pondering oop stuff .KQs on Kxx v loosie

Printable View

11-14-2011, 11:37 PM
celtic123

pondering oop stuff .KQs on Kxx v loosie

Microgaming - €0.02 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG+1: €3.06 ( 62/34 /100% cbet 4/4 over 20 or so)
MP: €13.65
MP+1: €2.00
CO: €0.26
BTN: €3.72
SB: €6.28
Hero (BB): €2.00
UTG: €0.92

SB posts SB €0.01, Hero posts BB €0.02

Pre Flop: (€0.03) Hero has Q:spade: K:spade:

fold, UTG+1 raises to €0.10, fold, MP+1 calls €0.10, fold, fold, fold, Hero calls €0.08

I flatted oop against this vill because , Im happy post flop against this player stat wise / hes probably Cbetting every flop / I can re-asses without bloating any pot. Good enough reasons ?

Flop: (€0.31, 3 players) K:heart: 6:club: 9:heart:
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets €0.31, fold, Hewo ?

I hit, c/r or flat?

1) Im ahead here a c/r keeps things simple.
2) flatting gives him more rope.
11-15-2011, 12:37 AM
Razvan729

a psb is rather unusual for a cbet, he has a TPGK, 2 pairs,AA or a set and sometimes NFD

i would flat here. c/f heart turn, CRAI Q turn and c/decide K/another card turn depending on timing and sizing.
11-15-2011, 01:10 AM
Icanhastreebet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razvan729

a psb is rather unusual for a cbet, he has a TPGK, 2 pairs,AA or a set and sometimes NFD

i would flat here. c/f heart turn, CRAI Q turn and c/decide K/another card turn depending on timing and sizing.

wat
11-15-2011, 04:11 PM
Outlaw

Did you consider calling the flop and leading out for half pot on any turn? Easy fold if raised, if called you likely can value bet or get a free showdown on the river.
11-15-2011, 04:38 PM
bikes

check raising this flop is an option if villian is loose and bad as you say he is.

lots of stuff OTF bad people can find a call with that you crush and can get a decent amount of monies in.
11-15-2011, 05:08 PM
d0zer

I don't care what the action is, I'm never folding a hand this strong to such a loose fish. I also wouldn't look into the bet sizing cuz the site has a pot button, right? crazy laggfish just mashing buttons, consider 3betting pre, I like c/r flop and never fold.
11-15-2011, 09:11 PM
OngBonga

Google translate got the words "hereby", "stupid" and "sheep" from that post. That's pretty much it. Romanian gibberish.
11-16-2011, 01:01 AM
Razvan729

Quote:

Originally Posted by OngBonga

Google translate got the words "hereby", "stupid" and "sheep" from that post. That's pretty much it. Romanian gibberish.

why romanian? that aint romanian language in a million years. it's a slavic language yes, but not romanian!!!
11-16-2011, 01:29 AM
Razvan729

we have no reason to think he is bad postflop besides stats on 20 hands. my personal opinion is that is not enough information to assume he is a terrible player postflop and i dont think that paying a stack is a good price for a info, when that information could come cheaper.

if he is that bad and can stack off any K,9,FD, underpairs here, you will see it soon on a better hand or in a pot w/ other player, and with that read, yes, we could assume on future pots that he's range is so wide we can stack off +EV w/ TPGK vs him, until then, just try to get a cheap SD vs him w/o no other info about his postflop play.
11-16-2011, 02:44 AM
bikes

he's playing 2nl so that in itself is a pretty good read
11-16-2011, 06:08 AM
Razvan729

Quote:

Originally Posted by bikes

he's playing 2nl so that in itself is a pretty good read

that means he's bad postflop as it means that a 100nl 12/10 is good preflop just because he is playing 100nl and his stats are 12/10 over 20 hands and you know better then me that a lot of 12/10 100nl players do suck postflop and thats why you make money.

for me that's not enough info. his stats do have some effect, that's why we call pre an call flop, because we think he has some worse hands in his range, but it is not enough info to assume that he is going to stack off w/ worse enough to make a raise/call here +EV, it can be +EV, not saying it may not, but at this point we dont have the info to assume that .
11-16-2011, 09:43 AM
JaneeOrphag

