Can we keep this semi friendly please???
Ill prolly choose to support a team from each league anyway and then decide which league i like best.
EDIT: Thanks to everyone for your opinions and answering my stupid questions. :)
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Can we keep this semi friendly please???
Ill prolly choose to support a team from each league anyway and then decide which league i like best.
EDIT: Thanks to everyone for your opinions and answering my stupid questions. :)
WilburForce The Fucking AIDS germ that fell off a slide
EPPICCCC
Two posts showcasing the wisdom of Mr Football Savant:
In short: West Ham, West Ham, please support West Ham. I Hate Man U, I hate Man U, I hate Man U. I am so blinkered about West Ham that I call Di Canio a genius. Kinda says it all really. Blinkered fuckwit.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm a big fucking cry baby who can't shut up about West Ham, rattles on about irrelevant shit, and then challenges people to a contest in any arena when they point out how much garbage I just churned out
Di Canio had skill. A genius he was not. A genius for Upton Park - that's a different story but hey, it is West Ham we're talking about here. Hagi, Cryuff, Baggio, Savicevic, Maradona, Zidane, Bergkamp, Mattahus, Gullit, Van Basten, Di Stefano, Puskas, Zico, Carecas, Mancini, Stoitchkov were all light years ahead.
But they didn't play for West Ham so he may not have heard of them.
Cool, a proper football thread.
Coming back to what someone said earlier about La Liga (the Spanish top tier) being superior to the EPL, I'd have to disagree.
When I have this discussion with people their main point seems to be that the game's more technical in Spain, which they then conclude that this means the football's 'nicer'. First off I'm not sure how far ahead they are anymore in terms of technical ability, here in the UK we sure have some masterful technicians. Ronaldo, Deco, Drogba, Berbatov, Scholes, Rooney, Torres, Fabregas, etc. would certainly compete with the best Europe has to offer in terms of technique. All I know is that the game over there is played at a much slower pace, so players have far more time on the ball, so it may look as if it's prettier but in reality it's just slower, less exciting and imo, less competitive and aggressive.
It's true that the style of play in the EPL is definitely more direct. With the exception of Arsenal and Man Utd I'd say not many teams try to 'pass teams to death'. But this isn't to say that over here people just hoof the ball up to a tall target man and hope for the best. That notion of a 'classic English centre forward' and anything that comes from it is an out-dated misconception imo.
Care to let us know who you support???Quote:
Originally Posted by Benoso
Just got in and read this. Nice one Thunder. As has been said before, you are priceless.
I really can't be bothered to have a pointless internet row with you. You win. You win the prize of being a complete cunt. Congrats. :D
OK ones a cunt and the other is The Fucking AIDS germ that fell off a slide. JK obv.
Can we move on now please???
Excellent points Benoso. And I concur. If I were to rank the leagues it would be:Quote:
Originally Posted by Benoso
Italian
English
German (above Spain due to tactical awareness)
Spanish
We also have excellent technicians, and to cope at the English pace, is testament. The main problem with the Primera Liga, is that it is extremely weak defensively. You can lose 10 games and still win the title! You watch the games and the defence is 2nd rate. Put it this way, when did you last see a world class Spanish defender? One that is trailed by all the big clubs? You hear of the Italians, Germans and even the English all the time. But not a Spaniard.
Sweetlemon69 said there's a reason why the Spanish teams shut down English teams and I gotta disagree. Save for Barca and Madrid, they don't. And English clubs have a better record in meetings than their Spanish counterparts.
But the outdated notion about English teams still abounds. Even when Klinsmann played for Tottenham, he told Bayern Munich that their next opponents (Nottingham Forest) were a typical English, long ball team. And we all know (possibly with the exception of Wilbur) that Nottingham Forest are legendary for their emphasis on passing football.
In other words you've been called and are too embarrassed & beaten to reply. It's okay, I understand.Quote:
Originally Posted by WilburFart
As for priceless - great riposte from a guy who reckoned he was better than me re: football. Great retort from a guy who's every point has been exposed. Great response from a guy who waffled a losd of shit but won't answer when it's been dismantled.
And I also find it "priceless" that you're quick to initially reply but run away trying to claim the moral high ground, when you've been fucked like a prison bitch in stockings and high heels.
By the way, claiming this moral high ground when your last post was full of school level abuse and petty challenging, all wrapped up in that glorious insecurity streak, doesn't really work. Kinda like West Ham in the top flight.
