Not trying to make light of the situation or anything, but I really hope they do this.Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
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Not trying to make light of the situation or anything, but I really hope they do this.Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
The only funny part of this whole thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
I'm confused as to how PS knows that these accounts were the hackers if there is no evidence of chip dumping? Who got all of the $$$?
they said that the hackers just simply lost all the money on the tables.
wait.. weird, so they didnt even chip dump? They just were having a joyride? Thats almost sicker. Like if its a scam you can almost admire the clever way that they screw people out of money (almost!) but if its just a joyride.. I mean.. idk, its just such a waste.
Another gross thing is that he has been toying with you after the fact, posting on here, talking on msn. Idk, I mean he had to be chip dumping if he cared enough to do all this right?
Anyways, Id ask stars what they suggest you do as far as contacting law enforcement since its an international thing. Im not sure if this is the type of thing they police, but I would think its a good idea to maybe contact interpol. They have to have a cyber crimes department and it would seem that they would be your best chance at getting any compensation, or atleast getting this fucker put in jail.
I would think that Stars would be able to know what method of withdrawl type they used and contact them to freeze their assets until some type of an investigation can occur.
to a bunch of various players? maybe they did it for shits and giggles and not for the $$Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
They didn't withdraw they sat at 5kNL and tried to play and lost it to the regs there.
yikes
I'm feeling stupid... how did they know these two accounts were the hackers if they weren't the accounts that ended up with the money?Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
yeah. well, looks like its back to donkey stakes for me.
Well that clears that up then and I highly doubt any law enforcement agency will lift a finger. Since they hacked in your account and you are a US Citizen I would think this would be an FBI issue but I think they would only laugh it up if you persued their services.
I am literally sick to my stomach.
Who's ready to start up a collection box for this poor guy?
Im guessing that those two accts are associated with the perpetrators IP address.Quote:
Originally Posted by zook
Probably matched IP addresses with the one that was playing on Will's account.Quote:
Originally Posted by zook
Edit: damn you boost
This maybe a dumb idea but if I was you I would get the HH's off stars and find out who the big pots were lost to when the hackers played. Then I would contact these people through 2+2 or through stars if possible and tell them what happened and ask stars to prove it to them. I know if I was a 5k reg and a low stakes guy got his BR hacked and lost to me I would want to give it back.
Thinking the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pythonic
Ah yes, ty boost and Warpe.
Really bizarre that they would go through the trouble of hacking an account just to joyride. And in the process blow their whole poker ide cover.
I'll ship after he's confirmed a thorough cleaning of his HD
Poker sites should set up some type of security that you have play from your residence of address but I'm sure hackers could get around that too with a simple address change.
God, imagine this happening to a full timer.
Or at least have the option to set certain IP address that are allowed to play on your account.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pythonic
what a nightmare
I´d give someQuote:
Who's ready to start up a collection box for this poor guy?
With all due respect, why does will deserve charity ahead of anyone else here who is busto because they never had 13K to get hacked in the first place? At least will is good at poker so he'll be able to earn that money back.
If you want a stake for 50NL or 100NL then just ask and a lot of people here would probably help you, myself included. Don't waste your time at 5NL please. There's no shame in asking for a stake when something like this happens to you.
Put yourself in his shoes and think about it. I know I'd definitely appreciate something like this if it happened to me and I'm pretty sure others feel the same way.Quote:
Originally Posted by mcatdog
:(
i like the idea of posting in the 2p2 forums seeing if the high staking regs will give u money back
look guys, i would obviously really appreciate any help i could get. i think i will be okay though, because i had 272k fpp's saved up (i was saving up for the porsche, looks like that project will be delayed). that will get me 3k worth in supernova bonus', so that will at least get me on my feet again.
what exactly should i say to them.Quote:
Originally Posted by reDZill4
id prolly give a quick summary of what happened show one of the emails from stars [the one where it confirms you has been haxdd] than a list of the players you lost big pots to and be like if you could contact me that would be great <3
the heart is key btw
also you prolly want to warn them about this poker ide thing
that's so sick. reading about this tilts the hell out of me. You have my support, probably can't help though.
Don't give up!
I'd be really surprised if the regs gave you anything back.
i wouldn'tQuote:
Originally Posted by Pythonic
you have to tryQuote:
Originally Posted by Pythonic
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...30#post3679930
tell me what you guys think.
err.. you cant get the key logger by just going to their site, right?
