Hrmmmmm she did get a blanket didnt she. Hrmmmmm
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Hrmmmmm she did get a blanket didnt she. Hrmmmmm
given how d&d do these things, Meli losing her faith is prerequisite for a surprise resurgence of great magic.
it's like how they only kill somebody if all our hopes and dreams are riding on them or if they have a coming to jesus moment. the opposite is also true, when somebody is destitute, they couldn't be more important and great power awaits them.
I didnt get an "ominous" vibe from the scene. Perhaps that rules out her being a pretender of the faith or something. It was more of a sad, depressing vibe.
Maybe its cuz her homeboy stannis is dead? She was convinced he was the juggernaut, maybe she did lose faith.
Cold by the fire/blanket, nice spots! Good analysis. Can't wait for Sunday..
JONSNOW
Interesting. The camera made it look like the wolf is key.Quote:
Originally Posted by JKDS
The ending of episode 2 was awesome.
I dunno man, after all the killings I feel we're lacking a bit of leadership. I'm low on people I care about.
Who wins in a fight: FrankenMountain vs Ser Twenty of House Goodmen?
The latter being the Lannister soldiers? I mean, not that it matters, any group of twenty nameless men (not those nameless men..) living on Planetos are going to lose to Franken Mountain.Quote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
Felt like making a "Ramsay's plot armor 20 good men that decimated Stannis" from last season joke.
http://i.imgur.com/0FkY7mn.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/cj7Gp5c.png
Hahaha, that is top notch.
Alright, so she's still powerful enough to [spoiler] [spoiler] [spoiler] [spoiler]. Now why the fuck was she a freaking grandma?
Also, I'm tired of being shown how overpowered the church suddenly is. Do the Lannisters just not have an army anymore? Are we saying that if Dany came by, riding on her single dragon, that she'd just win by default because there is no one to fight her?
I was really hoping for Jamie to fuck some bitches up, but then hes made to be just as powerless as every other lannister.
AND ANOTHER THING, Tyrion better fucking ride a dragon, I swear to gawwwd.
Oh lord the last thing I want is Tyrion Targaryen.
The power of the Faith Militant looks silly on the surface since it's not illustrated that well, but if you extrapolate it can make sense. Mace Tyrell could easily lead a small force to slaughter every last one of them, but would lose his children at the same time. The Lannisters are likely so unpopular that their legitimacy hangs by a thread. Killing the Faith Militant would likely create a serious revolt among the people. While it will probably come to this, it can also be a reason for hesitation.
Yeah, it's not that they are super strong, it's that they've managed to position themselves in an incredibly strong way, with a lot of thanks to Cersei's paranoia.
I'd guess that the Faith Militant is something akin to the power of the Roman Catholic Church during the Crusades, where the pope has wide power and influence and even sway over kings and nobles.
He's not Cardinal Richelieu, who's actively engaged in the political maneuvering of the day; he's closer to an influential Al Qaeda-affiliated imam.
Apparently a lot of dirty book readers are outraged over the ending of last night's episode, insisting that GRRM specified that Dany only survived the Khal Drogo funeral pyre because of nasty blood magic, not some Targaryen tolerance for fire.
Of course this is ultra life nitty and ignores the fact that Dany being able to survive flames has long been a theme on the show. From her first episode we see that she is not in the least bothered by scalding hot bath water. When Viserys is killed, she says, "He is not the dragon, flames cannot kill the dragon," strongly implying that she knows that she IS the Dragon.
Yeah, it's hard to believe the Faith Militant could become so powerful. Imagine what Joffrey would have done to them if he was still alive...
When they took over the city last season I was just assuming that there was a buildup that just wasn't shown because there's already too many story lines going on at the same time. I immediately thought of the Dan Carlin podcast Prophets of Doom about the occupation of Münster by the anababtists in the 1500's. Which is a real life example of a Marilyn Manson type sect taking control over a whole city. From that perspective I had no problem with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
Over 4h, but worth it imo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x79MW1gWtJ8
great fucking ep, but im not a fan of the time travel stuff.
this ep confirmed a handful of theories (hodor caused by bran-to-the-past warging, walkers created by children to stop humans), and i think several of the theories that just hit reddit will come true.