Now do me a favour and fuck off.
I only scanned through thunders antics and i missed this, i properly loled after reading, nice one thunder!Quote:
Originally Posted by badgers
Id also like to add thats the first time in my life ive been called a 'smary cunt', thanks thunder, its made me take a different perspective on life, ive finally realised after all these years what i TRULY AM. Im now gonna go out and help the elderly across the road in a non sarcastic fashion all the while thinking about my savior, the ever priceless thunder.
i couldnt really decide whether to post the special olympics or this so i flipped a coin
http://esum.files.wordpress.com/2007/09/serious.jpg
I personally prefer the downs running the 100m myself.
On a more topical note it was such a shame for Dean Ashton to get injured last weekend. He played really well from what I saw in the highlights, would have been good to see him try again with England after he kinda disappointed last time.
lol, thunder giving abuse instead of taking it is a refreshing change- probably becuase it's not a poker thread lawlz
INTERNAZIONALE DI MILAN
I watched them play the other day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/3...czlatanyp4.jpg
my other favorite team is Olympique Lyonnaise, which have some of the sickest fan chants ever
they sing the popeye tune with their hearts out
i want to witness one of their games one time live
Im going to a game this Saturday. Should be fun, but i doubt it will be good football cuz its my little cousins game and hes like 5. :)
Maybe i can start a riot or knock out a coach..lol.
To get you to understand some positions and formations and stuff visually:
our playing team is Levski Sofia, a Bulgarian favorite.
OFFENSE:
This is an example of an attacking formation
http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/9499/offensesx3.png
2 forwards (red dots, a tall one for headers etc. who also has a good foot and a smaller, quicker one who can go for rebounds, which stands a little more back red dot), 3 midfielders (green dots: an attacking one who, well, aid in attacking and distribute the ball. he's like the key to this offense; left and right ones to attack the flanks), an additional defensive midfielder (lonely green dot, aids defense) and for defenders (blue dots, 2 centerbacks and two sidebacks).
DEFENSE:
This is an example of a defensive formation:
http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/8619/defense1oc6.png
Here, since we can't essentially shut off offense altogether, I reduced the number of attackers to just 3 (1 centre forward [cf] and two attacking midfielders), 2 central midfielders, a defensive midfielder and the usual quartet behind. This formation would be good for like 2-0 leads, and will shut down many offenses.
Here is the last example for today, defense #2:
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/5561/defense2si5.png
this formation is much more defensive than #1. Here we have an additional back, called a sweeper. Wikipedia does a better job explaining this position than I do. Its the middle blue dot. Also, we have no more attacking midfielders. Only central midfielders and defensive ones. This kind of formation would be crucial to protect 1-0 leads in late game.
I have also outlined a few players with likely typical stats for their position, so you see which attributes are more important for which position.
O, and [SS] stands for Second Striker.
ta-ta!
L1+x = win at pes
Thank you yet again Jack.
Jesus Badgers..lol. WTF does this mean??? The hardest part about learning the game is figuring out WTF they are saying. I thought i spoke english, but apparantly not. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by badgers
Thunder:
I think I know more about football than you. I 've been playing a relatively high level for a long time. I also go to alot matches to watch the team I support (not as many as I'd like cause I'm often playing football). What level do you/ did you play? Who do you support? How often do you go?
And yes, supporting my family team does mean something. It's called passion and loyalty. You don't really get that feeling sitting at home watching football. And for the record Rio gets a good reception at Upton Park.
I think you'll find also I told Wes NOT to support West Ham.
Reason to offer you a fight? "Put him out of his misery and stomp his face into a fucking jar." Easy to type behind a keyboard. If I ever have the dis-pleasure to meet you, you can say this to my face or just try and do it.
Reason to offer you a game of poker...I thought this was a poker forum.
Fair play to you Thunder, you say some funny stuff, but I think you're cunt. And you think I'm the aids germ thats on a slide or something. Sounds like we're all square.
it just means press L1 and x on a playstation controller ftw at pro evolution soccer (a video game).Quote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
The way you two are conducting yourselves is worthy of a strikes. Quit the douchery.
agreed - I'm all done.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
When Bigred is the voice of reason you know somethings goneQuote:
Originally Posted by bigred
HORRIBLY WRONG ! ! ! !
people people
hooligans are an integral part of soccer
Yeah, Di Canio's a genius and you claim Arsenal play the best football in the world whilst simultaneously admitting you don't watch any other league.Quote:
I think I know more about football than you.
