland, United Kingdom)
Forge Bank (Halton, Lancaster, United Kingdom) Forming
FOUNDATION (London, United Kingdom) (Tamil Nadu, India) Forming
Frankleigh Co-Flats (Bradford-on-Avon, England, United Kingdom)
Godhive (Bexley, Kent, United Kingdom)
Harrow Ashram (London, England, United Kingdom) Forming
Hengrave Community of Reconciliation (Suffolk, England, United Kingdom) Forming
Hockerton Housing Project (Southwell, England, United Kingdom)
The Homestar Community (Borders near eastern coast, Scotland, United Kingdom) Forming
Isle of Erraid (Argyll, Scotland, United Kingdom)
Keveral Farm (Looe, England, United Kingdom)
Komaja (Gersau, Switzerland) (Cologne, Germany) (Espasingen, Germany) (Vienna, Austria) (Zagreb, Croatia) (Skopje, Macedonia, The Former Yugoslav Republic of) (Ohrid, Macedonia, The Former Yugoslav Republic of) (Brighton, United Kingdom) (Novi Beograd, Serbia and Montenegro) (Dublin, Ireland) (Sliema, Malta) (HR Den Haag, Netherlands) (Bowral, New South Wales, Australia) (Beverly, Massachusetts, United States)
Lammas (Pembrokeshire, Wales, United Kingdom) Forming
Laurieston Hall (Castle Douglas, Scotland, United Kingdom)
Lee Abbey Aston Household Community (Birmingham B6 5ND, England, United Kingdom)
Leyton co-housing (London, United Kingdom)
London Community (London, United Kingdom) Forming
Monkton Wyld Court (Bridport, Dorset, United Kingdom) Re-Forming
Moonlight Meadows (United Kingdom) Re-Forming
Mourne Grange Camphill Village Community (Co Down, N. Ireland, United Kingdom)
New Creation Christian Community (Northampton, England, United Kingdom) (Coventry, England, United Kingdom) (Birmingham, England, United Kingdom) (Leicester, England, United Kingdom) (London, England, United Kingdom) (Sheffield, England, United Kingdom) (Belfast, N. Ireland, United Kingdom) (Brighton and Hove, England, United Kingdom) (Liverpool, England, United Kingdom) (Milton Keynes, England, United Kingdom) (Oxford, England, United Kingdom)
Newbold House (Forres, Scotland, United Kingdom)
9/11-Truthers (Scotland, United Kingdom) Forming
The Othona Community (Essex, England, United Kingdom)
Othona Community Burton Bradstock (Bridport, England, United Kingdom)
Plants for a Future (Ashwater, Beaworthy, Devon, England, United Kingdom) (The Field, Higher Penpol, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, England, United Kingdom) Forming
Redfield Community (Buckinghamshire, England, United Kingdom)
The Rogue Elephant (Rural setting outside of London, United Kingdom) Forming
The Seventh Way (UK, United Kingdom)
Simon Community (London, England, United Kingdom)
Springhill Cohousing Community (Stroud, England, United Kingdom)
Stepping Stones Housing Co-op (South West, Wales, United Kingdom)Steward Community Woodland (Devon, England, United Kingdom) Forming
TRINITY Christian PRIORY (Spain) (Argentina) (Vera Cruz, Mexico) (Uppsala, Sweden) (Crawley, United Kingdom) (Bebra, Germany) (RENNES, France) (Dallas, Texas, United States) (Congo) (PARIS, France) (Selignac, France) (THIERS 63300, France) (Welkom, South Africa) (New Mexico and Mexico) (Wisconsin, United States) (Chicago, Illinois, United States) (Mpumalanga Province, near Badplaas, South Africa) (Newark, Notts, United Kingdom) (Venezuela) (Brazil) (Ecuador) (India)
Two Piers (England, United Kingdom)
The Well at Willen (Milton Keynes, England, United Kingdom)
Zeitgeist Collective (Thailand) (Manchester, United Kingdom) Forming
keith you're still talking crazy on this matter. Just because some webiste says that weed has 50+ carcinogenic compounds, that does not make it ok to spray shit that can cause harm onto the plants. It's not ok to make something that is bad for you even worse. I don't even think you believe what you say here, you're just being argumentative for the sake of it. I do that, argue a point I have no belief in, just because it's fun. It's like saying it's ok to drink canal water and vodka because the vodka is bad for you so who gives a crap about the canal water. Seriously keith. And yes the moulds aren't good to smoke either. I've had to throw a reasonable amount of weed on a fire because it was mouldy. A few hundred quid, up in flames. That was a bag that I left for too long. If that was the crop during its cycle it would've been thousands lost. Mouldy weed doesn't make it on to the market because noone wants to smoke it for free, let alone buy it. It's possible that a few particles of mould go unchecked, that's the case when you eat bread too. But any noticable sign of mould means that it is worthless and to be disposed of quickly.Quote:
I have worked at a charity shop before while on benefits, and raised this subject with my advisor a few months ago. He said it was possible but not something I can just go an do, I'd need to get agreement. This actually might happen. Or it might not, idk. I'm certainly not unwilling to work in a charity shop.
[/quote] sprays have to go through rigorous testing before being approved for use , same would apply to use on weed but as you maintain its a high value crop the incentive is their for the chemical companies to get their products tested to see what combustion products result . if they prevent mould that is contributing to the 50+ carcinogens then their use could actually make the weed less harmful.
you are lacking any understanding of how the marketplace works though. You think that decriminalizing will mean that everyone will carry on as before paying sky high prices to the growers.that won't happen. large scale growers will supply those not wanting to grow but a hell of a lot of your target market will be nipping down the local garden centre and buying some pot plants and grow their own.Quote:
No, you're right that Nan isn't going to make a living off tomatoes. I'm talking about quality here. When it comes to the point you're making, the difference between Nan's tomatoes and my weed is value. Weed is never going to be as cheap as tomatoes.