Wow, hold the door is right.
To me it was pretty obvious that the Three-Eyed Raven was lying when he told Bran that the past was written, "the ink is dry" etc.
The theory is that Bran is responsible for all of the major events in Game of Thrones, including Robert's Rebellion, that he drove the Mad King mad.
My personal theory is that Bran beseeches House Targaryen to aid in the battle against the White Walkers, with the plea of "Burn them all!" as Aerys' "Hold the door!"
the past was written though. hodor became hodor before bran hodor'd him because bran always hodor'd him.
pieces of my endgame predictions:
aJor ahai lives through the end as the night's watch lord commander.
jon becomes the new night's king.
arya kills dany.
the actress that plays kinvara is fucking hot.
i'll be honest, hold the door was not an upsetting scene to me. probably because the time travel bullshit nullifies drama greatly, and oberyn martel headsquash exists.
plus it was a "good" death. when was the last time in this show that somebody died heroically? nobody in this thing gets to sacrifice themselves for the good of others. the death was almost uplifting imo
the wolves are symbolic.
lady dying shows sansa's lady sensibilities dying. shortly after her dog died, she lost all the elements that made her a "lady".
summer's death signifies that winter can't be stopped anymore.
grey wind's death signifies the death of the grey wind (the stark's dominance in battle and in status)
nymeria being lost signifies arya being lost
ghost being alive and well signifies jon being alive and well.
shaggydog signifies rickon being a shaggy story (something that ends with no purpose). except that this trope is likely to be subverted and rickon's story will end with significance.
True, it was a "good" death.Quote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
http://www.fourfingerdiscount.com.au...ernet-king.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
it means more after having thought about what it means and watching again. i've changed my mind. it's brilliant writing.
hodor always knew he was going to die holding the door because he experienced it as wyllas. bran warged wyllas, not hodor, so it was hodor, with full mental capacity, holding the door, knowing he was fulfilling his destiny. it was a destiny he feared. previous times in the show when shit would hit the fan, he would panic, possibly becuase he didnt know if this was the time where he would hold the door. even as hodor carried bran everywhere from the very beginning, he knew bran caused this. he didnt reject his fate. he lived his entire life knowing the day he would die. it was a burden he would bear alone.
After watching, I feel spoon fed.
Why did the tree child not just throw the grenade? There was no need to sacrifice herself. None at all.
I've been sick for like 3 days now, so I'm all caught up on GoT and I've got to say it's incredible.
if tormund or brienne die this season, im done.
YOU HEAR ME?! IM DONE!
ALL MEN MUST DIE, tho
im srs. it's a bridge too far. you dont dangle the most hilariously awesome romance ever in front of me then snatch it away.
He does look like "she's the biggest woman I've ever seen!"
can i just say it's this kind of time travel horse shit that really fucked up ff8 for me
Closed loop! Closed loop!
Is this gonna air today or are they skipping for the holiday weekend?
It was another good episode last night imo. There seems to be a lot more action this season than last season.
i'm sick of seeing goldie locks stand in fire and ride dragons and rally troops and say how she's going to conquer the world, then do nothing. i hope she actually does this season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric
can't wait to see arya kill the weird servant.
there are a lot of paths that could go in so many different directions, so yeah all in all loving this season so far.
personal prediction: dany will lose most of her dothraki and ships in a storm in the narrow sea just like the mongols did when invading japan. it ain't called storm's end for no reason.
I agree. I think Dany is done, but it has to be something more clever than the obvious: sending thousands of men who have never sailed and never seen ice and snow in leather armor across the sea to fight an army of knights in a thousand year long winter. The last two episodes were fantastic. I am so happy about how the story lines of Arya and King's Landing are panning out. Even after the entirety of last season it's still satisfying to see Cercei getting fucked... Sam might finally see some character development that fits his story and Arya is going to kick so much ass before this season is over.
Agree most of dothracki die via shipping issues. But I think she's destined to meet up with John snow the other side and together they go for the throne. Those dragons are destined for the final battle either against Kings landing for iron throne or the night walkers.