Says it all.
Anyway, you're obviously ignoring all the points made so yeah, I'm done. Ps: you didn't just challenge me, you said I was shit at all those things which, as you don't know me, isn't very clever.
Ps: I may be a cunt - but that still doesn't alter the fact you know fuck all about football and are ill placed to comment.
Snap.Quote:
I'm all done
cool.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunder
Edited thanks to google. :)
after skimming thread, i nominate thunder for biggest douche in the universe.
I could say the same considering your relentless posts about inane shit like a racist dog and banal things like whining about which city should you live in.
Top it off with your stupid haircut and the fact that your skimming failed to notice I was right in what I said and you're a dead cert.
yeah sorry for confusion wes it was directed at jack cos he posted a screeny of pro evo.
I'm forever blowing bubbles,
Pretty bubbles in the air.
They fly so high,
Nearly reach the sky,
Then like my dreams,
They fade and die.
Fortune's always hiding,
I've looked everywhere,
I'm forever blowing bubbles,
Pretty bubbles in the air.
How's the gay zone treating you rilla?
And suddenly we have a new contender for the title of biggest douche in the universe.Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Someone watched green street, or is a closet west ham fan.Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Hi Thunder!
Watch some games, pick a team you like.Quote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
I would watch the champions league once it starts, best soccer on the planet, other then that the english and spanish leagues are good
Pretty complicated ruleQuote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
Basically a player has to have at least 2 players of the opposing team (including the goalee) between himself and the end line of the field (the opposing team goal line) when the ball is passed forward and he is involved in the play. It is a complicated rule to follow because in order to determine whether an offside takes place the lineman has to see the positions of the offense players, all defense players and the player passing the ball the moment the ball is passed
Structure varies from league to leagueQuote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
English and spanish leagues (and most other european leagues) - each team plays all the other teams twice, 3 points awarded for win, 1 for tie, the team with the most points wins the championship, last 3 teams are removed from the league to the secondary league (3 teams from the secondary league move to the first league)
Other then that every country has a cup (sometimes more then one) which is held independantly of the league, it is a series of knock out games between all teams from all leagues, the knock out game is actually 2 games - home and away - last team standing wins the cup (the final game is just one game in natural territory)
Champions league plays differently - 32 teams from all over europe start (there is a way to determine the 32 teams, some automatically qualify, others have some perlimnary rounds)
They are divided into 8 groups of 4, each group plays 2 games between each team (total 6 games), the best 2 teams from each group move forward - now the 16 teams play in home and away knockout format until the finals which is one game
lol, okay lets go into that. my racist dog thread was obv a level but that apparently went right over your head. i was seeing what peoples input that i value was on which city i should live in cause it was a huge decision. idk what haircut you are talking about, and my skimming succeeded in noticing your douchery.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunder
also the only reason, aside from pure douchery, that you are taking what i said so personally is cause i said some other threads that you made were gay.
I'll look out for the overweight gorilla next time I'm at West HamQuote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUIrJ...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-X6LnVASGs
lol at the italian league being the best in the world thunder
divedivedivedivedivedive
i'm not saying it doesnt happen in other leagues, but its a joke out there.
the game is played at a slower pace than the EPL which is why many players from that league that move over to the EPL struggle at first. italian league is less aggressive too.
and as for "the best players" - if the italian league was superior in terms of players' ability then why was the champions league final comprised of two english clubs? italy has some great players, and some good teams, but it's behind the EPL in both.
This, EPL>other leagues.Quote:
Originally Posted by sil693
OK Brazil vs Argentina Olympic Semi finals is on right now.
I finally get to see Ronaldinho play which should be fun. If he cut his hair it would be much easier to take him seriously though. :)
It would be nice if anyone that hasnt posted who they support would do so.
didn't see this was on - am now watching. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
Ronaldinho defo needs a haircut. And some new teeth.
If the olympics were a big game you wouldn't want to watch Ronaldhino play. He doesn't show up to big games.
lol notQuote:
Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
i support west ham and am upset alot. prob secretly an arsenal fan.
dont support man utd plz, or spurs. rather u support chelsea than them since chelsea MAY be good to watch this year.
also check out villa since MON is class
WOW what a goal.