I understand what you're getting at, but you're wrong to assume there would be no means of income for me if it was legal for me to grow weed. I might not have the profit margins of the big companies, but believe me my weed will be nicer, and it will still be profitable because it will always have a significant value. It's not a competition between me and the big company to see who makes the most money. I just want an income, which would be easy.
who would typically be the higher disposable income people rather than the out of work kidsQuote:
And your point about cheap lager is also missing the point. I'm a cider drinker, but I'm very fussy about the quality. I want nice flat cider, not fizzy shit. The kids are all drinking nasty cider, and you can bet your life that Strongbow make a lot more money that Lilley's, who make my favourite cider. But Lilley's is still a viable business, because there are enough people who deem quality more important that value.
Hardly a ringing endorsement of their policy then is it .....vote green and make the bone idle better off isn't going to get them electedQuote:
And you're wrong if you think everyone will leave their jobs so they can do fuck all with their £500 a month or whatever the greens dish out. Will dan be able to support his family on £500? Nope. The only people who will laze about doing fuck all are the people who do that anyway.
again you are wrong , you are not looking for jobs , you are looking for a list of job adverts which is not the same thing.You are not looking for a job that you intend to interview for and then if succesfull turn up and work at.WHen we advertised jobs in the past their was no point advertising at the job centre. All we got from job centres were people wanting the interview so that they could then carry on claiming. They , like you, had no intention of doing the job that they were applying for, they were just ticking boxes to ensure the dole money kept flowing.Quote:
I have no choice but to lie to them. The alternative is to get nothing. Am I fraudulent? Well actually no I'm not. They ask me what I've been doing. I give them a list of jobs. I don't say I actually applied for them, not anywhere where I put my signature anyway, I give them a list of jobs. I tell them I'm looking for jobs. Well I am looking for jobs. For my list that I have to give them. So no I'm not acting fraudulently. And even still, when the alternative is to become quickly homeless and hungry, your point is still moot because it's hardly a crime for someone to lie in order to survive.
It doesn't make the bone idle better off, we'd have exactly the same, maybe even less. It just means we don't have to go through this stupid rigmarole of pretending to look for work when 95% of the unemployed are either a) unwilling to work, b) unemployable, or c) unable to find work.Quote:
Hardly a ringing endorsement of their policy then is it .....vote green and make the bone idle better off isn't going to get them elected
Indeed. This only emphasises why it's a stupid idea to force me into applying for jobs I don't want. It's a waste of not only my time, but anyone who gives me an interview.Quote:
WHen we advertised jobs in the past their was no point advertising at the job centre. All we got from job centres were people wanting the interview so that they could then carry on claiming.
As for the rest of you post, we're just going round in circles. Thanks for the list of hippie communes, that must have taken some time for you to present that list with links and all. I'm sure none of the people who reside at these places are dole scum stoners.
:facepalm:Quote:
Thanks for the list of hippie communes, that must have taken some time for you to present that list with links and all. I'm sure none of the people who reside at these places are dole scum stoners.
lol ......blatant copy paste from the hippies who createed the list in the first place on the link i gave
I guess, it's still a long way to go in proving that though. Sure it will also be a tough process overall. https://imagicon.info/cat/10-3/1.gif
What? I'm pretty sure we proved ong is a lazy scrounging bum who is generally a detriment to society.
Nah you just proved that you're the same as all the other drones that go and work day in day out and think everyone else should have the same shitty daily life you have.
Hey ong, love you. Xxx
Your home life is better than mine, I'll grant you that. But my (lack of) work life is better. Swings and roundabouts.
Meh, horses for courses.
And to be fair, there's a limit to how low a salary I'd take before I joined you in your life of squalor and misery.
I would like to point out that squalor is correct, misery is incorrect.
So how much would you need to earn before you'd accept a typical office job? Average responsibility and stress.
£25k pa?
£25k a year would perk my interest for sure. If someone offered me a job that I could reasonably do, that wouldn't bore me too much, then sure I'd get off my arse for that kind of money. I'd probably settle for £20k. How long I'd stick it for depends on a) how much of an arsehole my boss is, and b) how mundane the job was, and c) how much I'm being paid.
Oh a d) if I had a family to support.
If d applied, then my attitude towards work would be vastly different. It's easy to be idle when I haven't got anyone to support.
Dude, you're not stupid. Surely you could get a 20k pa job. Just lie on your CV and say you've been abroad for the last 5 yrs. Then again you live in Birmingham so low salary.
I could pretty easily bullshit a job, complete with reference, to fill the last 5 years on my cv. If I pulled my finger out and tried to get a job, then I'm sure I could rise above 90% of the field. I just don't want to.
Lol 90%, maybe fiddy.
Fuck you I'm top ten percent.
has Ong posted today http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...ngham-30174763
I live in Kidderminster, not Brum. Besides, I doubt very much that has anything to do with cannbis production because I can't imagine what would cause an explosion. That's likely to be breaking bad shit, either serious chemicals, or pressurised gas. Growing weed has a high fire risk because of the electric and heat, but the most likely thing to explode would be the ballasts, and I don't think that would rip a house apart. I've never seen one blow though. Whatever caused that explosion was meaty.
It could be two fucking idiots messing about with fertiliser.
So all you needed was a friend and some fertilizer.