Yeah, the scenes with Dany are getting worse.
id prefer her not even in the show by now.
Yup, I especially hate the parts that remind me of the dragon skit on Saturday Night Live.Quote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
id be tickled pink if the real shaggy dog story is dany. let's have a giant kraken emerge during a storm and swallow her and her stupid dragons.
i dont think rickon will be a shaggy dog story, but will be a subversion of the trope. he'll probably sit winterfell by the end or something.
Dany's wasteland exists only because she does. Because of that, she and at least 1 dragon have plot armor.
Think of like, Jon. He isnt necessary. The wall lives on, zombies still rage.
Cersei? Kingslanding is still there. She could die next episode, wouldnt matter.
Kill Tyrion? Still doesnt matter.
But you cant kill Dany. There is literally no reason to even look at her location without her. The entire storyline would be just a distraction from the zombies and impending peril, and that isnt what GRRM is about. He kills characters all the time, but they all have a purpose. Dany's purpose hasnt been revealed yet. None of what she does matters at this point in the story, and she wont die before her storyline eventually impacts the rest of the world.
while i do think grrm is about using a shaggy dog story, i dont think dany would be it. you could argue stannis is it, but you could also argue that he served purpose of getting meli to the wall, etc.
I know this is the show thread, but now that the show is spoiling the books, do we still want this thread to be book knowledge free?
i think we should add some book stuff, but it depends on what the show only people have to say.
there is still some book stuff that shouldn't be mentioned. but i think that there is value to the books for the show only people now. for example, show!euron is fucking garbage even though he's totally awesome in the books and potentially the main Act III antagonist.
No books that arnt officially released please
Euron in the books is boss, but do you really think the show Euron is that bad? I think the casting is great. The Kings moot was a bit of a let down though. That was one of my favorite chapters in the whole series-- the Moot consisting of just Yara and Euron was weak, all the intrigue was lost, and they left out the dragon horn. I know this is tiptoeing into hyperbole, but without the horn, Euron winning the moot is close to being a plot hole.Quote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
ldo.Quote:
Originally Posted by JKDS
Show!Euron: "I don't mock the Drowned God; I am the Drowned God. From Oldtown to Qarth, when men see my sail, they pray."Quote:
Originally Posted by boost
Book!Euron: "Godless? Why, Aeron, I am the godliest man ever to raise sail! You serve one god, Damphair, but I have served ten thousand. From Ib to Asshai, when men see my sails, they pray."
This encapsulates why I don't like Show!Euron. Book!Euron is deeply mysterious. He's been to foreign lands, he knows foreign things, and he engages in foreign rituals. He's a religious fanatic who claims a divine destiny, and nobody can say otherwise since he appears to be truly inspired by his foreign experiences.
Show!Euron says silly things like he's a god. He makes cock jokes and says "let's go murder them." Show!Euron is an arrogant prick whose strength against his opposition is probably that he's just more ruthless than they are. Book!Euron is inspired. Conquest is his godly destiny, and for all we know, he's magical.
The show is trying to keep the religious fanaticism, mystery, and power of Euron, but I think turning him from a "godly" man to a "god" himself sullies his character. It makes him look too big for his britches instead of a divinely inspired enigma. Maybe it's just me, but I really loved the "godly" stuff the Iron Islanders cared so much about in the books. It gave them so much more depth and mystery. I was upset to see that "no godless man can sit the Seastone Chair" turned into "yadda yadda Salt Throne."
Show!Euron looks like just another meanface drabdress Iron Islander. I wanted to see this guy:
http://orig11.deviantart.net/b1ff/f/...ic-d6m4qod.jpg
Instead we got this guy:
http://starecat.com/content/wp-conte...of-thrones.jpg
On a related note, I read an interesting analysis of each act's villains and heroes. The short is that Act 1 is Tywin vs Tyrion, Act 2 is Jon vs Ramsay, and Act 3 is Euron vs Dany. Also can be thought of as father vs son, bastard vs bastard, kraken vs dragon. Each act is a type of struggle: Act 1 is the destructive power of war and political power (culminating is the Red Wedding). Act 2 is the destructive power of humanity at its root (Ramsay embodies human evil, Jon is for the most part human good, and they are likely to face off, not unlike Tyrion and Tywin did). Act 3 is the destructive power of religion and magic. I like the kraken vs dragon metaphor. Both Dany and Euron will probably have "divine right" on their side, as well as the most amount of magic.