He blasted it off his team mate..lol.
found a vid of wilbur and thunder
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/sn...ekly/686117852
then would you share with us who you consider to be the best keeper in recent times da goat? preferably one that isnt petr cech nor gianluigi buffon?Quote:
Originally Posted by Da GOAT
Peter Schemichael (sp?) and its not even close imo!
Liverpool, although I like Arsenal a lot as well
Real Madrid in spain
why not these two, considering they are definitely up there? and schmichael id say is also a very strong canditate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
I'd check out what I'm saying before you lol. Historically speaking, in every sense, the Italian league has been light years ahead. be it wages, attracting players, success on the European level, tactics or technique.Quote:
Originally Posted by sil693
True. So is every other league bar (until recently) the EPL. But it's getting bad, too.Quote:
divedivedivedivedivedive. i'm not saying it doesnt happen in other leagues, but its a joke out there.
True to an extent. I am guessing you don't watch much? Yes, it's slower over all but, like Spain, makes strong use of lightning bursts. Controlled and precise as opposed to all the time, chasing shadows.Quote:
the game is played at a slower pace than the EPL which is why many players from that league that move over to the EPL struggle at first. italian league is less aggressive too.
In terms of less aggressive, that's a misnomer. Especially in and around the box. Once the back line gets involved, all gloves are off.
It's slower but it's also more difficult, tighter marking, more intelligent defences. It's why 17 goals per season was a good haul for a top striker.
Unlike my remarks to Wilbur, I am not having a go at you here but this is a very laughable comment and just shows your lack of knowledge on the matter. Wow, one final between EPL teams. 12 Italian teams have contested the past 17 CL/European Cup finals. Juventus and AC Milan made it an all Italian affair in 2003. 1998 also saw an all Italian affair when Inter Milan facde Lazio in the Uefa Cup final.Quote:
and as for "the best players" - if the italian league was superior in terms of players' ability then why was the champions league final comprised of two english clubs? italy has some great players, and some good teams, but it's behind the EPL in both.
In 2003, 5 Italian teams were in the quarters with 3 in the semis.
In 2004, 3 of the last 8 were Italian. Same again the year after.
But this is just recent history. Remember when English clubs were allowed back into Europe in 1992? Man Us' ECWC win against Barca apart, English teams got stuffed. And it wasn't until 1999 that they triumphed. In that time frame the Italians were running riot. Go back to the dark days of the CL when Man U were repeatedly paired with Juventus and subsequently dismantled. And this was the same team that I said played better football than the recent Arsenal side have.
Overall, in terms of European Cup success:
Italy has 11 wins & 14 runners up. 26 final appearances in total.
Spain has 11 wins & 9 runners up. 20 in total.
England has 11 wins & 5 runners up. 16 in total.
In terms of wins:
Milan - 7 & 4 r/u.
Juventus - 2 & 5 r/u.
Inter - 2 & 2 r/u.
In contrast, Man U only has 3 appearances (with 2 in the last 10 years). For well over 40 years, Man U have been noticeable for their absence. Only Liverpool boasts a record that matches the Italians with 5 wins & 2 r/u spanning decades.
Let's spread out a bit. In terms of semi final appearances. Barring real Madrid, the table reads as such:
Milan - 13
Juventus - 10
Man U - 10
Liverpool - 9
Inter - 7
That's 30 Italian appearances compared to 19 English.
I haven't gone into the Uefa Cup and the ECWC but it's more of the same. From 88 - 98, Italian teams won 8 of the 10 UEFA Cup competitions. Including consecutive wins for 3 years running, on 2 occasions. And since it arrived in 1972, Italian teams have won 9 times, compared to 6 for England and 5 for Spain. Italy also has had 6 runners up compared to the 3 of England.
beyond the plain facts as detailed above, there is far more. Until the past few years, the EPL has been way behind the Italian (plus Spanish, German and even French) when it comes to revenue and spending power. In 1987, Ruud Gullit set a world record transfer of £5.5m when he joined Milan. It took the EPL until 1995 before they got even close, with a then British record transfer of £5m for Chris Sutton.
In the meantime, more world record transfers were being broken in Italy - illustrating the power they held. In 1990 Roberto Baggio moved to Juventus for an eye watering world record of £12.5m. This was matche din the same year by Vialli's move to Juventus. Then in 1992, Gianluigi Lentini moved to Milan for a staggering record of £14m - although trustworthy sources believe the overall fee to be nearer £20m. In comparision, Newcastle didn't break the world record until 1996 - the first English team to do so. And still, only marginally more than Lentini of 4 years prior.