This is so sick dude.
GL...
2p2 thread seems good. its nice that sauce was at the table so atleast he can vouch for you if it comes to that.
again, sick that this happened to you and gl getting a roll back together.
After reviewing the HH's, I think there's no way this was just a "joyride." I'd email them again and request some further investigation, especially on the players who weren't regulars in those games.
Wow.
I just read this whole thread and its the sort of thing that puts me off playing poker, absolute madness.
If it's any consolation Will, this thread has probably made a lot of people, including myself, not play poker tonight and instead concisely clean their HD and change passwords etc etc, and that has probably prevented this happening to anyone else in the future.
I'm so sorry mate, hope something sorts out for you.
So sick. I have just forked out money for a total Internet Security package (Bitdefender) and hope this never happens to any of us again!! For all of us a reminder of never ever opening any files from people you don't know.
Guys you really messed up those 2+2 threads, tons of HH's and excitement was not what was needed.
1) You need a reputable poster to make the thread,
2) You need stars to verify that the IPs that accessed the account and played 5kNL were not wills so they dont think will just tilted
3) no accusations
4) talk to a mod before you make the thread to ask can it go in High Stakes NL
If I was you I would PM a mod and get the current threads locked and start again before they fill with useless crap and everyone loses interest.
Totally agree. PS identified 2 Spanish hackers. You guys are widening the net to include people of which there is no evidence that they have any involvement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irisheyes
2p2 thread was deleted
here I'll do a draft instead of complaining about what others are doing.
Shit Will this is horrible. I'm sure I'm not the only one but I am definitely willing to stake you if you need it.
Check all this some information may be wrong. Make sure there are no spelling mistakes.
Make sure you contact stars first and notify them of what you are doing. Ask them to varify the story in the thread.
Make sure the two active threads on the issue are locked before this one is posted. PM a mod.
PM this draft to a mod and ask them to post it. No one will give a shit if you post it yourself. Failing that, get a mods permission to post it it HSNL.
PM this to a mod:
*********************
Some of you might have seen some threads on this matter posted on the 2+2 forums alreads and I would firstly I would like to apologise for the confusion regarding the issue. I'm sure you can appreciate that in cases like this speed is often crucial and obviously when relatively large sums of money are involved tensions run high.
Basically I awoke this morning to discover that my $13.4k bankroll was missing from my pokerstars account without my knowledge. Obviously I emailled stars sequrity rapidly and requested an email containing all recent hand histories played on my account. These hand histories shoed my screen name 'wil__' playing at a 25/50NL table and a 10/20 NL table. I was not in cotrol of my account when these hands were played.
Stars sequrity investigated the matter and concluded that an IP address associated with two seperate pokerstars player accounts from Spain accessed my account last night and played the HSNL hands, losing my BR in the process. You can email stars yourself and they will verify this. I have contacted them and asked them to verify this information within this thread.
x days ago I was contacted by a guy on MSN asking me to visit his website and try out his new poker tracking software. We got talking and stupidly I followed his instructions. I downloaded a file from that website. That MSN contact's IP address has since been discovered to be the same one as was used to play hands on my Pokerstars account. The same IP address also created an account on FTR poker forums and responded in a thread I made about this chrisis attempting to downplay this issue.
Basically this is an appeal for people who were present at those HSNL tables last night to contact me. I would hope that you could find it in your heart to possibly refund some of my money which was lost on those tables by the hackers. This is a very significant sum of money for me. Failing this appeal there is little I can do to recover the money.
Thank you,
_____________________-
I have attached here all correspondance with Pokerstars and also the correspondance which occured between myself and the hacker via MSN.
************************************************** ********
Everybody check this please and say if there is things you would change.
Oh yeah guys btw if you're doing some spring cleaning today, go get Firefox 3 beta 5. AFAIK it greatly reduces the chances of something getting onto your computer just from visiting rogue websites alone.
sorry wil
keep your head up
holy crap! i bet the same PS employee stole both of your monies.Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerplayeRz
that is worse than the absolute poker thing
so fucking rigged
i just saw the hand history and it looks like a fellow FTRer is playing at that table
he was supposed to be in europe, maybe he was in spain
this is all so rigged
PokerplayeRz
i feel for you man, you should try contacting stars again and see if they can get that employye behind bars
wow thanks a lot irish for that draft. i really appreciate that, and i also really appreciate you guys' support.