Yeah man, you make solid points. I'm just trying to bolster my fanboydom as to have it last me through the end of the show. If this show flounders, and I have to come to terms with that fact-- I don't even..
The casting was good. My issue is artistic direction. It's the same with Daario.
Remember this from the last ep:
Daario: "You weren't made to sit on a chair in a palace."
Dany: "What was I made for?"
Daario: "You're a conquerer..."
Book!Daario would have responded with something offensive and arrogant. Perhaps with "My cock." Book!Daario is a ridiculous, conceited, silly man, which makes Dany's adoration of him all the more meaningful since it shows her own lack of judgment. But instead the show turned him into the most bland love interest that the average girl in the audience can get behind.
I wanted this idiot:
http://images4.fanpop.com/image/poll...64549_full.jpg
Instead we got this idiot:
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/...20141117212332
Don't get me wrong, I love the show. Hardhome, Tormund heart Brienne, gangster ass depictions like that of Tywin Lannister....Quote:
Originally Posted by boost
But you know me, I'm gonna bitch about something.
Again, solid points.
I probably have a positive bias to show Daario, only because I like the actor from his role in Treme. That being said, after reading the books, I definitely think they should have stuck with the original casting if that was an option. His ability to smirk the smirk of pure confidence while showing the world those crooked teeth was the embodiment of the character.
yup. original casting certainly got the smarmy douchebag correct
The only thing anybody needs to know about Game of Thrones
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G94G0Gxh1cU
http://www.instantrapairhorn.com/
What is HYPE may never die, but rises HYPEr and stronger.
What did it mean when Margaery gave the flower drawing to her grandmother? Their house symbol is a rose so is it her way of saying that she's still planning for the house despite telling her grandmother to leave?
ya
plus a thorn i think.
arya theory that's about 75% a friend's and 25% mine: waif returns to jaqen saying it's done. jaqen says "a girl still lives" and sends waif back out to finish the job. in the meantime, arya realizes she's gonna die by bleeding out. she returns to the hobaw and tells jaqen to give her the death juice and promise her that he will kill cersei (and maybe the mountain and ilin payne). maybe she says to take her face and use that to show cersei whose responsible for her death in the last minutes. jaqen then gives her the death juice which is transformed into the cure juice. the many faced god sees her sacrifice, her gifts, her whatever, and spares her, he has more use for her. then jaqen tells her a death is owed and she must go find and kill waif.
this fits a bigger theory i have that jaqen's plan for arya has this entire time been for her to kill cersei. he doesn't want her to be fullblown fm. there are inklings in the dialogue that the fm is a sort of moral institution that kills based on judgment instead of just money (like providing mercy for slaves by the first fm in valyria killing masters). fm hasn't been contracted to kill cersei, but they want cersei dead nonetheless and they know arya is the way to do it. this has all been training to get to that goal imo.
i remember years ago before i read the books i had some heated arguments with several 2p2ers about hound being alive. they told me i was blind and he was obviously dead. the symbolism and character arc said otherwise.
i stopped talking about his return after i read the books becuase the gravedigger theory was way too solid and it confirmed that hound was alive. then ian mcshane straight up spoiled it months ago
the only upsetting aspect of his return is NOT ENOUGH AIRHORN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psS2IMFkxKo
The part with Arya was a bit much. She wouldn't let anyone get close to her and wouldn't be fooled by what appeared to be a sweet old lady. If she did get stabbed in the gut like that and then submerged in water for that long then it is hard to imagine how she could survive.
One of the problems with this season is that people don't die and stay dead. The part with Jon Snow was tolerable but Sunday's scenes with Hound and Arya were kind of annoying.
scratch my arya theory. there's a much better one on reddit now. it explains your problem with how arya got caught too.
in case it's faux pas posting a reddit theory:
Spoiler:it's jaqen wearing arya's face
Wow, that spoiler is confusing. I need to wrap my head around that Arya theory.