Of the past 40 record transfers, Italy has 24 whilst England has 13. Of which Chelsea account for 8, in the past 5 years.
Even the French and Germans were beating us up in the transfer stakes. In 1991, Trevor Steven moved to Marseille for a massive £5.5m. At the same time, Gazza and Platt (one a genius but crocked and the other a very average player) both swanned to a small & middling club respectively for the same fee of £5.5m. In comparision, the British record was just £2.9m when Liverpool paid for Dean Saunders at the same time. Our giant teams were being outspent by the equivalent of Reading and West Ham!
Wages have always been higher in Italy, until the past few years. On average, the wage in Italy (and other nations) has been 3 -4 times the maximum of the English League.
And this meant the best players & the biggest names in the world headed to Italy: Maradona, Gullit, Van Basten, Matthaus, Klinsmann, Brehme, Shevchenko, Zidane, Ronaldo, Desailly, Deschamps, Roberto Carlos, Rijkaard, Batistuta, Trezeguet, Weah, Redondo, Hagi, Veron, Sammer, Kaka, Kliuvert, Boban, Cafu, Crespo, Papin, Savicevic, Seedorf, Stankovic, Adriano plus countless more. The biggest names on the planet, in any era, will have been found in the Italian league.
In contrast, English football was a predominantly home grown affair. With Ardilles and Villa causing a commotion when they moved in the late 70's. In the 90's, when money started creeping in, the top foreigners saw England as a cushy retirement home - hence the plethora of over the hill players: Gullit, Vialli, Di Canio, Zola. Kluivert plus many even lesser names and has beens who never were. Admittedly, Zola kept the level up but he was still in his latter years when he moved.
Sure, we got a few young 'usn but this was usually a last resort. Cantona had been virtually kicked out of France and no one wanted to touch him. Bergkamp was suffering a slow, agonising death at Inter Milan who at the time were playing ultra defensive, play. and he only came because he was desperate to escape. Henry - snubbed Arsenal for Juve and only joined when that went pear shaped - like Bergkamp. And Carbone (not world class but young) was a journeyman footballer, which is why he ended up at such a small, backwater club like Sheffield Wednesday.
Traditionally though, players in their prime, and with choice at hand, rebuff the English league: Trezeguet, Henry, Kluivert, E'to, Giuly, Zidane, Ribiery, Ronaldo, Seedorf (3 times) plus many, many more. Even Shevchenko, Batistuta and Ballack openly put off joining until their best years were behind them. And Batistuta never even made it!
Finally, we come to tactical and technique. I can't pore this as I can with the aforementioned facts and figures but look at the players. Look at Italy's stunning success at World Cups and European Championships. Plus their club success which has been detailed above. Look at how Ian Rush, like Jimmy Greaves, Des Walker, Blisset & Wilkins all failed to succeed. Only John Charles has been rated a success. By both the English and Italians. When David Platt was made boss of Sampdoria, the whole nation laughed. Because the notion of an Englishman being tactically aware was so ludicrous. And even our best manager (Ferguson) is several levels below his European counterparts.
Hope that clears things up. If not, check with other people in the know (which will be hard to locate in the UK). Check record books, talk to people on the internet or whatever. English football has caught up, monetarily, in recent years but it still does not, regularly, attract the top foreign players. Go through the team sheets over here and compare them to abroad. Look back to past World Cups and Euro Champs and remember the big name foreigners and whether they were over here. They weren't.
Di Canio was never a big name player. Another journeyman. Bergkamp, yes. But tainted. Cantona, not a big name player. Henry - damaged good looking for an escape. He was also young. But a big name, star player, at the top of his game, in his prime over here? No. Once in a while there may be a fluke capture but in Italy (and to a lesser extent, Spain) it's an everyday occurance.
Hope that helps.
:lol:
bets keepers of recent times:
Buffon
Toldo
So good and far ahead it's not even funny.
Schmeichel next and in 4th, Cech.
Prolly a dumb question but for offsides to be called does the guy thats offsides have to touch the ball???
For example, im offsides (behind everyone else) when my team mate scores. If he passed it to me it would be called, but he shot it and i never touched the ball. Is this offsides or does the goal count???