Other things to get is -Quote:
Originally Posted by Irisheyes
- A good anti-virus program. I use BitDefender at it works awesome, doesn't slow down the PC or anything that some programs might do.
- AdAware, for removing adware and shit like that (spyware, etc etc. crap you get from visiting websites)
- Spybot, for removing spyware, trojans and other software that wants to know what you're doing.
- There's also PeerGuardian which stops people/or IP addresses rather to get into your computer. Maybe not necessary but it can stop people from hacking into your computer...
wow irish awesome draft Will you should definitely use that. I think you could definitely get some sympathy from some regs.
And I'm very sad to hear about what has happened. I hope and am sure that you'll recover!
And very well written Irish, even though I'm by far no expert in the english language but it looks very good and professional!
Willy boy. Lets go to Spain with some baseball bats and nun-chucks. Fucking rediculous.
AFAIK the spyware programs don't remove anything dangerous, it's stuff that's mostly annoying. The dangerous stuff is too smart for them.Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerSwede
Anyway, this sucks balls. If you have any questions about cleaning up your puter will I'd be happy to do what I can to help.
GL rebuilding (not that you need it).
what do you reccomend is used to prevent this type of thing from happening to youQuote:
Originally Posted by swiggidy
Fucked up shit.
I'm going to email stars and bitch tomorrow. There is no way they should have let them cash out if this was chipdumped. I wouldn't care that much if every time i tried to cash out there was a 48 hour cooling off period or something to stop this happening. Obviously it's too late for you but I feel the need to do something to make my roll seem more secure after this.
BEST OF LUCK WILL. This is insane and you must be going through hell. :(
they didn't cash it out they just lost it at the tables
I don think it would do any harm for one of the computer guys on here to write a sticky about protecting your computer etc etc
Most of us only have bits of knowledge like what programs to get etc
Seems very unlikely that they'd go to this length just to donk off they money. Probably trying to luckbox it up to like 50k before dumping it across different accounts?
it seems like P5's had a really good comprehensive article sometime last year that was posted and was like the gospel for that kind of shit. i cant look for it atm, but ill try to find a link sometime today.Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffed22001
I am so pissed off at this. I mean you shouln't give up on it. They shouldn't let winners of those pots cashout, no one who played at that table should cashout until investigation is done and it should be a big investigation. It seems like Stars are ignorant about this and this pisses me off. I mean I might not know what I am talking about, but this is a big thing and I think they should do more about it than they do. I always trusted at their support and I am not sure about it right now.
You got any updates on this?
just read the whole thread for the first time. This suck big time. Feel for ya Will. GL getting that bankroll back.
Like everyone else this is a bit of wake up call about my comp security - any stickies or info about best way to protect is much appreciated.
As for those Spanish fuckers I hope they get a horrible disease and die a painful death the c*nts.
Will, I just saw this thread. That really sucks and I'm really sorry to hear what happened and best of luck with getting your money back.
gl will.
not really to speak of. i pm'ed a mod on 2p2 about that letter jack wrote, and i havent heard back. but now, my email doesnt fucking work, so i dont have any way of contacting poker stars. maybe if everyone sends poker stars frustration mail, they will cave and give some back. something like:Quote:
Originally Posted by The Odds God
Hi, it has come to my attention that one of my fellow poker players, 'will641' got his account hacked into early on April 16, 2008. It has also come to my attention that you guys have not done your job in trying to recover his money. The entire poker community is feeling pretty outraged about this, and is continuing to get concern about how safe their money really is on your site. I think if you don't take any action towards at least recovering some of his money, I think you will notice a decrease in regular players on your site, as they fear the same might happen to them, and if/when it does happen, they can be fairly sure now that you won't take any responsibility for it, or reach out of your own pocket to help a player who has been playing on your site, and will continue to do so.
P5's recommended SnoopFree Privacy Shield in that thread a year ago., i think its pretty good
gl will. One option would be to hire an investigator or attorney in Spain to run some background checks on these guys from the information you have. The police may not do much at first, but if presented by substantial information by a local professional, they may change their mind. A little money paid for further investigation can go a long way; possibly to recovery or reparations, but definitely to justice.
Since the criminals have posted here and are likely lurking the thread, be advised that your actions will not be forgotten and I am sure people will be working without your knowledge to put you in jail or possibly worse. You will always need to look over your shoulder from now on to see if you are being monitored. You will never be at peace. Good luck sleeping at night until you are caught for what you have done.