On another note, I liked the appearance of Ian McShane from Deadwood.
top reasons:
Spoiler:jaqen has all that coinage; not arya. jaqen would stare out at the statue of braavos as if he's saying goodbye; not arya. jaqen would throw the coins righthanded; not arya; maisie has trained to be lefthanded too. arya/jaqen was loud and obvious and clumsy. jaqen/arya was walking like a highborn, dressed as a an obvious westerosi. jaqen still owes arya his own life; remember how she named him.
Oh wow, you're right in that it does explain why it was too easy for Arya to get caught.
I thought he could only change to the face of a dead person.
Anyway, can we talk about how amazing the girl who plays lady of bear island is? holy shit, that's a great character!
they showed arya's face on a dead fm already i think. the rules are fuzzy. it's probably that if you're in with the hobaw, fm can use your face.
Then why show her stumbling around in fear of every single face?Quote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
Just face-shift to some neutral face and get to where you need to go.
because the audience thinks it's arya.
jaqen be going to find the real arya anyways.
dead pool for remaining eps: 75% on each of them dying: ramsay, yara, waif, tormund.
wun wun could die if the writers are the stupidest people on the face of the planet. all good writing saves him to fight in the biggest final battle of the show.
others, like rickon, tommen, olenna, im not sure if will die.
tormund totes dead becuase he's gotten a lot of play and the wildings are finally following jon. tormund done his duty. tormund and brienne is just comic relief, not gonna happen.
mel defo not dying because she has gotten no play. dnd only kill when it pulls at audience heartstrings.
polly easier to do an alive pool.
mine is: Arya, Tyrion, Varys, Baelish... erm... that's it. Everyone I don't know the name of dies. Oh and Sansa. Sansa can't die, she needs a payoff.
Yara is dead as fuck. Eaten by dragon. You heard it here first.Quote:
Originally Posted by wufwugy
Sansa is gonna die, in a horrible way. She's here to suffer, and you never suffer more than when you start to believe and have hope.
you shut your dirty mouth!
I think she'll probably witness John die first.
Tormund, no!
He's the wildlings at this point. We're not going to explore their politics, so without Tormund, they just become a name talked about.
Plus, he's gonna make a woman outta the Tarth girl.
I'm tryna interpret the D&D style. They rarely kill a character without giving that character play, and they often kill a character when he/she gets more play than normal. Except for the handful of "wrap things up deaths" (like Osha), they use the Oberyn strategy: get people fistpumping only to snatch it away at the last minute.Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
I see Tormund as fulfilling his duty. The wildlings follow Jon now. People like Tormund more now. Somebody has to die on the side of the good guys.
Exactly my thoughts.Quote:
Originally Posted by oskar
Well, maybe not eaten, but roasted. She's a goner. Her staying alive much longer holds the story back.
I don't think LF sits the Iron Throne in the show, but I think there's a really high chance that when it show wraps it's foreshadowed that he will. I think there's almost zero chance that he gets his comeuppance. Unless it's in a way where Sansa essentially becomes the new LF. Like her meeting with him was the first time she actually took a step towards being his peer. Her laying out that she thinks he's scum, but then letting him live makes her seem like a weak little girl, and her letter writing probably continues this role, but this could be a sick student-surpasses-the-master arc. Any other downfall of LF has to involve good triumphing over evil, and that'll be stupid lame.
i have a sneaking theory that littlefinger believes way more than he lets on, and that his attempts at gaining power are so that he can consolidate the fight against the walkers. if you think about it, somebody as truly shrewd as him may not just blow off the reports of what's going on in the north.
i dont think this theory is correct, but i wouldn't call it dumb if it happened.
really mild book stuff, not spoilery, but has to do with differences between the show and books:
Spoiler:I could buy that in the book world-- and the totality of it would be that LF is really the extremely pragmatic good guy while Varys is his foil, being the ostensibly good shadowy character, but ultimately he's driven by the trauma of his youth which has his goals being revenge against those who he sees as being the same as those who have wronged him.
But I think the show has failed to give us the same depth with Varys, and there's just not enough time to pull this one off on screen.