Heres an artist rendition of the situation..lol.
http://i522.photobucket.com/albums/w...cerdrawing.jpg
Heres the rule from the site that muzz gave, but it just confused me more:
Commiting an Offside Offence
A player in an offside position is only penalised if, at the moment the ball touches or is played by one of his team, he is, in the opinion of the referee, involved in active play by:
interfering with play
interfering with an opponent
gaining an advantage by being in that position
So according to this im ok as long as i dont interfere with the goalie right???
Correct Wes,
In your expert drawing the goal would stand from ur team mates shot, if the goalkeeper saved it and it landed at your feet you would be penalised as you have gained an advantage because of where ur stood.
I think the rule now is you can be in an offside position but as soon as you make a movement towards the ball if it is played through you will be punished.
Think thats right for the EPL anyway.
Thunder you make a very good arguement about the Italian league and nobody can disagee with stats but based on recent years (say 10 for example) Italy have 2 wins (both Milan) in the Champions League which is behind both England and Spain.
They have 2 wins in the UEFA cup but those were back in 97/98 & 98/99
Not exactly the driving force of football you make them out to be.
Italy has had some of the worlds best players play in their league but like wise has Spain & England. Just because they havent played here doesnt mean the leagues are better, its not always the level of football that helps decide where they play, living in Milan sure as hell beats living in Liverpool or Manchester.
As for the transfer records, big money transfers didnt happen here till SKY tv got involved, Italy has always been a rich country and could afford to pay players a lot more a lot sooner.
Who is it that you follow?
Well, the point I am making is that it should do. I am not talking of just the past few years but the past 40. And that even in recent past, when they haven't won, they've been there or thereabouts. So when they haven't won, they've been in the final - 12 of the past 17. And their record usually far exceeds the achievements of Engllish teams.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ablarrrr
The number f world class players in Italy far outranks Spain - which far outranks England. Look at the names list I provided. How many world class Italians, Brazilians, Germans ans Spaniards play in our league? Not many. If any at all. How many big name players have come to our league? Again, just a few and usually by default (Bergkamp, Henry etc).Quote:
Italy has had some of the worlds best players play in their league but like wise has Spain & England. Just because they havent played here doesnt mean the leagues are better, its not always the level of football that helps decide where they play, living in Milan sure as hell beats living in Liverpool or Manchester.
Besides, it's just one aspect. Better players = better play = better teams. And I also showed how they have dominated europe and on the international front. Plus the tactics and the technique.
Italy is no richer than England. National economy isn't an issue. Revenue from the league & clubs do. And the underlying point is that bigger fees & wages is just another reason why the best players flocked to other European countries rather than our own. Thus better players = better play = better teams.Quote:
As for the transfer records, big money transfers didnt happen here till SKY tv got involved, Italy has always been a rich country and could afford to pay players a lot more a lot sooner.
Overall, the points I were making were that in every aspect of football, Italy has achieved far more that we have. 30 CL/EC final appearances versus 19 for England. Bear in mind the competition is little over 50 years old - that's more than a 1/2 strike rate.
Sure, in the past few years we have caught up in terms of money but that's all really. The best players still avoid England. The technique and tactics are still lacking etc.
It's all very easy to point to last years final but it's hardly conclusive. Hence the wider scope I provided. Also, no one in the know (eg: professional level) truly rates the Premier league as being above Italy, or even Spain. Sure, Sky rattle on - but that's because it's their baby. Cryuff, Vialli, Gullit, Beckenbauer to name just a few, have openly made the same points about it not being as good a football league.
At the end of the day, all I can do is provide details and history to back up why I am saying what I am. Far better than just saying "I'm right, you're wrong".
You should have seen the first three drafts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ablarrrr
tl:dr like all thunders posts.
I'm not saying they are the best 'historically' but they are the best now: epl that is.
I'm staying with my original thoughts on Thunder
Right back atcha.Quote:
Originally Posted by WillburForce
Lol, im sure they were better than what I could do.Quote:
Posted: Tue, 19 Aug 2008, 5:37pm
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ablarrrr wrote:
In your expert drawing
You should have seen the first three drafts.
Thunder, from what I have read your the only person in this thread not to say which team you follow.
It must be an Italian team is it?
lol i cant pick buffon or cech
so we are looking to name taff 3rd best keepa, nah!!
btw westham make me cry, talk of selling anton ferdinand. while he is donkish he is still our best defender. most of team are donks and scumbags/overpaid donnas.
can i change team??????? Discuss.