Will, I sent the response you wrote to PS Support.
PokerStars position will be that it's the player's reponsibility to protect his password etc. yadda yadda yadda...Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
Nevertheless, I think they could put some additional precautions in place, esp when an account fires up from an IP address on the other side of the world than what it was logged-in from previously. I'm gonna work on a draft letter that can be sent to PokerStars.
Will, get your PC reformatted pronto. For all you know they could still be accessing your computer.
heres how helpful poker stars is...they say they cant give me any personal information for privacy reasons. its like, mother fucker, i am the fucking victim, these guys broke the law, and broke your agreement, they shouldnt get any fucking privacy rights.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ltrain
http://forums.majorgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=35407Quote:
Originally Posted by Miffed22001
in today's stupid law, criminals have more rights than victims. Fuck them. Those stupid stars act like they don't fucking care.
I think Poker Stars needs to seriously consider enhancing their very good security because of this issue. Players should at least have the option of only allowing play from this account from either certain IPs or certain cities. I think certain cities is a very good option for people who travel a lot, especially given a lot of this shit happens out of the country.
Holy shit man, I am so sorry to hear this. I will help by sending emails to support or chip off some for BR recovery if needed. I just can't believe this, so sorry!
Anyone else find it funny that I would be chipping off some BR to a guy who is then going to use it to pwn me at my own level?
It has come to my attention that one of my fellow poker players, 'will641' got his account hacked into early on April 16, 2008. The response from Stars support was that he should try and recover the money himself. The entire poker community is outraged about this, and there is growing concern about how safe their money really is on your site. If you don't take any action towards recovering his money, higher stakes players may move to other sites. They fear the same might happen to them, and now they can all see the lack of support they will get from Stars if it does.
Edited to read a little better.
warpe, for the computer illiterate, how exactly does one reformat their HD. do you just back up anything you want to keep, and systematically delete your entire HD? and then uninstall windows, then reinstall it? or is there a more efficient way of doing this.
idk im still kind of partisan to kapila's idea of going there with bats and nun-chucks. maybe sauce123 is still over there and can take care of it for me :lol:
yeah this is def better. i was trying to make it not seem like a threat or blackmail, but its kind of hard, especially when you are the one who got RAPED IN THE BUTTT. THESE HACKERS WILL RAPE YOU IN THE BUTT. IN THE BUTTTTTT!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by drmcboy
i'll send an email when I get home - though I'm not sure they'll take much notice from a lowish stakes player like me.
the more i think about this, the more it pisses me off. Stars should just give you the money back, or at least some of it - its obvious you've been hacked and its not as if they don't make enough money from players like yourself.
does anyone have a spare machine they can check this out on and find the program that may be at fault by downloading ?
so those of you who investigated this - was it chip dumping or not? were they really stupid enough to just lose it at the tables? I can't imagine that a hacker would be so stupid.
the "hand reading expert" at pokerstars looked at it for hours, and concluded there was no chip dumping, therefore they cant retrieve any of my money.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Odds God
the way i see it, is that most virus' are just out of pure maliciousness, so it does seem very possible that they just did this to rape me in the butt. its also possible that maybe this guy actually does have some regs in his pocket, and reg at those stakes would probably be excellent at disguising it, and pokerstars will most likely look the other way if a high stakes reg is questionably dumping. but then that begs the question, why would a high stakes reg risk his career and reputation over 13k
that slowplayed JJ hand was lol obv imo
how is that not blatant variance-reducing chip dumping?
I will send this to stars. I suck at english, but who cares.
"Hi! I am sending this mail because my friend's account (will641) got hacked. Me and the community of players at flopturnriver.com are very dissapointed with the way you handle the issue. You don't seem to care at all. It might be his fault and I understand that he is the one who is responsible for his money, but this happened at your site and you should at least help him with investigation and try to recover some of his money. 13K might not be much to you, but for ordinary people this is a lot of money and this guy worked hard on his game to make that money. This is also not good for reputation of your site. I love your site and in poker community you are known for having the best support of all poker sites, this is one of the reasons why I choose to play at your site, but I might change my mind if you don't do anything about this and I am not the only one. This is a big problem, but you don't seem to do anything. You also said that you can't give him any personal information for privacy reasons. You should note that he is the victim here and I don't think it is right that criminals have more rights than the victim. You should protect a victim, not the criminal. This is also not only his problem, but the problem of all poker players who play at your site or at any other site, so you should definitely investigate this a bit more. You can't pretend like nothing happened.