Sup, dudes?
http://i.imgur.com/zJCX2Tg.jpg
easily bottom five all time got eps. the writing in this show can be so depressingly bad. which says a lot since adapting this book series to an ~80 episode hbo show IS ABSOLUTELY THE EASIEST JOB ANYBODY COULD EVER HAVE
dnd choose the silliest devices
- make fun of hardcore fans by foreshadowing huge book events then just dont do them and instead piss in the river.
- plot so badly that there are no reasonable options other than a super secret twist, but little did those pleb viewers know that the real super secret twist is the atrocious writing.
- tell everything. never show. always tell. tell tell tell. jaime tells about his cersei love, never shows. brienne tells about her honor, never shows. the bwb can only say how important sandor must be, fuck subtext!
- blackfish: i cant leave the castle and help my niece, im needed here. oh wait, they're trying to kill me for being here? k i'm needed to die instead of help my niece.
- at some point, deaths are "gratuitious" (but cocks and tits never are!). let's kill three chars back to back to back and not show them! david, we're so fucking smart! that's right d.b. we're fucking brilliant!
Yeah, this episode wasn't very good. I know Arya is bad ass and she drank the special drink or whatever but seeing her run around like that after being stabbed repeatedly in the gut the week before was crazy.
the only thing going well is the hound being back and a badass, but im sure the dnd intent is to make it seem like cleganebowl is coming and hound gonna fuck some shit up but they'll give him aids or something and he'll die in a ditch somewhere.
Wun Wun had better not die this coming ep. A 25 foot tall man would massacre the entire Bolton force solo.
Stop being cry babies. This is still GOAT tier television, and you've been hopelessly spoiled by TV shows' increased quality over the last decade and a half if you think otherwise. Can you fucking imagine turning on the TV in 1994 and seeing this? Although the camp of Xena and Hercules was and is endearing, get a fucking grip and realize how fortunate we are to be watching GoT as it is. Might the show disappoint after such a superbly strong start? Sure, maybe-- but whatever, the books will be great, and the show not living up to the books and the first few seasons of the show leaves a ton of room for it to still be top tier entertainment.
i can always appreciate that you'll come down on a different perspective than me. it keeps me on my toes.
xena da warrior princess got nothing on the goatness that is s2 the walking dead.
btw i bet literal immortal half-god hercules would have been more debilitated from a bowel stab-twist than Lady No One of House Stark.
Yeah, there were some really strange ball drops in that sequence for sure. Like, why not have the actress say something like "good thing they missed the important bits, otherwise you'd be dead already."? Why not do a passage of time, say a week or so, between the stabbing and the Waif T1000'ing Arya through the streets of Bravos while they both hardcore parkour?
Also the gut stab was strangely reminiscent of the abortion Dr. Frey performed on Robb's wife. It's like someone thought "oooh I really liked the way that looked, can't wait to use it again!" but felt the end of the series closing in and felt they might not get their chance so they just forced it in here.
So, yeah, I am not turning a blind eye to the short comings, but I'm also not being a hyperbolic drama queen-- The Hound and BWB scene(s) were fantastic, probably the best this season. The barter over the condemned dialogue is absolutely top notch(speaking of, Bronn and Pod comic relief sideshow was a great use of the characters). Sure they teased at some book stuff here that they didn't pay off, but with a dozen or so episodes left in the series, that would have been terrible. What they gave us is a fantastic substitute.
Does the show sometimes not live up to its abstract potential? Sure, but the internet is acting like they're watching The Walking Thrones...
Miguel Saposhnik who directed this episode and the Whitewalker battle last season will also direct the last episode. Shit is going down! I had to re-watch that battle a couple of times. Easily the best depiction of medieval warfare I have ever seen. Last episode is going to be Spoon's red pill nightmare. I predict Littlefinger and Tyrion to be the only two men with a penis left standing, and I'm not even that sure about Tyrion. I am so hyped for the Sansa vs Dani bitch fight for the Throne.
#TeamSansa #bitchishardcore
I'll definitely follow everything Iwan Rheon is involved in. He hit it out of the park as Rhamsey Snow. This looks like a promising start: