Micro Play..

Is it ok to open up my range a little when playing fr micro games?

Playin two tables here and it's nice TAG ABC poker I am playing, in position, with a solid range.

But it makes me wonder if I am on the SB with something like 78o, 54o, J10o for example, and I only have to call 1c to see the flop lol should I just call it as I can see it so cheaply? Or should I stick to my proper game? I find myself even folding AJo in the big blind or EP1 as I don't want to be caught out of position, is this the right thing to be doing with the stakes being so low? Profits are slow when doing this and I notice that people who are playing more hands are hitting more flops and profiting more.

I completely hate the micros lol but am being sensible with my BR management. It's such a different game I think. Is opening up your calling range a good strategy in them?

Thanks guys

You aren't "only calling 1c".
You are throwing 1SB away to chase random trash on the flop with shit hands oop, wich is terrible.

That's all I really wanted to know mate thanks for the info, looking at it in terms of blinds rather than the monetary value makes me see the sense in it, I didn't change my game after I posted this just played the same as I always do, have learned a lot so far from posting a few Q's in here

Calling more pre with hands with high implied odds is still likely to be okay at 2nl (all pocket pairs and a bunch of suited connectors and suited aces). It gets bad higher up as villains won't pay you off when you hit and you'll get squeezed too often as well.

I don't think completing the sb with unsuited connectors is too bad if there's a ton of limpers already, but you're unlikely to make much of a profit (if any).

The way to beat 2nl is still to keep it nice and snug. You might go 10k hands of breakeven doing so, but you can often then pick up 30BI in the next 10k hands if you're patient.

Thanks for the advice mate just playin my normal game here with 4 tables. Playin 1000 hands to get a sample to see how I do, I will post up the graph in here after to let whoever wants to see it

Hey guys, so I played 1000 hands there, 4 tables, 3:35 hours, +$1.19

I think it was a good result as the amount of information I got on myself and some of the hands I got to review made it worth it, here is the graph.

Attachment 772

What I have realised is that focusing on the money I am leaking in hands is far more important than what I am winning, without the leaks my profit would be a lot higher as I seem to go on a good run, then stupidly leak a lot of money in one hand or more which sets me back, I marked the hands which lost me the most money to review, here is one of the hands here that lost me quite a bit



SB: $0.94 (47 bb)
BB: $2 (100 bb)
UTG+1: $2 (100 bb)
UTG+2: $2.18 (109 bb)
MP1: $1.83 (91.5 bb)
Hero (MP2): $3.61 (180.5 bb)
MP3: $1.98 (99 bb)
CO: $1.48 (74 bb)
BTN: $2.01 (100.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with J:spade: Q:heart:
3 folds, Hero raises to $0.06, 3 folds, SB raises to $0.12, BB folds, Hero calls $0.06

Flop: ($0.26) Q:diamond: T:club: 2:spade: (2 players)
SB bets $0.12, Hero calls $0.12

Turn: ($0.50) A:spade: (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $0.32, SB raises to $0.70 and is all-in, Hero calls $0.38

River: ($1.90) 5:diamond: (2 players, 1 is all-in)

Results: $1.90 pot ($0.07 rake)
Final Board: Q:diamond: T:club: 2:spade: A:spade: 5:diamond:
SB showed K:heart: K:club: and won $1.83 ($0.89 net)
Hero mucked J:spade: Q:heart: and lost (-$0.94 net)


I opened this up in MP, should I play tighter from this position and should have folded it preflop? I am in position against villain which affected my decision to play as well.
Villain bets flop and I call with top pair, decent kicker
At the time I thought he had maybe paired a 10 but nothing more and then he goes all in when the A comes out and I just thought he was bluffing so I called and he showed the KK
Thoughts on this one?

Also I have a few hands where I folded over pairs and am wondering whether I made the right play here, both hands are pretty similar but from the aggressiveness of the betting from villain I put him on a higher over pair straight away, or am I wrong about these plays?



SB: $2.32 (116 bb)
BB: $2.47 (123.5 bb)
Hero (UTG+2): $1.81 (90.5 bb)
MP1: $2.09 (104.5 bb)
MP2: $1.34 (67 bb)
MP3: $1.98 (99 bb)
CO: $2 (100 bb)
BTN: $2 (100 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with J:spade: J:club:
Hero raises to $0.06, MP1 folds, MP2 raises to $0.18, 5 folds, Hero calls $0.12

Flop: ($0.39) 5:diamond: 8:club: T:heart: (2 players)
Hero bets $0.22, MP2 raises to $1.16, Hero folds

Results: $0.83 pot ($0.03 rake)
Final Board: 5:diamond: 8:club: T:heart:
Hero mucked J:spade: J:club: and lost (-$0.40 net)
MP2 mucked and won $0.80 ($0.40 net)


And this here is the other



SB: $2 (100 bb)
BB: $2.29 (114.5 bb)
Hero (UTG+2): $2.05 (102.5 bb)
MP1: $1.97 (98.5 bb)
MP2: $3.40 (170 bb)
MP3: $2 (100 bb)
CO: $3.52 (176 bb)
BTN: $3.29 (164.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with T:diamond: T:heart:
Hero raises to $0.06, 5 folds, SB raises to $0.24, BB folds, Hero calls $0.18

Flop: ($0.50) 4:diamond: 3:heart: 5:heart: (2 players)
SB bets $0.31, Hero folds

Results: $0.50 pot ($0.02 rake)
Final Board: 4:diamond: 3:heart: 5:heart:
SB mucked and won $0.48 ($0.24 net)
Hero mucked T:diamond: T:heart: and lost (-$0.24 net)


Maybe I was being too tight but I think not, in that last hand I definately had villain on JJ+. some feedback on these would be great, time for some needed sleep now, will be back in the morning or afternoon

QJ fold pre twice, flop call, turn meh bet something small like 10c since he is so short he's either shoving or folding and fold to the reraise since he 3bet pre chances are that he had your Q beat

JJ fold to the 3bet unless he 3bets wide

TT fold to the 3bet unless he 3bets wide


typical 2nl 3bet range is QQ+ and AK.look how wide his range has to be and you are still worse than flipping against it

QJ hand - check back turn, no point in betting imo. As played, b/f turn.

JJ hand - call or fold pre is close. As played, c/c flop.

TT hand - fold pre if you don't want to call this flop.

One perspective that could be helpful: The rake is proportionately higher at micros, so you can play fewer hands profitably.

Def. stop raising to 3x as your standard open. Make it 4x + 1 and keep playing your tight game.

This is for a couple of reasons. 1) You play good, tight poker PRE and your ranges are so much stronger than theirs that you can be confident that you have the best of it more often than not. 2) Some people will see your 4x open and react is stupid ways, almost no one will see it and react appropriately. 3) The rake is killing everyone's bottom line at the micros much harder than higher stakes. You respond by playing fewer pots, and you play them big.

Play strong hands for big money.

I'm just set mining really with the JJ and 1010. If I had read that my opponent had nothing better than me I would have continued on but went with my gut in these occasions, no set no bet is my general rule, except for the super premium pocket pairs, depending on the circumstances.

4x +1, the +1 meaning? An extra BB per limper?

Real useful info here thanks guys

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MrFerguson91

I'm just set mining really with the JJ and 1010. If I had read that my opponent had nothing better than me I would have continued on but went with my gut in these occasions, no set no bet is my general rule, except for the super premium pocket pairs, depending on the circumstances.

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Set mining with JJ, TT is probably throwing away a lot of value with those hands. If you're in a multiway pot, then more conservative play with all hands is important, but even still, JJ, TT are going to be ahead on a majority of flops against most ranges in non-3-bet pots.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MrFerguson91

4x +1, the +1 meaning? An extra BB per limper?

---

Yes.

Ahh right I see mate , I have been set mining today a little bit and have had like 4 pocket pairs in a row and flopped the set every single time winning all four of the hands too, what are the chances lol the odds are on my side today

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MrFerguson91

Ahh right I see mate , I have been set mining today a little bit and have had like 4 pocket pairs in a row and flopped the set every single time winning all four of the hands too, what are the chances lol the odds are on my side today

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The chances of being dealt any PP are exactly 1/17 = 5.6%
Chances of flopping a set given that you hold a PP and didn't fold PRE are 1/8 = 12.5%

0.056^4 * 0.125^4 = (1/17*1/8)^4 = 1/136^4 = 1/342,102,016 = 2.9 x 10^(-9)

Very nearly 3 times out of a billion hands dealt, you will be dealt 4 PP in a row, and if you do not fold those hands all of them will flop a set.
(Flop-a-set is my cat's name.)

This calculation doesn't consider whether or not you win all 4 hands, which would drive the probability down further.

Also, this calculation assumes that every 4 hands dealt, the count resets. This means that if you were dealt 4 hands, and the final 2 hands were PP, and you flopped a set - then the next group of 4 starts with 2 PP and you flop a set with both - then this is not considered to be a success.

There are ways to do the math so that you DO count these "rolling successes," but I am too lazy right now to dig them up.

Ahh right I kind of understand mate haha needed to re-read that a few times lol
Thanks for workin that out for me

Just played 4 tables there then started tilting a wee bit so I stopped, 414 hands, +$1.71, 1:15 minutes

Graph

Attachment 776

Frustrating to say the least but at least I am not losing. The micro profit is so slow but I am determined to beat them, well, I am beating them now but not as much as I would like.

I seem to win $2 at one table, then lose $2 on the other table putting me back to square one lol the hand where I leaked the most money...

This guy was playin pretty loose and aggressive, so I just took him all in with AKo, and unluckily the time I took him all in he had AA

SB: $8.78 (439 bb)
BB: $2.95 (147.5 bb)
UTG+1: $1.87 (93.5 bb)
Hero (UTG+2): $1.77 (88.5 bb)
MP1: $2 (100 bb)
MP2: $2.45 (122.5 bb)
MP3: $2 (100 bb)
CO: $1.86 (93 bb)
BTN: $1.92 (96 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with K:diamond: A:club:
UTG+1 folds, Hero raises to $0.08, 6 folds, BB raises to $0.24, Hero raises to $0.73, BB raises to $2.95 and is all-in, Hero calls $1.04 and is all-in

Flop: ($3.55) Q:heart: 8:club: T:heart: (2 players, 2 are all-in)
Turn: ($3.55) 6:heart: (2 players, 2 are all-in)
River: ($3.55) A:heart: (2 players, 2 are all-in)

Results: $3.55 pot ($0.12 rake)
Final Board: Q:heart: 8:club: T:heart: 6:heart: A:heart:
BB showed A:diamond: A:spade: and won $3.43 ($1.66 net)
Hero showed K:diamond: A:club: and lost (-$1.77 net)

Do you think I should have just folded to the 3bet instead of 4betting? A lot of the times in microplay I see people going all in with as little as A10o+, so that was my reasoning behind the 4bet, now I am thinking in hindsight that I should have just thrown it away when he 3bet

still not topping up to 100bb , what are villains stats and 3bet % : if 3bet% is 4 or higher i'd be happy getting it in here. if he's a nit , probably best to fold to the shove.

I'm playing 10c and see people 3Bet-shove fairly weak but if it goes up in stages like that they're usually strong. I'll call a 2Bet or 3Bet shove ($5+ into a 15c-45c pot) with AQ+ usually but I wouldn't 4Bet them.

At 2NL I would be even more sure to make your own play solid and not worry too much about exploiting. Assume they have better hands than they really do and you will win most of the time. You don't have to get all the value -get some of it and keep it.


I would have flat called the 3Bet, likely called on the flop (QT could well be sets at that point and then there's the draws) and hopefully let it go on the Turn (flush now as well as the possible sets ..not much he 3Bets sensibly that isn't well ahead at this point). A on the river would have been trouble if it went that far but I might have saved some of the money. AK v AA is often going to be painful though.
Folding to the 3Bet is fine too. There'll be a few AQ and AJ you're missing there but also plenty of JJ+.

Having 4Bet you should respect the Shove. You just won't see less than KK+ here often enough to call.


Also assume they will call more than could possibly be reasonable and bet accordingly when you do have big hands.

If you expect to be winning over all you don't need to play risky/marginal hands, wait for a better spot to put your money in.

Hi MrFerguson91

I'm playing a lot of Micro too and I do find it harder than I thought it would be. I find success playing Zoom as there is a lot more action. Keep on playing good hands in position. I personally like to call SB with suited connectors or suited A but that's just me. It seems like your doing well. Do you play always play 9 handed tables? Have you ever thought about playing 6 Handed tables?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Keith

still not topping up to 100bb , what are villains stats and 3bet % : if 3bet% is 4 or higher i'd be happy getting it in here. if he's a nit , probably best to fold to the shove.

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Got it sorted now I had changed it but it wasn't working for some reason, I reapplied it and its all fine now :)
Didn't have any 3bet info on him, not enough to know whether to call or not, should maybe just fold in these situations then until I have more info from the hud

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Timlagor

I'm playing 10c and see people 3Bet-shove fairly weak but if it goes up in stages like that they're usually strong. I'll call a 2Bet or 3Bet shove ($5+ into a 15c-45c pot) with AQ+ usually but I wouldn't 4Bet them.

At 2NL I would be even more sure to make your own play solid and not worry too much about exploiting. Assume they have better hands than they really do and you will win most of the time. You don't have to get all the value -get some of it and keep it.


I would have flat called the 3Bet, likely called on the flop (QT could well be sets at that point and then there's the draws) and hopefully let it go on the Turn (flush now as well as the possible sets ..not much he 3Bets sensibly that isn't well ahead at this point). A on the river would have been trouble if it went that far but I might have saved some of the money. AK v AA is often going to be painful though.
Folding to the 3Bet is fine too. There'll be a few AQ and AJ you're missing there but also plenty of JJ+.

Having 4Bet you should respect the Shove. You just won't see less than KK+ here often enough to call.


Also assume they will call more than could possibly be reasonable and bet accordingly when you do have big hands.

If you expect to be winning over all you don't need to play risky/marginal hands, wait for a better spot to put your money in.

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Thanks for the info mate, just going to stay tight and be really patient and try and go in with the best hands I can that I think are in the lead preflop, play in position unless its a premium hand, and see how it goes after a few more sessions :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PJfan10

Hi MrFerguson91

I'm playing a lot of Micro too and I do find it harder than I thought it would be. I find success playing Zoom as there is a lot more action. Keep on playing good hands in position. I personally like to call SB with suited connectors or suited A but that's just me. It seems like your doing well. Do you play always play 9 handed tables? Have you ever thought about playing 6 Handed tables?

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Hey mate, yeah it is hard to adjust to play it, but tight is best I have now learned lol in position with nice strong hands.

I think 6max takes a different strategy than full ring, I would rather focus all my time learning full ring instead of trying to learn both, once I learn full ring I might give 6max a go but it wont be for a while, I prefer a tighter game with slower play for some reason, can make less mistakes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MrFerguson91

Hey mate, yeah it is hard to adjust to play it, but tight is best I have now learned lol in position with nice strong hands.

I think 6max takes a different strategy than full ring, I would rather focus all my time learning full ring instead of trying to learn both, once I learn full ring I might give 6max a go but it wont be for a while, I prefer a tighter game with slower play for some reason, can make less mistakes

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OK makes sence. I like the action that's why I play zoom. Hopefully one day we can play a SNG or cash table together.

1- The JQ hand maybe you could have folded it preflop, but on the turn, If you think that the villian hasn't got an ace, I wouldn't bet to try to make him fold, because you have showdown value, an also a gutshot that every once in a while you will hit, so I would check the turn to control the size of the pot and because you have showdown value
2- I don't like your call to the 3bet with JJ oop because in most flops villian will make you fold with a cbet. Maybe you could have tried a 4bet to 0,39c or fold it pre. It is very useful to know the villian, because if he is not a great player, I wouldn't mind ending up all in pre against him with JJ. On the flop don't donk, it is better to check and see what the villian does.
3- The TT hand I would fold it pre because his 3bet is way too big, and the worst you might see here is AQ which you are flipping, and the any overpair has you dominated. You have invested only 3bb, why would you risk 12bb when you are in a tough spot, it is better to lose 3bb.

Thanks mate useful info, the TT hand I'll be folding from now on depending on the opponent and if i have a good enough read from him, the 3bet def indicated a strong hand, stronger than TT anyways

The 4bet on the JJ hand is a nice idea possibly pushin him off the hand pre, and if he 5bets or I miss the flop check/fold

New session tonight, only playing 3 tables at 2nl, seem to be able to focus more on the other players when I play less and I don't lose track of things so I will be playin fewer tables a session from now on.

466 hands played (Not an overly big sample, but was grinding them for around 3 hours)

My average stats over the 3 tables was 18/12 over the 466 hands played

+231.5 BB

Graph

Attachment 777

I was playing nice ABC poker the whole time with minimal mistakes, picking my spots nicely and also had a lot of success with my 3bets and stealing, all was going perfectly until this, my only big mistake in terms of BB lost



SB: $0.41 (20.5 bb)
BB: $2.91 (145.5 bb)
UTG+2: $1.66 (83 bb)
MP1: $2 (100 bb)
MP2: $2 (100 bb)
MP3: $4.39 (219.5 bb)
CO: $2.33 (116.5 bb)
Hero (BTN): $2.15 (107.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BTN with A:heart: K:spade:
UTG+2 calls $0.02, MP1 folds, MP2 raises to $0.09, MP3 folds, CO calls $0.09, Hero raises to $0.27, 3 folds, MP2 raises to $0.95, CO folds, Hero raises to $2.15 and is all-in, MP2 calls $1.05 and is all-in

Flop: ($4.14) 8:club: Q:club: K:diamond: (2 players, 2 are all-in)
Turn: ($4.14) T:heart: (2 players, 2 are all-in)
River: ($4.14) 5:spade: (2 players, 2 are all-in)

Results: $4.14 pot ($0.14 rake)
Final Board: 8:club: Q:club: K:diamond: T:heart: 5:spade:
MP2 showed A:club: A:diamond: and won $4 ($2 net)
Hero showed A:heart: K:spade: and lost (-$2 net)

When villain 4bet I had gut feelin he had AA and I called anyway hoping I would run into A10+ as he was playin pretty loose, hit myself a slap after that one and follow my gut next time, ruined the session for me so I called it a night before tilt may have kicked in

Forget that hand :)



Although I have a hand here which was my second biggest loss that I would like to know whether I played it correctly or made some mistakes.



SB: $2 (100 bb)
BB: $0.91 (45.5 bb)
UTG+2: $3.05 (152.5 bb)
MP1: $1.94 (97 bb)
MP2: $2.80 (140 bb)
Hero (MP3): $3.18 (159 bb)
CO: $2 (100 bb)
BTN: $4.65 (232.5 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with Q:heart: K:diamond:
3 folds, Hero raises to $0.08, 3 folds, BB calls $0.06

Flop: ($0.17) 4:spade: 6:diamond: Q:diamond: (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.10, BB calls $0.10

Turn: ($0.37) A:heart: (2 players)
BB bets $0.08, Hero calls $0.08

River: ($0.53) 8:spade: (2 players)
BB bets $0.10, Hero calls $0.10

Results: $0.73 pot ($0.03 rake)
Final Board: 4:spade: 6:diamond: Q:diamond: A:heart: 8:spade:
BB showed A:spade: K:heart: and won $0.70 ($0.34 net)
Hero mucked Q:heart: K:diamond: and lost (-$0.36 net)

I hit top pair on flop, cbet as per, Villain calls, an A comes on the turn so I flat to control the pot a bit (also the A scared me A little), villain bets, I call and an 8 comes on the river.

Villain was 31/3 so playing pretty lose and passive, wouldn't have put him on the A as he was playing so passively, I don't think he would have called the cbet on the flop with nothing.

Did villain get lucky with the A on the turn, or was there something I could have done differently in the hand?


And then lastly the hand where I won the most in

Just wondering was my play ok in this

SB: $2.78 (139 bb)
BB: $2 (100 bb)
UTG+2: $0.80 (40 bb)
MP1: $1.89 (94.5 bb)
Hero (MP2): $2.62 (131 bb)
MP3: $1.97 (98.5 bb)
CO: $0.77 (38.5 bb)
BTN: $2 (100 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A:heart: K:heart:
UTG+2 folds, MP1 raises to $0.18, Hero calls $0.18, 5 folds

Flop: ($0.39) 2:spade: K:club: 7:club: (2 players)
MP1 bets $0.18, Hero raises to $1.06, MP1 calls $0.88

Turn: ($2.51) T:diamond: (2 players)
MP1 bets $0.65, Hero calls $0.65

River: ($3.81) 3:diamond: (2 players)

Results: $3.81 pot ($0.13 rake)
Final Board: 2:spade: K:club: 7:club: T:diamond: 3:diamond:
MP1 showed 2:club: A:club: and lost (-$1.89 net)
Hero showed A:heart: K:heart: and won $3.68 ($1.79 net)

Thanks :D