My intro

Greetings all members, I'm a fresh participant on this here message board therefore I suspect I should present myself. To begin with I am 25 years of age, a girl, plus I enjoy studying oriental studies in my school. I certainly can't wait chatting with all you older members. bye bye x
11-16-2011, 09:45 AM
d0zer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razvan729

that means he's bad postflop as it means that a 100nl 12/10 is good preflop just because he is playing 100nl and his stats are 12/10 over 20 hands and you know better then me that a lot of 12/10 100nl players do suck postflop and thats why you make money.

for me that's not enough info. his stats do have some effect, that's why we call pre an call flop, because we think he has some worse hands in his range, but it is not enough info to assume that he is going to stack off w/ worse enough to make a raise/call here +EV, it can be +EV, not saying it may not, but at this point we dont have the info to assume that .

being a pussy vs 60/30s will cost you a lot of value. widen your value ranges vs these fish, you don't need to be 100% sure that he sucks postflop. 99% is good enough.

and re: your 12/10 example, you need a lot more hands for tighter players to figure them out than you do extremely loose players. In 20 hands we've seen the 60/30 c-bet 4/4 times. a 12/10 in that sample we might see c-bet once
11-16-2011, 11:56 AM
OngBonga

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razvan729

why romanian? that aint romanian language in a million years. it's a slavic language yes, but not romanian!!!

It's not Romanian? Apologies then. Google translate told me it was. Blame Google!
11-16-2011, 03:13 PM
kickass

this guy obviously has all kings in his range and prolly thinks theyre all the nuts here give him sets AA and all kings for prolly a super tight range and we're a 60/40 favourite.
dont ever fold dont wait GET IT IN
11-16-2011, 03:44 PM
OngBonga

Not sure I wanna stack off on this flop. If we raise him, he folds crappy pairs that he probably continues firing with if we simply flat call. Worse kings are gonna be in by the river regardless, so why stack off his KJ- on flop? Give him rope.
11-16-2011, 04:21 PM
kickass

Hearts. If and when one drops it will be hella harder to get the cash in if he doesn't have a flush and if he does bet a flush card how happy are we getting it in on a 3 flush board he'll never fold anything he'd call 3 streets with. Reraise now jam turn.
11-16-2011, 04:43 PM
bikes

this is not a spot to let the donk hang himself.

theres too many turn cards where the V can check behind the turn with 1 pair hands that we crush and we lose the opportunity to extract the maximum from his range with this hand.
11-17-2011, 03:24 AM
Hoopy

Vs someone this bad I like check raising big and getting all the money in. He's clearly going with any K or even a decent 9, sometimes he'll get it in with just an average draw.

Calling flop will leave us guessing on lots of turn cards, as bikes said he can check back as well with stuff like 9x.
11-18-2011, 08:46 AM
Icanhastreebet

btw I c/c, donk here.
also he's played like over half the pots, how don't we have any postflop reads?
11-18-2011, 10:50 PM
rpm

i'm looking to get it in and i think it benefits us to get as much in on the flop as we can.
11-20-2011, 02:23 AM
phishaphy

Obuwie damskie

Women's shoes due to the fact that women are an fundamental component of the dressing room. Practically every mate has in her closet a not many pairs of shoes. There may be, of routine, shoes and only one destination. I am steady that in every abigail's stock of clothing determination be starting evening shoes, sports winter.
Do women agree with me:)
11-20-2011, 11:43 AM
aSteadasipse

2fa1 unlock iphone 4

<a href="http://unlockiphone4withios5233.tumblr.com/post/12963507379/unlock-iphone-4-on-4-3-5">how to unlock iphone 4</a> <a href="http://www.allexpertarticles.com/business/iphone-4-unlock-quickly-as-well-as-easy/410405">unlock iphone 4</a> <a href="http://dailybooth.com/subscemetto1987/20387066">iphone 4 unlock</a> How to jailbreak and unlock iphone 4 - ios 4.0.2 ? unlock iphone 4 Can you use a gevey sim to unlock iPhone 4 iOS 5? unlock iphone 4 Can I unlock iPhone 4 iOS 4.2.1 to T-Mobile US? [via Craigslist]? unlock iphone 4 Is it possible to buy unlocked iphone 4 in Vegas? Where?
11-20-2011, 04:27 PM
celtic123

Thanks for every response, I couldn't reply earlier cos of password issues.

Thought provoking, I thought I did the right thing at the time. Now I think I did the right thing, but for the wrong reasons.