I love your site otherwise. Keep doing a good work."
So I sended this. It is probably a piece of garbage, but who cares, have to send something.
I think it is very irresponsible to the point of being negligent that Pstars and other poker sites don't have the option to set IP addresses that can access your account. I mean I know on some message boards admins can set there account to only be accessed form their ip... so it can not be hard for a poker site to implement this kind of technology.
At the very least like how when you use your credit card out of state getting gas and they call you. Same should be done if you log off for the night and log back on 2k miles away in a few hours. Something is going on.
ProZach, this might actually be possible if you request that you can only log in on your IP. I heard back in the golden days of Party Poker some guy on party did that.
I'm gonna sound like an asshole now: I don't think stars should reimburse the lost 13k, it is the responsibility of the player to secure his computer. Now, if the crackers had actually broken into the stars software then that's another thing completely.
With that said, there are obvious things that could be done by the poker sites. Blocking IP's from across the world is one of them. Secondary codes (ie from an electronic device or just a list of use-once codes) is another.
Btw, if you keep your account logged 24/7, it won't be possible for outsiders to access it, right?
...assuming they don't get remote control of your computer, which can be done.Quote:
Originally Posted by HalvSame
Who here wants to stop playing online or keep 90% of their roll off the sites? Geesh!
New Computer Security Primer post in tools:Quote:
Originally Posted by reDZill4
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...er-t69797.html
Personally, I use ZoneAlarm Security suite (anti-virus/anti-spyware/software firewall) plus a physical firewall (router), have Windows XP set to auto update, switched to Firefox as a browser and have IM security set on highest in the software firewall so that it can't receive files. All I can think of right now.
Privacy rights have a hell of a lot more to do with PokerStars getting sued by the criminal/thief than it does with protecting said criminal.
By giving out personal information they could be breaching multiple laws like the Fair Credit Reporting Act & opening themselves up to million dollar lawsuits.
Suppose Will finds this guy with PStars help and kills him or at the least severely cripples him(I know I would want to if it were my money), then that criminals' heirs are going to sue Pstars for millions. Fair, probably not. Legal responsibility, definitely. Ask anyone in the financial/insurance industries to what extent their companies go to to protect personal information. Millions of dollars in settlements and legal fees depend upon this protection of identification. PStars can't just give this degen criminal's personal information out. It sux, I know.
i just need to get diplomatic immunity son!
lolQuote:
Originally Posted by will641
yeah, silly, I forgot about that for a moment (and I am a law student, shame on me). But this sucks so bad. My point was just that they should do something, not just say like you should say when you suffer a beat: "yeah, it sucks, that's poker."
I took 75% of my roll off PokerStars last night and am now keeping that in a secure savings account.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pythonic
I'm not sure how well this applies but it could offer some ideas on out of nation dealings:
a few years ago I went on vacation with my parents to Cozumel, long story short my dad got convinced to buy into a time share. After paying like 2000 down payment and signing contracts my parents realized there was some bullshit in there that made whatever the deal was not nearly as spectacular as it was made out to be. Whatever it was, they wanted out, but we had to leave- vacation was over. After we got back to the states my mom started calling people. Lawyers based in the area of the business, the US consulate(or some form of US official living there), etc, and started basically getting as much information as she could, then communicating back to the business what steps she was taking in suing them basically.
After enough harassment/threats of suing they realized she was for real and didn't want to mess with it, they gave all the money back and did exactly what she wanted(probably would have danced for her if she asked).
Obviously this is a different type of case BUT it seems like a fantastic idea to talk to a US consulate in the Spain area and find out what your options are. Pokerstars will have to give information on the guys if the plan is suing them, which seems(with my very little knowledge of law) well within your rights.
This is no doubt the same guy that started the "poker is fixed" thread a couple months ago that had so much dispute. Same broken English. Same prolific use of ellipses. And same bottom line message: "all must retire the money of the rooms...."Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerplayeRz
Just the same, this is a scary thread. I know when I play next I'm changing my password to something heavily alphanumeric and randomish.
if you have a keylogger installed they will record the change in PW, you need a clean machine