Dad supports City
2 brothers Arsenal
Me saying fuck you guys im supporting redknapp and di canio, oh snap they are gone wth!!!
Try Man U. Be like at school, having to rise above peer pressure.
my sister had a baby boy not along ago. They moved over to North London, just down the road from The Arse....we're wondering if it may be time to change to clubs. Let him be an Asrenal fan so he won't endure the misery of following the Irons...Quote:
Originally Posted by Da GOAT
Liverpool is one of the teams im strongly considering supporting. Got any pros and cons on them as a franchise???Quote:
Originally Posted by TLR
Also i havent heard much about Chelsea which is odd because arent they like one of the best teams??? Does everyone hate them like they hate Man United???
He didnt do shit. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by bigred
I watched Canada vs Jamaica and it was so exciting. It was nice having a team to pull for and we even have a few good players. the best being Julian DeGuzman. He was really good in the game and came very close to scoring the winner late in the game. we would have won except our goalie totally blew a corner and knocked it in his own net. Game ended as a draw. :(
Also who do you support Thunder??? if you dont want to say thats cool, but at least let us know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by badgers
on the computer you can edit the shit out of it, and make this excellent excellent game truly epic
From a completely objective point of view, Liverpool are a good candidate. They've an illustrious history, have been around for aaages, always been in and around the top of the league. Their glory days came in the 70s and 80s but many feel they're a few world class players short of really challenging for honours thus far in the 21st century. Some good players too, I consider Steven Gerrard to be possibly the best midfielder in the world (Pirlo and Kaka deserve a shout too) and in Fernando Torres they probably have the hottest striker in the game right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by wesrman
Re: Chelsea. A lot of people don't like Chelsea because of the manner in which they've achieved success. A few years ago, after years of respectable but not outstanding league positions, Chelsea were purchased by a multi-billionaire Russian oil magnate. He's invested over 500m in players since he arrived. Many believe that Chelsea 'bought' their league titles. They're also kinda known for being a big, strong, industrious, powerful side, who don't play really attractive football. I'd say it's fair to say they go for power and drive over flair and dynamism: this can be reflected in their best players, Drogba, Ballack, Essien, Terry. They do have some 'flair players' like Joe Cole, Malouda (eventhough he's horseshite) and new acquisition Deco.
Thanks dude.
It's all down to you. If Liverpool struggle to challenge and end up out of the title race very early on (as last year) will you have the energy as a noob fan to carry on when their campaign is all but dead, with only sporadic games in the Champions League to whet your appetite?
Chelesea are a top team but, so far, have played very pragmatic football. Dull but effective. Not quite the "Beautiful Game". What turned Abramovich onto buying the club was watching the classic 5-4 thriller between Man U & Real Madrid (think that was 2003). 2 great teams, playing fantastic cavalier football and thrill a minute. And capped off by a wonderful second half tour de force by David Beckham, who scored 2 goals and single handedly dragged Man U back into contention. Maybe Abramovich will get that with the new coach Scolari but with pretty much the same team as last year, I can't see much happening to change their footy. So will you be able to get excited over this kind of play? Many true footy fans find it dull so Americans will struggle even harder.
Arsenal play great football but are under the cosh financially and so won't be expected to challenge for top honours. Most other teams play passing football but can't see you being excited over basement clubs like Stoke, West Ham and Portsmouth.
Even though there are many narrow minded "fans" who hate Man U - they have become more likeable as Chelsea have taken that mantle of most hated club (see Benoso's post). And as Man U are one of the only teams to knock Chelsea off their perch, they get backing. Even if it's somewhat reluctant from these narrow minded fans. And I'd still be calling them narrow minded if this were the 80's and they were hating Liverpool. In a way, you'd deserve more credit for going for Man U when the easy option is to follow the idiots who despite them - succumbing to peer pressure instead of doing what you want, even if that may make you unpopular with these buffoons.
Who I support, if anyone, is not relevant so don't wanna say. I think you should be looking at a top four club.
lol thunder you support united right?
Thunder, I disagree that Arsenal are 'under the cosh financially'. Since moving to the Emirates their revenues have almost tripled. Weren't they call provisionally the 'richest club' a year or so back?
It's just that Arsene Wenger has a very stringent transfer policy, he doesn't want to jeopardise his wage structure with some £130k/week journeymen. Apparently he's had £70M+ transfer kitties in the past but decided to put his faith in his youngsters.