I check raised and he folded.
11-21-2011, 01:02 AM
Micro2Macro

dbij fkio
11-21-2011, 02:18 AM
Icanhastreebet

Quote:

Originally Posted by phishaphy

Women's shoes due to the fact that women are an fundamental component of the dressing room. Practically every mate has in her closet a not many pairs of shoes. There may be, of routine, shoes and only one destination. I am steady that in every abigail's stock of clothing determination be starting evening shoes, sports winter.
Do women agree with me:)

I strongly disagree. I believe every mate has in her closest too many pairs of shoes. I am a man. That is all.
11-21-2011, 04:59 AM
KenliereePrah

The 25 Toughest Passwords on the Internet

If you are trying to secure your email or maybe your bank account on the net, the actual dumbest password it is possible to use can be … “password.” This can be in accordance with SplashData, some sort of California software firm you do, among other details, to sell the app that helps you actually manage your security passwords.
The list is one of those actions that is enjoyable to stick through, but safety persons remind united states that we’re additional vulnerable on line than we like to believe, and occasionally we allow the poor guys. Check it out, and for those who use one of those, SplashData says it’s quite possibly recommended that you modify it.
one. username and password 2. 123456 three.12345678 Five. qwerty five. abc123 Half-dozen. monkey seven. 1234567 Eight. letmein 9. trustno1 ten. monster 11. baseball 15. 111111 13. iloveyou 14. expert 15. sunshine 04. ashley 17. bailey 18. passw0rd 19th. shadow 20. 123123 Twenty-one. 654321 22. superman 1. qazwsx 24. michael 20. football
We’ve observed things such as this ahead of; back June, a fresh That you are able to app developer referred to as Daniel Amitay located that from the 13,000 feasible quantity pass codes within the iPhone, there were just Twelve that represented 15 % of all of the codes he or she found to become in use. Just like the list above, that it was predictable: 1234 seemed to be the runaway director, followed by 0000, 2580 (the center line on any cellphone keypad), 1111, 5555 and so forth.
SplashData provides standard advice: Don’t possibly be so predictable.
-Mix the characters within a private data - use emails, numbers and unique characters.
-Longer passwords tend to be better passwords. Look at eight characters if not more, maybe two phrases separated by the underscore or even a room.
-Don’t use one particular password to get almost everything. If another person hackers your Facebook bill, your financial institution account may very well be future.
To bear in mind them all, it is said, an online password manager may be beneficial. Or it's possible you'll need to you choose a scrap of papers with your wallet.
11-21-2011, 07:41 AM
celtic

Thats all there is to it then ?
11-21-2011, 08:48 AM
rpm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razvan729

we have no reason to think he is bad postflop besides stats on 20 hands. my personal opinion is that is not enough information to assume he is a terrible player postflop and i dont think that paying a stack is a good price for a info, when that information could come cheaper.

we have great reason to assume he is bad postflop. he is 62/34 or whatever. there is almost no way possible this guy is any good postflop imo. we're not (potentially) paying a stack to try to gain any kind of information. we're looking to get our money in good against a fish.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razvan729

if he is that bad and can stack off any K,9,FD, underpairs here, you will see it soon on a better hand or in a pot w/ other player, and with that read, yes, we could assume on future pots that he's range is so wide we can stack off +EV w/ TPGK vs him, until then, just try to get a cheap SD vs him w/o no other info about his postflop play.

this sounds like the "wait for a better spot" logic. that's a tournament phrase. in cash games we want to take every +$EV spot we can.
11-21-2011, 09:43 AM
bikes

wait for a better spot is no longer a tournament phrase donkament players realize edges arent as big as they used to be. its a phrase used by dumb nits as an excuse to fold without the nuts because they suck at making decisions without said nuts
11-21-2011, 01:13 PM
OngBonga

Problem with the "wait for another spot" logic is that somebody else tends to find that better spot before you.
11-21-2011, 03:42 PM
PKKFW

Personally I use the phrase to basically mean a situation where I think it is too close for me to make the proper decision. Maybe that's because I suck at making decisions and maybe it's because it is a very close call and maybe it's a bit of both.

In this spot I'd be looking to get the money in by c/r I reckon.
11-22-2011, 04:39 AM
celtic

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outlaw

Did you consider calling the flop and leading out for half pot on any turn? Easy fold if raised, if called you likely can value bet or get a free showdown on the river.

no . I didnt consider this. I tend to play that way with draws as semi bluffs. I dont think I trust my post flop play enough .
I need to think about this some more.